Anyone know what happened in Dun Laoghaire tonight?

hatrickpatrick

Load of ambulances, fire brigades and Garda cars outside Dun Laoghaire Dart Station, traisns suspended all evening due to an "incident"... Never like it when I hear that word in relation to dart injuries

Anyone know what happened? Are the people involved ok?

Cookie_Monster

when all that reported is "incident" usually means someone jumped in front of a train

Richard Hillman

Don't wanna spread rumours but I heard that it was an incident involving a person and a train. Terribly sad.

repsol

Richard Hillman wrote: »

Don't wanna spread rumours but I heard that it was an incident involving a person and a train. Terribly sad.

Selfish thing to do.What about the poor **** driving the train who will probably be traumatised for life,not to mention the firemen scraping him/her off the tracks?Someone jumped in front of a train about six months ago in Kilbarrack station and loads of small kids standing near me saw the whole thing.Not nice

foggy_lad

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Load of ambulances, fire brigades and Garda cars outside Dun Laoghaire Dart Station, traisns suspended all evening due to an "incident"... Never like it when I hear that word in relation to dart injuries

Anyone know what happened? Are the people involved ok?

If it was a suicide/person hit by a train you would wonder why there would be so many ambulances and fire service vehicles in attendance. seems like an improper use of resources that may be required elsewhere.

repsol

Extra ambulances for witnesses who may have shock/heart attack. Fire engines number decided by a risk assessment carried out by experts for various types of incident in advance.It takes a lot of manpower to carry body and all the medical equipment up to half a mile(depends on speed of train) and to collect bits of punter.People always imagine there is more than there is.I would suspect there were 2 ambulances,1 DO's car 2 fire engines and an ET plus the Gardai.Better to send it and not need it than need it and not send it

Cookie_Monster

foggy_lad wrote: »

If it was a suicide/person hit by a train you would wonder why there would be so many ambulances and fire service vehicles in attendance. seems like an improper use of resources that may be required elsewhere.

emergency braking by the driver could easily cause fall injuries on the train, especially if a lot of standing people.
Fire engines to hose the place down

Victor

Can people a little more sensitive please?

Someone would appear to have been injured or killed. It may not have been a deliberate action. People who commit suicide tend to be ill and/or distressed, not selfish.

Moderator

---

Passengers had to be removed from train via the tracks. http://www.railusers.ie/forum/showthread.php?t=14561

goingnowhere

Indeed Victor especially as the poor girl survived and was rushed to hospital

donspeekinglesh

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/woman-loses-hands-after-being-trapped-under-dart-train-3285189.html

January

Poor girl

repsol

January wrote: »

Poor girl

Poor driver!

Tabnabs

A work colleague was on the train in question. Some of her comments about the incident - everybody, all bystanders, immediately whipped out their mobile phones and started taking pictures and videos. She also heard people phoning the media to relate the story.

She saw the casualty being stretchered out of the station. The paramedics brought her to the gate out to Harbour Road, locked, so they went back to the steps and found someone to finally unlock the gate (surely standard procedure for IR staff to unlock this in these circumstances?).

The people fainting on the platform were two teenage girls. Nobody went over to them to see if they were alright or needed assistance. They were helped to their feet by their two male friends and led out of the station.

shamwari

foggy_lad wrote: »

If it was a suicide/person hit by a train you would wonder why there would be so many ambulances and fire service vehicles in attendance. seems like an improper use of resources that may be required elsewhere.

What kind of remark is that to make? :rolleyes:

By all accounts, the lady involved suffered horrific injuries and may have died had the response of the emergency services not been what it was. :mad:

Cookie_Monster

as a matter of interest would the fire brigade ahve the equipment to jack up a train if required?

Coriolanus

You're looking at about 50-75 tonnes, that's presuming they can detach the line and raise each carriage individually. I wouldn't think they'd have anything on hand. You'd be talking a crane or at least some pretty heavy duty pneumatic lifts.

Victor

Without wishing to be morbid (it is late, I'm not sure if this is the right word), anything that goes under a train generally isn't coming out in one piece, there would be little need to lift it. Using a crane in the vicinity of the tensioned overhead cables would be problematic.

Irish Rail do have teams that can lift carriages for re-railing after derailments.

If you ever have a train heading towards you, go for the space under the platform, or second choice, between the tracks, never on the sleepers between the rails - some trains have a lot of equipment in this space or their could be cables, chains, etc.

shamwari

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

as a matter of interest would the fire brigade ahve the equipment to jack up a train if required?

Short answer is yes. They have hydraulic jacks and inflatable bags that can do the job. Saw similar being used to lift a fully laden HGV off a cyclist who was mown down in Dublin city centre. Thankfully the cyclist survived, albeit badly injured.

Cookie_Monster

shamwari wrote: »

Short answer is yes. They have hydraulic jacks and inflatable bags that can do the job. Saw similar being used to lift a fully laden HGV off a cyclist who was mown down in Dublin city centre. Thankfully the cyclist survived, albeit badly injured.

Yes that was what i was wondering essentially, would that standard equip lift the weight of a carraige / dmu etc

shamwari

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Yes that was what i was wondering essentially, would that standard equip lift the weight of a carraige / dmu etc

I wouldn't imagine that a DMU would be significantly heavier than a comparably sized single-decker coach. So weight wouldn't be an issue as such, particularly if the emergency services can lift a fully laden HGV. Remember too that when lifting, the vehicle doesn't need to be lifted quite high. Several inches of lift for a short time is usually sufficient to enable the immediate extracation of the victim.

patrickbrophy18

Victor wrote: »

Someone would appear to have been injured or killed. It may not have been a deliberate action.

Quite right. The circumstances leading up to the accident are yet to be confirmed.

Victor wrote: »

People who commit suicide tend to be ill and/or distressed, not selfish.

I'd be inclined to disagree with you on this one. If someone commits suicide by throwing themselves into the path of a car, train or other form of heavy machinery, it is incredibly selfish. I can't begin to imagine the high level of guilt and trauma imposed on the driver or operator and onlookers in such cases. Let's not forget the friends and relatives who would be deeply affected. To cut a long story short, the mental damage left behind would be rather large and long lasting too.

Victor

patrickbrophy18 wrote: »

If someone commits suicide by throwing themselves into the path of a car, train or other form of heavy machinery, it is incredibly selfish.

Someone who is in such a mental state to do something like this, would tend not to have the clarity of thought to be blameworthy.

You are engaging in 'blame the victim', which just makes it worse for them.

patrickbrophy18

Crikey, there appears to be a lot of either overly sensitive or socialist people on these types of forms lately.

Victor wrote: »

Someone who is in such a mental state to do something like this, would tend not to have the clarity of thought to be blameworthy.

While it may very well not have been the case with the incident in Dun Laoghaire DART Station, anyone who decides to commit suicide by manipulating man operated machinery is completely inconsiderate. Essentially, they are trying to die in such a way that would not only traumatize onlookers but someone who is doing their job. If, as you say, someone "is in such a mental state", public areas should be off limits to them as such states make them a danger to others. I doubt people like parents and their kids want to be around a person that's like a ticking time bomb ready to go off.

Victor wrote: »

You are engaging in 'blame the victim', which just makes it worse for them.

I would hardly call someone with self inflicted injuries a victim.

Seaswimmer

patrickbrophy18 wrote: »

Crikey, there appears to be a lot of either overly sensitive or socialist people on these types of forms lately.



While it may very well not have been the case with the incident in Dun Laoghaire DART Station, anyone who decides to commit suicide by manipulating man operated machinery is completely inconsiderate. Essentially, they are trying to die in such a way that would not only traumatize onlookers but someone who is doing their job. If, as you say, someone "is in such a mental state", public areas should be off limits to them as such states make them a danger to others. I doubt people like parents and their kids want to be around a person that's like a ticking time bomb ready to go off.



I would hardly call someone with self inflicted injuries a victim.

Things are rarely as black and white as you make them out to be in this and many of your previous posts.

I think most normal people on here would feel deep sympathy for EVERYONE concerned. Victim, witnesses, driver, emergency services ect..

sligotrain

People going under trains is a highly traumatic experience for all concerned. In fact, as a method of suicide it is often one of the least effective. The person concerned may well end up maiming themselves for life.

I know of drivers who have experienced attempted and actual suicides and it is not something they ever forget, London Underground in particular has a high level of PUT (person under train) incidents and drivers are specifically trained to cope with these situations. But it remains a highly traumatic experience for all concerned.

It is in my opinion, a dangerous practice to condemn and villify the victims themselves. I am married to a Psychologist who deals with both the families and the victims (where the victim survives of course) and I have to say that anyone who chooses to pontificate about selfishness and socialism should hang their heads in shame.

Too often it's a real gap in our own social services that ultimately leads to people choosing to end their own lives. Mental health issues do not stop convieniently at 5pm on a Friday. We should wake up now to the scandalous lack of a proper out of hours mental health and social service in this country. As someone whose own extended family fell victim to this I cannot emphasise how important understanding is.

Losty Dublin

One of the DART drivers makes regular talks to trainee drivers. He's had no less than seven suicides on his watch and a few attempted ones as well.

parsi

Losty Dublin wrote: »

One of the DART drivers makes regular talks to trainee drivers. He's had no less than seven suicides on his watch and a few attempted ones as well.

They must have been horrible experiences and something that stays with one for life. The sense of powerlessness must be tremendous and quite heart rending. I'm sure counselling can only go so far to help matters (though there are some who'd begrudge even that).

I presume he doesn't give out if more than one emergency service person arrives on scene ?

shamwari

patrickbrophy18 wrote: »

Crikey, there appears to be a lot of either overly sensitive or socialist people on these types of forms lately.

Nope, it's not over-sensitivity or socialism. It's called compassion. Which, with respect, is something which the balance of your post clearly shows you are devoid of.

shamwari

Losty Dublin wrote: »

One of the DART drivers makes regular talks to trainee drivers. He's had no less than seven suicides on his watch and a few attempted ones as well.

I've also heard tales from drivers that are too shocking, horrible and tragic to repeat here. Very grim stuff. Suffice to say, I have great admiration for someone who can still do their job after what that driver above has been through

Losty Dublin

parsi wrote: »

They must have been horrible experiences and something that stays with one for life. The sense of powerlessness must be tremendous and quite heart rending. I'm sure counselling can only go so far to help matters (though there are some who'd begrudge even that).

I presume he doesn't give out if more than one emergency service person arrives on scene ?

shamwari wrote:

I've also heard tales from drivers that are too shocking, horrible and tragic to repeat here. Very grim stuff. Suffice to say, I have great admiration for someone who can still do their job after what that driver above has been through

My Dad had at least two suicides than I can recount him telling me off; it wasn't a topic you'd want to press him on for obvious reasons. There was also the numberous livestock and wild animals that would meet their makers which were equally gruesome at times.

One other especially vulgar incident that he encountered was when he was taking a goods bound for Cork one night and somebody threw a sack down off a bridge which hit the train. When he got out to do his incident checks, the by then burst sacks contents were all over the track and train cab; it was full of puppy dogs

patrickbrophy18

Seaswimmer wrote: »

Things are rarely as black and white as you make them out to be in this and many of your previous posts.

I think most normal people on here would feel deep sympathy for EVERYONE concerned. Victim, witnesses, driver, emergency services ect..

From what I gather from a lot of the posts, the incident at Dun Laoghaire DART Station appears to have been an accident. In this case, my hopes and prayers do indeed go out to "EVERYONE" involved. In fact, I hope that the medical unit at the hospital were able to surgically re-attach all severed bodily parts of the victim. I've seen cases on medical TV programs where people with severed arms have had them re-attached successfully and months on make a complete and miraculous recovery. Please be to god that this will be one of those cases!

Anyway, on the matter of suicides, there are many instances where I would sympathize for someone who does commit suicide. For example, if someone chooses to end their lives by themselves on their own merit, I would be incredibly upset for them and especially their families as it would be an isolated incident. In this instance, they aren't taking casualties with them. Nevertheless, in such cases there is something which could have been done to prevent them from occurring. I can't even begin to imagine the grief that the families would face for the years and perhaps decades following an incident like this. In any case, my hopes and prayers would be with the victim and their families. As per sligotrain's assertion, I too agree that social services to help people in such a state because the mental pain is indeed 24/7 and not 9-5 Monday to Friday.

However, there are a host of surrounding dangers involved in committing suicide on a road or train tracks. This can be anything from the risk of a pile up if it is a road (due to the increased likelihood of death imposed on drivers, pedestrians and cyclists) to a derailment if it's done on tracks (where the lives of passengers as well as the train driver are put at risk). For this reason, committing suicide on someone else's watch (particularly on roads or railways) is akin to suicide bombings on flights where the lives and well-being of others are placed at risk. As such, if someone chooses to commit suicide by endangering the lives of others, this immediately makes me devoid of sympathy and compassion (as per shamwari's phrasing). Having said that, my sympathies would still go out to EVERYONE ELSE concerned (families, friends, workers and all).

parsi

foggy_lad wrote: »

If it was a suicide/person hit by a train you would wonder why there would be so many ambulances and fire service vehicles in attendance. seems like an improper use of resources that may be required elsewhere.

Reported for being uncivil and likely to cause stress to other members.

davidlacey

sure some junkie passed out on a street or road must be more important , what a rather dumb comment saying it is an improper use of resources , so emergency services have to choose who to save or not based on their state of mind and if it was an incident or an accident? get real foggy

Cookie_Monster

parsi wrote: »

Reported for being uncivil and likely to cause stress to other members.

what a load of BS:rolleyes:

stress to other members? come off it

Victor

davidlacey wrote: »

sure some junkie passed out on a street or road must be more important , what a rather dumb comment saying it is an improper use of resources , so emergency services have to choose who to save or not based on their state of mind and if it was an incident or an accident? get real foggy

I think his point is why was there a major response, rather than just one ambulance and the reason was because the passengers needed to be de-boarded via the tracks. And of course there could be people suffering from shock.

dermo88

Patrickbrophy18

If someone commits suicide by throwing themselves into the path of a car, train or other form of heavy machinery, it is incredibly selfish.

Of course they are, but it is sadly the last resort for many who find themselves in that mental state.

Patrickbrophy18
Crikey, there appears to be a lot of either overly sensitive or socialist people on these types of forms lately.

Edited, because poster appears to have adjusted his, and exercised a bit more tact, rather than behaving like a knuckle dragging American tea partier.

Losty Dublin

My Dad had at least two suicides than I can recount him telling me off; it wasn't a topic you'd want to press him on for obvious reasons. There was also the numberous livestock and wild animals that would meet their makers which were equally gruesome at times.

I cannot describe the sheer sense of forboding if you see a car or truck stalled ahead on a level crossing. You have 300 meters to go at 90kph, thats 12 seconds...you start counting....

I recall being in a cab ride once overseas....outside Ireland. I start saying Hail Marys. The driver started praying to his boy. The truck moved with 5 seconds and less than 80 meters to go, and he'd slammed the brakes on HARD.

I turned the air fairly blue on that incident. The driver laughed and said "You get used to it", and chain smoked his way along. Mind, if Hanifi saw drugs addicts shooting up on the track, he actually accelerated. He definitely had a mad black sense of humour to say the least. "My road, my rails, my rules, and you know damn well I have 300 tonnes of steel which won't stop, as he rammed the throttle into notch eight. The engine roared, the horn blared, and his view was "Well if my train kills them, tough. I get on the mobile to the police, and let them deal with it. I've a schedule to keep and if I've put them out of the misery of earthly addiction and existence, they should thank me" Unfortunately that was until he ran over 3 kids sleeping on the tracks on an overnight freight, and that traumatised him. That was the only time he stopped to check, because they woke up and ran. He wished he had followed his normal developing world procedures, where life essentially is cheap(er). Within 3 months, he'd taken a payoff, resigned, and started up a trucking business which paid him three times as much as before.

Drivers are traumatised by the worst of these. You've got a nice spruce engine, and someone decides its a fast efficient convenient way to end their lives. Some, a few develop a rather dark sense of humour as a coping skill. The money might be half decent, but the long hours and unsocial nature of the job have a hard psychological impact, but many would not do anything else, it almost becomes a vocation.

Losty Dublin

parsi wrote: »

Reported for being uncivil and likely to cause stress to other members.

Reported here as well.

dermo88

Losty Dublin

One of the DART drivers makes regular talks to trainee drivers. He's had no less than seven suicides on his watch and a few attempted ones as well.



Hoe does anyone cope with that........I'd go nuts.

Victor

dermo88 wrote: »

Its nice to know that you appear to be a nasty right wing reactionary sociopath devoid of compassion or sympathy for your fellow human being. Go back to your cave and mourn the loss of Mitt Romney you effing sick one percenter.

No need to be so harsh or indeed offensive.

For your information, I am neither socialist or sensitive, but theres a point in time you might wish to exercise some tact.

See, I know you are capable of choosing the right words.

Moderator

Losty Dublin

dermo88 wrote: »

Losty Dublin

One of the DART drivers makes regular talks to trainee drivers. He's had no less than seven suicides on his watch and a few attempted ones as well.



Hoe does anyone cope with that........I'd go nuts.

That's a very good question. These days the drivers have options of counselors and psychologists they can be referred to and time off which is often forced upon them. In older times it was pints or a shot of whiskey after you got to your destination; pioneers tended to have rather bald rosary beads as well and I say that with no tongue in cheek.

loyatemu

two first-hand accounts, might offer some insight:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2012/jan/27/i-threw-myself-under-a-train
http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2011/feb/26/run-over-by-freight-train

Victor

parsi wrote: »

Reported for being uncivil and likely to cause stress to other members.

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Reported here as well.

Knock it off.

If you have a problem with a post, either counter it or report it. None of this snide 'I'm telling on you' stuff.

Reported issues actually need to be for breaches of the rules.

Moderator.

Sponge Bob

I had the misfortune to rely a lot on the (London Tube) Northern Line once.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/tube-suicides-increase-by-74-per-cent-as-recession-worries-hit-home-6366152.html