Clamping - make your case here!

T-Maxx

Every time a clamping related thread shows up here one can't help but notice the two very opposite brigades - those strongly opposed against it and those who see it as a just and effective controlling mechanism.

I myself fall in the latter group. You park where you shouldn't - you pay the price. Simple really. It's like an instantaneous parking fine - no wasting of the court's time with BS stories, pulling strings, trying to get off without paying etc. I agree that the release fee is very harsh for maybe being a few minutes late, but I've been late many times and never clamped. Luck? Maybe so, or maybe the clampers are human too....

Please will the clamping haters explain to me why they choose to ignore the notices, and then bitch and complain for getting clamped, looking for legal loop holes to get off the hook, and often going to extremes like forcefully removing the clamp? Is it the principle of paying for parking, the unforgiving nature of having been clamped, is the hefty release fee the issue, ...? Do you feel that you're entitled to park where ever you like, maybe also including in the disabled bay / family parking / no-parking zone?

I'm not trolling, just trying to understand the motives of the anti-clamping gang here.

Voodoomelon

I'm not leaning either way, but most of the clamping stories on here are from people who were wrongly clamped.

Veloce

Voodoomelon wrote: »

I'm not leaning either way, but most of the clamping stories on here are from people who were wrongly clamped.

True. Bolt cutters all the way

Davidth88

I have told this story before why I hate private clampers

I used to live across the road from here

http://maps.google.ie/maps?q=ub5+5ha&hl=en&ll=51.547923,-0.369394&spn=0.007379,0.01929&sll=53.401034,-8.307638&sspn=7.24805,19.753418&hnear=Northolt,+UB5+5HA,+United+Kingdom&t=m&z=16&layer=c&cbll=51.548036,-0.369395&panoid=w6jHvDOtXt9LaA_0UsfPVw&cbp=12,66.15,,0,0

One day , I was walking to the station and saw a commotion . A clamper had decided to clamp a car . Now this area needs something because it's next to a busy tube station so clamping or something is needed.
However this car had someone in it ! It was a woman who had parked here because it was secluded and was breast feeding her baby .
He was refusing to remove the clamp.

The station master from the nearby tube station got involved ( I knew him ) and punches etc were thrown. The police were called , and they basically ordered the clamper to remove the clamp and nearly turned their backs while the gathering crowd lynched the clamper.

His attitude seems to sum up most private clampers , it is basically blackmail.

It should be regulated , and tightly , right now anyone can clamp , you could have a criminal record , or the company could be a front for other things.

Until it's regulated , as far as I am concerned private clampers are fair game .

CUT THEM OFF

MugMugs

T-Maxx wrote: »

I myself fall in the latter group. .

Evident by your prejudiced tone toward anti clampers.

To answer your questions, Signs of reserving rights mean sod all in this country. The only person permitted to lay hands on my vehicle/property are those whom have a LEGAL right and those who I give express permission to.

Clampers don't fall into either category.

pred racer

Its simple. I hate clamping because of clamping companies, their attitude and their practices (specifically what to my mind are extortion and intimidation)
If there was a reasonable release fee i.e. 20-30 euro, a fair appeals procedure and these companies didnt employ scumbags, I dont think there would be much of a problem.
I see their practices as exactly the same as me waiting outside tesco and not allowing you back into your car if you dont give me a hundred quid.

Inconsiderate parking annoys me as much as the next bloke but clamping and demanding €120 to release somebodies car is way out of proportion to the offence.

If someones car is parked in an actually dangerous position, lift it, no problem. Otherwise i cannot concieve of any situation where there is not an alternative to these ****.

Anan1

Antares wrote: »

Evident by your prejudiced tone toward anti clampers.

To answer your questions, Signs of reserving rights mean sod all in this country. The only person permitted to lay hands on my vehicle/property are those whom have a LEGAL right and those who I give express permission to.

If you don't like the rules on private land then why don't you respect the landowners wishes and stay away?

AltAccount

I believe people should park considerately and properly.
I believe people should honour the rules as laid out by the owners of the land where they park.
I believe people who don't do the above should be sanctioned.
I believe clamps are far more effective sanctions than tickets/fines/whatever.

So in essence, the landowners, and therefore the clampers they employ to act on their behalf, have my support.

I have a problem with the way the campers operate, the exorbitant fees they charge, their lack of customer service, their lack of discretion, and their sham of an appeals process.

If I felt they had any respect for the people they clamp, I'd have respect for them, but they don't and so I eagerly await the day I get clamped in the wrong, and the opportunity to remove the clamp and to lead them on a merry jig and treat them like the cnuts that they are.

Tallon

T-Maxx wrote: »

but I've been late many times and never clamped. Luck? Maybe so, or maybe the clampers are human too....

There's the difference, come back to me when you've been done for being a minute over, digit wrong in reg etc.. then you'll know how frustrating it is

Anan1 wrote: »

If you don't like the rules on private land then why don't you respect the landowners wishes and stay away?

That's a bit hard, especially when you LIVE on said land!

Anan1

Tallon wrote: »

That's a bit hard, especially when you LIVE on said land!

In that case you're either one of the landowners yourself or renting from one!

AltAccount wrote: »

If I felt they had any respect for the people they clamp, I'd have respect for them, but they don't and so I eagerly await the day I get clamped in the wrong, and the opportunity to remove the clamp and to lead them on a merry jig and treat them like the cnuts that they are.

Don't hold your breath - i've been driving over 20 years and i've yet to be clamped in the wrong. I know it happens, but I think it's rare. Most people starting 'I've been wrongly clamped' threads here turn out to have been a little economical with the truth.

jhegarty

How about this case op ?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=1638801&postcount=1

Tallon

Anan1 wrote: »

In that case you're either one of the landowners yourself or renting from one!

Exactly!

sophia25

Anan1 wrote: »

In that case you're either one of the landowners yourself or renting from one!

Don't hold your breath - i've been driving over 20 years and i've yet to be clamped in the wrong. I know it happens, but I think it's rare. Most people starting 'I've been wrongly clamped' threads here turn out to have been a little economical with the truth.

I've been playing lotto over 20 years, yet never win. I assume therefore it's a fallacy when people claim to have won. Think they must be quite economical with the truth;)

L1011

Private clamping is nothing but extortion by another name. The Scottish legal system agrees with that, unfortunately nobody has managed to make ours do so yet.

OldmanMondeo

There is a time and place for clamping. Private grounds would be one. May it be an apartment block, office car park, whatever, as long as there is clear notices of what can / will happen if you park there without permission. Fee need to be reasonable, €80 might be the cost of a clamper to drive from one car-park to another, taken in his/her salary, cost of running the van, replacement clamps/locks etc and the company like others, needs to make a profit to survive.

Clamping on public roads does not work, IMO, better to lift the car, compound it and charge an fee to cover these costs.

Clamping companies, both private and public (councils) need regulation. An independant body needs to be set up for appeals. It shoudl also be made illegal to remove a clamp.

Either way, people will still feel hard done by should they get clamped.

MugMugs

Anan1 wrote: »

If you don't like the rules on private land then why don't you respect the landowners wishes and stay away?

Like Domestic parking spaces in apartment complexes?

Digits wrong on texts?

Public areas maintained by private companies who enforce parking restrictions.

Justification for a breach of a rule by a few minutes equals disabling a persons vehicle and extorting money from them?

We've already agreed we will never agree on this Anan1

djimi

If the clamping companies acted with even one ounce of decency and werent run by thugs then I think people would be more sympathetic towards them. If you are clamped in the wrong then a simple phone call should have the clamp removed within 5 minutes. Not this "pay now, appeal later" extortion attitude that they have.

I agree that if you dont want to be clamped then you should respect the rules of where you park. But likewise if you are respecting the rules and still get clamped you should not have to start WW3 with the clampers to get your car back. It works both ways. All the bad press that clampers get they bring on themselves.

goz83

I was clamped at the harbour in DunLaoighre a couple of years ago. The area I parked was a pay and display I remember, but this happened on a SUNDAY MORNING. I went fishing for about an hour to an hour and a half with a friend. I came back to the car just before 12 noon and I was shocked to see a clamp on my car. I should add that I ALWAYS pay for my parking where it is pay and display. There were no times or days displayed on any signs and I tried to put a coin into the ticket machine (just to be sure) and my coin was returned, so I figured Sunday is free parking, or at least free until noon, or 2pm as it is in many places.

I wasn't the only one who got caught out by this. On the long walk up to the clamping office, I counted a total of 32 cars parked, of which only 4 cars were not clamped (yet). I spend ages arguing with them, but they kept saying "it's in the system" and "you can appeal" BS. I told them about the ticket machine not working but nothing was getting through the unusually thick skulled clamper. If I wasn't in such a rush to get home by the time I was done arguing, I would have made arrangements to cut the clamp off. The signage was scarce and very poor in my opinion. It's a total money racket and almost no effort is made to properly inform drivers of the parking rules at the harbour. I have not returned since and have no intention to. Scumbags ruined my experience of an otherwise nice place to visit.

squod

It's illegal. It's probably staying illegal. I'll leave it there.

Eric Cartman

for public places parking tickets are a better method than clamping , if ive parked incorrectly I can just drive off and then ill pay the fine.

for private land , electronic gates and ticket barriers are the best solution , some jumped up príck doesnt get to stick something to your car and it ensures only paying patrons or residents cars have access.

keeping a car somewhere by a clamp to tell somebody 'your car shouldnt be there' is a terrible solution and severely open to abuse by these bully boy extortionists

kildare.17hmr

Every clamper iv seen in action had an attitude problem and came accross as a bully. Its unregulated and anyone can do it. They are not qualified to lay a finger on a car and if they happen to damage a brake line in the process are not liable :rolleyes: until private clamping is heavely regulated whith indedendent appeals that are fair or it is deemed illegal i will remove ANY clamp i feel like removing wether that person was "in the wrong" or not

Indricotherium

There is no excuse for the reported bad customer service that clamping companies are offering. Likewise there is no excuse for rudeness or thugishness that people employed to clamp cars are apparently exhibiting.

However I think the attitude towards clampers and clamping g by some people on this board is laughable. Yesterday someone from this board cut a clamp off a car for a stranger who had failed to comply with the most basic of requirements to park in an area.

The woman yesterday did not text the correct reg to the company looking after the area and was clamped accordingly. No matter how close to her actual reg it was, it wasn't her reg.

The correct course of action for her was to pay her fine and then appeal on the basis that she had made very reasonable attempts to comply with the rules.

I suspect many of the wrongly clamped stories doing the rounds here have a similar error on the part of the clamped at their core.

You're out of pocket for a few weeks and you feel like an idiot, but that's the way of it.

Tallon

Indricotherium wrote: »

There is no excuse for the reported bad customer service that clamping companies are offering. Likewise there is no excuse for rudeness or thugishness that people employed to clamp cars are apparently exhibiting.

However I think the attitude towards clampers and clamping g by some people on this board is laughable. Yesterday someone from this board cut a clamp off a car for a stranger who had failed to comply with the most basic of requirements to park in an area.

The woman yesterday did not text the correct reg to the company looking after the area and was clamped accordingly. No matter how close to her actual reg it was, it wasn't her reg.

The correct course of action for her was to pay her fine and then appeal on the basis that she had made very reasonable attempts to comply with the rules.

I suspect many of the wrongly clamped stories doing the rounds here have a similar error on the part of the clamped at their core.

You're out of pocket for a few weeks and you feel like an idiot, but that's the way of it.

What an utter drivel of a post!

I suppose you are one of these people that think if someone gets beaten up, they should just 'Feel like an idiot for a few weeks, then get over it' ?

We've all made mistakes, she text the wrong reg. She tried to comply with the rules but made a mistake

Davidth88

Indricotherium wrote: »

The correct course of action for her was to pay her fine and then appeal on the basis that she had made very reasonable attempts to comply with the rules.

.

That would be fine ( no pun attended ) if the appeal wasn't to the same company that clamped you under a misleading name like ' independent appeals company ltd '

Currently this is a total joke/farce , and I would not give it any credit at all , there is NO appeal process currently in place with these bullies.

Indricotherium

Tallon wrote: »

Indricotherium wrote: »

There is no excuse for the reported bad customer service that clamping companies are offering. Likewise there is no excuse for rudeness or thugishness that people employed to clamp cars are apparently exhibiting.

However I think the attitude towards clampers and clamping g by some people on this board is laughable. Yesterday someone from this board cut a clamp off a car for a stranger who had failed to comply with the most basic of requirements to park in an area.

The woman yesterday did not text the correct reg to the company looking after the area and was clamped accordingly. No matter how close to her actual reg it was, it wasn't her reg.

The correct course of action for her was to pay her fine and then appeal on the basis that she had made very reasonable attempts to comply with the rules.

I suspect many of the wrongly clamped stories doing the rounds here have a similar error on the part of the clamped at their core.

You're out of pocket for a few weeks and you feel like an idiot, but that's the way of it.

What an utter drivel of a post!

I suppose you are one of these people that think if someone gets beaten up, they should just 'Feel like an idiot for a few weeks, then get over it' ?

We've all made mistakes, she text the wrong reg. She tried to comply with the rules but made a mistake

That beat up statement is nonsense and I think you know that. There is a clear and obvious difference between a criminal assault causing harm and someone parking somewhere and failing to comply with local rules.

She tried to comply with the rules......but didn't.

If her appeal were refused I would call foul, and say that it was unfair, but as it stands, she parked illegally by her own fault and put a clamping company to some expense both by clamping her car and by dealing with an appeal.

The company in question has provided proper signage. The appeals process was not availed of so it can't be commented on.

Tallon

Indricotherium wrote: »

That beat up statement is nonsense and I think you know that. There is a clear and obvious difference between a criminal assault causing harm and someone parking somewhere and failing to comply with local rules.

She tried to comply with the rules......but didn't.

If her appeal were refused I would call foul, and say that it was unfair, but as it stands, she parked illegally by her own fault and put a clamping company to some expense both by clamping her car and by dealing with an appeal.

The company in question has provided proper signage. The appeals process was not availed of so it can't be commented on.

The beat up statement makes complete sense, don't try and twist it into a criminal charge BS, it was an analogy!

"The company in question has provided proper signage" Are you having a laugh, honestly? We've been through this. If I put a sticker on the wall outside my house saying "If you walk by my house, you will be tied to a chair and not released until you pay me an €80 release fee" is that legal? Is that legitimate? If I did that to you, would you pay it, and then after a couple of weeks, just Deal with it?

You must have never coloured outside the lines as a kid!

MugMugs

Indricotherium wrote: »

If her appeal were refused I would call foul, and say that it was unfair, but as it stands, she parked illegally by her own fault and put a clamping company to some expense both by clamping her car and by dealing with an appeal.

Why even run it to an appeal ( she wouldn't win anyway ) then?

Why bother putting her out of pocket and the company through extra administration.

It would be easy for them to see the incorrect reg in the text sent and verify her number there and then and in turn would be easy for them to come out, drop the clamp and leave it at that.

Out of interest, what's your opinion on people attatching immobilising devices to other peoples property in PUBLIC areas?

Indricotherium

Antares wrote: »

Indricotherium wrote: »

If her appeal were refused I would call foul, and say that it was unfair, but as it stands, she parked illegally by her own fault and put a clamping company to some expense both by clamping her car and by dealing with an appeal.

Why even run it to an appeal ( she wouldn't win anyway ) then?

Why bother putting her out of pocket and the company through extra administration.

It would be easy for them to see the incorrect reg in the text sent and verify her number there and then and in turn would be easy for them to come out, drop the clamp and leave it at that.

Out of interest, what's your opinion on people attatching immobilising devices to other peoples property in PUBLIC areas?

What's a public area?

If a car is illegally parked and causing an obstruction I don't see the point in clamping it there and prolonging the problem.

I don't fully understand what you mean by a public place? I don't see how you could get clamped in a place that parking is not controlled??

The reality of it is that many people don't have driveways now and parking areas off site are assigned to them... Apartment complexes and the like.

Only the other day over on the legal discussions board there was a fella sticking burning papers through someone's letter box over a parking dispute.

With parking at a premium in residential areas schemes like clamping etc are going to be a reality. It just has to be lived with and complied with.

This is just my own personal experiance, so I know it has limited value; but I have yet to hear a hard luck clamping story where I felt the "victim" was completely blameless and hadnt infringed in some way the rules.

Tallon

Indricotherium wrote: »

It just has to be lived with and complied with. .

No it doesn't that's the point!

You don't have to just put up with BS because someone asks you too, you're perfectly entitled to question illegal and unethical issues!

Indricotherium

Tallon wrote: »

Indricotherium wrote: »

It just has to be lived with and complied with. .

No it doesn't that's the point!

You don't have to just put up with BS because someone asks you too, you're perfectly entitled to question illegal and unethical issues!

I don't think clamping in general is unethical.

the_syco

Indricotherium wrote: »

The reality of it is that many people don't have driveways now and parking areas off site are assigned to them... Apartment complexes and the like.

If someone parks in your space, they'll get clamped. If you then park somewhere else because your space is blocked, you'll also get clamped. If you try to appeal, you are in the wrong, so you won't get a refund. Fun times.

MugMugs

Indricotherium wrote: »

What's a public area?

If a car is illegally parked and causing an obstruction I don't see the point in clamping it there and prolonging the problem.

I don't fully understand what you mean by a public place? I don't see how you could get clamped in a place that parking is not controlled??

The reality of it is that many people don't have driveways now and parking areas off site are assigned to them... Apartment complexes and the like.

Only the other day over on the legal discussions board there was a fella sticking burning papers through someone's letter box over a parking dispute.

With parking at a premium in residential areas schemes like clamping etc are going to be a reality. It just has to be lived with and complied with.

This is just my own personal experiance, so I know it has limited value; but I have yet to hear a hard luck clamping story where I felt the "victim" was completely blameless and hadnt infringed in some way the rules.

What I am trying to tell you is that despite the area being privately controlled, by definition of our Law if the area is open to the public, ungated and does not require express invitation then it is a public area. A privately controlled public area.

coolisin

I had to move out of a place I was sharing as they were bringing in clamping, but it was going to be targetting commercial vechiles, I was coming to the end of my lease anyway, so I left.

Clamping in private carparks should be enforced, like parking in a disabled spot, clamp!
Parking nearly all day in a shopping centre carpark, because its free next to a luas line clamp!

Parking while visiting a relative in an apartment block, no clamping.

The "parking enforcement agencies" should be regulated and made have a genuine appeals process, and not be bullying tactics.
The biggest problem with most apartment blocks and housing estates these days is the lack of parking in place, more cars on the road, I do not agree clamping is a way to enforce this.

I will actually choose a place to live based on if there is a ncps etc clamping sign up, i probably won't end up living there.
And if i ever own one of these places and get on a management commitee the clampers will be the first thing gone!

Anan1

sophia25 wrote: »

I've been playing lotto over 20 years, yet never win. I assume therefore it's a fallacy when people claim to have won. Think they must be quite economical with the truth;)

Are you sure you're putting down the right numbers?

Indricotherium

the_syco wrote: »

If someone parks in your space, they'll get clamped. If you then park somewhere else because your space is blocked, you'll also get clamped. If you try to appeal, you are in the wrong, so you won't get a refund. Fun times.

This is just bad customer service. Really bad.

If the company running the clamping had a functioning front desk, then this wouldn't be an issue.

Anan1

Antares wrote: »

We've already agreed we will never agree on this Anan1

I only just noticed you've changed your name.

The Muppet

Never been clamped Myself but I would take an angle grinder to it if I were without a shadow of a doubt due to a family members dealings with private clampers.

He parked in a railways station car park one morning and purchased the relevant ticket to allow him park there for the day. He put it on his dash board and went off to work.

When he returned to his car it was clamped. His ticket had blown off the dash possible when he shut the door. No problem so far, he wasnt displaying a ticket so deserved to be clamped.

However you would think this would be easily rectified as the permit was on the floor of his car so all he though he had to do was show it to the clamper to have the clamp removed, Not so .

The clamper refused to remove clamp without payment as he said this ticket could be for any car. My son went into train station told them the story and time he arrived at the station and asked them to check cctv at car park pay station which they did and confimed he had gone to the pay station and received ticket, so with the ticket in his hand and the cctv coverage he thought this would be enough to get the clamp removed.

Not so, clamper refused, said he would have to pay fee but he would definitely get it back on appeal so he paid. Appeal was lodged with all the above information and the parking ticket as evidence but was refused.

At the time a few years ago now he was on second year apprentice rates so this shower of robbers took over a third of his weekly wage knowing full well that he had a valid permit for the parking spot.

I've read numerous similar stories here and elsewhere so I would definitly never pay these vermin a cent if clamped, i'd cut the clamp off in front of them and take my chances and I'd advise anyone else to do likewise.

jd

the_syco wrote: »

If someone parks in your space, they'll get clamped. If you then park somewhere else because your space is blocked, you'll also get clamped.

The way it works here is if someone is in your space you ring the clamping company and they tell you where to park.

Cienciano

I think it's needed in some places. I can imagine what it's like if you live next to a train station. But as pred racer said, €120 plus a fiver adminstration fee is totally out of proportion to the offence.
The mantra "clamp first, ask questions later, and never take off a clamp without payment" doesn't do the clampers any favours.
I'd definitely go down the bolt cutter/angle grinder route if I was clamped in my apartment.

the_syco

Question: if you didn't notice the clamp, got in your car, and went to drive off, would the clamper be liable? And has it happened?

Indricotherium

coolisin wrote: »

I will actually choose a place to live based on if there is a ncps etc clamping sign up, i probably won't end up living there.
And if i ever own one of these places and get on a management commitee the clampers will be the first thing gone!

And what will you do when you arrive home from work and the carpark is full?

Tallon

Indricotherium wrote: »

And what will you do when you arrive home from work and the carpark is full?

Spend my €80 on food and drink

coolisin

Park considerately while not causing an obstruction.

I work erratic hours so I do arrive back with full car park and there is a few places you can park and not be in the way, no need to be clamped purely because car park is full.

If we need to park up on the paths we do a little, everyone seems to use a little common sense the system works.

And before anyone says anything about parking on paths its not a main road or thru road so traffic is moving slowly so very few pedestrians/buggys to be worrying about.

kirving

the_syco wrote: »

Question: if you didn't notice the clamp, got in your car, and went to drive off, would the clamper be liable? And has it happened?

Are the warning stickers also printed in Irish, an official language of the state? What if you said you couldn't read the sticker?

I'd think they would be liable in that case.

keithclancy

Kevin Irving wrote: »

Are the warning stickers also printed in Irish, an official language of the state? What if you said you couldn't read the sticker?

I'd think they would be liable in that case.

No, I think thats more likely to make you ring Joe Duffy and then have everyone cop that you understand English.

Viper_JB

Clamping, like communism works great in theory, doesn't work so well in the real world where greed and corruption exist though.

Colonel Sanders

I've said it before I don't agree with obnoxious "park anywhere" people but unless proper legislation is introduced I can't agree with private clamping as there is no legal basis for it

Surely until the legal angle is sorted there can be NO case for private clamping end of story?

Colonel Sanders

I've said it before I don't agree with obnoxious "park anywhere" people but unless proper legislation is introduced I can't agree with private clamping as there is no legal basis for it

Surely until the legal angle is sorted there can be NO case for private clamping end of story?

Tallon

Castleforbes Road, Dublin, this afternoon.

Ruairi Carroll

..... well it defo wasn't unloading anyway, presumably unattended too when clamped.

Tallon

RoverJames wrote: »

..... well it defo wasn't unloading anyway, presumably unattended too when clamped.

How do you know?

Could be up in it doing something :P