Romney is now a 'birther'.

joseph brand

“Ann was born in Henry Ford Hospital, I was born in Harper Hospital. No one’s ever asked to see my birth certificate; they know that this is the place that we were born and raised,” he said.

And here I was, thinking that this issue was put to bed, except for some crackpots who can't/ won't get over it. Has he met Orly Taitz?

So, he's a mormon AND a birther! What's next? Stories of lizard people? He could yet turn out to be worse than palin. Give it time.

President Obama’s campaign was not impressed. “Governor Romney’s decision to directly enlist himself in the birther movement should give pause to any rational voter across America,” said spokesman Ben LaBolt.

The good side is; Romney is making a fool of himself.
The bad side is; he's insulting the intelligence (or lack there of) of voters and spreading ignorance.

Duck Soup

Oh dear. This just reeks of desperation. The Romney campaign has been on the back foot pretty much all summer; the Ryan bounce was zero; the lead-in to their convention is the Akin clusterfcuk. It kind of spits in the face of Romney's own rhetoric of last week, when he complained about campaigning of 'hate' and 'divisiveness'.

But no one should be terribly surprised. Even as Romney was talking about raising the debate, he was running three separate Mitt-approved TV spots about Obama dropping the workfare requirement for welfare payments [a claim Politifact judged to be a flat out lie].

It's dogwhistles. Sail as close to the "He's a furriner/He's handing out free loot to his black base" winds as you possibly can, and then throw your hands up in the air and exclaim "Racebaiting? I'm sure I don't know what you mean."

The electoral strategy is now crystal clear. Bet everything on white. Take big chunks out of the various ethnic votes with the voter suppression measures in the battleground states and lock up as much of the white vote as humanly possible. It's almost a throwback to the Nixon-to-Dubya era Southern Strategy campaigns.

Here's Romney cracking his birther comment today in Michigan:

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/08/24/romney-no-one-has-ever-asked-to-see-my-birth-certificate/comment-page-17/

And here's a discussion of it. Note Martin Bashir's observation that there are 7 birthers up for speaking slots at the Republican convention next week.

http://video.msnbc.msn.com/martin-bashir/48783257/#48783257

Mr.Micro

joseph brand wrote: »

And here I was, thinking that this issue was put to bed, except for some crackpots who can't/ won't get over it. Has he met Orly Taitz?

So, he's a mormon AND a birther! What's next? Stories of lizard people? He could yet turn out to be worse than palin. Give it time.



The good side is; Romney is making a fool of himself.
The bad side is; he's insulting the intelligence (or lack there of) of voters and spreading ignorance.

He is a disaster and could be the next President, as common sense does not always prevail in the US. He is so gaffe prone, a double for Stan in cartoon series "american dad". What is it with Republicans, that stupidity and arrogance are part of the package. Next he will be saying, has anyone noticed that Obama is not white....he is black,lol. Come on Obama, the last thing the US or the world needs is this guy, he probably even dyes his hair.

Atlantis50

Mitt Romney making a joke about his birth certificate makes him a birther?

Obama jokes about his birth certificate on a regular basis (just look at all the youtube videos for the search 'obama jokes about birth certificate').

If any Republican refers to their own birth certificate, that makes them a birther?

An objective look at this makes the OP and the posts above utter nonsense.

Duck Soup

Atlantis50 wrote: »

Mitt Romney making a joke about his birth certificate makes him a birther?

Obama jokes about his birth certificate on a regular basis (just look at all the youtube videos for the search 'obama jokes about birth certificate').

If any Republican refers to their own birth certificate, that makes them a birther?

An objective look at this makes the OP and the posts above utter nonsense.

Say Sting and George Michael are up for a Grammy and in the weeks leading up to the awards Sting makes a joke that "Well, another day gone by and I haven't been caught masturbating in public toilets" is he (a) taking a sly dig at his opponent under the guise of humour or (b) just making a passing general observation about the wild and crazy things that sometime occur in Californian public conveniences?

Obama gets to crack jokes about it because he's been subject to the most vitriolic and sustained campaign of lies about his very legitimacy as an American.

If Romney really wanted to do something similarly self-deprecating he might care to crack a few jokes about blacks at the back of Mormon churches (or some Mormon magic underpants jokes), getting postcards from the tropical tax haven locations his money holidays in or how he had to throw out some homeless people from the stable his dressage horse uses. Now that's comedy.

Atlantis50

So one joke about his own birth certificate makes Romney a birther?

What has Romney's consistent position all along on Obama's birth certificate and legitimacy to serve as President been?

That is the key issue to establish a pattern of 'birtherism'.

Einhard

Pretty desperate move, and I think anyone (hint hint Atlantis) who claims it wasn't done to cast doubt on Obama's birth place, and to pander to a fringe, is being disingenuous. However, as regards the negative ads, the Obama campaign hasn't exactly been pure as the driven snow on that front either, so I don't think Dems/liberals/Romney-haters can cast stones on that issue.

Atlantis50

Einhard wrote: »

Pretty desperate move, and I think anyone (hint hint Atlantis) who claims it wasn't done to cast doubt on Obama's birth place, and to pander to a fringe, is being disingenuous. However, as regards the negative ads, the Obama campaign hasn't exactly been pure as the driven snow on that front either, so I don't think Dems/liberals/Romney-haters can cast stones on that issue.

It was a joke about his own birth certificate. It is absolutely incredible that anyone with a modicum of intelligence (who follows American politics) would believe it was a targeted attempt to appeal to birthers who despise Obama enough already that they're going to vote against him no matter what.

Maybe you will answer this question: What has Romney's consistent position all along on Obama's birth certificate and legitimacy to serve as President been?

Jame Gumb

Ah come on Atlantis...it's pretty clear what Romney was doing and it's bad form.

Atlantis50

Jame Gumb wrote: »

Ah come on Atlantis...it's pretty clear what Romney was doing and it's bad form.

Yeah, because the birthers were unsure of how to vote in November or needed a greater reason to back Romney. This joke will get them going in favour of Romney :rolleyes:

Jane might answer the all-important question: What has Romney's consistent position all along on Obama's birth certificate and legitimacy to serve as President been?

Fr Tod Umptious

Again this is the typical reaction of Obama supporters on this board.

i.e Go way OTT on every utterance from Romney/Ryan/GOP and

a. proclaim that it will be the thing that finally kills their campaign

or

b. Express 'fear' that these people could get elected.

What are you all so worried about ?

Jame Gumb

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Again this is the typical reaction of Obama supporters on this board.

i.e Go way OTT on every utterance from Romney/Ryan/GOP and

a. proclaim that it will be the thing that finally kills their campaign

or

b. Express 'fear' that these people could get elected.

What are you all so worried about ?

Gormless right wing idiots in control of the most powerful military machine on the planet.

Gobsh1tes who believe that God is on their side in whatever they do being in charge of said military machine.

That kind of stuff.

Fr Tod Umptious

Jame Gumb wrote: »

Gormless right wing idiots in control of the most powerful military machine on the planet.

Gobsh1tes who believe that God is on their side in whatever they do being in charge of said military machine.

That kind of stuff.

Yep, and Obama has a kill list.

Enjoy the Kool Aid

MadsL

Atlantis50 wrote: »

Yeah, because the birthers were unsure of how to vote in November or needed a greater reason to back Romney. This joke will get them going in favour of Romney :rolleyes:

Jane might answer the all-important question: What has Romney's consistent position all along on Obama's birth certificate and legitimacy to serve as President been?

Forgive me if I steal my response from prospect.org
http://prospect.org/article/romneys-birther-joke-wasnt-joke

“The governor has always said, and has repeatedly said, he believes the president was born here in the United States,” Madden said. “He was only referencing that Michigan, where he is campaigning today, is the state where he himself was born and raised.”

Right.

Now, it’s unquestionably true that Mitt Romney isn’t a birther. He knows that President Obama was born in the United States and is fully eligible to serve as President of the United States.

But that isn’t an excuse, it’s an indictment.

If Romney's position all along has been to accept Obamba was born in the United States, then it is worse, not better to be making jokes about it at this stage. Watching the video this was a ra-ra statement designed to whip up a crowd who probably have their share of birthers. Watch him lap up the cheers.

Prospect continues..

Romney’s problem, throughout this campaign, has been his inability to seal the deal with skeptical conservatives. In the primaries, this forced him to take far-right positions on issues like abortion and immigration—he endorsed personhood amendments and “self-deportation”—and in the general election, it has led him to make a huge gamble by choosing Wisconsin Representative Paul Ryan—whose plan for Medicare plan and views on reproductive rights are widely unpopular—as his running mate. If Romney were confident in his ability to win the GOP base, he would have gone with someone more moderate. But as it stands, he needed a conservative ideologue on the ticket to show his fealty to the movement.

Let's watch as Romney is forced further and further to the right in order to feel comfortable that he is "speaking to the people", and let's watch as that loses him the election.

Einhard

Atlantis50 wrote: »

It was a joke about his own birth certificate. It is absolutely incredible that anyone with a modicum of intelligence (who follows American politics) would believe it was a targeted attempt to appeal to birthers who despise Obama enough already that they're going to vote against him no matter what.

Maybe you will answer this question: What has Romney's consistent position all along on Obama's birth certificate and legitimacy to serve as President been?

One thing I hate about politics in particular, is how so many people are willing to ignore the very obvious because it conflicts in some way with their positions. And that is what you are doing here Atlantis. Romney believes that Obama is American; as you point out, he has publicly stated that. But by mentionng it at such a rally, he encourages those who don't believe it and panders to the the fringe of the base. I don't think it's a big deal, but neither do I believe it was just a simple joke.

golden lane

lots of advice from experts........i am sure they need it......

Einhard

Atlantis50 wrote: »

Maybe you will answer this question: What has Romney's consistent position all along on Obama's birth certificate and legitimacy to serve as President been?

Pretty certain I did answer that. I'm sure you appreciate that one can have a position on a topic, and still give occasional mixed signals on the issue. As some Democrats have stated that they believe that Romney has paid tax, but still....hint,hint etc

matthew8

This is a ridiculous thread. I post on a highly-democrat board in which most people are highly sensitive about anything a republican says, not a word about this.

Memnoch

matthew8 wrote: »

This is a ridiculous thread. I post on a highly-democrat board in which most people are highly sensitive about anything a republican says, not a word about this.

Which proves that Romney wasn't trying to pander to birther sentiment with his ill judged 'joke.'

matthew8

Memnoch wrote: »

Which proves that Romney wasn't trying to pander to birther sentiment with his ill judged 'joke.'

Believe me, if Romney was just using some tea party racist dog whistle, that board would be all over it. It's one of their favourite words. Romney was just trying to crack a joke. If it didn't come out well it's because he's not a very funny guy. Obama cracks lots of jokes at press conferences. They're pretty funny.

Memnoch

matthew8 wrote: »

Believe me, if Romney was just using some tea party racist dog whistle, that board would be all over it. It's one of their favourite words. Romney was just trying to crack a joke. If it didn't come out well it's because he's not a very funny guy. Obama cracks lots of jokes at press conferences. They're pretty funny.

That's your opinion. Obviously a lot of people don't see it the same way. On the one hand, Romney is very gaffe prone, so much so I'm beginning to wonder if he isn't really some kind of highly advanced alien robot.

On the other, he's now being so tightly managed as a result of previous gaffes that I doubt he'd be saying anything on a speech that wasn't prescripted.

joseph brand

I love being home, in this place where Ann and I were raised. Where both of us were born … No one’s ever asked to see my birth certificate. They know that this is the place that we were born and raised.

He couldn't make it any clearer that he's referencing the 'birther' issue. Forget the whole economy and healthcare stuff, this is the main issue. It needs to be sorted, . . oh wait, it is.

No doubts at all that he's pandering to racists. No doubt.

Allow me to steal a comment from Reddit:

You know what we all have been asking for though Mitt? Your f*cking tax returns to be released just like every other presidential candidate has since your FATHER made it a campaign practice! And no "it has to do with my faith" bullsh*t. Your father was a Mormon too remember and he didn't have any issue with it.

The Reps want to go back 51 years for Obama's BC. They got it. The Dems and many Reps now want to go back 3, preferably 10 years, to see Romney's tax returns. NOT happening!

Ann Romney: "We've given all you people need to know and understand about our financial situation and how we live our life".

joseph brand

Memnoch wrote: »

That's your opinion. Obviously a lot of people don't see it the same way. On the one hand, Romney is very gaffe prone, so much so I'm beginning to wonder if he isn't really some kind of highly advanced alien robot.

On the other, he's now being so tightly managed as a result of previous gaffes that I doubt he'd be saying anything on a speech that wasn't prescripted.

This is the part which confuses me. Who let him perform this hilarious joke? Did his advisors think it would be fine? Sure it may go down well with that particular crowd, but there are reporters there!

I reckon if someone put Todd Akin's legitimate rape comments into Romney's next speech, he'd read them, because, just like Ron Burgundy, he'll read anything you put in front of him.

matthew8

That's your opinion. Obviously a lot of people don't see it the same way.

After a year of following Mitt Romney, I know just how awkward he is. He makes gaffes like this all the time. I doubt birthers will even find out about this.

Memnoch

matthew8 wrote: »

After a year of following Mitt Romney, I know just how awkward he is. He makes gaffes like this all the time. I doubt birthers will even find out about this.

He's not awkward, he just has no connection with or care for middle class Americans. His gaffes are actually quite telling for the most part.

'I'll bet you 20K dollars.'
'Corporations are people.'

Etc. Etc. He was born rich has lived his entire life rich with all the advantages that conferred upon him. He has no idea what it is like to truly struggle and to not have such an easy path in life. He would be absolutely the worst person possible to be president because he seems entirely devoid of genuine empathy for the people of the country.

Dave!

Forget the birther stuff, is Romney seriously gonna manage to get through the campaign without releasing his tax returns?! I can't believe he isn't feeling enough pressure on this. It's mad.

matthew8

Memnoch wrote: »

He's not awkward, he just has no connection with or care for middle class Americans. His gaffes are actually quite telling for the most part.

'I'll bet you 20K dollars.'
'Corporations are people.'

Etc. Etc. He was born rich has lived his entire life rich with all the advantages that conferred upon him. He has no idea what it is like to truly struggle and to not have such an easy path in life. He would be absolutely the worst person possible to be president because he seems entirely devoid of genuine empathy for the people of the country.

Since when do you need empathy to be president? The worst person possible? That's the biggest piece of hyperbole I've ever seen. I think that woman who thinks there are 2 vietnams might be a bit worse. And corporations are people is not an incorrect statement at all. I don't know why stating that it's people these corporations are made up of is a gaffe, because it's absolutely true.

MadsL

joseph brand wrote: »

Ann Romney: "We've given all you people need to know and understand about our financial situation and how we live our life".

Did you see Ann Romney's body language when she was asked that question on NBC? Have a look here at 8 minutes in, this has been edited away but the first version I saw had Ann Romney move into the defensive hands and ankles crossed position after being relaxed with leg over knee whilst talking about her MS.

http://rockcenter.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/15/13284524-ann-romney-talks-family-finances-in-exclusive-interview-theres-nothing-were-hiding?lite

And you people. Seriously?

Memnoch

MadsL wrote: »

Did you see Ann Romney's body language when she was asked that question on NBC? Have a look here at 8 minutes in, this has been edited away but the first version I saw had Ann Romney move into the defensive hands and ankles crossed position after being relaxed with leg over knee whilst talking about her MS.

http://rockcenter.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/15/13284524-ann-romney-talks-family-finances-in-exclusive-interview-theres-nothing-were-hiding?lite

And you people. Seriously?

Unfortunately the republican faithful have enough irrational hatred for Obama and 'liberalism,' that they are not interested in scrutinising their own candidate to see who he really is or what he really stands for.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Memnoch

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Obama wasn't born into wealth though. He worked hard to get where he got. From his humble beginnings. In many ways he is the personification of the American dream.

Permabear

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Amerika

Dave! wrote: »

Forget the birther stuff, is Romney seriously gonna manage to get through the campaign without releasing his tax returns?! I can't believe he isn't feeling enough pressure on this. It's mad.

My opinion: It might be maddening to the opposition that this distraction (and most others like pinning the 'birther' tag to Romney) to the election isn't getting the traction hoped, but it's not mad. Most Americans espouse to pay as little taxes as possible under our tax laws. What is madding to most Americans is how our government spends all our money they collect, and still have run a $1 Trillion deficit over the last 4 years. Romney pays about 14% in taxes, and when you factor in charitable contributions, the rate goes up to around 20% of income. I believe most understand in the year or so after the market collapse, his losses caused him to pay very little in taxes. Not what is important right now!

This election is shaping up to being Romney representing a brighter future for America, and Obama represents the failed past. The next couple of weeks will be quite interesting. The GOP convention will be represented by the brightest and best talking about their plans for economic growth and a return to prosperity, reigning in big government, and reducing our unsustainable spending. The Democratic convention seems to be turning into a Abortionpalozza and a celebration of the glory days of Bill Clinton, who's methods Obama has seemingly rejected.

Memnoch

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Please don't put words in my mouth and tell me what I would or wouldn't be saying.

I don't mind someone on wall street making millions in private equity, however I would advocate strongly for them to pay a much higher rate of tax than say that person's secretary or the person who cleans their house.

Duck Soup

You can put Romney's birther jokette into a wider political context. Romney has now gone from running 3 TV commercials claiming (falsely, according to all political fact checking sites) that Obama has dropped the work requirement for receiving welfare to running 5 TV commercials claiming that Obama has dropped the work requirement for receiving welfare. Why, you can almost hear the echo of Reagan's "welfare queens" stump speech.

Meanwhile, there will be seven birthers with speaking slots at the Republican convention this week. One may be considered a misfortune; two may be careless; seven sounds like a plan.

So why go all-out WASP? Simple enough, the most recent opinion polls have Obama ahead of Romney by 2 to 1 amongst Latino voters. One poll gave Obama a 94 to 0 lead amongst black voters. That's not a typo. Zero percent.

Romney might be the whitest man alive, so the chances of him making inroads into the African-American and Latino votes are vanishingly small. Romney's only route to the White House is to tie up the still-predominant white vote.

Hence all the ads about welfare. Hence the birther joke. Hence the birther speakers at the convention.

"Raise the debate" my bollix. This is going to get just plum nasty.

matthew8

At least his campaign doesn't accuse Obama of being responsible for the death of a woman, unlike Obama's.

joseph brand

Amerika wrote: »

My opinion: It might be maddening to the opposition that this distraction (and most others like pinning the 'birther' tag to Romney) to the election isn't getting the traction hoped, but it's not mad. Most Americans espouse to pay as little taxes as possible under our tax laws. What is madding to most Americans is how our government spends all our money they collect, and still have run a $1 Trillion deficit over the last 4 years. Romney pays about 14% in taxes, and when you factor in charitable contributions, the rate goes up to around 20% of income. I believe most understand in the year or so after the market collapse, his losses caused him to pay very little in taxes. Not what is important right now!

Do you mean his donations to his church?

The Tribune notes that members of “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints are encouraged to donate 10 percent of their gross income to the faith, and Romney’s disclosure early this year shows he did just that and also forked over more through his family charity.”

At least his money goes to a worthwhile cause, (spreading mormonism). :rolleyes:

Who could forget the Romney's 'baptising' Ann Romney's dead Atheist father?
Scary stuff indeed.

Amerika wrote: »

This election is shaping up to being Romney representing a brighter future for America, and Obama represents the failed past. The next couple of weeks will be quite interesting. The GOP convention will be represented by the brightest and best talking about their plans for economic growth and a return to prosperity, reigning in big government, and reducing our unsustainable spending. The Democratic convention seems to be turning into a Abortionpalozza and a celebration of the glory days of Bill Clinton, who's methods Obama has seemingly rejected.

The GOP convention will be represented by the greedy, the rich, and the super rich who can't wait for Romney to become POTUS and lower taxes for this elite group. Throw in some birthers, racists, rednecks, christians, octogenarians and mormon fruitcakes and you got one hell of a night! I'm excited.

“Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”

― John Steinbeck

Romney will have no qualms about exploiting all Americans, bar the elite. He's a business man. If I were an American millionaire lacking in morals and ethics I know who I'd be voting for, and he's not Obama.

joseph brand

MadsL wrote: »

Did you see Ann Romney's body language when she was asked that question on NBC? Have a look here at 8 minutes in, this has been edited away but the first version I saw had Ann Romney move into the defensive hands and ankles crossed position after being relaxed with leg over knee whilst talking about her MS.

http://rockcenter.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/15/13284524-ann-romney-talks-family-finances-in-exclusive-interview-theres-nothing-were-hiding?lite

And you people. Seriously?

"Let them eat cake".
I think she looks crazy. Her excuse for her husband not releasing his tax returns is weak at best. Apparently the tax returns would just give the Obama campaign some welcome ammunition. I wonder why?

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Memnoch

I don't believe that you lack the knowledge or understanding to know how different the roots and upbringing of both men and candidates are.

All you need to do is look at the 'Early life and careers,' section of the two men on Wikipedia to know that actually Obama did come from MUCH more humble beginnings and has worked his way up, which is very much the personification of the American dream. While Romney was born as the son of a wealthy automobile executive who went on to seek nomination for the president of the united states.

Yet you deliberately chose the point where Obama went to Harvard as your starting point, ignoring everything before that in order to be able to make your point. Why such a selective consideration of the evidence?

I don't know for sure if it is Romney's origins that cause him to utterly lack any kind of empathy for ordinary Americans, though they certainly contributed to a degree.

But his actions and rhethoric as a presidential candidate certainly seem to indicate this very strongly.

You continually lambaste Romney for being wealthy and privileged, while speaking sanctimoniously of President's Obama's "humble origins" and praising him as "the personification of the American dream." You seem to have some difficulty in appreciating that Obama, with his Harvard law degree, his estimated net worth of $11.5 million, and his 2012 household income of $789,674, is also wealthy and privileged.

Obama may be wealthy and privileged now, but he seems to understand much more what ordinary people are going through. He understands that his successes are thanks to America and the community he was raised in and everyone else who contributed to his life along with his own hard work. He 'didn't just build that,' by himself.

More importantly Obama continually wants to raise taxes despite the fact that they would affect him because he feels that would be better for America. I happen to agree with him.

I'm pretty sure Obama also pays a much higher effective tax rate than Romney (despite being a couple of hundred million less in net worth) and I don't think he has hid any money in off shore accounts.

Mitt Romney also feels his tax plan would be better for America. I'm not sure about that. But one thing that I do know for sure is that Mitt Romney's tax plan will be incredibly good for Mitt Romney.

Amerika

Memnoch wrote: »

I don't believe that you lack the knowledge or understanding to know how different the roots and upbringing of both men and candidates are.

All you need to do is look at the 'Early life and careers,' section of the two men on Wikipedia to know that actually Obama did come from MUCH more humble beginnings and has worked his way up, which is very much the personification of the American dream. While Romney was born as the son of a wealthy automobile executive who went on to seek nomination for the president of the united states.

Yet you deliberately chose the point where Obama went to Harvard as your starting point, ignoring everything before that in order to be able to make your point. Why such a selective consideration of the evidence?

I agree that Obama comes from much more humble circumstances than Romney. But not being privileged... not so much perhaps. Answer me this... How did Barack Obama get into, and pay for, uber expensive Columbia and Harvard? Was it privilege of a different manner perchance?

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

vetinari

Is 20.5 percent "much higher" than 15.4 percent? I'll let you be the arbiter of that.

This is your best argument. 20.5 percent is 33 % higher! That's a lot in most people's books!

Regards the birther comment. I really doubt he made that comment by accident. At this point in an election campaign, I'd wager pretty everything both Obama and Romney say is vetted by their advisers. Indeed Romney in general has run as one of the vaguest candidates in living memory. Anything he does say is obviously for a reason.

Memnoch

Permabear, the biggest rub here is that we DO NOT know how much tax Mitt Romney has paid. 15% last year means nothing I'll wager he's paid a lot less than that over all.

Also.. what vetinari said above.

Amerika - I agree with you. Most people born in the first world are already privileged compared to those born elsewhere. Even within America there are gradations. Obama understands this and everything he has done and said suggests to me he believes in everyone having the chance to succeed in the way that he has. I don't think Mitt Romney feels the same.

Obama got a scholarship into his first school. Wouldn't be surprised if he got more of them along the way. Then he worked as a community organiser before going to study at Harvard. I'm guessing he took loans to do that. I'm guessing he got in on merit. To try and say that their upbringing or paths in life were similar is a joke and highly disingenuous.

But the point still stands. The difference in their words and actions shows clearly to me who cares about ordinary americans and who cares about his rich buddies first and foremost.

joseph brand

Romney is worth an estimated $255 million. A quarter of a billion dollars.

Obama is worth an estimated $6 million dollars. Almost a quarter of a billion dollars less than Romney. Yet he paid 20.5 % versus Romney's 15.4% (according to Permabear). It seems that it would follow, that those who are wealthier than Romney pay less than 15%. And anyone less well off than Obama, (middle and working class) pay more than 20.5%. I'm open to correction here.

Romney drew fire in January when, in South Carolina, he characterized the $374,000 he earned in 2010 speaking fees as “not very much.”

And the crowd couldn't sympathise with him over his 'meager' earnings? This complaint usually goes down better amongst his wealthier 'friends'.

It doesn't sound very American of Romney to have his millions hidden in offshore accounts, including a Swiss bank a/c. The primary aim of which is to avoid paying tax to America, but he would like it's civilians to employ him as their President. Seems legit.

Would it be good for Ireland if the wealthy started moving their deposits offshore?

MadsL

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

From the American people I'd venture to suggest. Let me draw you a picture.

matthew8

What a lot of people don't realise about American taxes is income taxes are just one part of the total tax. I'm sure Romney pays much more than Obama in property tax and sales tax, which are the taxes that fund all schools and hospitals etc. I think Romney avoiding paying a higher level of tax is justifiable considering he gives a lot of money to charity.

Memnoch

matthew8 wrote: »

What a lot of people don't realise about American taxes is income taxes are just one part of the total tax. I'm sure Romney pays much more than Obama in property tax and sales tax, which are the taxes that fund all schools and hospitals etc. I think Romney avoiding paying a higher level of tax is justifiable considering he gives a lot of money to charity.

You're very entitled to think it is justified. But perhaps he should release his tax returns and let the rest of the country decide for themselves whether THEY think it is justified.

MadsL

matthew8 wrote: »

he gives a lot of money to charity.

He tithes, not quite the same thing.

matthew8

Memnoch wrote: »

You're very entitled to think it is justified. But perhaps he should release his tax returns and let the rest of the country decide for themselves whether THEY think it is justified.

I'm not opposed to him releasing his tax returns, I Just think tales of his greed are exaggerated.

MadsL wrote: »

He tithes, not quite the same thing.

He tithes, but he also gives a lot of other money to charities and spends quite a bit on philanthropy, including all the money he inherited from his dad.

MadsL

matthew8 wrote: »

I'm not opposed to him releasing his tax returns, I Just think tales of his greed are exaggerated.

If he was more transparent we would know.