Quick Question?...

The Dagda

So i was overtaking a line (5/6) of cars on a straight road (broken white line) and a car pulls out from a side road into the lane i was in.

I flashed the guy who had pulled onto the road, he stops on the road, and i complete the overtake.

My options were pull into the line of cars the left, or continue the overtake.

What was the correct option?

kleefarr

Slow down a bit and let him in?

Toyotafanboi

let me get this straight, 2 points

you were overtaking 5 or 6 cars at once?
did the car pull into the lane you were in while you were overtaking? as in he pulled out having looked to the right not expecting to find you on the wrong side of the road going in the wrong direction to his left?

edit : if either of these is correct then you should really leave 5 minutes earlier kind of job.

CiniO

The correct option was to not overtake on the approach to the junction with side road.


But if you were already in the situation you described - there is nothing wrong with pulling in the left between the cars provided they keep appropriate distance between each other (unfortunately usually they don't).
Option you chose was probably not bad either, as you made it without crashing into oncoming car, which means there was enough space.

The Dagda

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

let me get this straight, 2 points

you were overtaking 5 or 6 cars at once?
did the car pull into the lane you were in while you were overtaking? as in he pulled out having looked to the right not expecting to find you on the wrong side of the road going in the wrong direction to his left?

edit : if either of these is correct then you should really leave 5 minutes earlier kind of job.

Line of cars travelling at 80kph, straight road, broken white line, dry, about 1500m visibility. Car pulls into right lane having looked left and not right.

The Dagda

CiniO wrote: »

The correct option was to not overtake on the approach to the junction with side road.


But if you were already in the situation you described - there is nothing wrong with pulling in the left between the cars provided they keep appropriate distance between each other (unfortunately usually they don't).
Option you chose was probably not bad either, as you made it without crashing into oncoming car, which means there was enough space.

There were no gaps, cars up each others arses

FatMickey

The Dagda wrote: »

I flashed the guy

A guy got pulled for flashing as he walked towards a girl on broad street the other day… surely its against the law.

Light Switch

Good man Pat!

Toyotafanboi

The Dagda wrote: »

Line of cars travelling at 80kph, straight road, broken white line, dry, about 1500m visibility. Car pulls into right lane having looked left and not right.

personally i think regardless of condition overtaking 5 cars at once is taking the piss.

i dont know the maths, but im sure someone on here can calculate it. using epically rough semi made up numbers in my head at 2am. to overtake 6 cars, with a combined length of say 40 meters including the gaps between each car, traveling at 20 meters per second. i mean its probably around 20 seconds before that whole manouver is over and in that time you've covered half a kilometer.

regardless of the broken white line, visibility is good criac, common sense should still prevail.

The Dagda

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

personally i think regardless of condition overtaking 5 cars at once is taking the piss.

i dont know the maths, but im sure someone on here can calculate it. using epically rough semi made up numbers in my head at 2am. to overtake 6 cars, with a combined length of say 40 meters including the gaps between each car, traveling at 20 meters per second. i mean its probably around 20 seconds before that whole manouver is over and in that time you've covered half a kilometer.

regardless of the broken white line, visibility is good criac, common sense should still prevail.

Right... but what if the road is clear for 1500m BUT someone pulls on to the road without having checked both ways?

Toyotafanboi

The Dagda wrote: »

Right... but what if the road is clear for 1500m BUT someone pulls on to the road without having checked both ways?

at the time you decided to start the manouver it was clear, but not even the lord himself could predict what the road conditions would be like in 1500 meters/ 30 seconds time.

i mean lets be clear here. if God forbid you did cause an accident. who will the gardai find at fault.

- the fella pulling out who didn't check left when leaving his garden.

or

- the guy overtaking 6 cars on the wrong side of the road.

honest answers here?

The Dagda

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

at the time you decided to start the manouver it was clear, but not even the lord himself could predict what the road conditions would be like in 1500 meters/ 30 seconds time.

i mean lets be clear here. if God forbid you did cause an accident. who will the gardai find at fault.

- the fella pulling out who didn't check left when leaving his garden.

or

- the guy overtaking 6 cars on the wrong side of the road.

honest answers here?

Honest answer? Who broke the law? The person overtaking or the person who pulled out into without checking first?

The rules of the road clearly state (i realise the rules are only guidelines, and i'm paraphrasing) that you have to check both ways before entering a road. IIRC the rules also specifically mention looking out for overtaking cars.

So who's wrong? Honest answers...

Esel

The Dagda wrote: »

So i was overtaking a line (5/6) of cars on a straight road (broken white line) and a car pulls out from a side road into the lane i was in.

I flashed the guy who had pulled onto the road, he stops on the road, and i complete the overtake.

My options were pull into the line of cars the left, or continue the overtake.

What was the correct option?

The Dagda wrote: »

Line of cars travelling at 80kph, straight road, broken white line, dry, about 1500m visibility. Car pulls into right lane having looked left and not right.

The Dagda wrote: »

There were no gaps, cars up each others arses

You need to be clearer, to be honest...

Firstly, afaik, overtaking a series of vehicles is very severely frowned upon by AGS.

Secondly, you should not be on the wrong side of the carriageway approaching a junction on the right. This is a major no-no...

Thirdly, you should always drive at such a speed that you can stop in the distance that you can see to be clear.

/High horse.

Toyotafanboi

The Dagda wrote: »

Honest answers...

you discovered half way through a stupid stunt that you had bitten off more than you could chew, got a fright and somehow feel aggrieved. thats the honest answer here.

if you were the person pulling out of a siding and were forced to swerve and stop to avoid an oncoming overtaker i'm sure you'd be on here giving out about that too.

6 cars to overtake = too many. unless your a driving a veyron or something.

The Dagda

Esel wrote: »

You need to be clearer, to be honest...

Firstly, afaik, overtaking a series of vehicles is very severely frowned upon by AGS.

Secondly, you should not be on the wrong side of the carriageway approaching a junction on the right. This is a major no-no...

Thirdly, you should always drive at such a speed that you can stop in the distance that you can see to be clear.

/High horse.

Broken white line.

Esel

The Dagda wrote: »

Broken white line.

You are embarrassing yourself now.

The Dagda

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

you discovered half way through a stupid stunt that you had bitten off more than you could chew, got a fright and somehow feel aggrieved. thats the honest answer here.

if you were the person pulling out of a siding and were forced to swerve and stop to avoid an oncoming overtaker i'm sure you'd be on here giving out about that too.

6 cars to overtake = too many. unless your a driving a veyron or something.

The car i was driving doesn't change anything, if the car hadn't pulled into my lane the overtake would've been completed without any fuss.

And i didn't get a fright, i completed the overtake.

And i guarantee if i pulled onto a road without having checked both ways i wouldn't be on here complaining.

SRFC

phishing expedition going on here imo



Anyone over taking 6 cars at a time will be paying holy god a visit sooner or later wreckless driving broken line or not.

The Dagda

SRFC wrote: »

phishing expedition going on here imo



Anyone over taking 6 cars at a time will be paying holy god a visit sooner or later wreckless driving broken line or not.

What about 6 cars doing 50mph? Would holy god be ok with that? :rolleyes:

SRFC

Wait till a foreign object appears on the road you panic an wipe one the 6 cars you're over taking into a ditch when you panic,


better to get there late than never my friend remember this.

Toyotafanboi

The Dagda wrote: »

The car i was driving doesn't change anything, if the car hadn't pulled into my lane the overtake would've been completed without any fuss.

And i didn't get a fright, i completed the overtake. I'm asking for opinions.

if the car hadn't pulled into you lane? are you for serious? you were in his lane! overtaking 6 cars!

the car you were driving does have a bearing. eg, a bugatti veyron, some modern ferrari or other supercar would finish that manouver an awful lot quicker than a diesel passat, toyota yaris, what have you. (just using extremes for example).

stoneill

google map the location for us.

The Dagda

SRFC wrote: »

Wait till a foreign object appears on the road you panic an wipe one the 6 cars you're over taking into a ditch when you panic,


better to get there late than never my friend remember this.

A foreign object you say?! OK...

The Dagda

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

if the car hadn't pulled into you lane? are you for serious? you were in his lane! overtaking 6 cars!

the car you were driving does have a bearing. eg, a bugatti veyron, some modern ferrari or other supercar would finish that manouver an awful lot quicker than a diesel passat, toyota yaris, what have you. (just using extremes for example).

You're just ignoring the facts now. Goodnight.

Where To

Other car shouldn't have came out in fairness.
Still, you'll pull a stunt like that once too often someday OP.

Toyotafanboi

The Dagda wrote: »

You're just ignoring the facts now. Goodnight.

please tell me what i'm overlooking.

FatMickey

The Dagda wrote: »

A foreign object you say?! OK...

That’s the exact words the copper said to the girl that was flashed at on broad street :eek:

THall04

The Dagda wrote: »

So i was overtaking a line (5/6) of cars on a straight road (broken white line) and a car pulls out from a side road into the lane i was in.

I flashed the guy who had pulled onto the road, he stops on the road, and i complete the overtake.

My options were pull into the line of cars the left, or continue the overtake.

What was the correct option?

If it was a side road , and there was a junction ahead then you should not have been overtaking...Rules Of The Road is very clear on this (from page 46)

"You must not overtake when.....You are approaching a junction"

If there was a broken white line at the junction , then somebody should get onto the local authority to change it.

kneemos

THall04 wrote: »

If it was a side road , and there was a junction ahead then you should not have been overtaking...Rules Of The Road is very clear on this (from page 46)

"You must not overtake when.....You are approaching a junction"

If there was a broken white line at the junction , then somebody should get onto the local authority to change it.

Line markings in this country are as bad as the signage,neither bear any relation to reality.

curiosity

OP, if I understand the situation correctly...

• you were on a single carriageway road, came up behind a closely-bunched "caravan" of vehicles, which you decided to overtake on a broken white line
• while you were in the act of overtaking, another vehicle came to a side junction on the right side of the road as you were facing
• the vehicle was turning left, so the driver looked right, saw nothing approaching, and so moved out onto the side road you were on, you being in the process of overtaking

if this is the case, it's lucky nothing bad happened. Did the turning vehicle just avoid you/move onto the hard shoulder?

OP, if you come upon the same situation on the same road again, would you overtake? Or would you be cautious?

FatMickey

curiosity wrote: »

OP, if you come upon the same situation on the same road again, would you overtake? Or would you be cautious?

I THINK DAGDA HAS CRASHED DUDE :eek:

I also think it was just a hypothetical question that he had plenty of answers for before he even finished thinking about how to word it on here… I could be wrong :rolleyes:

event

The Dagda wrote: »

So i was overtaking a line (5/6) of cars on a straight road (broken white line) and a car pulls out from a side road into the lane i was in.

I flashed the guy who had pulled onto the road, he stops on the road, and i complete the overtake.

My options were pull into the line of cars the left, or continue the overtake.

What was the correct option?

Rules of the road:

You must not overtake when approaching a junction

Hal Decks

FatMickey wrote: »

A guy got pulled for flashing as he walked towards a girl on broad street the other day… surely its against the law.

I call BS on this.

kneemos

Hal Decks wrote: »

I call BS on this.

What did Brittney have to say?

The Dagda

THall04 wrote: »

If it was a side road , and there was a junction ahead then you should not have been overtaking...Rules Of The Road is very clear on this (from page 46)

"You must not overtake when.....You are approaching a junction"

If there was a broken white line at the junction , then somebody should get onto the local authority to change it.

There was a solid white line in the area of the junction, i overtook well before the junction on a broken white line, and i completed the overtake while still on the broken white line.

If i had been overtaking on the solid white line i would not be asking the question, as i would've been in the wrong.

The question is simply, accepting the facts as i have presented; straight road, broken white line, me overtaking, and a car turns out from a side road into the lane i am in - who is in the wrong?

CiniO

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

at the time you decided to start the manouver it was clear, but not even the lord himself could predict what the road conditions would be like in 1500 meters/ 30 seconds time.

i mean lets be clear here. if God forbid you did cause had an accident. who will the gardai find at fault.

No one, as garda doesn't decide about fault at accidents.

- the fella pulling out who didn't check left when leaving his garden.

or

- the guy overtaking 6 cars on the wrong side of the road.

He wasn't overtaking on the wrong side of the road. He was overtaking on the right side of the road, which is meant to be used while overtaking.
From what OP wrote, he seen the road was clear and he finished the manouver well before the junction. Other driver pulled from the side road at the junction without checking if main road was free. That's the number one offence - no giving priority to traffic when joining main road.

However everything finished well, as OP flashed to show his presence, and other driver reacted correctly by stopping.

PS - I don't think that overtaking 6 cars is takin a piss, provided there is enough space to do so.
Also those cars should keep enough distance than OP should be able to drive in between any of them.

CiniO

Esel wrote: »

You need to be clearer, to be honest...

Firstly, afaik, overtaking a series of vehicles is very severely frowned upon by AGS.

Why is that?

Secondly, you should not be on the wrong side of the carriageway approaching a junction on the right. This is a major no-no...

True, but what OP said he was well ahead of the junction and was to finish his manouver before the junction.

Thirdly, you should always drive at such a speed that you can stop in the distance that you can see to be clear.

As so OP did.

Toyotafanboi

CiniO wrote: »

No one, as garda doesn't decide about fault at accidents.


He wasn't overtaking on the wrong side of the road. He was overtaking on the right side of the road, which is meant to be used while overtaking.
From what OP wrote, he seen the road was clear and he finished the manouver well before the junction. Other driver pulled from the side road at the junction without checking if main road was free. That's the number one offence - no giving priority to traffic when joining main road.

However everything finished well, as OP flashed to show his presence, and other driver reacted correctly by stopping.

PS - I don't think that overtaking 6 cars is takin a piss, provided there is enough space to do so.
Also those cars should keep enough distance than OP should be able to drive in between any of them.

i'm sure if there was injury/ death etc, the gardais opinion on the matter would certainly be valued. and as others have said, the do take a dim view on overtaking mulitple cars at once.

at the end of the day, overtaking is a discretionary exercise, and just because the rules of the road say certain criteria make it ok to overtake on paper, you must still apply common sense, not be an idiot and attempt to overtake 5 cars traveling at an estimated 50mph on a single carridgeway road.

Mycroft H

You must not overtake at a junction. In short, a badly thought out overtake

cormie

I don't think the OP is as much to blame as it's being made out here. What if it was 2 cars? Any overtaking maneuver has an element of risk to it and whether it's 6 or 2 cars, if something like this happens, the overtaking vehicle is still put in a situation of increased danger. The oncoming vehicle neglected to do 2 main things, check if both ways were clear before joining the road and allowing a vehicle to complete its maneuver.

If it had been a case where a car was pulling out of a driveway and didn't check for traffic coming from it's left maybe there wouldn't be such negativity towards The Dagda but the fact it was a junction is allowing for a bit of dispute. The Dagda states he started and completed the overtake on a broken white line. There's no mention of any junction signs or no overtaking signs.

It would be interesting to see how an investigating Garda or Insurance claims manager would view it. What if it had been one of these he was overtaking? at least with 6 cars there's going to be a gap to pull back into.

corktina

The Dagda wrote: »

Right... but what if the road is clear for 1500m BUT someone pulls on to the road without having checked both ways?

he is wrong to have done so but more so are you for overtaking over a junction (it doesn't sound as if you could have completed your manoeuvre before the junction from your description)

peasant

The Dagda wrote: »

There was a solid white line in the area of the junction, i overtook well before the junction on a broken white line, and i completed the overtake while still on the broken white line.

If i had been overtaking on the solid white line i would not be asking the question, as i would've been in the wrong.

The question is simply, accepting the facts as i have presented; straight road, broken white line, me overtaking, and a car turns out from a side road into the lane i am in - who is in the wrong?

The sad thruth is that in case of an accident the police / insurance would have thought for about 1 second and then doled out a 50/50 responsibility for the accident.

Theoretically speaking the oncoming car is 100% at fault as he simply should not have pulled out.
And while you (theoretically speaking) were in the right, the simple fact that there was an accident puts you in the wrong and they'd get you under some "without due care and attention" clause.

How do I know? Because I had a similar accident on a motorbike in slow traffic.

SC024

What about the six cars that were up each others arse so he had to attempt to overtake them all ?

Esel

SC024 wrote: »

What about the six cars that were up each others arse so he had to attempt to overtake them all ?

1. No mention that they were too close together.

2. He didn't have to attempt to overtake them.

SC024

Esel wrote: »

1. No mention that they were too close together.

fair point.

2. He didn't have to attempt to overtake them.

he already said there was six cars to lose together to squeeze in between them at the beginning of this thread did he not?

Esel

SC024 wrote: »

he already said there was six cars to lose together to squeeze in between them at the beginning of this thread did he not?

Oops, my mistake. He did say that in post #3.

awec

This post has been deleted.

The Royal Scam

The Dagda wrote: »

Line of cars travelling at 80kph, straight road, broken white line, dry, about 1500m visibility. Car pulls into right lane having looked left and not right.

So what speed did you get up to get past 6 cars travelling at 80? I'm no Stephen Hawkins but I would say that if you for instance, were to stick under the limit of 100 (I presume), it would take more than 1500m to pass 6 cars safely

For how long did you have to wait behind the 6 cars before you decided that you needed to overtake. I hate wan kers that pass out 6 cars at a time.

CiniO

The Royal Scam wrote: »

So what speed did you get up to get past 6 cars travelling at 80? I'm no Stephen Hawkins but I would say that if you for instance, were to stick under the limit of 100 (I presume), it would take more than 1500m to pass 6 cars safely

Assume each car at average length of 4 metres. OP said they were all very close together, but let's assume there was about 20metres gap between each of them. And eventually you need extra 20 metres before and after those cars to change lanes. So OP needed to pass obstruction of the following length: 6*4 + 5*20 +2*20 = 164 metres.

If he wanted to keep within speed limit (100km/h) and other vehicles were travelling at 80km/h then speed difference was 20km/h = 5.5 m/s.
Therefore he needed (164m / 5.5m/s) = 30 seconds for the manouver.

Travelling at 100km/h (27.8m/s) for 30 seconds, OP traveled 834 metres.

So no - he woulnd't need more than 1500metres to pass safely.

Also who in his right mind overtakes at 100km/h 6 vehicles which are doing 80km/h. Most people would accelerate a bit more, to make sure that time and distance traveled on the right lane is much shorten that this shown above.

For how long did you have to wait behind the 6 cars before you decided that you needed to overtake. I hate wan kers that pass out 6 cars at a time.

What difference does it make how long did he have to wait?
Beside what's wrong with overtaking 6 cars at the time?

thecomedian

I'm pretty sure you shouldn't be overtaking when approaching a junction.

ianobrien

If there is a collision between the person doing the overtaking and the person turning right, it's the person turning right is at fault, 100%.

This happened to a family member. They were overtaking three to four cars and the vehicle in front turned to exit the road right (turned off the main road). Naturally there was a collision and it went to court. The ruling was that it was the person turning right was at fault as they changed lanes without checking if the lane was clear. The fact that there was somebody driving in the lane going the wrong way (ie the "overtaker") did not detract from the fact that they had possession of the lane.