Sick-sounding/silent shower, scalding water

who_me

Over the course of the last few days, my electric shower (Triton T90i, I think) went from it's normal high-pitched whine to a sick-sounding 'growl'; and today it went completely quiet.

The water is now scalding hot regardless of how I set the temperature knob, pressure seems a bit weaker than before.

Any idea what that might be? I haven't noticed any other problems with the electricity/water supply in the house recently. Anything I can fix myself, or do I need an electrician/plumber in? If so, any idea which?

Bruthal

Sounds like the pump has failed. It could be brushes worn or stuck in their guides, or the pump impellor after coming loose from its shaft, but the pump motor would still be heard running.

With no pump running, the water flow will be a lot lower, and so the water will be too hot. If the shower has gone quiet, then it would seem to be a pump problem anyway.

Solair

The temperature on an electric shower is controlled by regulating the water's rate of flow through the heater. So, if the water's not flowing fast enough, it will spend too long going through the heater and come out scalding.

Sounds like the pump motor's failed somehow or perhaps it's limescale / some kind of an obstruction in the pump itself.

who_me

Thanks for the replies, only spotted these now.

It might be the brushes alright, I took off the cover and the inside is covered with a black dust which I presume is from the brushes. The shower now alternates between the light on (water is scalding) and light off (water is cold, very little pressure). That gives me maybe 5 seconds when the water is heating up and cooling down that it's bearable.

Was hoping it might be a filter or something that would be easily replaceable.

Bruthal

Black dust inside the shower casing from the brushes is normal, so this alone would not tell that the brushes are the problem.

Is the pump running?

who_me

robbie7730 wrote: »

Black dust inside the shower casing from the brushes is normal, so this alone would not tell that the brushes are the problem.

Is the pump running?

It was alternating between running (much lower & quieter than before) with scalding water, then switching off with just cold water dribbling through, then back on etc.

Finally got someone to repair it, and unsurprisingly it needs replacement. 370 euros for the shower & labour. Is that good? He said it was a 12 year old unit (can't confirm that, but it's at least 5) and needed replacing. He said he could replace the pump but if he did that the pressure valve(?) would go within a week, so it'd be best to just replace the shower. He could have been speaking Swedish for all I knew...

Replaced with a T90z.

quaalude

who_me wrote: »

It was alternating between running (much lower & quieter than before) with scalding water, then switching off with just cold water dribbling through, then back on etc.

Finally got someone to repair it, and unsurprisingly it needs replacement. 370 euros for the shower & labour. Is that good? He said it was a 12 year old unit (can't confirm that, but it's at least 5) and needed replacing. He said he could replace the pump but if he did that the pressure valve(?) would go within a week, so it'd be best to just replace the shower. He could have been speaking Swedish for all I knew...

Replaced with a T90z.

I've a similar problem with a Triton T90xr, from 07/07 (the date is written on a sticker on the underside) - it's starting to make weird noises. I had someone come and look at it, and clean it, but it doesn't seem to have done much good - it's still making weird noises after it's been on a minute or two.
The guy who did cleaned it quoted a replacement shower at €360 (including install).
I'm willing to replace it - but I'd like something a lot quieter.

who_me - do you find the T90z quieter than your previous shower (before it started acting up)?

leeomurchu

quaalude wrote: »

I've a similar problem with a Triton T90xr, from 07/07 (the date is written on a sticker on the underside) - it's starting to make weird noises. I had someone come and look at it, and clean it, but it doesn't seem to have done much good - it's still making weird noises after it's been on a minute or two.
The guy who did cleaned it quoted a replacement shower at €360 (including install).
I'm willing to replace it - but I'd like something a lot quieter.

who_me - do you find the T90z quieter than your previous shower (before it started acting up)?

How do you mean he cleaned it? bit of a polish and bobs your uncle

Are you in a hard water area.

€360 is a good price for replacing the shower it's €200 minimum for a t90z sometimes a little higher it's a loss leader so there's little to no mark up on them. It'd probably take a 1-2hours to swap over the existing shower and re seal it fix any damage to tiles etc.

quaalude

leeomurchu wrote: »

How do you mean he cleaned it? bit of a polish and bobs your uncle

Are you in a hard water area.

Thanks for replying, leeomurchu.

I don't know what he did - I assume he opened it up and cleaned parts inside? I didn't see him do it so who knows really. He was fixing a couple of other things in my bathroom, he said looked at the shower too. He didn't do the other jobs well though.

I don't know if I'm in a hard water area - how can I tell?

leeomurchu

quaalude wrote: »

Thanks for replying, leeomurchu.

I don't know what he did - I assume he opened it up and cleaned parts inside? I didn't see him do it so who knows really. He was fixing a couple of other things in my bathroom, he said looked at the shower too. He didn't do the other jobs well though.

I don't know if I'm in a hard water area - how can I tell?

I'd say this lad is chancing his arm rather than actually diagnosing the fault even though he may well be right.

Is there lime scale around your taps and shower head?

There's not really much that cleaning them would do unless his put a limescale remover through the system but I suspect he would've said he did that rather than saying he cleaned it.

He might have removed the carbon off the rotor in the motor but that'll only be a temporary fix.

Is it still working properly disregarding the noise pressure/temp?

You won't find a quiet electric shower they're all pretty noisey as they're fixed to the wall amplifying the sound of the motor.

quaalude

leeomurchu wrote: »

I'd say this lad is chancing his arm rather than actually diagnosing the fault even though he may well be right.

Is there lime scale around your taps and shower head?

No - hardly any limescale. And a couple of days before, I bought limescale remover and cleaned the showerhead itself.

leeomurchu wrote: »

There's not really much that cleaning them would do unless his put a limescale remover through the system but I suspect he would've said he did that rather than saying he cleaned it.

He didn't say he cleaned it, exactly - he said he looked at it, and made an "opening up" motion (English not his native language). The word "clean" was used in the original quote.

leeomurchu wrote: »

He might have removed the carbon off the rotor in the motor but that'll only be a temporary fix.

Possible indeed.
Just to say, I was told from the outset that whatever was done might not sort the loudness problem, so I am not annoyed by this.

leeomurchu wrote: »

Is it still working properly disregarding the noise pressure/temp?

Yes, it's working OK.

leeomurchu wrote: »

You won't find a quiet electric shower they're all pretty noisey as they're fixed to the wall amplifying the sound of the motor.

Right, that's what I was thinking. I guess I was hoping a new, or a more expensive shower, might perhaps be quieter.

Thanks so much for your interest, leeomurchu - much appreciated.

Solair

The lifespan on those shower units isn't really wonderful, especially if you have hard water.

I know a few people who have installed water softeners on their domestic hot/cold (from attic tank) water systems to avoid such problems.

Limescale can build up quite quickly in instantaneous heaters like electric showers and it is not necessarily visible to a rudimentary inspection by just looking at it.

There's nothing to see as the heater's a sealed unit.

dfkdvgef

The water is now scalding hot regardless of how I set the temperature knob, pressure seems a bit weaker than before.

leeomurchu

Solair wrote: »

The lifespan on those shower units isn't really wonderful, especially if you have hard water.

I know a few people who have installed water softeners on their domestic hot/cold (from attic tank) water systems to avoid such problems.

Limescale can build up quite quickly in instantaneous heaters like electric showers and it is not necessarily visible to a rudimentary inspection by just looking at it.

There's nothing to see as the heater's a sealed unit.

If there isn't lime scale build up around the taps or in the kettle for instance it's most likely you're not in a hardwater area and limescale isn't the issue.

leeomurchu

dfkdvgef wrote: »

The water is now scalding hot regardless of how I set the temperature knob, pressure seems a bit weaker than before.

Has the pressure dropped noticeably?

It could be that your pump is on the way out it may have lost a seal somewhere or it could be the temperature regulator(stat) is gone in the shower.

who_me

quaalude wrote: »

I've a similar problem with a Triton T90xr, from 07/07 (the date is written on a sticker on the underside) - it's starting to make weird noises. I had someone come and look at it, and clean it, but it doesn't seem to have done much good - it's still making weird noises after it's been on a minute or two.
The guy who did cleaned it quoted a replacement shower at €360 (including install).
I'm willing to replace it - but I'd like something a lot quieter.

who_me - do you find the T90z quieter than your previous shower (before it started acting up)?

I couldn't have a shower yet (he said 2 hours for the sealant to dry before use) so I'm not certain.. It seems slightly quieter, but not substantially. It's quite a small bathroom, which probably everything seem noisier; but still it's the same for both devices.

I did find this: this which is 295. It's a Dublin link, but still a pity I didn't look more.

It does include a 2 year guarantee, though after he left it clicked I never received any receipt nor any paper guarantee. Is that normal?

leeomurchu

who_me wrote: »

I couldn't have a shower yet (he said 2 hours for the sealant to dry before use) so I'm not certain.. It seems slightly quieter, but not substantially. It's quite a small bathroom, which probably everything seem noisier; but still it's the same for both devices.

I did find this: this which is 295. It's a Dublin link, but still a pity I didn't look more.

It does include a 2 year guarantee, though after he left it clicked I never received any receipt nor any paper guarantee. Is that normal?

You should've received a receipt from him for work done unless it was a cash job.

There's a number on the front of the shower maynooth something or other you could ring them and see if you need to register the shower.

There's a gaurantee in the shower box ring the lad that installed it and ask him to drop off the gaurantee.

How much did it cost you?

Bruthal

leeomurchu wrote: »

Has the pressure dropped noticeably?

dfkdvgef wrote: »

The water is now scalding hot regardless of how I set the temperature knob, pressure seems a bit weaker than before.

It could be that your pump is on the way out it may have lost a seal somewhere or it could be the temperature regulator(stat) is gone in the shower.

The common cause of that is scale, in either or both the shower head and heating tank.

Water flow restricted, so temp goes up. The shower head can be cleaned easy enough with clear vinegar. The shower itself can be done also, with something like calgon, but not as easily for the diy`r.

One way amongst others to do it is switch isolator off, disconnect the pump, open the pipe to the shower below the gate valve in the attic(after closing valve), put shower head higher than the shower unit on its rail, switch on the isolator and shower to the cold setting (elements wont come on even if hot is selected anyway), and pour in the descaling solution into the pipe in attic with a funnel until it comes out the shower head by gravity, refit piping. Then switch shower off and leave overnight. Connect pump back up, and bleed shower.

A bit involved but will work if a shower is well scaled up. It can be tricky to get the solution down and right through though.

who_me

leeomurchu wrote: »

You should've received a receipt from him for work done unless it was a cash job.

There's a number on the front of the shower maynooth something or other you could ring them and see if you need to register the shower.

There's a gaurantee in the shower box ring the lad that installed it and ask him to drop off the gaurantee.

How much did it cost you?

Thanks. I did see the Maynooth sticker, but he peeled it off before he left. I do have the number of the repair man/company, so will give them a buzz.

It was 370. 380 at one point until I corrected him, so he mentioned it was 10 off since he was already there; then said it would normally be 420 in total. That's why I was surprised to see another Irish site quoting 295 for the same model shower.

leeomurchu

who_me wrote: »

Thanks. I did see the Maynooth sticker, but he peeled it off before he left. I do have the number of the repair man/company, so will give them a buzz.

It was 370. 380 at one point until I corrected him, so he mentioned it was 10 off since he was already there; then said it would normally be 420 in total. That's why I was surprised to see another Irish site quoting 295 for the same model shower.

I'd probably bet that the offer has just finished no matter when you ring them unless he's fitting the shower next door he'd not be making much if he had to travel.

€370 is a fair price to pay it could've been €500 easy not so long ago

quaalude

I've emailed the people who_me mentioned in post 16 - I'll post anything of interest.

quaalude

quaalude wrote: »

I've emailed the people who_me mentioned in post 16 - I'll post anything of interest.

Just coming back to say - I availed of the offer from this post, €295 for a T90Z to replace my T90XR.
The guy installed it the day after I contacted him, and did a clean, neat job in 45 minutes, for which I received a receipt. He installed a new shower pole and shower head in addition to the shower unit. He took away the old shower also.
I'm very happy - it's about half as loud as the old one. Only downside - a very small loss in pressure.

Bruthal

quaalude wrote: »

Just coming back to say - I availed of the offer from this post, €295 for a T90Z to replace my T90XR.
The guy installed it the day after I contacted him, and did a clean, neat job in 45 minutes, for which I received a receipt. He installed a new shower pole and shower head in addition to the shower unit. He took away the old shower also.
I'm very happy - it's about half as loud as the old one. Only downside - a very small loss in pressure.

Maybe you got a lower kw one than your original. The flow rate for a given temperature output, from the same starting temperature in the attic tank, is dependent on the kw rating.

This means that the colder the water is to start with, in the attic tank, the higher the user has to turn the temp dial up, which is actually just reducing the flow rate. So the same shower will operate at a higher flow rate in summer than in winter also.

So at any given time, a 9.5kw shower will have a higher flow rate for the same temperature output, than an 8.5kw one for example. But they will all vary in flow rate at different times of the year, for a given temperature output set by the user, as the attic tank water supplying the shower, varies widely in temperature.