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Can you teach just any old subject? Do standards matter at all?

  • 10-09-2012 11:29am
    #1
    speedycow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭


    Hi all,
    I was wondering if anyone could enlighten me about qualifications to teach. My contract recently ended, not because there's no hours in my subject but because a teacher, who has only gotten LC in this subject themselves, is permanent and got the hours. They have been teaching this subject for a number of years but they have absolutely now qualification to do so.

    Is this the standard we are teaching to now? Are the TC not supposed to uphold professional standards? I just don't understand how a teacher with on a LC in a subject can teach it to students, while there's a fully qualified, experienced teacher in that same subject out of work.


Comments

  • #2
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,397 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    speedycow wrote: »
    Hi all,
    I was wondering if anyone could enlighten me about qualifications to teach. My contract recently ended, not because there's no hours in my subject but because a teacher, who has only gotten LC in this subject themselves, is permanent and got the hours. They have been teaching this subject for a number of years but they have absolutely now qualification to do so.

    Is this the standard we are teaching to now? Are the TC not supposed to uphold professional standards? I just don't understand how a teacher with on a LC in a subject can teach it to students, while there's a fully qualified, experienced teacher in that same subject out of work.


    You've answered your own question. A permanent teacher's timetable has to be filled with hours before contract people so they got them for that reason not any other. No it's not fair, but had to be accommodated somewhere.


  • #3
    dukedalton
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 404 ✭✭dukedalton


    In theory, once a teacher is registered with the Teaching Council to teach, they can be employed in any way the individual school sees fit. However, I would imagine it's not going to reflect very well on the school in an inspection if there is a teacher teaching a subject they have no qualification in.

    I know from personal experience that schools are now very strict as regards teachers qualifications when they're hiring new staff, so I'd imagine in the future the system will even itself out. At the moment, though, trying to untangle unqualified permanent staff from teaching positions would bring the whole system to a shuddering halt.

    Not much consolation to people like you or me, though.


  • #4
    Gurgle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,064 ✭✭✭Gurgle


    dukedalton wrote: »
    I would imagine it's not going to reflect very well on the school in an inspection if there is a teacher teaching a subject they have no qualification in.

    Is this reported though?
    Are there any consequences for a school that does this?

    Is there any way for a parent to know if (for example) they're sending their child to a school staffed entirely by teachers qualified only to teach German?


  • #5
    dukedalton
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 404 ✭✭dukedalton


    Gurgle wrote: »
    Is this reported though?
    Are there any consequences for a school that does this?

    Is there any way for a parent to know if (for example) they're sending their child to a school staffed entirely by teachers qualified only to teach German?

    Yes, if it is the case that a teacher or teachers are teaching subjects they're not qualified to teach, it will appear in the report (the individuals concerned are not named, obviously).

    You will find inspection reports here:

    http://www.schooldays.ie/articles/Secondary-Schools-in-Ireland-by-County

    Edit: There are no tangible consequences for a school which has teachers teaching subjects they're not qualified in, other than it being in the report.


  • #6
    Gurgle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,064 ✭✭✭Gurgle


    dukedalton wrote: »
    You will find inspection reports here:

    http://www.schooldays.ie/articles/Secondary-Schools-in-Ireland-by-County
    Thanks for that, never realized the reports were available.

    I just read the report on my son's school's maths inspection.
    The quality of teaching and learning was good in the majority of lessons observed. There was, however, scope for further development in a significant minority.

    This (I guess) is diplomatic code for "One of the (qualified)teachers just leaves the kids to themselves with their maths books, nothing is ever corrected but at least there's a teaching assistant on hand to try and explain things when they get stuck."


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  • #7
    seavill
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,620 ✭✭✭seavill


    Gurgle wrote: »
    This (I guess) is diplomatic code for "One of the (qualified)teachers just leaves the kids to themselves with their maths books, nothing is ever corrected but at least there's a teaching assistant on hand to try and explain things when they get stuck."

    That is a fair jump to make. To be 100% honest I'm not sure are you trolling to get a response there or not.

    It could mean any number of things.

    Does you school have a teaching assistant?


  • #8
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,397 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    Gurgle wrote: »
    Thanks for that, never realized the reports were available.

    I just read the report on my son's school's maths inspection.



    This (I guess) is diplomatic code for "One of the (qualified)teachers just leaves the kids to themselves with their maths books, nothing is ever corrected but at least there's a teaching assistant on hand to try and explain things when they get stuck."

    Not necessarily. It could mean that the teacher is teaching mainly using the book and the whiteboard and the inspector would have preferred to see more use of IT in the classroom, as that is what they are currently obsessed with.


    A friend of mine said they had an incidental inspection in her school today. The inspector said at one point that they would like to see more use of the data projectors in the classroom but later went on to say that they didn't want to see so much powerpoint. You can't win. Granted you can do other things on the computer, but showing (relevant) video clips is often a non runner as youtube is blocked in most schools and 90% of video clips online are on youtube.


    A lot of inspections are about ticking boxes. I know teachers who have used data projectors to project the axes for graphs onto the board. They could just as easily draw them with a marker to the same effect yet because they've projected them inspectors think it's a marvellous innovation when really it's the exact same thing only they've saved themselves the effort of drawing two lines.


  • #9
    Gurgle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,064 ✭✭✭Gurgle


    seavill wrote: »
    That is a fair jump to make. To be 100% honest I'm not sure are you trolling to get a response there or not...
    Does you school have a teaching assistant?

    Not trolling, the vast majority of the teachers in the school are top notch by all accounts. They have 2 maths teachers, one is apparently very good the other is a waste of space. There's a teaching assistant in the class with the bad one, and he does his best but he isn't a maths teacher.


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