Wheelset advice?

colm_gti

Still dragging this out but my finger is hovering over the trigger ready to shoot....I've come to my senses and decided against buying tubs, but I'm undecided as to whether I should go for deep section aero wheels or light standard wheels. I've been keeping an eye on the classifieds for the past 2 months and nothing has come up, and I'm a bit wary of buying used wheels now anyway...

Currently on a set of Mavic Aksiums, which are quoted at 1795g for the set, which I'll be keeping for training etc.

My options are...

Mavic Cosmic Carbone SL. Quoted at 1740g for the pair, they're not much lighter than what's currently on the bike, but would I see any aero benefit that would outweigh this? They do look awesome though...

Mavic Ksyrium SLS. At 1395g for the set, they're featherweight compared to what I have, unfortunately the don't look as awesome as the cosmics...

Fulcrum Racing Zero. How do these compare to the Ksyriums?

Shimano Dura Ace C24. As above?

Wheels will primarily be used for racing...

If anyone can recommend any other options, I'm all ears! The above Mavic options would be right at the upper end of my budget.

Arthurdaly

I've got most of the wheels you mention above. I've got the askiums, cosmic sl and just recently taken ownership of the C24s.

I've got a black carbon bike with white graphics and the cosmics really do look amazing on the bike. In terms of performance they feel very fast on nice smooth roads and there is a definite performace advantage but it doesnt really translate to road racing where you sit in a bunch for 95% of the race. They feel nice to ride and I've done the majority of my training on them also. In just over one year I've got 5000+ km on them and they are still true and never had a problem.

I've recently bought the C24s because I got the notion that the cosmics were not suitable for hilly races, windy conditions or sportives, I justified the purchase saying they were super light and would be good for sprinting and climbing. Beautifully crafted wheel and they feel great when riding, when I pick them up I smile at how light they are. I've not put much mileage on them but first impressions are that they are a great all round wheel.

Like you I was torn between an aero wheel or a light wheelset and in the end bought both. I cant comment on the fulcrums or the kyrsiums but I would imagine they are in the same league as the C24s.

I suspect you will go down the same road as me if you buy the cosmics and eventually end up with both. The lighter wheelset will be a better all rounder but you will be constantly thinking about how great the cosmics would look on your bike
In terms of performance the gains are marginal for each wheelset and will probably not directly result in a podium appearance, unfortunately you can't buy a win (if you could i'd be world champion).

My advice would be go for the Fulcrums or C24s first as they are a better all rounder but you will eventually have both

El Vino

Don't Mavic strongly advise you only use their Tyres, is this not a little bit limiting ?, Tempeted by the C24s at that price, I've been using RS80s ant they have been fantastic.

Arthurdaly

El Vino wrote: »

Don't Mavic strongly advise you only use their Tyres, is this not a little bit limiting ?, Tempeted by the C24s at that price, I've been using RS80s ant they have been fantastic.

No, I've never read anything about that. I've never used a mavic tyre.

royrogers

El Vino wrote: »

Don't Mavic strongly advise you only use their Tyres, is this not a little bit limiting ?, Tempeted by the C24s at that price, I've been using RS80s ant they have been fantastic.

Hi was thinking about upgrading to these RS80s, have you deep section or standard wheels,what are they like? deep section look the business and not a bad price either.

doozerie

I have Mavic Ksyrium SL's because they came with my bike. It's entirely subjective but I personally would not pay the purchase price of those wheels on their own. The wheels are light, and adequately stiff, but I'm quite light (63kg) so I'm don't really challenge the stiffness of any wheel. I haven't had problems with them as such, but some things irritate me about them: I can never seem to get the tension adjustment on the bearings just right, they are always either a little too tight or there is a little bit of play at one part of the wheel rotation (or both!); the freehub needs regular maintenance and one or two very wet rides are enough to make it need re-lubing; at least one of the rims has water in it from a very wet ride (not unique to the Ksyriums though).

What it boils down to is that, for me, I don't think the Ksyrium SL's are particularly good value for money. I've only been using them for 2 years though, and if I'm still using them 5 years from now then I might have to reconsider their value for money offering. It doesn't help that I've become a bit disillusioned with Mavic stuff in recent years, I find their rims are less easy to build with and less robust in use than they used to be (I've been using Open Pro's for the road for quite a few years now, and XC717 for an on-road MTB for a a couple of years).

As a comparison to my Ksyriums, I have a pair of Rolf Vigor's that roll much better than them -but the Rolf's are about the same price (but available for less at times, which is how I got mine) and, mainly due to having less spokes, flex more so may not be well suited to a strong rider. Even my entry-level Pro-Lite Luciano's rolled better than my Ksyriums, until the rear bearings started getting gritty after only a year of use. There is a pattern here of me becoming disillusioned or disappointed with a variety of factory-built wheelsets!

From your list, I've read quite a few very good reviews of the Dura-Ace, I've seen mixed reviews of the Carbones (though mostly positive reviews), and I'm left with the impression that the Fulcrums are very good too. I'd struggle to choose between them in your shoes. My views on factory-built versus hand-built wheels has shifted recently though. I've been building wheels for my commute bikes for years but I always opted for factory-built wheels for my "good" bikes. I liked the look of factory built wheels, and their marketing blurb always convinced me that they'd be a good choice. Plus, for reasons I can't explain or justify I think I assumed they'd always simply be better quality than anything someone could produce by hand, despite my best ever wheelset having being hand-built ones. However, as I've seen rims wear out on factory built wheels I've started to question more and more the merits of my buying wheels that, realistically, will be consigned to the bin once they start to wear out (you can certainly buy replacement rims, etc., for some factory built wheels but the expense is prohibitive for some that I've seen parts available for). Also, relatively exotic hand-built wheels seem to be more readily available now than a few years ago, so that narrows the gap even further.

I'd recommend a read of the wheel info page on wheelsmith.co.uk for one perspective on this, it certainly helped me to see things in a different light recently. And incidentally, I bought a pair of commuting wheels from them only last week and found them excellent to deal with and the wheels were built and shipped the day after my order. The real test will be how well the wheels work in use, of course, but so far I have nothing but praise for them and they'd be among my shortlist of sources for any future wheels I look to buy for my "good" bikes. So, don't make the silly mistake that I did and relegate hand-built wheels to the category of boring or inferior, good ones are neither and some expensive factory-built ones can be both. ...I think I may be preparing myself for old age by giving my "Bah! Disposable society! Not in my day..." moan muscles some exercise

Lumen

doozerie, for me the appeal of factory-built wheels is consistency. You're buying both consistent components and consistent builds.

At the risk of stating the obvious, with handbuilts you get consistent components but only consistent builds from the same source. So it's not reasonable to compare the build quality of a Open Pro/Ultegra hub or whatever with a Ksyrium, only the component quality.

Many factory wheels really aren't priced to make rebuilding economical. The carbon laminate Shimano rims, for instance, are almost as expensive as a new RS80.

doozerie

@Lumen, I agree with you, you should get consistency with factory built wheels. The benefits of handbuilt really only come into play if you can find a genuinely good wheelbuilder, and unfortunately they are quite rare. However, if you do find a good wheelbuilder then I think you'll end up with consistently better wheels from them than from a factory. Plus, if the hubs are good quality to start with and you maintain them well then the handbuilt wheels could potentially be rebuilt again and again for only the cost of a new rim plus build cost each time.

And if you can find a good wheelbuilder that is willing to actually talk to you and discuss your requirement with you, which is even rarer, then in addition to ending up with consistently better wheels, they'll also be wheels that are well suited to both your needs and your demands. I've not encountered that combination in Ireland, unfortunately.

El Vino

Arthurdaly wrote: »

No, I've never read anything about that. I've never used a mavic tyre.

This is lifted straight off their website- on the links above the Mavics seem to include tyres

"For the first time, wheel sets are now designed with the integration of their specific tyre.
By developing wheel and tyre technologies together Mavic can improve the wheel's responsiveness and reach a new era in wheel system design."

Might be marketing guff I know.

Hungrycol

I asked a similar question last year: Here's some more comments back then. I went with the Zero's in the end. They're a brilliant wheel but the cosmics do look pretty bling!

Lumen

El Vino wrote: »

This is lifted straight off their website- on the links above the Mavics seem to include tyres

"For the first time, wheel sets are now designed with the integration of their specific tyre.
By developing wheel and tyre technologies together Mavic can improve the wheel's responsiveness and reach a new era in wheel system design."

Might be marketing guff I know.

It's almost certainly nonsense. Even the new fancy-schmancy CXR 80 tubular aero wheels with their snap-on plastic CX01 strips, don't look like they actually need specific tyres to work.

on_the_nickel

Not sure what you think Colm, but I'm getting the C24s after reading that.

Good price too - from looking at the freight costs table, am I right in saying postage is only €2.95?

letape

on_the_nickel wrote: »

Not sure what you think Colm, but I'm getting the C24s after reading that.

Good price too - from looking at the freight costs table, am I right in saying postage is only €2.95?

I expect that the good price on the C24s is down to the fact that a new model is being release by Shimano for 2013 model year. There was something on cyclingnews about this last week.

The existing C24s will also not be compatible with 11 speed Shimano drive trains. That's one thing that the fulcrums have in their favour; the ease of changing the inexpensive freehub so that their wheels are compatible with all drivetrains.

colm_gti

Thanks for all the replies lads, between this thread and hungrycols thread I'm almost sold on a set of 2-way fit fulcrum racing 1's, though I'm so so tempted by cosmics, despite their weight :-/

fat bloke

Dura ace wheels are great. As said above, you smile everytime you pick them up, they're just so light.

Half a kg nearly up to the Cosmics - hard to argue with that in my opinion. I've put lots of all sorts and all weather miles on my dura ace wheels and they're still perfect -all I've ever done is wash them occasionally. Never lubed or greased anything on them anywhere.

BDK

Colm,I was in the same boat as you recently.I had Pro Lite Bracciannos and wanted better(looking?) wheels for my new Look 595.I liked the look of the Cosmic carbones,especially the exalith all black ones,but got the zeros.I tried a friends set of carbones and found them noisy on poor road surfaces.With deep dish envy I got a set of TechLite 38mm carbon clinchers from crc and they transform the look of the bike,they cost 700euro or so in a sale.I notice no real diferences in average speed with all those wheelsets but the TechLites look the best,which I like.Braking is fine on them and theres no issues in crosswinds.Best of luck,Bdk.