Dragon Age: Inquisition

GetInTheHole!

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/gaming/bioware-confirms-development-of-dragon-age-3-inquisition-8151911.html

http://ie.ign.com/articles/2012/09/17/dragon-age-3-inquisition-announced

Very little details actually given but release is expected in late 2013 with talk of you playing the part of an Inquisition character in war ravaged Orlais..

DA:O is still one of my favourite games but DA2 just took the p*ss in my opinion.

What are the chances that this will be a return to form?

marshbaboon

If I could care less about a Dragon Age sequel I'd fade into oblivion.

Dermighty

I bought Dragon Age 2, played it for approximately 30 minutes and then decided that Bioware could go ****ing themselves with an iron pole.

What a heap of **** they turned out to be.

johnny_ultimate

TBH, I never quite got the big deal about Dragon Age: Origins. Yes, I played it on 360, hence missing the supposedly superior combat, but the world, characters and level design (hmm, I wonder if there's enemies behind this door... of course there ****ing is) were so lazy and derivative I just gave up halfway through. I simply couldn't have cared less. The negative reviews for the second always makes me wonder how much worse it could actually be. Not curious enough to ever consider playing it or anything.

Canis Lupus

Found the first one had finicky controls (reeeeeeally disliked the fact that clicking a character jumped to their perspective and thus confusing the hell out of the situation) and the difficulty level was all kinds of messed up. Normal was ridiculously hard and easy was ridiculously easy.

Long story short... I agree with Mr Baboon.

calex71

Hated DA2 loved DA:O

If the Mass Effect series has taught me nothing it's that a 3rd game will be even more dumbed down and removed from the original. No Sale.

Wonder if they will recycle the environments and dungeons again to cur cost and dev time


....... Oh and this news on the back of the news that the founders have "retired" http://investorplace.com/2012/09/bioware-founders-leaving/

Rats fleeing a sinking ship? probably not but still after DA:2 and ME:3 Bioware can f right off

calex71

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

TBH, I never quite got the big deal about Dragon Age: Origins. Yes, I played it on 360, hence missing the supposedly superior combat, but the world, characters and level design (hmm, I wonder if there's enemies behind this door... of course there ****ing is) were so lazy and derivative I just gave up halfway through. I simply couldn't have cared less. The negative reviews for the second always makes me wonder how much worse it could actually be. Not curious enough to ever consider playing it or anything.

Think mass effect series, pretend there was not a 2 and skip to 3 you're there except DA:2 just copy pasted the same dungeon into various parts of the game.

Zillah

This is your last god damn chance Bioware.

Kerplunk124

I've tried about 3 times to get into the first one but i just cant

gizmo

calex71 wrote: »

Wonder if they will recycle the environments and dungeons again to cur cost and dev time

Given the fact that they're using the Frostbite 2 engine, I'd wager no.

Potential-Monke

Kerplunk124 wrote: »

I've tried about 3 times to get into the first one but i just cant

How long are you giving it? I hated it the first time i played it but it grew on me after you get out of the castle and a bit further into the story. Plus, you get to plough Morrigan if you play your cards right!

It has it problems, yes, but i enjoyed it (having not played any of the D&D games or similar before).

But, DA2 was pants. Terrible let down. And i was fully expecting

a continuation of the Morrigan story

but didn't get anything. Rightly annoyed.

danthefan

Looking forward to see how this turns out, I loved the first game, skipped the 2nd based on the reviews. If it's as good as the first I'll be happy.

saiint

loved origins
hated the rest
and the expansions...
hopefully this one will be an improvement

AnCapaillMor

Actually liked the story from the 2nd one but the gameplay did let it down, it get tedious fairly fast.

degrassinoel

Played origins through a few times, Da2 once. And to be fair to it.. i enjoyed the story from start to end, though it was entirely clear from the end that there would definetly be a sequel.

I did try a few times to play through Da2 again but it doesn't have the ballgrabbing ability that other bioware games have, at least not for me anyway.

I can understand(i don't agree) people not liking ME3 but ME2 was brilliant, i much preferred it over the original mass effect due to a lot of reasons, but mainly the mako was a massive pain in the ring. That said, so was planet scanning and evading the reapers..

Mr Freeze

AnCapaillMor wrote: »

Actually liked the story from the 2nd one but the gameplay did let it down, it get tedious fairly fast.

The 2nd one was good during the whole Qunari plot, I thought that this was the main plot, but it was dealt with half way through the game.

I think the game would have been ok, if they hadn't dumbed it down and if didn't re-use the same interiors over and over, and if they had a bigger storyline with more than just Kirkwall as the setting. The game was tiny compared to DA:O, you were just running around Kirkwall the whole game.

blatantrereg

degrassinoel wrote: »

Played origins through a few times, Da2 once. And to be fair to it.. i enjoyed the story from start to end, though it was entirely clear from the end that there would definetly be a sequel.

I did try a few times to play through Da2 again but it doesn't have the ballgrabbing ability that other bioware games have, at least not for me anyway.

I can understand(i don't agree) people not liking ME3 but ME2 was brilliant, i much preferred it over the original mass effect due to a lot of reasons, but mainly the mako was a massive pain in the ring. That said, so was planet scanning and evading the reapers..

I was more disappointed by ME2 than by DA2, which I quite liked. ME2 was stupidly easy, even on hardest level (and I'm not anything special when it comes to FPS games). I liked ME3 a lot.
DA:Awakenings was broken for me as my tank character became invulnerable to normal damage pretty fast from sensible levelling and no exploits spoilers or cheating. I really really liked DA:Origins and am looking forward to DA3; pleased that it will be made.

Icyseanfitz

meh bioware have lost their magic in my opinion, couldnt care less about any of their games these days (saying a lot coming from a former bioware fangirl :pac:), EA is the devil and all that lark

nyarlothothep

I'm looking forward to it. If they make like the original or even moreso in the spirit of Baldur's Gate it will be a sure fire win. Additionally I think they should go with an unconventional plot, I found DAs plot to be boring, but they got the characterisation just right. For DA3 it would be cool if they went with a character piece involving intrigue, magic and prophecy but primarily conveyed through character motivations rather than plot devices. It will probably be none of those things.

sin0city

Old thread I know but I've just seen it's likely cross platform so I may have to get a PS4 earlier than expected.

For a Dragon Age thread there's a lot of negativity there. I f*cking love the series. It's a really well conceived world and the lore is excellent. There should be more games developed like this.

Dragon Age: Origins is one of my favourite games and I thoroughly enjoyed 2.
Yeah, the reused dungeons was inexcusable and they dumbed equipment down but I thought the story was engaging and there were some excellent characters. I think they struggled with time on this one.

But yeah, the new Dragon Age is my most anticipated game this year and I think it will look epic with the new engine. They also have the tools to make a massive game now with the memory on the PS4. I've really high hopes for it.

Big Knox

DA:O was a flawed but great game. It had some lazy design at times but it also had some excellent characters and the combat was done very well. However it's one of those games where you absolutely had to play it on hard or it's a completely different experience. The difficulty brought a new dimension to play where you couldn't just autopilot and end up hating the sometimes annoying and predictable enemy placement. You really had to make good use of the AI skill and queue system. I also strongly disagree with anyone who says it was a broken system as it wasn't, the hardest difficulty wouldn't be possible if it didn't work.

I gave up on the 2nd one, even though I wasn't hating it as such I just couldn't forgive the terrible design decisions and laziness that was evident throughout. However I'm hopeful that 3 will be a much better affair.

sin0city

Big Knox wrote: »

However it's one of those games where you absolutely had to play it on hard or it's a completely different experience.

Agree. Once I realised that area of effect spells didn't hurt your own party members on normal I turned it to hard. Seemed like that should have been the default difficulty. It called for some micro-managing and I think I'd have enjoyed the game far less on normal and I dont' usually play games on hard.

Dcully

DAO was fantastic DA2 was very poor imo but i didnt play much of it.
Infact i might install DAO again for another playthrough.

Sarky

The characters were well done, but DA's setting just wasn't interesting enough to keep me going. I don't think I'll be soiling myself with anxiety waiting for this one.

Cillo rs200

Can't get excited for this at all. DA:O was great, DA2's story was great too, but the game itself was a serious letdown. Aside from the recycled dungeon, whoever at Bioware thought taking away the ability to manage our parties armour should be shot! Like really, we are all rpg nerds here, micromanaging parties is what it's all about!

I'll wait for reviews on this on i think.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

rpg nerds were exactly the people they weren't targetting with DA2

Cillo rs200

True, actually they did the same with Mass Effect. Assholes. Hopefully they will listen to the criticisms, from what i've heard so far they seem to be.

YouSavedMyLife

I actually liked DA2 more than DA1. Im probably the only person in the world mind you, but i did like it. Maybe cause i played DA1 on a console and tbh it was terrible. Played through DA2 twice and really liked it :rolleyes: Went back to play DA1 after i got a gaming PC and my god is the combat slow.....ugh, gave up after 2 hours.

Pushtrak

I had a lot of fun with Awakening. I don't know how many times I've cleared it, but I know I've cleared it with each of the character classes, some multiple times. Some of the origin stories, I thought great, though wasn't impressed too much by some of them. It was a great game, but I don't have motivation to go back to it again.

There are certain parts in the game that are just dull after playing too many times. For instance, the bit where you

go to get the help of the mages and are in the dream world or whatever

. It has been ages since I played it, so my ability to describe it isn't the greatest, but ye should know what I mean. Awakening was amazing. I think the story was better in it than Origins, and I really enjoyed Origins story.

Other DLC for it was hit and miss. Some quite poor bits in there DLC wise. The ultimate box was great so you didn't specifically have to pay for the lesser quality DLC.

Dragon Age 2, it wasn't much of a game. It was more of a poor expansion quality. Awakening would have impressed far more as DA2 than what we got. And the DLC was very poor in DA2. That said, I am looking forward to DA3. I hope it is closer to the quality of Origins than 2, that's for sure.

It seems popular to hate BioWare these days. People are pissed about DA2 and ME3. DA2 I get. ME3, I get where people are coming from, but it has so much going for it aside from the concerns that I can't write off the game. It was a very good game, with at least one stupid decision which I don't need to go in to.

sin0city

Cillo rs200 wrote: »

I'll wait for reviews on this on i think.

Yeah, I'll probably get it because of the world and lore alone. Orlais setting could be good I think and I really like the fact there's talk that you'll get to meet your characters from the other 2 in game. Not so sure about this coop talk though. Most single player game now seems to have to have coop or multiplayer added.

Pushtrak wrote: »

Some of the origin stories, I thought great, though wasn't impressed too much by some of them. It was a great game, but I don't have motivation to go back to it again.

There are certain parts in the game that are just dull after playing too many times. For instance, the bit where you

go to get the help of the mages and are in the dream world or whatever

. It has been ages since I played it, so my ability to describe it isn't the greatest, but ye should know what I mean. Awakening was amazing. I think the story was better in it than Origins, and I really enjoyed Origins story.

Other DLC for it was hit and miss. Some quite poor bits in there DLC wise. The ultimate box was great so you didn't specifically have to pay for the lesser quality DLC.

Dragon Age 2, it wasn't much of a game. It was more of a poor expansion quality. Awakening would have impressed far more as DA2 than what we got. And the DLC was very poor in DA2. That said, I am looking forward to DA3. I hope it is closer to the quality of Origins than 2, that's for sure.

It seems popular to hate BioWare these days. People are pissed about DA2 and ME3. DA2 I get. ME3, I get where people are coming from, but it has so much going for it aside from the concerns that I can't write off the game. It was a very good game, with at least one stupid decision which I don't need to go in to.

Yeah, even though all the origin stories weren't great the fact that they were there at all was great. I know what you mean about the fade. I started a new play through a while ago and haven't gone back to it because the thoughts of doing the fade again put me off.

I enjoyed all the DLC though. Played through them all except witch hunt - I'd just had enough at that stage.

It does seem popular to hate on Bioware and that pisses me off because they make incredible games. In my opinion, leaving the ending aside, ME3 is still one of the best games ever made.

I loved DA:O, but one of the things I hated on the Xbox version was that the sprint key and the interact key were the same. So I'd be running from some enemies, one of my team would run near me, and suddenly they'd tell me that it wasn't a good time to chat. Or in non-combat, where we'd leap into huge conversations.

I can't remember much from DA2, but just that it was nowhere near as good.

mewso

I am just playing through Baldur's Gate having grabbed it and it's sequel from GOG and I'm just sorry I missed it first time around. Really don't know why I didn't play it then but this is gaming crack as my good friend amp used to say. I can see how the casual gamer would be put off by it and why Bioware gravitated towards a more "streamlined" mechanic but I would like to hear what people who have played the oldies feel about Bioware today compared to then. I have thoroughly enjoyed their modern games but playing through BG now I think their games have lost a lot. Maybe I was better off for not having being spoilt by their older games before playing Mass Effect and Dragon Age.

sin0city

I don't know. Baldur's gate is a classic. Been thinking about picking up the enhanced edition but have enough games at the moment. It was a more focused rpg with deeper mechanics alright and the writing's brilliant but I think the writing in ME is brilliant too. I will never forget Kaiden coming on to my male Shepard at the Citadel, cheesy music and all.

For me it's not neessarily better than the new games, just different. BG2 is even better by the way and KOTOR is quality too. I still have faith in Bioware and am just happy they're still making games. They are one of my favourite developers.

Cillo rs200

sin0city wrote: »

Yeah, I'll probably get it because of the world and lore alone. Orlais setting could be good I think and I really like the fact there's talk that you'll get to meet your characters from the other 2 in game. Not so sure about this coop talk though. Most single player game now seems to have to have coop or multiplayer added.

I'm hoping that the fallout from the mages vs the Chantry (I am very rusty story wise so forgive me if i'm wrong on this!) will be a major plot point in the 3rd. You could have the mages openly rebelling and calling on the Tevinter Imperium for help (Love the idea of the tevinter imperium). The whole Qunari plot line in DA2 was woefully underutilised in my opinion. Especially after that awesome trailer with Hawk fighting that dude and using blood magic to rip him apart. Oh, and that badass sword/staff!

sin0city wrote: »

It does seem popular to hate on Bioware and that pisses me off because they make incredible games. In my opinion, leaving the ending aside, ME3 is still one of the best games ever made.

I agree totally about ME3. But the reason I'm hating on them is because DA and ME were far and away my favorite franchises, and KOTR was up there too. To drop the ball so badly on all three was unforgivable. It's telling that the downturn coincides with joining EA. If the new ME games get good reviews i'll jump back in though.

Icyseanfitz

meh bioware are dead to me, ea ruined them

Kirby

Bioware screwed up badly with Dragon age 2 and the whole mass effect 3 ending. It was terribly, terribly written and was completely devoid of any common sense or link to the rest of the three games.

They could use a PR win to be honest, especially after the semi failure that The old republic turned into. I'm hoping Dragon Age 3 captures what made Origins great and improves upon it.

sin0city

Cillo rs200 wrote: »

It's telling that the downturn coincides with joining EA.

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

meh bioware are dead to me, ea ruined them

I really hope this isn't the case but unfortunately it stacks up so far.

Reekwind

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

meh bioware are dead to me, ea ruined them

I think the real problem with Bioware is their over-designed games that treat the players as idiotic bystanders. That predates EA

sin0city

Falthyron

Reekwind wrote: »

I think the real problem with Bioware is their over-designed games that treat the players as idiotic bystanders. That predates EA

Eh, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, and Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic say 'Hi!'...

I hate EA too, but less of the sweeping generalizations please. The whole point of 'modern' games is to attract idiotic bystanders, hence WoW-clones, DA2, and changes made to Mass Effect 3, when compared to ME1.

Reekwind

Falthyron wrote: »

Eh, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, and Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic say 'Hi!'...

And since then? Oh hey there Mass Effect!

There's not a clean break between the early days and today's repetitive formula (how painfully familiar the three area format of NWN has become) but it's not difficult to determine 'early' and 'late' Bioware periods. The excesses of the latter, which I'd date to Mass Effect, do predate the EA period

I hate EA too, but less of the sweeping generalizations please. The whole point of 'modern' games is to attract idiotic bystanders, hence WoW-clones, DA2, and changes made to Mass Effect 3, when compared to ME1.

So let's not slate Bioware for dumbing down (for lack of better term) because everyone else is doing the same?

Falthyron

Reekwind wrote: »

And since then? Oh hey there Mass Effect!

There's not a clean break between the early days and today's repetitive formula (how painfully familiar the three area format of NWN has become) but it's not difficult to determine 'early' and 'late' Bioware periods. The excesses of the latter, which I'd date to Mass Effect, do predate the EA period

So let's not slate Bioware for dumbing down (for lack of better term) because everyone else is doing the same?

The 'dumbing down' is indicative of the industry, not just BioWare. Yes, they have dumbed down and the break is very clear from ME2 onwards. Dragon Age: Origins not so much, but it's successor is certainly dumbed down. This is a part of the decision making process at EA.

I can not accept your argument that KotOR is comparable to Dragon Age 2... Leagues apart. And this division can be, and has been attributed to the merging with EA. EA have decided that they need a broader audience, which means catering for the largest denominator. In EA's eyes, you start at the bottom and work from there. NWN, DA:O, Baldur's Gate, are complex games and the likes of ME3 or DA2 are child's play. Anyone could play them.

This same effect can be seen with the Elder Scrolls series. It is a systemic problem designed to appeal to as many as possible. I have little hope for Dragon Age 3, especially after EA announcing all of their future titles will have micro-transactions.

BioWare were a far better company for gamers before the EA merger. Now, however, they are a far better money making company (SWTOR excluded :P ) with wide ranging appeal. For me, they will be remembered for the former rather than the latter.

Reekwind

Falthyron wrote: »

The 'dumbing down' is indicative of the industry, not just BioWare. Yes, they have dumbed down and the break is very clear from ME2 onwards. Dragon Age: Origins not so much, but it's successor is certainly dumbed down. This is a part of the decision making process at EA

There's two parts here:

The first is the assumption that it's okay for a company to dumb down its games and streamline them to the point of inanity because some other companies are doing it. If Bioware are making poor design decisions then they should be called out on it, regardless of trends elsewhere in the industry. They're responsible for their content, not that of other companies

(And it's not as if it's impossible to make complex and worthy games in today's environment. The Witcher and Crusader Kings II, to take two very different examples, show how developers can still make commercially and critically lauded games that combine polish with depth and don't handhold the player every step of the way)

Secondly is the EA connection. The truth is that Bioware's template game is Mass Effect. That's where the key features of this generation of games (dialogue wheel, reliance on cinematics, ultra-defined areas and associated quests, ridiculous signposting, etc) really took form. The signs were leading there of course but even Jade Empire (very much a hybrid beast) is still very different from what came later. And the development of ME predates the EA acquisition. That cannot be said to be forced on the company from the outside

I can not accept your argument that KotOR is comparable to Dragon Age 2... Leagues apart. And this division can be, and has been attributed to the merging with EA

To continue from above, Bioware showed all the signs of over-designing their games long before. Remember this chart? How many similarities can you spot between KOTOR and DA:O?

But for me, and this is going back a fair bit, what was really damning was an interview in which a Bioware writer defended their archetypal narrative structure (in particular the four area design) on the basis that it was all players could handle. Give people, so the theory went, more than four areas to visit and they'd get lost; give them more than four quests to complete at the same time and they'd lose track; better to give them bright map markers to be sure that they didn't have to navigate. It's taking design to the extremes to reduce the role of player freedom/choice

And this was before the arrival of EA on the scene

Icyseanfitz

i think this sums up bioware these days

push a button something awesome has to happen :rolleyes:

pity i used to love bioware, bg1, bg2, kotor, jade empire me1 and dao where all great games imo

gizmo

I do wonder about people who blame EA for Bioware losing their more purist RPG credentials. Have you not played Jade Empire?

Cillo rs200

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

push a button something awesome has to happen :rolleyes:

Just like training mice in a lab.

I know it was already mentioned but I'm just praying to god that CD projekt don't ever sell up. They seem to be the last bastion of challenging game design. The witcher 3 will be up there with the second coming of jesus hopefully. A badass, bearded, demon infused DNA jesus.

Kirby

Cillo rs200 wrote: »

Just like training mice in a lab.

I know it was already mentioned but I'm just praying to god that CD projekt don't ever sell up. They seem to be the last bastion of challenging game design. The witcher 3 will be up there with the second coming of jesus hopefully. A badass, bearded, demon infused DNA jesus.

They are changing direction with the third one though. It's open world. It's much more difficult to pull their type of story off in an open world setting.

Cillo rs200

That is true, i'm hoping the increased freedom of the next gen consoles will allow them to compensate for that a bit, their prossessing power will dictate a lot. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt for now anyway, they haven't put a foot wrong yet. And the wild hunt is such a freaking cool idea, I can't wait to play it. If they turn it into a Skyrim clone i will freak.

nesf

mewso wrote: »

I am just playing through Baldur's Gate having grabbed it and it's sequel from GOG and I'm just sorry I missed it first time around. Really don't know why I didn't play it then but this is gaming crack as my good friend amp used to say. I can see how the casual gamer would be put off by it and why Bioware gravitated towards a more "streamlined" mechanic but I would like to hear what people who have played the oldies feel about Bioware today compared to then. I have thoroughly enjoyed their modern games but playing through BG now I think their games have lost a lot. Maybe I was better off for not having being spoilt by their older games before playing Mass Effect and Dragon Age.

The early Bioware RPGs were formative for me though I grew up playing the old SSI licenced AD&D RPGs and seriously if you think BG is unforgiving... Back in the 80s and 90s RPG markers for the PC seemed to believe that people were not knuckle dragging morons (I can't speak for console RPGs of this time, I didn't play them but from what I've heard many of them weren't easy to put it mildly). Nowadays since the switch to cross platform games and the attempt to appeal to as broad (read: dumb/lazy) an audience as possible we get streamlining! Dragon Age II in the paraphrased word of one reviewer was changed in ways to make it appeal more to people who didn't connect with Dragon Age Origins while simultaneously alienating those who did connect with DA:O. The still streamlined but more complex than most DA:O was too much for some people apparently so we get the mess that's DA II.

I've given up on Bioware making anything like BG I or II again. Gaming in most genres has become a thing of mass entertainment. I do still have hopes for the genre though and so do many others apparently: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/obsidian/project-eternity?ref=card

To quote:

We have wanted to go back to our roots and create an epic PC role-playing game adventure for years. But, it's been almost impossible to get funding through traditional methods for a game like this.

I've read similar complaints for FPS players about the dumbing down of the genre over the past decade. I don't play FPS games much though so I don't know the truth of it. The only genre that I regularly play that hasn't seen a whole lot of dumbing down is Strategy. Getting into the arguments why that is could take all night and I need sleep so, eh rant over.

Icyseanfitz

yup ive big hopes for project eternity and many of the kickstarter games actually, they dont have any big publisher behind them pushing what they think gamers want

Big Knox

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

yup ive big hopes for project eternity and many of the kickstarter games actually, they dont have any big publisher behind them pushing what they think gamers want

Yep it's the only way we are going to see what the old school fans want. Path of Exile is a great example. An ARPG made by a small dev company, funded through donations and supporter packs and it is glorious. The game every true ARPG fan wanted since D2. Even with a true F2P model it's already been a huge success so far and it's still only in open beta so hopefully more success stories can pop up in different genres also.