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1961 Plane crash Dublin airport

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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,818 ✭✭✭donvito99


    Great post! You certainly learn something new everyday.


  • Registered Users Posts: 743 ✭✭✭LeftBase


    Real feel of D-Day drop about the video, especially how the "6th" is written by the pictures. :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,831 ✭✭✭sparrowcar


    Meant to say the video is not mine. My father remembers it clearly and has some old slides of it I think.

    Very hard to find info on the web about it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,766 ✭✭✭BowWow


    I was brought out by my father to see it on the road.

    Thanks for the post.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 794 ✭✭✭bluecode


    A family friend who worked for Aer Lingus at the time told me that the pilot, presumably the Captain was probably in a state of shock. When a Garda or airport policeman appeared at the scene he tried to run away thinking he was about to arrested.

    Which given that they ran out of fuel. He may have had reason.

    Of course I must say this, given it was a Lourdes flight. They had a miraculous escape! :P

    Interesting thing about the Lourdes flights. They actually gave many ordinary Irish people their first ever flight. Airline flying was for the wealthy back then.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 25,192 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    Although well before my time I never knew about this at all. Very interesting. I'd say there were more prayers said during the approach then the whole time in Lourdes


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,831 ✭✭✭sparrowcar


    Strange how this appears just after this thread was started? The author must of read this thread ;)

    http://comeheretome.com/2012/10/15/the-plane-that-landed-on-the-dublin-to-belfast-road/


  • Registered Users Posts: 1 Kirkstown


    excellent clip, my Gran was on the flight I only learned last week. Imagine ! She was probably going over to Lourdes to pray for my Grandad who had cancer then. Sadly he died shortly after that anyway.


  • Registered Users Posts: 914 ✭✭✭lambayire


    Wow. I never knew about this one.

    I am struggling to figure out where the plane crashed in relation to the airport from one of the clips.
    If the incident happened today, where would it be?
    Somewhere on the M1?


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,948 ✭✭✭✭GBX


    I never heard of this either.

    @lambayire - to me it looks to be in around where the National Show Centre. Or that vicinity.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,190 ✭✭✭crisco10


    lambayire wrote: »
    Wow. I never knew about this one.

    I am struggling to figure out where the plane crashed in relation to the airport from one of the clips.
    If the incident happened today, where would it be?
    Somewhere on the M1?


    Was trying to figure that our myself...

    Looking at this picture:

    getimage-1.jpg?w=500&h=386

    You can just make out the old terminal in the top right which is still at the airport, and using that, and the approach road as a guide, looks likes the plane is sitting somewhere around the long term parking/M1...(or maybe even closer to the airport than that? perspective is tricky to guess through!)

    What intrigues me is the path the plane took; looks to have narrowly avoided a few buildings?

    Edit: A little bit of digging indicates that the current "Airport Road" (R132) used to be the "Dublin - Belfast" Road. So looks to be somewhere near that pub across the road from Long term? but those buildings look quite old...?

    Edit2: Based on the video, this looks like the planes potential flight path. The final resting position is pretty much for sure on the "X" though. The house in the video is defo Kealy's.

    399077.JPG


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭Mebuntu


    Assuming he was not off course my guess is somewhere here if landing on the old runway:

    EDIT: Map incorrectly based on wrong info. (see later posts)

    mh7byc.jpg


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭Pat Dunne


    My understanding is that that the plane came to a rest mid way between Kielys Pub and The Coachman's approximately where the Roundabout is now. Here some footage from Pathe Newsreel, its without commentary.

    According to legend it nearly collided with the old tower, having banked left after a failed landing on the now disused 31.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EMFMZyHlJP8


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,812 ✭✭✭billie1b


    Correct Pat, the plane even took out the road sign for the left turn up to the main airport building from the main road.
    The main airport roundabout now has a monument in the middle of it 'the spirit of the skies', this is supposedly why the monument was placed in that spot and aptly named too, think it was put in in the 80's.


  • Registered Users Posts: 914 ✭✭✭lambayire


    I always wondered about that monument.

    Thanks for the info!


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭Mebuntu


    Pat Dunne wrote: »
    My understanding is that that the plane came to a rest mid way between Kielys Pub and The Coachman's approximately where the Roundabout is now. Here some footage from Pathe Newsreel, its without commentary.

    According to legend it nearly collided with the old tower, having banked left after a failed landing on the now disused 31.

    Thanks for that info. My map above was based on this report of the crash which gives the impression that it was cleared to land on 24 but went down before reaching:
    https://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19610919-0

    By runway 31 am I correct in assuming you mean 29 (realigned magnetically since then?)

    So to recap, it tried to land on what we now know as (disused) runway 29, turned left just missing the tower and dropped onto the road?

    I love the shot of the two Guards having their picnic in the field :).


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,812 ✭✭✭billie1b


    Mebuntu wrote: »
    Thanks for that info. My map above was based on this report of the crash which gives the impression that it was cleared to land on 24 but went down before reaching:
    https://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19610919-0

    By runway 31 am I correct in assuming you mean 29 (realigned magnetically since then?)

    So to recap, it tried to land on what we now know as (disused) runway 29, turned left just missing the tower and dropped onto the road?

    I love the shot of the two Guards having their picnic in the field :).

    RWY 29/11 was the old RWY before 28/10 was built, the older RWY before 29/11 was 24/06, it's what pier D is now built on, it stretches from just beside RWY 29/11 and went straight across to where the west apron is now.

    *circled in blue

    C27ACF23-437B-4333-ACBF-3D52C5BC9F77_zpslug6nmvo.jpg


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭Mebuntu


    billie1b wrote: »
    RWY 29/11 was the old RWY before 28/10 was built, the older RWY before 29/11 was 24/06, it's what pier D is now built on, it stretches from just beside RWY 29/11 and went straight across to where the west apron is now.
    Thanks. I am aware of that but I am trying to find out what runway it was trying to land on as there are now conflicting comments here.

    The report I linked says it was cleared for 24.

    crisco10 has projected a map of it trying for 24 but turning left and crashing at the spot indicated.

    Pat Dunne says it failed to land on runway 31 which doesn't (didn't) exist. That's why I wondered if "runway 31" had been magnetically realigned to 29 since then and that's what he meant.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,190 ✭✭✭crisco10


    Mebuntu wrote: »
    Thanks. I am aware of that but I am trying to find out what runway it was trying to land on as there are now conflicting comments here.

    The report I linked says it was cleared for 24.

    crisco10 has projected a map of it trying for 24 but turning left and crashing at the spot indicated.

    Pat Dunne says it failed to land on runway 31 which doesn't (didn't) exist. That's why I wondered if "runway 31" had been magnetically realigned to 29 since then and that's what he meant.

    Just to be clear, I'm completely guessing the flightpath based on the line that was added to the picture taken at the time, as well as the info that it was trying to land on 24. I've no idea why it would have veered left and deviated from the runway centre line?


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭Mebuntu


    crisco10 wrote: »
    Just to be clear, I'm completely guessing the flightpath based on the line that was added to the picture taken at the time, as well as the info that it was trying to land on 24.
    If she was, indeed, trying for 24 then your map is probably as good as it gets. We'll just have to wait for Pat :).


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,893 ✭✭✭EchoIndia


    Here is a summary of the official report: https://www.flightglobal.com/FlightPDFArchive/1963/1963%20-%200843.PDF

    This makes it clear that the aircraft was turning final for runway 24 when power was lost on the port engines owing to difficulties with the fuel system, it veered to the left of the approach course and force-landed near the then main road. There are good photos here: https://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19610919-0

    It may be that the aircraft spun around a bit during its ground slide so that it ended up pointing in a different direction to its flight path.

    This was not the only DC-4 variant to be lost because of the complicated fuel management system (the 1967 Stockport Argonaut crash being a well-known example).

    The three-runway system at Dublin at that time was 06/24, 17/35 and 12/30. The latter was the shortest of the runways and is nowadays used for aircraft parking. What was 17/35 is now the "crosswind" runway 16/34. 06/24 became 05/23 and has now been built over for the most part as a result of terminal and ramp developments.


  • Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭Mebuntu


    Great stuff, EchoIndia. Thanks.

    She certainly was a long way off the centreline.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,206 ✭✭✭plodder


    Pat Dunne wrote: »
    My understanding is that that the plane came to a rest mid way between Kielys Pub and The Coachman's approximately where the Roundabout is now. Here some footage from Pathe Newsreel, its without commentary.

    According to legend it nearly collided with the old tower, having banked left after a failed landing on the now disused 31.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EMFMZyHlJP8
    Fascinating footage. I'd say the three young lads on the bikes are likely still around.

    The "tourist bar" in the film seems to be Kealy's and the cottage to the right of it is still there (derelict) in this google maps view

    https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.4253704,-6.2292709,3a,75y,270.21h,91.6t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smJXNhQqxeFtse81A7s8ntg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656


  • Registered Users Posts: 1 dabaizhu


    Thanks for posting this, my parents were on the flight back in 1961 on their way home from their honeymoon in Lourdes, my mum was always thankful with the skill of the pilot avoiding the power lines on the Dublin-Belfast road, . She reckons he circled the airport for 15 or 20 mins before crash landing, but it may have been less as time would seem to slow down.... One thing probably not reported is that after the airplane came to a stop, the air stewardess announced that the plane had hit the stump of a tree and don't anybody move....everybody rushed to the exits after a few seconds....



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,893 ✭✭✭EchoIndia


    I don't think there was any circling as such. The crew were not anticipating any problems until the engines quit on final approach. Without power, the crew would have had only limited ability to influence where the aircraft came down, but of course in those days the area around was essentially rural and road traffic would have been light.

    There is a summary here: https://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19610919-0



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