Do speed limits apply to cyclists as well?

CiniO

I just started laughing while reading some article in Polish newspaper about 18 year old cyclist there, who got a fine for speeding with picture from speed camera attached into his mailbox.
He was doing 46km in 30km/h zone. He was so unlucky, that a member of municipal police who was dealing with speed camera picture, was his neighbour - recognized his face, and therefore issued a fine.
Young lad didn't accept a fine, and the case will have to be resolved by court, as no one is really sure if speed limits apply to cyclists as well or not.

Anyway - that made me wondering how does that work in Ireland.
Do cyclists have to obey speed limits on the roads?
I must say it happens to me, that I exceed speed limit while cycling, but I would never thought I could be fined for it.
What do you think?

iverjohnston

"member of municipal police, who was his neighbour, recognized his face and therefore issued the fine " sounds like the old soviet system is alive and well in Poland! Nigel in Cavan

MagicMarker

Rules of the road are the rules of the road, so I'd imagine so, yes.

challengemaster

If it uses the road, speed limits apply, as do all other laws

...or at least they should

langdang

Nope

maidhc

The Road Traffic Acts apply to mechanically propelled vehicles. So unless you consider yourself a "machine" on the bike, then you can speed safe in the knowledge you are for the most part immune from the law.

There are various offences for cycling while intoxicated and getting a tow, but for obvious and very good reasons the vast majority of Road Traffic laws do not apply.

MetzgerMeister

As said, that only applies to mechanically propelled vehicles.

When it comes to cycling while intoxicated, would that even apply if you've just had a few pints say 4 or 5 and then cycle home?

Marcin_diy

challengemaster wrote: »

If it uses the road, speed limits apply, as do all other laws

...or at least they should

So what to do with the fact that speed meters for cyclists are not required by law? How can cyclist supposed to monitor they speed?

langdang

MetzgerMeister wrote: »

As said, that only applies to mechanically propelled vehicles.

When it comes to cycling while intoxicated, would that even apply if you've just had a few pints say 4 or 5 and then cycle home?

I'd say you'd have to be flaming to be done first time out, or a serial "very well oiled and wobbling" offender after using up a few warnings. IMO

CiniO

MetzgerMeister wrote: »

As said, that only applies to mechanically propelled vehicles.

When it comes to cycling while intoxicated, would that even apply if you've just had a few pints say 4 or 5 and then cycle home?

In relation to being drunk while cycling I think this is what apply:

6.— (1) A person shall not, in a public place—

(a) drive or attempt to drive, or be in charge of, an animal-drawn vehicle, or

(b) drive or attempt to drive a pedal cycle,

while he or she is under the influence of an intoxicant to such an extent as to be incapable of having proper control of the vehicle or cycle.

(2) A person who contravenes subsection (1) commits an offence and—

(a) if the offence relates to an animal-drawn vehicle, he or she is liable on summary conviction—

(i) in the case of a first offence, to a fine not exceeding €3,000 or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 1 month or to both, and

(ii) in the case of a second or subsequent offence, to a fine not exceeding €5,000 or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 3 months or to both,

or

(b) if the offence relates to a pedal cycle, he or she is liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding €2,000.

(3) A person liable to be charged with an offence under this section shall not, by reference to the same occurrence, be liable to be charged under section 12 of the Licensing Act 1872 with the offence of being drunk while in charge, on a highway or other public place, of a carriage.

(4) Where a member of the Garda Síochána is of opinion that a person is committing or has committed an offence under this section, he or she may arrest the person without warrant.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2010/en/act/pub/0025/print.html#sec80

So generally if you are so wasted you don't have proper control of your bicycle, then you might be arrested and fined up to 2 grand.
But I understand that few pints is allright

I wasn't aware of this actually until now. I know that in Poland cycling when drunk is the same offence as driving drunk, and attracts heavy fines and suspension of driving licence (provided cyclist have one) for at least 1 year. Alcohol limit is 0.20mg comparing to 0.50 in Ireland. That's harsh world :P

pete4130

A friend of mine got a ticket for cycling above 30mph in the Phoenix park several years ago. He thanked the Garda for the ticket. In court the Judge had heard he'd been cheeky to the officer and he got fined. He has the ticket framed.

Mycroft H

No, because they don't have a speedometer.

deandean

+1 if you don't have to have a speedometer you can't reasonably be booked for speeding.

CiniO

deandean wrote: »

+1 if you don't have to have a speedometer you can't reasonably be booked for speeding.

Are you saying that if I take my speedometer off my car, I will be able to speed legally ?

Mycroft H

CiniO wrote: »

Are you saying that if I take my speedometer off my car, I will be able to speed legally ?

Ahh but they are a legal requirement on a motorised vehicle. :P

CiniO

BX 19 wrote: »

Ahh but they are a legal requirement on a motorised vehicle. :P

OOps.. Seems I missed a part "if you don't have to have"... somehow i read it "if you don't have"

O.A.P

I wish I could go over the speed limit on my bike.
My bike is crap.:(

CiniO

O.A.P wrote: »

I wish I could go over the speed limit on my bike.
My bike is crap.

Same as speed limits, so you might try anyway :rolleyes:

monument

MagicMarker wrote: »

Rules of the road are the rules of the road, so I'd imagine so, yes.

challengemaster wrote: »

If it uses the road, speed limits apply, as do all other laws

The rules of the road differ in many ways for different road users, generally rightly so.

Jimdagym

CiniO wrote: »

In relation to being drunk while cycling I think this is what apply:



http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2010/en/act/pub/0025/print.html#sec80

So generally if you are so wasted you don't have proper control of your bicycle, then you might be arrested and fined up to 2 grand.
But I understand that few pints is allright

I wasn't aware of this actually until now. I know that in Poland cycling when drunk is the same offence as driving drunk, and attracts heavy fines and suspension of driving licence (provided cyclist have one) for at least 1 year. Alcohol limit is 0.20mg comparing to 0.50 in Ireland. That's harsh world :P

:eek: Jesus that's a bit harsh. If you are going to drink, that's not much of a disincentive to bring the car.

Alanstrainor

I regularly break the speed limit on my bicycle! I'm very proud of this fact!

Chris.Buckley

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I regularly break the speed limit on my bicycle! I'm very proud of this fact!

As do I. I go through some of the biggest and longest hills in cork city on a daily basis which usually have a limit of 40 kph. I smash that, and and even pass a traffic camera on the way, but I'm not sure if i'm a big enough object to trigger it.. the only people who ever seem to care are taxi drivers. I often get road rage from them, but no-one else. I'm not really sure why that is..

goz83

BX 19 wrote: »

Ahh but they are a legal requirement on a motorised vehicle. :P

So what about those motorised pedal bikes?

goz83

Chris.Buckley wrote: »

the only people who ever seem to care are taxi drivers. I often get road rage from them, but no-one else. I'm not really sure why that is..

Because they own the road. Didn't they tell you that? No need for indicators on a taxi....we must all know what their intentions are on the road.

maidhc

goz83 wrote: »

So what about those motorised pedal bikes?

They are only "assisted", you need to pedal them or they stop.

goz83

maidhc wrote: »

They are only "assisted", you need to pedal them or they stop.

Not those ones. There are electric bikes that don't need to be peddled. If the battery runs low, or if you just feel like burning some calories, you can peddle them. I haven't seen many here (Only one for sale), but have seen a few of them in Spain on the roads. No license needed for them there, but who know about Ireland? They are slightly bulkier than the assisted ones, but pretty much the same idea.

Wicklowrider

UK has an offense titled "Furious Cycling" I kid you not. I could never find out if the law remained here after independence.

One of the N'rn Ireland champion cyclists ( can't remember which..) was actually done for it just before the demise of the R.U.C. He came around a corner in a T.T and couldn't stop soon enough for an RUC officer.
Judge went bananas and threw the whole thing out.

http://www.criminal-solicitors.com/bicycles.htm

" A £200 fine is set for furious cycling."

L1011

Chris.Buckley wrote: »

As do I. I go through some of the biggest and longest hills in cork city on a daily basis which usually have a limit of 40 kph. I smash that, and and even pass a traffic camera on the way, but I'm not sure if i'm a big enough object to trigger it.. the only people who ever seem to care are taxi drivers. I often get road rage from them, but no-one else. I'm not really sure why that is..

There is no legal speed limit of 40km/h.

keithclancy

So if its an electric bicycle you can be done, since its a mechanically propelled vehicle ?

Our man in Havana

keithclancy wrote: »

So if its an electric bicycle you can be done, since its a mechanically propelled vehicle ?

Yes. If it has an engine or some type of motor in it yes.

leannejoshua

wouldnt think so ! not that id ever be able 2 do d speed limit on a bike !:D

langdang

keithclancy wrote: »

So if its an electric bicycle you can be done, since its a mechanically propelled vehicle ?

There's some wattage limit and the need for it to be pedal assisted for it still to be a bicycle. Technically should be licenced if over a certain power or if power is applied without pedalling. Openly flouted by some of the sellers here. Really vague stuff with zero enforcement. Usual story!

hdowney

It poses an interesting question all the same. One of the reasons (if not the only reason) for speed limits, particularly in built up areas such as the main street of a town is to have the car travelling at a safe speed (eg so they can stop if a child legs it out in front of them - stopping distances and the like). In these cases it could possibly be prudent to have some sort of inforcement for cyclists (not necessarily a speed limit per say, more a 'careful and mindful driving law'). I say this because cyclists can easily build up a head of steam, especially coming down a hill, and if they were to hit someone (say a child) whilst going quite fast it could cause some damage, both to them and the person they hit. And where would the law stand in cases like that.

Sorry for the wall o text!

monument

MYOB wrote: »

There is no legal speed limit of 40km/h.

It should be in places by now; it's in guidance from the department to councils sent at the start of last year - http://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CGQQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.transport.ie%2Fupload%2Fgeneral%2F13028-CIRCULAR_SPEED_LIMIT_GUIDANCE_AND_ANNEX_B-1.DOC&ei=HvoLUMHMBMu6hAfB95yDCg&usg=AFQjCNEMtfw31fXniXADJePs81qzu7CSFw&sig2=Z-yBK8j9Uq2uLyHYiY7yPQ

Our man in Havana wrote: »

Yes. If it has an engine or some type of motor in it yes.

It's more about the power and if it is assisted or not.

L1011

monument wrote: »

It should be in places by now; it's in guidance from the department to councils sent at the start of last year - http://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CGQQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.transport.ie%2Fupload%2Fgeneral%2F13028-CIRCULAR_SPEED_LIMIT_GUIDANCE_AND_ANNEX_B-1.DOC&ei=HvoLUMHMBMu6hAfB95yDCg&usg=AFQjCNEMtfw31fXniXADJePs81qzu7CSFw&sig2=Z-yBK8j9Uq2uLyHYiY7yPQ
.

Unless the Road Traffic Act was amended the guidance is irrelevant. Its entirely possible it was amended as this govt has produced a huge amount of legislation but I've not noticed it. I'll check later.

monument

MYOB wrote: »

Unless the Road Traffic Act was amended the guidance is irrelevant. Its entirely possible it was amended as this govt has produced a huge amount of legislation but I've not noticed it. I'll check later.

Not sure, but generally: They seem to have taken the approach of publish the traffic signs manual and give advice elsewhere, and then update the law later.

starlit

How would they spot a cyclists speed on a their bike? Is it not only viewable from a vehicle? Doesn't make sense.

The rules of the road applies yes and traffic offences prevail for fines but the speed?? Sure a bike can't go as fast as a car?! Unless a speedometre is attached?

Chris.Buckley

MYOB wrote: »

There is no legal speed limit of 40km/h.

sorry, meant 45 kph.

L1011

Chris.Buckley wrote: »

sorry, meant 45 kph.

There's DEFINITELY no legal speed limit of 45km/h

Legal speed limits are all multiples of 10.

If there is a 40 in legislation now, it could have been 40. I'm not sure there is, in which case it has to be 30 or 50.

The legal limits at the time of metrification were 30, 50, 60, 80, 100 and 120.

monument wrote: »

Not sure, but generally: They seem to have taken the approach of publish the traffic signs manual and give advice elsewhere, and then update the law later.

Completely unenforcable limit then, if that is the case. Not checked yet.

goz83

I think a power/speed limit should apply. If everything with a motor/engine is licensed, you'd need to put those tiny electric and petrol scooters into the mix. Although maybe that wouldn't be a bad idea....keeping 5 year olds off them.

L1011

monument wrote: »

Not sure, but generally: They seem to have taken the approach of publish the traffic signs manual and give advice elsewhere, and then update the law later.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2010/en/act/pub/0025/print.html

Was actually updated and quite some time ago too - section 86 there inserts the 40km/h limit to the 2004 Act. Never noticed that.

Chris.Buckley

MYOB wrote: »

There's DEFINITELY no legal speed limit of 45km/h

Calm down buddy! I didn't mean to insult your knowledge of speed limit multiples, but I think you'll find on Tivoli hill, there is a speed limit of 45kph..

L1011

Chris.Buckley wrote: »

Calm down buddy! I didn't mean to insult your knowledge of speed limit multiples, but I think you'll find on Tivoli hill, there is a speed limit of 45kph..

Its not legally valid in that case.

Mycroft H

Chris.Buckley wrote: »

Calm down buddy! I didn't mean to insult your knowledge of speed limit multiples, but I think you'll find on Tivoli hill, there is a speed limit of 45kph..

Its on private property, so its technically not legally binding.

Our man in Havana

No technically about it. It is totally unenforceable.

Chris.Buckley

BX 19 wrote: »

Its on private property, so its technically not legally binding.

It's not private property, it's a main road. technically called "silversprings lane" but I know It as Tivoli hill.

O.A.P

Chris.Buckley wrote: »

It's not private property, it's a main road. technically called "silversprings lane" but I know It as Tivoli hill.

Have you ever got 40 kph going up that bump?

Chris.Buckley

O.A.P wrote: »

Have you ever got 40 kph going up that bump?

going up it? not a chance, it's pretty steep in person. going down it? yeah for sure. You'd easily freewheel at 50 down it, it goes for about a km.

O.A.P

Chris.Buckley wrote: »

going up it? not a chance, it's pretty steep in person. going down it? yeah for sure. You'd easily freewheel at 50 down it, it goes for about a km.

Not on my bike ye would'nt :cool:

Dawn Rider

pete4130 wrote: »

A friend of mine got a ticket for cycling above 30mph in the Phoenix park several years ago. He thanked the Garda for the ticket. In court the Judge had heard he'd been cheeky to the officer and he got fined. He has the ticket framed.

I read the park by-laws a while ago, and it stated the spped limit for a bike was something like no more than 10mph and you could receive a fine of no more that £10.
Not doubting your story. But, I wonder if your friend was fined for beeing cheeky, more than anything else?

Wicklowrider wrote: »

UK has an offense titled "Furious Cycling" I kid you not. I could never find out if the law remained here after independence.

One of the N'rn Ireland champion cyclists ( can't remember which..) was actually done for it just before the demise of the R.U.C. He came around a corner in a T.T and couldn't stop soon enough for an RUC officer.
Judge went bananas and threw the whole thing out.

http://www.criminal-solicitors.com/bicycles.htm

" A £200 fine is set for furious cycling."

I believe that's still in place here.

keithclancy wrote: »

So if its an electric bicycle you can be done, since its a mechanically propelled vehicle ?

You are supposed to be taxed and insured for those. How many are is anyone's guess

guyfo

Friend of mine whizzed past the gardi doing the limit in a 30 zone on the way back from college in dublin city centre one day. They pulled him over and fined him!