Are US cops lunatics?

asherbassad

Before anyone kicks off about how brave and heroic these guys are I'd like to know if doing a "tough job" (though it's not that tough at all) excuses behaviour like this:

Cop blows away a woman in a car:

http://rt.com/usa/news/five-border-agent-car-431/

Cop batters a man in a wheelchair:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YnvrI2vikE

TSA frisk toddler in a wheelchair:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0umMfAV8vNo

Biggins

asherbassad wrote: »

Before anyone kicks off about how brave and heroic these guys are I'd like to know if doing a "tough job" (though it's not that tough at all) excuses behaviour like this:

Cop blows away a woman in a car:

http://rt.com/usa/news/five-border-agent-car-431/

Cop batters a man in a wheelchair:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YnvrI2vikE

TSA frisk toddler in a wheelchair:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0umMfAV8vNo

So TWO incidents of cops and one of a totally separate different airport agency?

Yea, lets taint them all - every one of them.

cursai

Cue corrib gas and may day parade videos alongside general Garda/real life haters.

partyatmygaff

Some US cops are lunatics, some are heroes who are very good at their job. It's the same in any country, the only difference is the US police are armed. An unarmed cop on a power trip isn't too bad but give them weaponry and they become heavy handed.

And the TSA aren't "cops" or a police force.

Thrill

U.S. cops, a rotten bunch of lads.

minidazzler

There are 35000 cops in New York City alone. I am pretty sure they are not all lunatics. There are plenty who are mental, but some will slip through the psych evaluations.

Youssef Chippo

TSA officers aren't cops.

Cops in the US are no better or worse than any other country. Corruption is rife among many police forces, taking bribes, brutality, etc.

aaronjumper

There are assholes in every profession, you just have to hope that you won't have to deal with them.

Sir Pompous Righteousness

I don't think it's fair to call all US cops lunatics. Sure, there are a few nutjobs as there are in every profession, but you can't say they all are.

Geekness1234

Out of the 3 links you posted one was actually about a cop.
The first link/video was way out of line by anyone's standards,but taring every Policeman in the U.S. is a completely over the top.
Other one was about Border Patrol and the other TSA.Both separate departments.

RMD

Nope, the vast majority aren't. Problem is when you give them guns, tazers and CS gas without rigid enforcement and engagement rules, cops become more brash in their actions. American police can get away with a greater no bullshít approach than here in the UK, but often this leads to an abuse of power.

Here's an example of brilliant policework from an American cop. Story behind this incident is that this idiotic "activist" was openly walking through public areas with a semi-automatic reproduction of a gun usually manufactured as an automatic. He was "exercising" his second amendment and hopping to create some bullshít video of police abusing their powers. How a person can walk through a public area with a gun resembling a fully automatic weapon, let alone openly brandishing a weapon is beyond me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbkaAO_3A1o

asherbassad

Youssef Chippo wrote: »

TSA officers aren't cops.

Cops in the US are no better or worse than any other country. Corruption is rife among many police forces, taking bribes, brutality, etc.

Ah well that makes it alright then.

B.A._Baracus

Am I too late to say that the last clip is that of a TSA agent?

oh nuts I am gotta go be smug somewhere else so ...

Soby

Yes they are , too take on a job like that

MP62

asherbassad wrote: »

Before anyone kicks off about how brave and heroic these guys are I'd like to know if doing a "tough job" (though it's not that tough at all) excuses behaviour like this:

Cop blows away a woman in a car:

http://rt.com/usa/news/five-border-agent-car-431/

Cop batters a man in a wheelchair:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YnvrI2vikE

TSA frisk toddler in a wheelchair:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0umMfAV8vNo

Why's a cop giving a blowjob to a woman in a wheelchair car while a toddler is watching?

Madam Marie

Whatcha gonna do when they come for you?

asherbassad

Biggins wrote: »

So TWO incidents of cops and one of a totally separate diffident airport agency?

Yea, lets taint them all - every one of them.

TWO incidents? TWO?

Abner Louima getting raped with a plunger?
Cops pepper spraying girls at demonstrations?
Cops beating to death homeless schizophrenics screaming for their mothers?
Cops shooting an unarmed man FORTY ONE TIMES

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRhSPWznmQM

http://www.google.com/search?q=us+police+brutality&hl=en&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=EoJrUN3nHonXrAGM4YGABg&sqi=2&ved=0CD4QsAQ&biw=1280&bih=624



How many examples do you need before you stop quacking out the "isolated incidents" and "a few bad apples" nonsense?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/oct/24/us-police-brutality-worst-examples

token101

Hardly just the US though is it? you need only look at that Brazilian guy in London to see that. OP seems to have an issue with any sort of US authority.

4zn76tysfajdxp

asherbassad wrote: »

How many examples do you need before you stop quacking out the "isolated incidents" and "a few bad apples" nonsense?

Six thousand. Get to work.

IvySlayer

The TSA are really hated in America. The touching and feeling they do is really intrusive. Some kids are even strip searched There was once a pilot and they asked to see his penis and he refused, they wouldn't let him pass.

Biggins

asherbassad wrote: »

TWO incidents? TWO?

Yes, the TWO you listed first listed.
Not three which you seem to espouse is all cops!

Your attitude stinks of having a gripe or chip on your shoulder about them.
Get over it.

asherbassad

cursai wrote: »

Cue corrib gas and may day parade videos alongside general Garda/real life haters.

I've lived in many countries.
Garda Siochana are salt of the earth so are Dutch cops.
German cops sound too. US cops are thugs and the Met are bastards.

But hey, I guess that's real life, huh?

IvySlayer

I've been in the States before, only had 1 encounter with the police. Asked for directions from one, he was sound, he started singing the directions

El Horseboxo

I'm not excusing any actions of cops but think it's unfair to say they don't have a tough job. Depending on location being a cop in the US is extremely tough both physically and mentally. I'm not a cop but I'm in law enforcement and I don't envy some of the street guys at all. I've had ride ins when assisting local police and they can be pushed right to the edge on patrol. A majority are good ones and can handle walking the line. Unfortunately some that never should have worn a uniform slip through the cracks and get a badge. Poor psych eval testing and pushes for recruitment while implementing cutbacks contribute towards that according to some of the older guys I've talked to.

MP62

asherbassad wrote: »

cursai wrote: »

Cue corrib gas and may day parade videos alongside general Garda/real life haters.

I've lived in many countries.
Garda Siochana are salt of the earth so are Dutch cops.
German cops sound too. US cops are thugs and the Met are bastards.

But hey, I guess that's real life, huh?

Sounds like you're maybe the problem If you keep having all these encounters with the police.

asherbassad

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Am I too late to say that the last clip is that of a TSA agent?

oh nuts I am gotta go be smug somewhere else so ...

We all know the TSA aren't cops per se. They are usually too thick to pass the chimpanzee test to become a US cop. They're law enforcement nonetheless. Their attitude is the same. It's just that their reading and writing skills aren't above 4th grade.

Biggins

asherbassad wrote: »

...it's just that their reading and writing skills aren't above 4th grade.

Thats the greatest load of cobblers I've read here in a while.
Keep it up - your doing your argument well.

token101

asherbassad wrote: »

I've lived in many countries.
Garda Siochana are salt of the earth so are Dutch cops.
German cops sound too. US cops are thugs and the Met are bastards.

But hey, I guess that's real life, huh?

No that's just your stupid ****ing generalisations. Have you met every American cop? Every Met policeman?

asherbassad

token101 wrote: »

Hardly just the US though is it? you need only look at that Brazilian guy in London to see that. OP seems to have an issue with any sort of US authority.

Why are you bringing up London cops? We're talking about US cops here.

token101

asherbassad wrote: »

We all know the TSA aren't cops per se. They are usually too thick to pass the chimpanzee test to become a US cop. They're law enforcement nonetheless. Their attitude is the same. It's just that their reading and writing skills aren't above 4th grade.

Bit like your arguing skills.

Biggins

asherbassad wrote: »

...US cops are thugs and the Met are bastards.

But hey, I guess that's real life, huh?

No, thats your venom filled opinion.

Habeas corpus please!

Wee Willy Harris

If they so wish, it seems...

Just part of a greater authority that can't really be held accountable

asherbassad

Biggins wrote: »

Yes, the TWO you listed first listed.
Not three which you seem to espouse is all cops!

Your attitude stinks of having a gripe or chip on your shoulder about them.
Get over it.

Get over it? Is that a joke?
I have a problem with US cops battering and killing people on a regular basis and you call that a "gripe"? A "chip on my shoulder"?

token101

asherbassad wrote: »

Why are you bringing up London cops? We're talking about US cops here.

asherbassad wrote: »

I've lived in many countries.
Garda Siochana are salt of the earth so are Dutch cops.
German cops sound too. US cops are thugs and the Met are bastards.

But hey, I guess that's real life, huh?

:pac:

Biggins

asherbassad wrote: »

Get over it? Is that a joke?
I have a problem with US cops battering and killing people on a regular basis and you call that a "gripe"? A "chip on my shoulder"?

Your words speak for themselves.

Habeas corpus please!

asherbassad

IvySlayer wrote: »

I've been in the States before, only had 1 encounter with the police. Asked for directions from one, he was sound, he started singing the directions

So you want a guy to be applauded for not being a prick?

Biggins

asherbassad wrote: »

So you want a guy to be applauded for not being a prick?

We want you to produce the evidence that every cop in America is a certified lunatic.

If you can't - your talking through your ass.

asherbassad

token101 wrote: »

No that's just your stupid ****ing generalisations. Have you met every American cop? Every Met policeman?

No I haven't. But it's strange that you probably put your trust in polls even though the poll just takes a sample rather than tests the entire population. The encounters I've had with the aforementioned police have been overwhelmingly negative and I've never, EVER been arrested or mouthed off to a cop. So bear that in mind before you throw out some sneering little comment like I must be a troublemaker or upstart.

That coupled with the brutality statistics are enough for me and most people to conclude that these guys are assholes. You on the contrary would probably give any bollocks with a badge the benefit of the doubt because...why? I don't know. But I have a good idea.

RMD

asherbassad wrote: »

We all know the TSA aren't cops per se. They are usually too thick to pass the chimpanzee test to become a US cop. They're law enforcement nonetheless. Their attitude is the same. It's just that their reading and writing skills aren't above 4th grade.

There's a saying in the states "Those who can't make cops become private security, those that can't make private security become TSA". The TSA are a fairly awful establishment.

You asked an open ended question yet clearly have a gripe with US cops and seemingly wont accept any view other than that of "I hate the US cops rabble rabble rabble". What was the point of asking such question? "I hate the US cops" would make for a more suitable thread title. You're generalising an entire nation with only a handful of cases. That's ridiculously stupid.

Biggins

RMD wrote: »

There's a saying in the states "Those who can't make cops become private security, those that can't make private security become TSA". The TSA are a fairly awful establishment.

You asked an open ended question yet clearly have a gripe with US cops and seemingly wont accept any view other than that of "I hate the US cops rabble rabble rabble". What was the point of asking such question? "I hate the US cops" would make for a more suitable thread title.

Hell, the OP can't tell the difference between cops and non-cops!
If he made this argument in court - he would be laughed out of it!

asherbassad

token101 wrote: »

:pac:

Completely went over your, didn't it?

RMD

Biggins wrote: »

Hell, the OP can't tell the difference between cops and non-cops!
If he made this argument in court - he would be laughed out of it!

He brings "polls" into it which previously weren't mentioned and are largely irrelevant yet doesn't produce any form of credible evidence to substantiate his claim. What's even more ridiculous, he's never even encountered a member of the US police force. The US police force isn't a nationwide force, it's done on a county level while there are higher groups of authority who have state or federal jurisdiction.

Now I assume OP you're going to throw some claim at me to be a supporter of US cops also?

Biggins

Besides not being able to tell differences, the person with a gripe likes to attribute words never said/stated!

asherbassad wrote: »

TWO incidents? TWO?

Abner Louima getting raped with a plunger?
Cops pepper spraying girls at demonstrations?
Cops beating to death homeless schizophrenics screaming for their mothers?
Cops shooting an unarmed man FORTY ONE TIMES...

How many examples do you need before you stop quacking out the "isolated incidents" and "a few bad apples" nonsense?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/oct/24/us-police-brutality-worst-examples

Please show anywhere in this thread where I 'quacked' about "isolated incidents" and "a few bad apples" !!!

Please do - or just continue with this daft rubbish in your head, avoiding the question of where have I stated such a thing!

Capt'n Midnight

IvySlayer wrote: »

The TSA are really hated in America. The touching and feeling they do is really intrusive. Some kids are even strip searched There was once a pilot and they asked to see his penis and he refused, they wouldn't let him pass.

It's called "Gate Rape"

I'll say it again.

Some people don't have what it takes to be a cop and try for private security. Private security rejects get taken by TSA.

asherbassad

Biggins wrote: »

Hell, the OP can't tell the difference between cops and non-cops!
If he made this argument in court - he would be laughed out of it!

Biggins, that the TSA are not cops is beside the point. All you're doing is trying to sidestep the issue of abuse of power by nitpicking. If I gave 20 examples of police brutality, 19 involving, shall we say, Nassau County Long Island personnel and 1 case involving Suffolk County personnel, you'd throw back the "oh so 1 Suffolk swallow makes a summer, does it?"

You first came out with the "just 2 cases" rubbish. I've provided more and you're still clinging on to the "TSA aren't cops" cop-out (no pun intended) rather than engaging the issue and giving some reasoned insight. These guys routinely beat and kill and abuse their power and get away with it. No matter how often they do it you will excuse it because you don't seem to like people who question authority. Not only that but it would seem quite logical that by condoning their barbarism you yourself are somehow protected from it.

Biggins

asherbassad wrote: »

Biggins, that the TSA are not cops is beside the point. All you're doing is trying to sidestep the issue of abuse of power by nitpicking. If I gave 20 examples of police brutality, 19 involving, shall we say, Nassau County Long Island personnel and 1 case involving Suffolk County personnel, you'd throw back the "oh so 1 Suffolk swallow makes a summer, does it?"

You first came out with the "just 2 cases" rubbish. I've provided more and you're still clinging on to the "TSA aren't cops" cop-out (no pun intended) rather than engaging the issue and giving some reasoned insight. These guys routinely beat and kill and abuse their power and get away with it. No matter how often they do it you will excuse it because you don't seem to like people who question authority. Not only that but it would seem quite logical that by condoning their barbarism you yourself are somehow protected from it.

Bla.. bla...

* You posted TWO example of cops - not THREE!

* You can't tell the difference.

* "engaging the issue and giving some reasoned insight" ???
Are you for real? After the pure schite, NO proof and inaccurate postings you have made so far?

* "you don't seem to like people who question authority" :pac: :pac: :pac: :pac: :pac: :pac:
Have you even bothered your backside to look into what I post on a very regular basis here, looked into not one but two websites I have set-up or even read my signature?
HINT: Look under my name on the left!
Your funny, blind or seriously deluded!

O' and by the way...

Please show anywhere in this thread where I 'quacked' about "isolated incidents" and "a few bad apples" !!!
Please do - or just continue with this daft rubbish in your head, avoiding the question of where have I stated such a thing!

asherbassad wrote: »

...you'd throw back the "oh so 1 Suffolk swallow makes a summer, does it?"

Never stated that or espoused that either.
Keep going - your doing well!

By the way, the above statement from you gives the impression that one example means a whole thing - kinda ironic when you espouse because of SOME cops - all might be lunatics!

So its ok for you to do it - but no others should try it! (...and they haven't by the way!)
Your the only one here tarring all with the same brush.

Keep going - your doing well indeed!

It wasn't me!

So AGS are salt of the earth, eh? Your own experience is the only determining factor in your appraisal of a body which extends way, way beyond that? Plus, obviously, what you drag up online in support of your position. I've had dealings with a number of different districts of AGS in a number of capacities and have found most to be superbly helpful, professional and pleasant to deal with. However, I know of enough abuses and criminality by individuals to compare amply with your stories. yet I'm not thick enough to believe that either represents the nature of the entire organisation (And unlike US law enforcement, AGS actually is a homogenous, nationally organised body). I deal with them on an individual level, always. I have expectations of them based on the role they're supposed to fulfill. Some perform admirably, some are unimpressive, some are real problems. My experiences with any one individual will not have any effect on how I deal with the next person however, or what I expect from them. It's clear that you have an agenda. Nothing you say is worth a damn as a result.

token101

asherbassad wrote: »

No I haven't. But it's strange that you probably put your trust in polls even though the poll just takes a sample rather than tests the entire population. The encounters I've had with the aforementioned police have been overwhelmingly negative and I've never, EVER been arrested or mouthed off to a cop. So bear that in mind before you throw out some sneering little comment like I must be a troublemaker or upstart.

I never said anything about you being in trouble with anyone! This is like arguing with a hormonal teenage girl :pac:

asherbassad wrote: »

That coupled with the brutality statistics are enough for me and most people to conclude that these guys are assholes. You on the contrary would probably give any bollocks with a badge the benefit of the doubt because...why? I don't know. But I have a good idea.

I doubt you have any idea really! You're just making stuff up as you go along!

Overheal

asherbassad wrote: »

Before anyone kicks off about how brave and heroic these guys are I'd like to know if doing a "tough job" (though it's not that tough at all) excuses behaviour like this:

Cop blows away a woman in a car:

http://rt.com/usa/news/five-border-agent-car-431/

Cop batters a man in a wheelchair:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YnvrI2vikE

TSA frisk toddler in a wheelchair:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0umMfAV8vNo

1) TSA are not Cops. Everybody hates the TSA.

2) The guy was hit in the face. I haven't been hit in the face lately. How would I react? Probably like that. I'm sure he answered for it nonetheless.

3) Sketchy account. Early in the article "multiple witnesses told reporters that they never saw the man anywhere close to being on the car"; later in the same article "Witnesses say Alvarado may have accidentally hit the agent with her car".

That article is not a thorough body of evidence to pass judgement on. We've had that happen before, and the proceeding investigation exonerated the cop.

asherbassad wrote: »

Why are you bringing up London cops? We're talking about US cops here.

Accurately highlighting that the United States is not a special rose when it comes to undesirable police incidents.

asherbassad wrote: »

Get over it? Is that a joke?
I have a problem with US cops battering and killing people on a regular basis and you call that a "gripe"? A "chip on my shoulder"?

Do you also shed a tear for every orphan in Africa every night? Just curious.

asherbassad wrote: »

The encounters I've had with the aforementioned police have been overwhelmingly negative and I've never, EVER been arrested or mouthed off to a cop.

And they haven't tried to batter or kill you yet? I'm slightly confused.

RMD wrote: »

The US police force isn't a nationwide force, it's done on a county level

And metropolitan in many circumstances. Around here I encounter Summerville, North Charleston, Berkely County, Dorchester County, and Charleston County police. In fact I was involved in a crash this summer where the Charleston county police arrived on scene within 90 seconds but since the accident took place within the city, it was up to the city to enforce so we had to wait it out for 20 minutes or so while they arrived. Presumably had it been a more pressing matter (like a robbery or a homicide) it probably wouldn't have made much difference. I probably should've asked them with that 20 minutes that I had, but since I had rolled through a red light and lived to tell about it I wasn't really feeling chatty.

It wasn't me! wrote: »

So AGS are salt of the earth, eh? Your own experience is the only determining factor in your appraisal of a body which extends way, way beyond that? Plus, obviously, what you drag up online in support of your position. I've had dealings with a number of different districts of AGS in a number of capacities and have found most to be superbly helpful, professional and pleasant to deal with. However, I know of enough abuses and criminality by individuals to compare amply with your stories. yet I'm not thick enough to believe that either represents the nature of the entire organisation (And unlike US law enforcement, AGS actually is a homogenous, nationally organised body). I deal with them on an individual level, always. I have expectations of them based on the role they're supposed to fulfill. Some perform admirably, some are unimpressive, some are real problems. My experiences with any one individual will not have any effect on how I deal with the next person however, or what I expect from them. It's clear that you have an agenda. Nothing you say is worth a damn as a result.

I've met some very good AGS people on a couple situations. I recall one less than favorable division in Carlow town; I must have sat there for half an hour waiting for immigration while I watched the guy at the counter essentially shrug off anyone who came in the door, smirk, and afterwards snicker and joke about whoever he was just talking to, when these were people that had concerns. He must have forgot I was there or perhaps he assumed I was Polish, idk.

asherbassad wrote:

If I gave 20 examples of police brutality, 19 involving, shall we say, Nassau County Long Island personnel and 1 case involving Suffolk County personnel, you'd throw back the "oh so 1 Suffolk swallow makes a summer, does it?"

Hell why not the last 250 years of documented history? Hold every cop in the country responsible for Rodney King. Why the hell not, right?

You asked a pretty simple question though: "Are the US cops lunatics?"

The answer is not as simple as throwing out hundreds, even thousands of case reports. Especially not when the total police force in the United States hovers around 709,000 officers. Per capita, Ireland actually has more officers per civilian population. Lots of countries do, actually. In fact Iran has the lowest reported figure in the chart. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_size_of_police_forces) I found that surprising. Those chaps cut people's hands off. Aren't they the lunatics? How do you measure lunacy? What is your definition of lunacy? Are we narrowing this discussion to just the United States and if so, what are we taking Cultural Bias into account? For that matter would we be culturally biased to call Iranian police lunatics for dismembering people for crimes?

areyawell

Wee Willy Harris

i seen some, boston cops beat a suspected irish mobster so hard his wound got gang green