Astra 28.2 and Eutelsat 9e

oconnorw

Hi,
has anyone managed this on an 80cm dish in the Dublin area with an offset bar. if so where did you buy the offset bar.? Do you get break up in rain?

Thanks for the information

kingtiger

yeah have it on my Triax 80cm,

just got the triax multi LNB bar and pointed my dish at 19e then lashed on 13e and put 9e beside that and works perfectly

my bar look like this

aaaa Dish
28e 23 19 13 9e

oconnorw

Thanks for the info. What signal strength and quality did you lose on 28.2 as a result of pointing at 19E

Thanks

kingtiger

oconnorw wrote: »

Thanks for the info. What signal strength and quality did you lose on 28.2 as a result of pointing at 19E

Thanks

not much RTE is at 98% snr, some sky premium channels are around 75-80, all channels are perfect with no break up even in lashing rain

Bodan

as an aside, would it be possible to get Astra 28.2 and telestar 12 15.0°W with an offset bar or would 2 completely separate satellite dishs be required?

excollier

You will probably need two dishes. That sort of separation is not reall possible on a standard offset dish, maybe a toroidal, but that would be costly.

Smeagol

maybe a toroidal,

Yep, works on my T90

Bodan

Thanks for the advice and tip, the Wavefrontier T90 does look like it could be an option. It says .. "T90 can cover up to 40 degrees in arc (60 degrees in azimuth)", which is just barely out of range (43 degrees), but that azimuth number is giving me some hope... just as soon as i find out what azimuth means.

craig_b

Alright lads, I was just setting up a silvercrest dish and receiver I got out of lidl's about 3 years ago only getting around to it now lol, but I cant seem to get any decent channels on it only german and french mainly. Is it possible to get RTÉ and BBC on it? any help would be appreciated thanks.

Craig.

pelisor2000

oconnorw wrote: »

Hi,
has anyone managed this on an 80cm dish in the Dublin area with an offset bar. if so where did you buy the offset bar.? Do you get break up in rain?

Thanks for the information

craig_b

zg3409 wrote: »

Start a new thread and I will try and help.

cheers.

zg3409

Bodan wrote: »

Thanks for the advice and tip, the Wavefrontier T90 does look like it could be an option. It says .. "T90 can cover up to 40 degrees in arc (60 degrees in azimuth)", which is just barely out of range (43 degrees), but that azimuth number is giving me some hope... just as soon as i find out what azimuth means.

For the T90 it's quite a large project to set it up. It is very large and heavy. It would be very useful for foreign satellite use but might be overkill for just 28.2 and Saorsat. If you go ahead beware Saorsat on a T90 needs "horizontal" polarisation as the dish double bounces the signal in simple terms. (Actually LHCP->RHCP)

Regarding degrees it took me a while to realise 28.2 - 9 east does not equal 19.2 degrees of a difference on the bar. Satellites are nominally at certain places in the Sky, but depending on where you are in earth the angle between them varies. You would need to put your location into:
http://www.dishpointer.com
and select 28.2, note the elevation and angle.
Then select 9 East and note them again. Finally take the two numbers away from each other.


So for example Dublin 28.2
Elevation: 21.4°
Azimuth (true): 139.5°

9E
Elevation: 27.4°
Azimuth (true): 161.2°

So the elevation difference is 6 degrees (angle or height) and the horizontal difference is 21.7 degrees. Now depending on the type or dish the bar may be on an angle (see the photos above) and so adjusting the bar adjusts both elevation and azimuth at the same time it can be hard to calculate. Safely say it should work.

I would recommend a solid 90cm dish, and then I would recommend both the 9E and 28.2 are both offset each side (like in the photo) with the 9E being nearest to the centre. In some areas RTENL recommend a 1M dish.

Depending on the make of dish different bars may or may not fit. The one shown is a triax bar on a triax dish. The bar would need to be intended to cover a 20 to 23 degree arc for Ireland. Most bars are not designed for such a range.

This explains it quite well:
http://www.satsig.net/pointing/multi-lnb-dish-pointing.htm

Smeagol

It's all right what you're suggesting, zg3409. But I was refering to Bodan's question about 28°e and 15°w, and excollier's reply.

as an aside, would it be possible to get Astra 28.2 and telestar 12 15.0°W with an offset bar or would 2 completely separate satellite dishs be required?

I can pick up the Saorsat with a Lidl camping disch (35cm) with a good signal in Sligo. Maybe two dishes are an option for some of you out there.

watty

not in Rain you can't, a 45cm for Sky and 80cm for Saorsat would make more sense in Sligo, Or 90cm+ for both pointed at about 13E.

With 2F successfully "up" how long before Sky only install Zone 1 dishes in all of Ireland? That will save them a bit and alignment less critical.

PogMoThoin

Installed one today in Mayo with an 80cm dish. I don't have a meter that does DVB-S2 so I had to align 9E with a KU LNB and swap out after. Centring the dish on 19E didn't work out. I had no problem finding 28E but failed to find 9E as it's very weak so I ended up moving the 9E LNB to just off centre where it just about came in with a weak enough signal and then aligning 28E further out the bar than I had originally planned. If I had a meter that did DVB-S2 centring on 19E would have been fine.

STB

I have a TD88 and can get from 28.2e on the very left edge of the Triax Bracket (same one as in previous pic posts this thread) to 4.8e on the right on the right hand side of the bracket. Infact the lnb sitting immediately inside the 4.8e lnb is pulling in 9.e and 10e. I guess the centre arm is pointing around 15/16 degrees. Elevation is 25.6 ish.

zg3409

RTENL Recommend the 9E LNB be at the very centre of the dish. However I have done the sums and if you do that with an 80cm dish then 28.2 won't get a strong enough signal.

For a reliable SAORSAT service, because of its frequency and the different locations of satellites, the SAORSAT Ka LNBF must always be directly on the end of the support arm and pointed directly towards the centre of the dish

From the RTENL Saorsat FAQ

I would normally recommend a 90cm dish for dual feed in Mayo, with the 9E LNB set up close to the centre as you have done. See this old thread for my sums etc. Some of the info on that thread is old as it was done before RTE NL recommended an 80cm dish.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=77008691

In the Saorsat FAQ RTENL show a KA LNB at prime focus on an 80cm dish, with a special feed bar for 28.2 The feed bar was supposed to be made available from Onwave but there seems to only have been one made. Onwave have stopped selling KA LNB's direct to the public. In your photo above they seem to be supplying their dish with triax's bar.

I like your 28.2 LNB with the built in DiSEqC switch. Very neat.

watty

Mine is pointed at 16E. An 90cm wide 95cm high Triax that SES Astra gave me.

I'd be sceptical at pointing more east than 16E for Saorsat offset really. But depends on your dish and location of course.

When Astra 2F takes over, centred on 9E and offset to 28E may work OK on 80cm

STB

pelisor2000 wrote: »

Interesting redrill mod of the arc.

Capt'n Midnight

www.satpointer.com will give you an approx dish size for your location

as the offset gets bigger the apparent size of the dish gets smaller and the LNB will pick up more noise as things other than the dish come into it's view at the edges so it's not as simple as multiplying the diameter of the dish by the cosine of the offset angle

don't forget that a bigger dish will need more accurate alignment so it might be easier to use two smaller dishes than one humongous one

lawhec

watty wrote: »

not in Rain you can't, a 45cm for Sky and 80cm for Saorsat would make more sense in Sligo, Or 90cm+ for both pointed at about 13E.

With 2F successfully "up" how long before Sky only install Zone 1 dishes in all of Ireland? That will save them a bit and alignment less critical.

Main problem will be that 2F won't take all the load off 2A & 2B straight away (we'll probably have to wait until 2E comes into service), wherever Sky will use the UK/Irish Spot beam for their encrypted service (or still "mysteriously" use the Pan-European beam) and that part of Sky's own pay channels and a load of non-Sky channels but FTA & on the Sky EPG use Eutelsat 28A - a satellite that seems to have been developing some problems recently with regards to its power output (11.222GHz appears to be quite weak here, maybe it's just me) that Eutelsat has brought in the old W2M(?) satellite that was originally a write-off and is now Eutelsat 28B but currently doing no broadcasting at present. To cover all co-located satellites at present I don't think 45cm dishes would cut it for rain fade in pretty much all of Ireland.

What may be more likely is that Sky in having some services transferred from 2A/2B over to 2F and using the UK/Irish spot beam and taking advantage of the higher strength it provides compared to the older satellites, increase the FEC of their transponders to deliver essentially the same strength of S/N as previous, but with some extra bitrate as a bonus - for example, going from DVB-S 27500 2/3 to DVB-S 27500 3/4 gives an extra 4.2Mbits. I'd say Sky's engineers and technicians will be monitoring the BBC's recent transmission changes on their HD transponder and take into account any calls into customer services where BBC1 HD and BBC HD are lost or prone to breaking up.