Complaint of Rude and Threatening Behaviour.

gozunda

I recently was obliged to make a complaint regarding a monitors unacceptable behaviour and language towards me on Animals and Pets.

I PM'd the moderator (AJD) to ask him to explain his behabiour and he basically told me to go to hell and if I made a complaint I would be wasting my time.

He indicated that "I could knock myself out" and try if I wished and told me To go to the Dispute Resolution Forum, which I duely did.

On posting in the DRF I was then refered to by no less than 3 mods/admins and then told after variuos replies backing this Mods behaviour but given little/no oportunity to reply and the thread was closed. I then reopened the Thread in the DRF so I could reply as indicated in the Dispute Resolution Process (Diagram) But I was then told in the last reply that I had to go to the Help Desk as the

the DRP is for disputing infractions and bans. Help Desk is for specific Mod complaints.

OK so I have looked at the details of the help desk for furher details and it says:

Dispute Resolution - This is our forum for dealing with disputes between members and Moderators.

Well I dont know but thats what my original complaint was about - a dispute between myself and a moderator
My first question is Where or to who do I make such a complaint and what is the procedure? I can find no other information on this....

If I am in the correct place I would like to add the follwing comments relative the last reply on THE DRF that I recieved from the Admin q'em

You have admitted fault that led to the card.

No that is not the case - I admitted that I used the trem "Fluffy Bunny" and the trem "B*ll*cks" in relation to the content of a specif post and IF that was considered offensive I would put my hands up.

..Your actions on thread suggested trolling (the term' fluffy brigade ' in the context of the animals and pet forum is inflammatory and trellis, and this was the uncivility referred to in the warning.

The Original MOD threw public accusation of being a troll and of making unsubstaniated accusations at me - both of which I have strongly refuted. In this Mods PM to me he did Not refer to any of this but onlysaid I was "Uncivil" and I was getting a warning.

Well either I am being accused of being a Troll or I was being Uncivil. I cannot see how I can be accused of two things (the first which I deny and the second flagged by the use of the trem "fluffy Bunny") with such a massive discrepancy. I asked the oroginal Mod for an explanation - he did not do so. Hence my complaint at his actions after the warning and his behaviour.

...The Mod was not being hysterical, but could arguably have responded to you in a less equally inflammatory way, and are aware of this. I there is nothing further to discuss in context of the dispute.

I question The MODS rude and threatening behaviour both during and after the warning he issued. If I have accepted that the forum does not like use of the terms listed above THEN I would expect that as the Mod responded to me in an "inflmatory way" that at least I should recieve an aknowledgement by him of the same.

g'em

When Mods issue warnings they are given a number of options on a drop down menu as to the nature of the warning: uncivil behaviour, spamming, abuse etc. There is no option for trolling, it is considered being uncivil i.e. that term is used as an umbrella term to cover a number of uncivil bahviours in a forum.

You were given a yellow card for trolling - in a forum that is almost exclusively concerned for the welfare of animals you used the term "fluffy brigade", a very inflammatory term that pokes fun at the target forum audience, much like if I went into the Fitness forum and called the users gear heads. It's trying to provoke a negative reaction, it is trolling, it is uncivil behaviour.

The warning was deserved, there is absolutely no question about that.

As for your claims that the Moderator was rude and threatening. Rude? Yes, perhaps a little bit. Brisk would be a better take on it though. Threatening? No, not at all. They directed you towards the correct procedure for appealing your warning.

edit: apologies, I should really ask what resolution you are looking for here?

gozunda

g'em wrote: »

When Mods issue warnings they are given a number of options on a drop down menu as to the nature of the warning: uncivil behaviour, spamming, abuse etc. There is no option for trolling, it is considered being uncivil i.e. that term is used as an umbrella term to cover a number of uncivil bahviours in a forum.

g'em I was given a warning for UNCIVIL BEHAVIOUR - To suggest otherwise is disingenious. The MOD could had every opportunity to incluse a reference to 'Trolling" in his PM - THEY DID NOT. If you wish I will post the entire PM here. Prior to this The MOD made a hysterical public response to my post accusing me of trolling because he in my opinion he is apparently biased and unfair in his behaviour. (I have looked thru other threads and he has recently made similar biased comments to other posters)

def of trolling

a troll is a person who posts rude or offensive messages on the Internet, such as on online discussion forums, to disrupt discussion or to upset its participants.

Def of Incivility

lack of civility or courtesy; rudeness
an impolite or uncivil act or remark

Incivility and Trolling are two VERY different things. If you believe they equate then perhaps the drop down you refer to should be updated. As I have explained this is a moot point - I was told my warning was for Unvivil Behaviour.

You were given a yellow card for trolling - in a forum that is almost exclusively concerned for the welfare of animals you used the term "fluffy brigade", a very inflammatory term that pokes fun at the target forum audience, much like if I went into the Fitness forum and called the users gear heads. It's trying to provoke a negative reaction, it is trolling, it is uncivil behaviour.

This is incorrect as I have said- I was given a warning for UNCIVIL BEHAVIOUR - To suggest otherwise is disingenious. Ref "fluffy bunny" I was commenting directly on the reply by the poster which was imo at one end of the animal rights beliefs spectrum. It was not designed to provoke a negative reaction - it was my comment on the content of their reply -period. I have seen much worse on this forum that did not cause any sanction.

The warning was deserved, there is absolutely no question about that. As for your claims that the Moderator was rude and threatening. Rude? Yes, perhaps a little bit. Brisk would be a better take on it though. Threatening? No, not at all. They directed you towards the correct procedure for appealing your warning.

I would expect Mods on a large forum like this behaviour to be fair and transparant - not RUDE (brisk???) And YES threatening because he threatened me in his PM that I could knock myself out and that I would not be listened too - That is threatening behaviour.

If I was directed towards the correct procedure - why was I passed from mod to mod then redirected here to the help desk - sorry I really do not get this bending of the stated process for a complaint. I have asked for the details of this procedure as I cannot find it details anywhere.

I would expect At Least an aknowledgement from this MOD of his behaviour. If you are unwilling to reprimand this MOD for using his authority to silence othrs views and opinions then that is on your head. It does not make what occured any less offensive.

gozunda

This is the content of the PM recieved from the Mod in question

Dear gozunda,

You have been warned for being uncivil.

Typically, this means that you are posting in a needlessly aggressive or confrontational manner being disruptive on the forum or causing stress for the other members. We don't want that here.

For more information please refer to the Boards.ie FAQ.



adrenalinjunkie

Your post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by gozunda


This is a wind-up right?

I have dogs, cats, fowl and I have NEVER had a dog who did any of the above to another of my animals.

If one of my pets killed another pet I would have very serious concerns - I am not talking flies, mice etc here btw for obvious reasons as these are not pets!

My dogs do not / have not kill cats and I would not allow this ever as any type of normal behaviour. The dogs accept the cats as part of the family because they are domestic pets and are not wild. They are no

This is the MOds Public Post directed at me

Enough with the personal abuse, the trolling and the unsubstantiated accusations. This is your first and only warning.

Cherry Blossom

Hi OP,

First off I feel compelled to post the entire chain of PM's following the yellow card as I feel the context of my replies in relation to the PMs you sent me is quite important here.

adrenalinjunkie wrote:

gozunda wrote:

adrenalinjunkie wrote:

Dear gozunda,
You have been warned for being uncivil.
Typically, this means that you are posting in a needlessly aggressive or confrontational manner being disruptive on the forum or causing stress for the other members. We don't want that here.
For more information please refer to the Boards.ie FAQ.
adrenalinjunkie

..

Dedar ADJ

I would like to differ on your opinion and register a complaint on the apparent biased nature of your reply.

On the thread you said

"Enough with the personal abuse, the trolling and the unsubstantiated accusations. This is your first and only warning."

There was absolutley no intention of no personal abuse, trolling or unsubstantiated accusations- I was replying to the content of ISDW post with regard to their view that all domestic dogs will kill cats and other pets as standard and I quote:

ISDW - "I'm surprised at a behaviourist labelling a dog the way they seem to have for having one fight, and killing some chickens and a cat. My dogs would kill chickens if they could get to them, and we have a locked door between our dogs and cats at all times."

I refered to the contents of ISDW post as b*ll*cks - well that what it was imo. I was critiscing the post AND not the poster. If that is against Forum rules I cannot find any details of same. I would be grateful expalin how you came to such a conclusion?

Would you also explain why you chose to give one reason in real time (see above) for this warning and a completly different one in your private ema(below) il to me?

You have been warned for being uncivil.
Typically, this means that you are posting in a needlessly aggressive or confrontational manner being disruptive on the forum or causing stress for the other members. We don't want that here.

I was not Uncivil to the poster but was refering to the perverse logic of their post.
I explained WHY this was so in detail - Th bit you deleted in your posted reply.


You may not like what I am saying - it does not follow that your accusations are warrented imo.

Regards

G

You have been uncivil to numerous posters throughout the duration of that thread. You accused a poster of dog-fighting, asked people if they are members of the 'fluffy brigade', and yes you used a needlessly aggressive and confrontational tone throughout. The yellow card stands.

adrenalinjunkie wrote:

gozunda wrote:

On reading the whole thread I would point out that My replies have followed fairly accurately the tone of the thread. I remain at a complete loss at your public accusations of trolling and supposedly unsubstantiated accusations. You may disagree with what I said but your response has been both inaccurate and misleading to other posters And do please explain how an accusation of "trolling" and "unsubstantiated accusations" equates with the the accusation of being "uncivil" that you have now thrown at me? Btw I asked ISDW a question if he engaged in dog fighting from where he posted that he expected his pets to kill each other as a matter of course. This was not an accusation - unsubstantiated or otherwise. Please retract your public accusation of trolling etc and I will take the matter as closed. Otherwise provide me with a direct reference to senior impartial moderator so I can take this matte further. Regards F

The dispute resolution process is here, knock yourself out. I must advise however that your posting style is very reminiscent of another poster you appealed a yellow card and had it increased to a well deserved month long ban. Time-sinks are not looked upon too fondly over there.

AJ

First of all, I appologise for my abruptness in my PMs, I was quite short on time but rather than drag it on unnecessarily I replied to you with the short version. Aside from that, it's a yellow card and I think the reasons for it being given were already crystal clear.

gozunda wrote: »

I recently was obliged to make a complaint regarding a monitors unacceptable behaviour and language towards me on Animals and Pets.

I PM'd the moderator (AJD) to ask him to explain his behabiour and he basically told me to go to hell and if I made a complaint I would be wasting my time.

As you can see from the PM exchange which is posted above at no point did I tell you to 'go to hell' nor did I say you would be wasting your time. I mearly informed you of a past incident which was similar in nature and of it's outcome. Probably not my place to do so and I can see how could be interpreted as trying to persuade you not to go down this road, so again appologies for that. However, don't see any possible way how it could be interpreted as either rude or threatening. What exactly would I have to gain from threats?

gozunda wrote: »

The Original MOD threw public accusation of being a troll and of making unsubstaniated accusations at me - both of which I have strongly refuted. In this Mods PM to me he did Not refer to any of this but onlysaid I was "Uncivil" and I was getting a warning.

Well either I am being accused of being a Troll or I was being Uncivil. I cannot see how I can be accused of two things (the first which I deny and the second flagged by the use of the trem "fluffy Bunny") with such a massive discrepancy. I asked the oroginal Mod for an explanation - he did not do so. Hence my complaint at his actions after the warning and his behaviour.

Here is a definition of trolling for you:

Posting controversial, inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

Posting inflammatory statements with the intent of provoking other users into an emotional response is exactly what you were doing on that thread. Trolling is uncivil. You were also posting in an increasingly aggressive manner causing stress on other posters. If you want to separate trolling from being uncivil then you were guilty of both.

Lastly I will point out discussion of illegal activities is not permitted anywhere on boards. Dog fighting is illegal, therefore asking another user in an accusatory manner if they are engaging in this illegal activity is both abusive and insulting to that person.

gozunda

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

Hi OP,

...
Posting controversial, inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

Posting inflammatory statements with the intent of provoking other users into an emotional response is exactly what you were doing on that thread. Trolling is uncivil. You were also posting in an increasingly aggressive manner causing stress on other posters. If you want to separate trolling from being uncivil then you were guilty of both.

...

I have already pm'd the Mod on this Thread against this MODS continued threatening behaviour. I have deliberatly not corresponded or entered into any discussion with this Mod due to the nature of the complaint.

However AJD has continued to attempt to provoke me in another thread (Here) by deliberatly attempting to goad me into a row or other negative behaviour

I refuse to directly corrospond with this individual whilst this matter is current. This in my opinion is a basic consideration in dispute resolution. Unfortuanetly this Mod does not appear to have such considerations.

I have brought this matter to the attention of this forum - This Mod is the subject of my complaint and I am not going to enter into a direct online arguement with them.

My complaint of rude and threatening behaviour stands.

g'em

I have asked adrenlinjunkie not to engage with you for the time being. I haven't done this in agreement with your assertions, moreso becuase you unfortunately seem to be confusing the idea of 'debate' and 'incivility'.

There is nothing rude or thretening in the way that aj has spoken with you on that thread. This is, after all, a series of discussion forums. You made a point that she disagreed with and refuted your claim. If this Help Desk thread was not open it would be no different to the thousands of discourses that go on every day here on boards. Given that you are having an issue with aj from another thread though I feel that you might be taking this a little personally. Understandable, it's hard not to when you feel an injustice has been carried out and you feel hard done by.

gozunda I have read the threads you linked to at length and I just don't find any evidence of rude threatening behaviour on behalf of the Mod. Brisk discourse yes, and I have already told the Mod that it was perhaps unwise to engage with you given the current standing of your unresolved claims, but I do not think she was wrong.

There seems to be an inherent misunderstanding of the styles of communication that you both have (that is not a sleight in any way, this happens very often in text communication) and I would advise that both you and adrenalinjunkie try to have minimal contact with eachother in future.