Andy Robinson quits as Scotland coach

jdcav1230

Just confirmed.

Glass Prison 1214

Graham Henry's dream job has just become available.

phog

jdcav1230 wrote: »

Just confirmed.

EOS to take over Scotland and Andy Robinson will get the Connacht job. Edinburgh's poor showing this year may be a stumbling block for Bradley

CatFromHue

From his commenst after the game it's not too surprising

"The performance was totally unacceptable and I'm very angry," said Robinson.

"I'd like to apologise to the fans who turned up here to watch us. There will be consequences as a result of today. We're going to look at everything."

It puts the IRFU in a tricky position if they do decide to change our management team as Scotland could get first dibs on a good coach.

Paulw

He never really got a performance from the team. They were always due a big win. They had moments of real quality, but were never able to string it together for a full game.

It will be a loss to Scotland, but who will take over now?

danthefan

Paulw wrote: »

He never really got a performance from the team. They were always due a big win. They had moments of real quality, but were never able to string it together for a full game.

It will be a loss to Scotland, but who will take over now?

He beat Australia and South Africa I think.

Anyway nice to see some honesty from an international coach.

Teferi

Andy Robinson has always been impressively forthright in his comments and refreshingly passionate about his team.

Paulw

danthefan wrote: »

He beat Australia and South Africa I think.

But, the team had the potential to string results together and win something. He was making progress, but it was a flash in the pan. A spark here or there.

jacothelad

Scotland simply don't have enough players of the quality needed. They do have good ones though. When you look at some of their 'main' players, they are very poor. Nick de Luca is dreadful, Jackson is crap, Ross Ford isn't international standard, etc I often read on here about player A or B from Scotland being a Lions contender and I often wonder on what exactly the posters base their conclusions. Even Richie Gray isn't fulfilling his bright potential.

I feel sorry for Robbo.Decent man etc. He is however suffering the same fate as his 3 or 4 predecessors, all brought low at least partly because of lack of options in players.

jdcav1230

CatFromHue wrote: »

From his commenst after the game it's not too surprising

"The performance was totally unacceptable and I'm very angry," said Robinson.

"I'd like to apologise to the fans who turned up here to watch us. There will be consequences as a result of today. We're going to look at everything."

It puts the IRFU in a tricky position if they do decide to change our management team as Scotland could get first dibs on a good coach.

Holy shït never thought of that. If they get Schmidt I will go ballistic

rrpc

jdcav1230 wrote: »

Holy shït never thought of that. If they get Schmidt I will go ballistic

Doubtful if someone the calibre of Schmidt would want to go there. EOS or Bradley would be about the best they could hope for. Clive Woodward wouldn't even want that job .

Glass Prison 1214

jdcav1230 wrote: »

Holy shït never thought of that. If they get Schmidt I will go ballistic

There is absolutely no chance of them getting Schmidt.

jamiedav2011

Not a hope Schmidt, or COS for that matter will go there.
Can't quite believe this tbh, sure it's a very poor result but Tonga are no mugs and Robinson had been making some progress.

As someone says above, Scotland have very few real quality players bar perhaps Gray, Visser and Hogg, and only seem to thrive in the dour 6N clashes.

The lack of a real quality 10 has hurt them big time.

Just as an aside, is Richie Gray living on reputation a little bit? Hasn't set the world alight in the last 6-7 months anyway, and wouldn't be in a Lions 22 on form certainly atm.

Have only seen bits of him for Sale, and he doens't look the world class SR he supposedly is, though he's still very young I suppose.

Is he suffering from 'Chabal sydrome'? (Stand out physical traits making him more noticeable and a crowd favourite?)

Quint2010

I'll miss Andy Robinson. He had two forms of expression-silence and rage...

Trhiggy83

Was only thinking last night how he was still in his job, if anything scotland are now worse than when he took over, time for a fresh approach and put a scot in charge.

I can understand when countries bring in a coach from outside for their expertise but you need to have the passion for the job as well which i doubt robinson had in abundance for scottish rugby

Digifriendly

You can't make a silk purse out of a pig's ear as they say. Whoever the coach is he simply doesn't have enough quality players at his disposal. Scottish rugby both at club and international level is in dire straits I'm afraid.

jdcav1230

rrpc wrote: »

Doubtful if someone the calibre of Schmidt would want to go there. EOS or Bradley would be about the best they could hope for. Clive Woodward wouldn't even want that job .

Even though Scotland as a whole are a pretty bad team, they have good enough attacking threats in Lamont, Hogg and Evans. Schmidt is a world class coach and probably wants the NZ job one day so if he could get the Scotland backline scoring tries, NZ might consider him as a backs coach. Think of it. For a lot of last season, Leinster were scoring tries from everywhere with their second/third string team. If he can get the likes of Kelly Brown and Richie Gray, two big, powerful yet skillful blokes, into their back play, they could be a force to be reckoned with. I will cry if the IRFU dont snatch up Schmidt soon

padser

CatFromHue wrote: »

It puts the IRFU in a tricky position if they do decide to change our management team as Scotland could get first dibs on a good coach.

I'd struggle to see Scotland attracting a coach Id want to see take over Ireland.

That said, if anyone from the IRFU read this please do worry about Scotland getting the best available coach and don't hesitate, fire Kidney now!!!!

Funk It

Sean Maitland, Tim Visser and Stuart Hogg are going to be a force to be reckoned with in the 6 Nations. I am a fan of Duncan Weir, and would like to see Laidlaw play at 9 with Weir at 10.

They need Ansbro to recover from his neck injury to shore up the midfield, but they will have some great players to work with, just have to complete the set.

razorblunt

For all of De Luca's failings I think he has been decent so far this year.
The Lamont brothers are spent forces also they really needed Ansbro.

Having Visser on the wing is a bit reminiscent of Geoghan in the 90s.

Digifriendly

Funk It wrote: »

Sean Maitland, Tim Visser and Stuart Hogg are going to be a force to be reckoned with in the 6 Nations. I am a fan of Duncan Weir, and would like to see Laidlaw play at 9 with Weir at 10.

They need Ansbro to recover from his neck injury to shore up the midfield, but they will have some great players to work with, just have to complete the set.

To complete the set they need more than half a team and they simply don't have those players I'm afraid. Scottish rugby is in a real mess and it won't matter who is the next coach IMHO.

thomond2006

The SRU has already accepted that Scottish rugby can't produce the talent, hence the influx of project players like Josh Strauss and WP Nel along with the search for 'granny rule' players like Sean Maitland.

Scioch

What about Robinson for the Irish job once Kidney's time is up ?

Funk It

thomond2006 wrote: »

The IRFU has already accepted that Irish rugby can't produce the talent, hence the influx of project players like Richardt Strauss along with the search for 'granny rule' players like Michael Bent.

I edited your quote thomond, to what I guess a lot of people will be saying about Ireland. Not that I don't think that it is great to have Strauss and Bent in the Irish setup.

Scotland are in the same boat, but they are getting some class players on board, key word being 'some'.

Will be interesting to see who will take up the Scotland job, O'Sullivan and Mallet would be 2 names, provided that neither get the Connacht job that is.

dtpc191991

Scioch wrote: »

What about Robinson for the Irish job once Kidney's time is up ?

No!! We had him once already and it didn't go well.

Scioch

dtpc191991 wrote: »

No!! We had him once already and it didn't go well.

Did we ? Jesus that must have been an age ago I dont recall it at all.

phog

Scioch wrote: »

What about Robinson for the Irish job once Kidney's time is up ?

He'd hardly wait 4 or so years for it now, would he?

dtpc191991 wrote: »

No!! We had him once already and it didn't go well.

Dont think we did, we had Brian Ashton though.

dtpc191991

Scioch wrote: »

Did we ? Jesus that must have been an age ago I dont recall it at all.

I think we did years ago. This is info from my parents so it could be incorrect.

jamiedav2011

Funk It wrote: »

I edited your quote thomond, to what I guess a lot of people will be saying about Ireland. Not that I don't think that it is great to have Strauss and Bent in the Irish setup.

Scotland are in the same boat, but they are getting some class players on board, key word being 'some'.

Will be interesting to see who will take up the Scotland job, O'Sullivan and Mallet would be 2 names, provided that neither get the Connacht job that is.

Completely different level there, you're twisting things to fit an agenda tbh.

Scioch

Funk It wrote: »

I edited your quote thomond, to what I guess a lot of people will be saying about Ireland. Not that I don't think that it is great to have Strauss and Bent in the Irish setup.

Scotland are in the same boat, but they are getting some class players on board, key word being 'some'.

Will be interesting to see who will take up the Scotland job, O'Sullivan and Mallet would be 2 names, provided that neither get the Connacht job that is.

Strauss isnt in the Bent category, we didnt have the hooker problem to the same degree that we had the prop problem. He was just here and going to be qualified and the IRFU made sure to bring him in as he was extremely good. They actively sought out Bent because it was clear we were in trouble with regards to short term prop replacements.

Ireland and Scotland are in no way comparable on that. With Best and Ross fit its unlikely Strauss or Bent would make the starting 15. We are not lacking in international standard players. Just international standard props.

CatFromHue

padser wrote: »

I'd struggle to see Scotland attracting a coach Id want to see take over Ireland.

That said, if anyone from the IRFU read this please do worry about Scotland getting the best available coach and don't hesitate, fire Kidney now!!!!

Well there were seemingly 40 applicants for the Connacht job and like many other industries in the recession at the moment that if there is a job available you take it. Even if it wouldn't be the one you wanted most.

I mean there is a position available now with Scotland whereas with Ireland it would be April at the earliest, if at all. It would put the IRFU in a difficult position to attract candidates away from Scotland without it becoming public knowledge.

Stheno

But why are scotland so lacking in players?

TheGoldenAges

Stheno wrote: »

But why are scotland so lacking in players?

Having only 2 professional teams doesn't help....

Scioch

phog wrote: »

He'd hardly wait 4 or so years for it now, would he?

What do you know that I dont ? Who have we signed on for the next four years ?

irishbucsfan

dtpc191991 wrote: »

I think we did years ago. This is info from my parents so it could be incorrect.

No not Robinson. They must be thinking of Ashton. Robinsons first international job was as Woodward's Assistant. Think he was still playing when Gatland was in charge of Ireland.

[Jackass]

Wow, an international coach who is willing to admit unacceptable results and have the dignity and respect for the fans to leave when the position has become severely compromised. (Remember, we were just one game away from dropping outside the second tier of nations at the weekend - Under Eddie O'Sullivan we enjoyed much time as a top tier team, peaking at 3rd in the world at one point - open to correction on that though, might have been fourth...)

O'Sullivan didn't show the respect to walk away, Kidney wont either, and the IRFU both times have themselves to blame for keeping the blazer boys they have in their pocket in the job and carry out their selection preferences from the old boys club, and for recklessly offering contracts before time.

Kidney has no class and will drag this out until he's fired. It makes it so refreshing to see a guy like Robsinson doing the right thing.

Cosmo Kramer

Stheno wrote: »

But why are scotland so lacking in players?

Quite simply because not enough people play the game in Scotland. It's hard to appreciate, until you've spent some time here, just how far down the pecking order rugby is in the mindset of your average Scot.

Since Ireland and Wales have got their acts together in the last 10-15 years Scotland have been completely blown away - there is little chance of that changing through the use of native Scottish players alone. So they are trying to play smart and bring in Kiwis/Saffers/Aussies etc.

Maitland will make a huge difference to them based on his Super Rugby stats. Denton is Zimbabwean and came through the South African system, Visser is Dutch, Max Evans is English, so is Pyrgos and they tried to bring in a Welsh out-half last year (Shingler?). Hines and Parks are previous examples of the same thing. At this stage we're about the only top tier rugby country they haven't tried to source a player from (maybe they need to start looking at the parentage of some of the Ulster boys!). But even with that approach they cannot keep up.

Sean Lineen might be an outside shot to replace Robinson. Did a decent job with a limited bunch of players at Glasgow in recent years and would know the setup well.

its_phil

I believe Sean Lineen is the favourite, with Scott Johnson behind.

I can't remember what Thomond and Jaco said about him Johnson 14 months ago on Talking Rugby but that sums him up for me too. Useless

jacothelad

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Quite simply because not enough people play the game in Scotland. It's hard to appreciate, until you've spent some time here, just how far down the pecking order rugby is in the mindset of your average Scot.

Since Ireland and Wales have got their acts together in the last 10-15 years Scotland have been completely blown away - there is little chance of that changing through the use of native Scottish players alone. So they are trying to play smart and bring in Kiwis/Saffers/Aussies etc.

Maitland will make a huge difference to them based on his Super Rugby stats. Denton is Zimbabwean and came through the South African system, Visser is Dutch, Max Evans is English, so is Pyrgos and they tried to bring in a Welsh out-half last year (Shingler?). Hines and Parks are previous examples of the same thing. At this stage we're about the only top tier rugby country they haven't tried to source a player from (maybe they need to start looking at the parentage of some of the Ulster boys!). But even with that approach they cannot keep up.

Sean Lineen might be an outside shot to replace Robinson. Did a decent job with a limited bunch of players at Glasgow in recent years and would know the setup well.

The SRU f*cked up royally in their destruction of the Borders Pro side. The Borders is the heartland of rugby in Scotland and they cut it's balls off. I don't think you can run an international side with only 2 pro teams. The critical mass just isn't there to create the player base. I also believe that Wales were wrong to bin their 5th region for similar reasons. I think there were many in Ireland who would have shrugged their shoulders and gave each other knowing looks if Connacht had been wound up. me included. We can all see what is beginning to grow out West. Imagine if we had 4 thriving and competitive sides, a position to which we seem to be on course. In Scotland the equivalent players to Buckley, McCarthy, Griffen, O'Halloran, McSharru etc are playing weekend games for Gala, Melrose, Selkirk, Hawick, Jedforest etc.

molloyjh

Funk It wrote: »

I edited your quote thomond, to what I guess a lot of people will be saying about Ireland. Not that I don't think that it is great to have Strauss and Bent in the Irish setup.

Scotland are in the same boat, but they are getting some class players on board, key word being 'some'.

Will be interesting to see who will take up the Scotland job, O'Sullivan and Mallet would be 2 names, provided that neither get the Connacht job that is.

To be fair Scotland's problem is that with such a small player base and only 2 pro teams they can't fill the starting XV with international quality. Ireland's is that with such a small player base we have depth issues in a couple of positions. Our first choice XV is all Irish, with 2 project/granny players on the bench. Totally different situation.

Funk It

molloyjh wrote: »

To be fair Scotland's problem is that with such a small player base and only 2 pro teams they can't fill the starting XV with international quality. Ireland's is that with such a small player base we have depth issues in a couple of positions. Our first choice XV is all Irish, with 2 project/granny players on the bench. Totally different situation.

With regards to the Scottish player base, they have an awful lot of players playing in England and a few in France (some of their U20s were playing with Clermont and Racing as well I think). But I agree totally with what you are saying, I was blowing it out of proportion when I edited thomonds post in order to show that we are also "guilty" of obtaining overseas players for our national side.

molloyjh

Funk It wrote: »

With regards to the Scottish player base, they have an awful lot of players playing in England and a few in France (some of their U20s were playing with Clermont and Racing as well I think). But I agree totally with what you are saying, I was blowing it out of proportion when I edited thomonds post in order to show that we are also "guilty" of obtaining overseas players for our national side.

A lot of sides do it, even England. And they have a bigger player base than any other country. It's a brave new global multi-cultural world out there now. That's bound to be reflected in rugby too. As long as a player makes their lives here I couldn't give a fiddlers where they were born. And Scotland don't have the luxury of "innocence" where-as we do to a degree.

Feel for Robinson all the same. I've a lot of time for him really. Love his reactions in the box at times. It's great to see a coach that invested in what he is doing. He just doesn't have the resources at his disposal right now. It will be interesting to see who they get in. Can't see Bradley making the cut given Edinburghs form this season. 6 months ago he would have been a shoe-in, but not any more.

jm08

[Jackass] wrote: »

Wow, an international coach who is willing to admit unacceptable results and have the dignity and respect for the fans to leave when the position has become severely compromised. (Remember, we were just one game away from dropping outside the second tier of nations at the weekend - Under Eddie O'Sullivan we enjoyed much time as a top tier team, peaking at 3rd in the world at one point - open to correction on that though, might have been fourth...)

O'Sullivan didn't show the respect to walk away, Kidney wont either, and the IRFU both times have themselves to blame for keeping the blazer boys they have in their pocket in the job and carry out their selection preferences from the old boys club, and for recklessly offering contracts before time.

Kidney has no class and will drag this out until he's fired. It makes it so refreshing to see a guy like Robsinson doing the right thing.

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/7555.php

Eddie O'Sullivan Resignation Statement


Eddie O'Sullivan resigned as Ireland head coach on Wednesday night and issued the following statement thanking the players, fans and the IRFU.

"At the conclusion of the Six Nations championship and having given my role as national team head coach much consideration, I have come to the decision to step down. "In doing so I would like to thank all my management team and all the players that I have worked with during my tenure as Irish coach. Their commitment and professionalism in representing their country has been consummate throughout.

"I would also like to thank the IRFU for their unwavering support of me as coach to the team.
"In addition, I would like to thank the Irish rugby supporters who have played a huge role in driving the team on to some outstanding performances in recent years.

"Finally I would like to wish the Irish rugby team and the IRFU every success in the future, in a professional sport that is becoming more demanding and competitive by the day.
"I will not be making any further comments on this issue for the foreseeable future, and I would ask that the privacy of both myself and my family at this time be respected."

Eddie O'Sullivan
Wednesday, March 19, 2008

who the fug

Would't mind having him at London Irish.

Fireball07

jacothelad wrote: »

The SRU f*cked up royally in their destruction of the Borders Pro side. The Borders is the heartland of rugby in Scotland and they cut it's balls off. I don't think you can run an international side with only 2 pro teams. The critical mass just isn't there to create the player base. I also believe that Wales were wrong to bin their 5th region for similar reasons. I think there were many in Ireland who would have shrugged their shoulders and gave each other knowing looks if Connacht had been wound up. me included. We can all see what is beginning to grow out West. Imagine if we had 4 thriving and competitive sides, a position to which we seem to be on course. In Scotland the equivalent players to Buckley, McCarthy, Griffen, O'Halloran, McSharru etc are playing weekend games for Gala, Melrose, Selkirk, Hawick, Jedforest etc.

I agree with you there.

I can't really remember though, what kind of attendances did Borders get? Could they sustain them financially?

But it's true...very hard to create an international side with only 2 professional teams. Of course, they are already losing most of their top players to England and France.

Cosmo Kramer

Fireball07 wrote: »

I agree with you there.

I can't really remember though, what kind of attendances did Borders get? Could they sustain them financially?

But it's true...very hard to create an international side with only 2 professional teams. Of course, they are already losing most of their top players to England and France.

They got in the region of 1500 per game at home. Much as rugby is popular in the Borders, they never bought into the professional team. It's really only in the last two years that Glasgow and Edinburgh have started to get something of a foothold in terms of respect from their local rugby communities. Maybe the Borders would have as well if they were given long enough, similar to Connacht. But they were making huge losses and the SRU didn't have the same kind of resources as the IRFU to keep them running.

With so many Scottish players playing abroad now, I think the knock on effect on the Borders if they were still operating would be that they would lose their better players to Glasgow/Edinburgh/abroad and would have a very weak team. I doubt there are many genuine Pro 12 standard players kicking around the Scottish amateur leagues.

DEFTLEFTHAND

It's funny how Ireland and Scotland have switched places since the 90s. As an Ireland supporter I used to fear Scotland during that 90s period, they were a classy outfit who we never defeated once in the 5 nations during those ten years.

I'm not really up on their youth game at the moment, is there any sign on the horizon of them ending this long slump in the near future?