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Waterford Airport.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,044 ✭✭✭ hardybuck

    Jeez all this fascination with distance Waterford might be from other airports and different parts of the country is an absolute dose. What other places might or might not be getting is also extremely petty.

    By the sounds of things Waterford Airport are finalising a new business case to reflect the fact that the runway extension is going to cost far more than previously envisaged. It also sounds like the Comer deal isn't actually finalised yet - and these are far more relevant to the future of the airport than how long it might take to drive from Tullamore or Enniscorty.

  • Registered Users Posts: 7,768 ✭✭✭ blackwhite

    Sligo airport is a more like-for-like comparison. Has a rescue helicopter and some aero-club activities, but no commercial routes.

    Also got zero funding.

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,044 ✭✭✭ hardybuck

    The airport will require the support of people from in the region, and further afield, if it is to survive. Quite a bit of the recent posts have been focusing on how long it'll take to get to the airport from places like Kildare.

    Posters who seem to be quite clearly from the city also regularly focus their attention on what's happening in other places outside Waterford, often quite sour and negative posts.

    Therefore it's not surprising that posters from outside the area are interested in this discussion.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,861 ✭✭✭ Cosmo Kramer

    Waterford is welcome to expand, if it does so with private funding and subsequently continues to be privately funded to make up the inevitable financial shortfall caused by a lack of demand for it's services due to its hopeless location to the south of the city and in a region that is already very well connected by road to other facilities. Same as Galway would have been in that respect had someone invested in it at the time.

    But there's extremely limited justification, if any, for government funding of an airport expansion in a location that has a two hour motorway link to the largest airport in the state - whether that's Galway Airport or Waterford. Which is what people seem to be asking for here - millions of government money for an airport that really isn't needed and few will use.

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,822 ✭✭✭ BBM77

    Oh I get it, government money should not be spend on projects in Waterford.

    Why were you arguing Galway airport should have expanded? Realistically that would have only happened with government money and you knew that when you wrote it. If Waterford can get a small amount from the government and at least try to make a success of its regional airport. What is wrong with that? Why the clear double double standards?

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,044 ✭✭✭ hardybuck

    We can do without the Google Maps again for a long time now that you've done such a thorough job with it.

    If the airport does reopen it'll require a lot more regional support than it got ever before to stay open. One of Kerry's London routes would get roughly the same number of passengers as Waterford got across all it's routes on it's busiest ever year.

    Ultimately that's the decisive factor, not the Government or anything else. There is loads of unspent capital funding every year. This extension will get approved if whoever actually owns and runs the place these days can put together a reasonable business case to get approval for extra inflation related costs.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,861 ✭✭✭ Cosmo Kramer

    It would be in the region of another 5 million a year, every year, to keep the place operating with commercial flights. Let's not pretend this is a one off funding request, it's an annual subsidy that's being sought here to operate an unnecessary unviable airport. It's madness.

    If the Comers or the local rate payers or whoever want to waste their money on it year after year then fair enough, but wanting the public purse to pay for a white elephant airport given the level of infrastructure investment there has already been in the south east in the last 20 years really is quite something.

  • Registered Users Posts: 604 ✭✭✭ Dunmoreroader

    I don't see the word Mods under your name, me bucko, so I'll post what I feel like within the rules of the forum thanks very much.

  • Registered Users Posts: 604 ✭✭✭ Dunmoreroader

    I forgot Kerry.....bit of a stretch but you'd never know, yanks in London wanting to see the Ring of Kerry on Pattys Day, who'd normally fly into Dublin or some such. Who knows? 😉

  • Registered Users Posts: 604 ✭✭✭ Dunmoreroader

    Just discovered the good people at SENSER had produced this study a few years back;

    Population figures and therefore potential catchment numbers have only risen sharply since then.

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭ 914

    In 2007 Kerry airport had just over 300k passengers

    In 2007 Waterford had just over 140k passengers.

    Considering Waterford was running with turbo prop ATR72's with a costly regional airline compared to Kerry running RyanAir and PSO services to Dublin.

    Waterford did not fair out to bad, had Waterford have been on the same par as Kerry, runway length, type of aircraft and destinations, who is to say we would not be handling similar passenger numbers?

  • Registered Users Posts: 638 ✭✭✭ azimuth17

    Someone remind me of just how much debt was taken from Cork Airport and put on DAA balance sheet? (Cork Airport’s €200m debt is a “red herring” that has no impact on its day-to-day operations but which would be even greater today had the airport been responsible for it over the past number of years, rather than the DAA. Examiner) Waterford Airport never had a realistic chance of succeeding with turbo prop versus 737s with costs being divided by seat numbers. Again, if we are going to have an airport to facilitate the things that happen there at present then we should have a proper runway.Kerry and Knock both succeeded when they could access jet flights. Galway failed without them. If private investment is prepared to take the gamble on Waterford, then so be it. Why should that matter to the persistent voices posting here that just dont want an airport in Waterford at all?. Just do wonder how the airport might have progressed if it had had a 737 runway when Ryanair started there. Odds on they would still be there.

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,044 ✭✭✭ hardybuck

    Yeah and two years later Waterford’s numbers had held steady while Kerry's grew further to 426k. The likes of Knock are hitting about 800k a year also in the last full pre-Covid year.

    It looks like that's the sort of benchmark to be aiming for, and therefore passenger numbers would need to treble or quadruple from the previous peaks for the operation to be viable. It'd be a huge shift but who knows as you say.

  • Registered Users Posts: 261 ✭✭ cal naughton

    Is see the catchment area debate is still going on!

    There could be a population of 5Million on the airports doorstep and it still wouldn't matter. If the comers get control it's for a property play.

    Airport operators they are not!

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭ 914

    Again those two years after, Waterford was very limited due to the runway and airline, full length runway in place and the option of jet aircraft and things could be different.

    Anyhow we can all argue all day if Waterford is viable or not or whether we have the population to support it and potential airlines.

    Fact of the matter is, it is all irrelevant unless we have the runway in place.

    Will we get the runway? I'm not so sure, business case has still yet to be sent into government, no word on contracts with the Galway lads.

    No pun intended but it's all still up in the air.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,227 ✭✭✭ snotboogie

    I was responding to a poster who said that there is a population of 1 million within a 1 hour drive of Waterford airport, which is a nonsense, its not even half that. You then went off posting screenshots of how one can get the Naas in 90 minutes or how you can squeeze to an unpopulated Kildare county boundary on the M8 in just over an hour, all of which has nothing to do with the original claim.

  • Registered Users Posts: 604 ✭✭✭ Dunmoreroader

    So what, they're going to build apartments along each side of the runway or knock through the fence to the business park and build more units on the airport land? If they wanted to diversify into redeveloping obsolete airports don't they have a handier candidate on their own doorstep?

  • Registered Users Posts: 261 ✭✭ cal naughton

    The Galway airport is owned by the city and county councils who have been burned before when dealing with them so no chance they would sell.

    Thankfully the councils realize that the airport is not commercially viable and there are plans for an industrial estate which is ideal for the growing medical device companies who are all based on the east side of the city.

  • Registered Users Posts: 137 ✭✭ Valhalla90

    Any update on this never ending saga?

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭ 914

    Other then the fact the runway was to be started in Q1 of 2023 but any financial plan has yet to be submitted to government!

  • Registered Users Posts: 181 ✭✭ Bhoy1967

    Any update on this - thought we were looking at March start and no sign of any movement yet?

  • Registered Users Posts: 34,401 ✭✭✭✭ PTH2009

    Suppose us Waterford folk have the 'North Quays' and 'Walsh Park redevelopment' happening

    We should be happy with what we got and not be mentioning anything more

  • Registered Users Posts: 874 ✭✭✭ Asdfgh2020

    Is it a case of ‘build it and they will come’ ie an airline like Ryanair/Aer Lingus or wait for an airline to commit before commencing works…?

  • Registered Users Posts: 17,783 ✭✭✭✭ JCX BXC

    No airline will ever commit, so if it's going to be built it'll be a build it and hope they come.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭ 914

    Not financial plan sent to government as of yet, so very unlikely we even see any movement in Q2