Boiler service responsibility ?

Stuxnet

My partner and I, and our 2 kids moved into a property last feburary, obviously up till recently there hasnt been much need to use the gas bolier, well now its in full swing everyday.
There is a next service due sticker on the boiler, it says due march 2008,

Now the estate agent guy who looks after a number of houses in this estate swears the boiler was serviced in the last year, before we arrived, how convenient, but I don't see any evidence of this, he says his mate did it, (i wouldnt trust this guy as far as i could throw him) :rolleyes: and he cant ask the landlord to do it again.

We're not too convinced, and the pressure is at .5 when it should be between 1 & 2.5, I don't want to go adjusting valves, I want for my own peace of mind and children's safety a registered gas service engineer do a job on it.

what can I do, we've no contact for or ever met this phantom landlord, and agent is playing hardball.....should I just order a bord gais engineer out, and post the bill to the estate agent ?

Thanks

murphaph

Stuxnet wrote: »

My partner and I, and our 2 kids moved into a property last feburary, obviously up till recently there hasnt been much need to use the gas bolier, well now its in full swing everyday.
There is a next service due sticker on the boiler, it says due march 2008,

Now the estate agent guy who looks after a number of houses in this estate swears the boiler was serviced in the last year, before we arrived, how convenient, but I don't see any evidence of this, he says his mate did it, (i wouldnt trust this guy as far as i could throw him) :rolleyes: and he cant ask the landlord to do it again.

We're not too convinced, and the pressure is at .5 when it should be between 1 & 2.5, I don't want to go adjusting valves, I want for my own peace of mind and children's safety a registered gas service engineer do a job on it.

what can I do, we've no contact for or ever met this phantom landlord, and agent is playing hardball.....should I just order a bord gais engineer out, and post the bill to the estate agent ?

Thanks

I fully understand your concerns. The pressure being low is a potential problem but not likely to cause harm, however a poorly serviced boiler could obviously be dangerous wrt carbon monoxide.

I think you should at least get it in writing from the agent that the boiler has been serviced and preferably a cert from the guy who did it.

I'm getting my boiler serviced next week in my rented out house. I couldn't live with myself if it killed my tenants and as far as I know the landlord is legally responsible for this too.

ABajaninCork

murphaph wrote: »

I think you should at least get it in writing from the agent that the boiler has been serviced and preferably a cert from the guy who did it.

I'm getting my boiler serviced next week in my rented out house. I couldn't live with myself if it killed my tenants and as far as I know the landlord is legally responsible for this too.

Totally agree. Get it in writing. And yes. The landlord is responsible for the upkeep of the boiler.

fasttalkerchat

Personally I would get the best price and charge it to the landlord after giving him a few weeks to do it himself.
Others may disagree but I don't see how a stingy landlords profit comes before your children's safety.

murphaph

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

Personally I would get the best price and charge it to the landlord after giving him a few weeks to do it himself.
Others may disagree but I don't see how a stingy landlords profit comes before your children's safety.

You're jumping to all sorts of conclusions about this landlord whom you have never met, nor has the OP!

The agent is between the OP and their landlord. That's all we know. Perhaps the agent charged the LL for a service that never took place, for all we know!

The LL may well be making a hefty loss by the way (though the boiler should still be serviced)

A boiler service only runs to €60 or so. If the OP is genuinely concerned about the safety of the system then I would advise having it serviced at their own expense and worrying about the €60 afterwards.

GASMANN

if the boiler was serviced in febuary, the rgi ( registered gas installer ) who serviced it would have issued a "declaration of conformance" certificate.
by law ONLY an rgi can service/do any work on a gas boiler and when this or any gas works are completed, a d.c cert MUST be issued.
a copy of the d.c goes to the property owner, the register of gas installers and to the rgi themselves, so you should have no problem getting a copy as there are three of the same cert available.

this may not apply to yourself o.p, but any private landlord renting to local counclis have to present their cert's annually to the council. the concils are very black and white about this.

jd

Is it a gas boiler? It's a fairly trivial operation to increase the pressure in the system by turning a valve for a few seconds - we have to do it every few months or so.

murphaph

jd wrote: »

Is it a gas boiler? It's a fairly trivial operation to increase the pressure in the system by turning a valve for a few seconds - we have to do it every few months or so.

Some systems have a filling loop, not a valve, but the pressure being low is not going to kill anyone anyway. The concern here is wrt carbon monoxide.

Stuxnet

Thanks for the replies folks, ya course I'm not worried about the pressure, Im concerned at being totally and rudely being fobbed off, told "my word is good enough now stop pestering me about the bolier..." (paraphrasing :-p ) its grand attitiude.

Thanks for the information about the certificates, I have requested them in an email....Ive a feeling he'll be asking me to book a service this week :-p

xper

OP, in addition to chasing the cert, for peace of mind, buy an approved carbon monoxide alarm and position it correctly

djimi

Stuxnet wrote: »

Im concerned at being totally and rudely being fobbed off, told "my word is good enough now stop pestering me about the bolier..." (paraphrasing :-p ) its grand attitiude.

If this is the way that he is speaking to you then keep all future correspondance to letters only (registered).

Stuxnet

Update:

No reply from the agent after I asked him for the certificates :mad:

Anybody regulate these guys ?, I don't give a toss about the price of the service, but the fact this guy can thinks he can fob me off like this and ill go away really annoys me, anybody I can complain to and get heavy with my demand for these boiler service certificates

tonyheaney

ABajaninCork wrote: »

Totally agree. Get it in writing. And yes. The landlord is responsible for the upkeep of the boiler.

Hi sorry i know this is a bit late but i need to know,who is responsible for getting and paying the serving of my gas boiler? we live in a RAZ house and need to know what if the landlord says no, what are my rights then?

foggy_lad

tonyheaney wrote: »

Hi sorry i know this is a bit late but i need to know,who is responsible for getting and paying the serving of my gas boiler? we live in a RAZ house and need to know what if the landlord says no, what are my rights then?

In a ras property the landlord is responsible for all maintenance and servicing of boilers etc.

The_Conductor

foggy_lad wrote: »

In a ras property the landlord is responsible for all maintenance and servicing of boilers etc.

Yes.
Whether or not an annual service is mandated, is open to debate- the term 'regular service' is used on the Bord Gais, and British Gas websites, as opposed to 'annual service'.
In an Irish context the boiler is a tax deductible consumable from a landlord's tax perspective (not 100% sure over what term, I have a suspicion its on a different flatline deduction than other costs).

RAS is problematic- as the landlord is already accepting below the market rent for the property- and often perceives these issues as council issues, rather than his or her issue- which results in the buck being passed between the two. In actual fact- as you have surmised, it is the responsibility of the landlord.

mad m

jd wrote: »

Is it a gas boiler? It's a fairly trivial operation to increase the pressure in the system by turning a valve for a few seconds - we have to do it every few months or so.

You shouldn't have to top up your gas boiler at all, you either have a small weep or your expansion vessel may need replacing. You will know if expansion vessel is gone if pressure builds up to over 3 bar and you get a blow off of water through the safety valve. Otherwise do you have to vent radiators at all?

tonyheaney

The_Conductor wrote: »

Yes.
Whether or not an annual service is mandated, is open to debate- the term 'regular service' is used on the Bord Gais, and British Gas websites, as opposed to 'annual service'.
In an Irish context the boiler is a tax deductible consumable from a landlord's tax perspective (not 100% sure over what term, I have a suspicion its on a different flatline deduction than other costs).

RAS is problematic- as the landlord is already accepting below the market rent for the property- and often perceives these issues as council issues, rather than his or her issue- which results in the buck being passed between the two. In actual fact- as you have surmised, it is the responsibility of the landlord.

We have been in the house since January 1 2011 and no one has looked at it since we moved in

The_Conductor

tonyheaney wrote: »

We have been in the house since January 1 2011 and no one has looked at it since we moved in

Have you not organised a service yourself?

mari2222

standards of rented dwellings

Article 13 - Electricity and Gas
 Installations in the house for electricity and gas
supply must be maintained in good repair and
safe working order.
 There must also be, where necessary, provision
for the safe and effective removal of fumes to the
external air.

The_Conductor

mari2222 wrote: »

standards of rented dwellings

Article 13 - Electricity and Gas
 Installations in the house for electricity and gas
supply must be maintained in good repair and
safe working order.
 There must also be, where necessary, provision
for the safe and effective removal of fumes to the
external air.

I know.
Unfortunately absolutely nothing there about an annual service.
The Bord Gais and the British Gas websites have suspiciously similar wording about ensuring a gas boiler is 'serviced regularly' but both neglect to define what 'regularly' means.

OP- for your own peace of mind- with the permission of the landlord, get it properly serviced. Its only 50-60 Euro, and you get a proper report from the engineer. Its illegal for anyone other than an RGI approved technician to service a gas boiler.

ABajaninCork

The_Conductor wrote: »

I know.
Unfortunately absolutely nothing there about an annual service.
The Bord Gais and the British Gas websites have suspiciously similar wording about ensuring a gas boiler is 'serviced regularly' but both neglect to define what 'regularly' means.

OP- for your own peace of mind- with the permission of the landlord, get it properly serviced. Its only 50-60 Euro, and you get a proper report from the engineer. Its illegal for anyone other than an RGI approved technician to service a gas boiler.

Regularly in the UK means Annually. It's the law in the UK a CP12 (Gas Cert) MUST be issued to tenants on a yearly basis. Before issuing one, the gas fitter (who must be Gas Safe certified) has to service the boiler and check it over thoroughly before the cert is issued.

foggy_lad

The_Conductor wrote: »

RAS is problematic- as the landlord is already accepting below the market rent for the property- and often perceives these issues as council issues, rather than his or her issue- which results in the buck being passed between the two. In actual fact- as you have surmised, it is the responsibility of the landlord.

It will have been made crystal clear to all landlords who sign up to the RAS scheme that all maintenance and servicing of heating appliances are their sole responsibility. They are also responsible for broken windows except where a tenant breaks them maliciously. RAS is not so much problematic but it is so clear in the terms that there is no way the landlords can get out of it saying they didn't know or weren't sure!

tonyheaney

The_Conductor wrote: »

Have you not organised a service yourself?

Referring to my original question would i pay for it? or land lord?

tonyheaney

There must also be, where necessary, provision
for the safe and effective removal of fumes to the
external air.

In our kitchen we have no external Fan for the cooker. A lot of the cooking smell is vented to the bedrooms. does this fall in that category?

ABajaninCork

foggy_lad wrote: »

It will have been made crystal clear to all landlords who sign up to the RAS scheme that all maintenance and servicing of heating appliances are their sole responsibility. They are also responsible for broken windows except where a tenant breaks them maliciously. RAS is not so much problematic but it is so clear in the terms that there is no way the landlords can get out of it saying they didn't know or weren't sure!

According to Foggy_lad, it's down to the landlord. Who is the LL in your rent agreement? Is it the council, or the owner?

I'd call the CC in the morning and ask.

tonyheaney

foggy_lad wrote: »

It will have been made crystal clear to all landlords who sign up to the RAS scheme that all maintenance and servicing of heating appliances are their sole responsibility. They are also responsible for broken windows except where a tenant breaks them maliciously. RAS is not so much problematic but it is so clear in the terms that there is no way the landlords can get out of it saying they didn't know or weren't sure!

We have windows that do not closes properly, when we do close them there is always a big gap on the hinge side so we have to kinda give them a good bang.

My wife gave the baby's window a good bang 5 days ago and the handle and part of the window frame broke away. 4 days ago we reported it and no one has come to look at it. what happens now? who pays for it and how much??

tonyheaney

ABajaninCork wrote: »

According to Foggy_lad, it's down to the landlord. Who is the LL in your rent agreement? Is it the council, or the owner?

I'd call the CC in the morning and ask.

we are in a raz house and there is a pig of a property manager in place