a starting pistol, do i need a permit/licence

niall_b73

ok so i have my dog and i am training her up.
she will soon be 1 year old and i think it is time she got introduced to the bang of a shot being fired.
i do not own a shotgun.

so i was thinking of purchasing a starter pistol that fires blank 22's

in order for me to do this do i need to get permission from anyone or can i just go ahead and buy it and use away at it freely.

many thanks,
niall_b73

dev110

AFAIK you need to get authorisation from your Super.

Sparks

Yeah, you need an authorisation from your Super, after that you're covered. Without it, you'd be in possession of an unlicenced firearm.

meathstevie

Also a lot cheaper to get someone to fire a few shots with a shotgun over the dog, .22lr blanks are nowhere near the sound of a shotgun as well.

thermo

the op could get a blank fire pistol that fires 9mm P.A.K.. much louder than a .22 blank.

niall_b73

ok so after further investigation and chatting to various guarda the local officer in charge of the fireams rang me and told me that i would need to fill in the FCA1 form in order to get a permit.
i was also told that i would have to pay the same as i would for a proper firearm.
so i am going ahead with the sending off of the form but i dont see any point in paying the fee for a starting pistol.
courious to see what will come of it

niall_b73

Cass

That sounds very odd.

A blank firing gun is a firearm, and does need authorisation, but it does not fire a projectile, a letter from the Super has all that has ever been needed, and there is no section on the FCA1 to tick for a blank gun.

Sparks

He (the Garda) is wrong. That's not what the firearms act reads, and there's no need to apply via FCA1 for a full firearms licence.

Section 2(4)(g) is very clear; you do not need a firearms licence for

(g) the possession, use or carriage of a firearm or blank ammunition for the purpose of starting athletic races by a person who stands authorised in that behalf under this section,

And that authorisation is granted under section 2(5)(a) by the local Superintendent:

5) (a) The Superintendent of any district may authorise in writing the possession, use or carriage of firearms or ammunition in that district in any of the circumstances specified in paragraphs (d), (e), (f), (g), (h) or (j) of subsection (4) of this section,or of any component parts of a firearm, during such period, not exceeding one year, as may be specified in the authorisation.

This appears to be a clear-cut instance of something the Garda Firearms Policy Unit has spoken about to the shooting community in the past - a local Garda at the desk who doesn't know the specifics making a call he shouldn't. Unless it was the Super you were talking to, put the request to the Super instead of the lad at the desk; and if it was the Super, give the Firearms Policy Unit a call and ask for help there.

niall_b73

thanks for that spark.
so i just got off the phone to the firearms policy unit and he said after explaining my case that i can send in the FCA1 form and apply that way so as the licence would be granted for the 3 years at the cost of the 3 year licence

or

that i can write directly to the local superintendant stating in depth what my need and purpose for the gun was and that if i was successful that he would issue me with a yearly permit which would need to be updated yearly at no cost !!

niall_b73

daveob007

directly to the super,blank firers do not require a firearms cert only a letter at no cost.

Mezamo

I think you should also let the Super know that his own lads havnt got a ****ing clue and to have them trained properly!!

chem

What about blank fire guns for re-enactors?? Rifles/sub machine guns? I have seen some of the stuff a UK company rent and its jaw dropping! Hire and fire is the name of the company. Hireandfire-uk.com

Sparks

chem wrote: »

What about blank fire guns for re-enactors?

Same deal, different section. Section 2(4)(f) to be exact:

(f) the possession, use or carriage of a firearm or ammunition by a person taking part in a theatrical performance or rehearsal or in the production of a cinematograph film for the purpose of the performance, rehearsal or production, being a performance, rehearsal or production the person in charge of which stands authorised in that behalf under this section,

And the authorisation goes out from section 2(5) as before.

niall_b73

well now, where do i start.......
i finally received word back after many phone calls to the local guarda station and a visit by the so called firearms officer.

when the firearms officer called out to me he told me that there was no such thing as an annual permit from the super, so i printed of the sections above stating where is said that there was for him and he took it with him to look into it more but he was still not satisfied !!
he still asked me for the fca1 form and took that with him as well.

to cut a long story short i got my refusal today.

Copy of starter pistol refusal.jpg

so that is that, i dont know what the hell i was going to shoot or who the hell i was going to hurt with the starting pistol but thats the way it is !!

i just cant be arsed anymore :mad:

niall_b73

Cavan duck buster

niall_b73 wrote: »

well now, where do i start.......
i finally received word back after many phone calls to the local guarda station and a visit by the so called firearms officer.

when the firearms officer called out to me he told me that there was no such thing as an annual permit from the super, so i printed of the sections above stating where is said that there was for him and he took it with him to look into it more but he was still not satisfied !!
he still asked me for the fca1 form and took that with him as well.

to cut a long story short i got my refusal today.

Copy of starter pistol refusal.jpg

so that is that, i dont know what the hell i was going to shoot or who the hell i was going to hurt with the starting pistol but thats the way it is !!

i just cant be arsed anymore :mad:

niall_b73

That supper for yours (don't mink me saying) has no F##KING notion on what is reverent to the firearms act ect. At all, i hope you will challenge your supper, and by all means, DO NOT PAY for permit!!!

juice1304

I would ring the FPU and see what they have to say about it. If your are already a firearms owner there should be no reason not to allow you to have it to train your dog.:mad::mad::rolleyes:

niall_b73

juice1304 wrote: »

I would ring the FPU and see what they have to say about it. If your are already a firearms owner there should be no reason not to allow you to have it to train your dog.:mad::mad::rolleyes:

ahh i cant be bothered anymore :mad:
i dont have a fire arm, was refused that last year as well :mad:
i'll just have to stick to fishing

niall_b73

Vegeta

I hope I don't cause offense here but do you have you any previous convictions or rulings against you?

niall_b73

Vegeta wrote: »

I hope I don't cause offense here but do you have you any previous convictions or rulings against you?

yeah, a long time ago and i told him all.

niall_b73

DJandDeid

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/under-starters-orders-the-latest-weapon-to-be-outlawed-1947204.html

Possibly this might have something to do with the Super's decision

garv123

niall_b73 wrote: »

well now, where do i start.......
i finally received word back after many phone calls to the local guarda station and a visit by the so called firearms officer.

when the firearms officer called out to me he told me that there was no such thing as an annual permit from the super, so i printed of the sections above stating where is said that there was for him and he took it with him to look into it more but he was still not satisfied !!
he still asked me for the fca1 form and took that with him as well.

to cut a long story short i got my refusal today.

Copy of starter pistol refusal.jpg

so that is that, i dont know what the hell i was going to shoot or who the hell i was going to hurt with the starting pistol but thats the way it is !!

i just cant be arsed anymore :mad:

niall_b73

Do you not already have a shotgun licence?

niall_b73

garv123 wrote: »

Do you not already have a shotgun licence?

nope

niall_b73