Feel very hard done by

ThisNoize

Adult summoned to court for possession of cannabis with the street value of €10.

I handed it straight over to the Garda when asked. (Garda himself called me the 'perfect civillian' as I was co-operative and polite)
No previous convictions or encounters what so ever with the Garda and I have also stopped using Mariajuana since.

I was told to pay a fine of €500. Money isn't the issue.
Surely this will stay on my record and hinder me from getting a job or possibly studying or working abroad in Australia or the U.S?

I know it's my fault and believe me, I've learned from my mistake but I really do feel hard done by?

Can anybody shed some light?

chopser

ThisNoize wrote: »

Adult summoned to court for possession of cannabis with the street value of €10.

I handed it straight over to the Garda when asked. (Garda himself called me the 'perfect civillian' as I was co-operative and polite)
No previous convictions or encounters what so ever with the Garda and I have also stopped using Mariajuana since.

I was told to pay a fine of €500. Money isn't the issue.
Surely this will stay on my record and hinder me from getting a job or possibly studying or working abroad in Australia or the U.S?

I know it's my fault and believe me, I've learned from my mistake but I really do feel hard done by?

Can anybody shed some light?

What else did the Judge say and did you have a solicitor represent you?
You can ring up the District Court Clerk and ask what order was made.

ThisNoize

chopser wrote: »

What else did the Judge say and did you have a solicitor represent you?
You can ring up the District Court Clerk and ask what order was made.

I got free legal aid.
My solicitor was quite disgusted by his decision and definitely wants to appeal it.

As for the judge I'm 99.9% he said 'fine' as in paying a fine.

chopser

ThisNoize wrote: »

I got free legal aid.
My solicitor was quite disgusted by his decision and definitely wants to appeal it.

As for the judge I'm 99.9% he said 'fine' as in paying a fine.

My question is did he let you away with a large fine and not convict you as can often happen.

ThisNoize

chopser wrote: »

My question is did he let you away with a large fine and not convict you as can often happen.

This I don't know.
If I ring up, can I find this out?

chopser

ThisNoize wrote: »

This I don't know.
If I ring up, can I find this out?

Yes ring up the District Court or your solicitor.
By large fine, I mean was it a donation to a cause?

kneemos

If the solicitor wants to appeal I suspect he had the book thrown at him.

NoQuarter

If it was the "poor box", its not a conviction. If it was a "fine", it is.

ThisNoize

It wasn't a donation as he said I have a deadline to pay. (Around 3 months)
Why can't I donate? People with previous and/or worse convictions get a second chance and I don't? Very unfair.

Can I ask what people would do in this situation (out of curiosity)

kneemos wrote: »

If the solicitor wants to appeal I suspect he had the book thrown at him.

Wasn't the case at all, what a stupid thing to say.

johnnyskeleton

ThisNoize wrote: »

Adult summoned to court for possession of cannabis with the street value of €10.

I handed it straight over to the Garda when asked. (Garda himself called me the 'perfect civillian' as I was co-operative and polite)
No previous convictions or encounters what so ever with the Garda and I have also stopped using Mariajuana since.

I was told to pay a fine of €500. Money isn't the issue.
Surely this will stay on my record and hinder me from getting a job or possibly studying or working abroad in Australia or the U.S?

I know it's my fault and believe me, I've learned from my mistake but I really do feel hard done by?

Can anybody shed some light?

The reality is if you weren't convicted and paid a charitable donation instead it would have been an excellent result which you should have een very grateful for.

Because you didn't get an extra special result, you are upset. You probably wouldn't feel so hard done by if perhaps you had more realistic expectations of what you were facing.

ThisNoize

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

The reality is if you weren't convicted and paid a charitable donation instead it would have been an excellent result which you should have een very grateful for.

Because you didn't get an extra special result, you are upset. You probably wouldn't feel so hard done by if perhaps you had more realistic expectations of what you were facing.

Yeah of course I'm upset by people with previous convictions and/or court summons who also were caught with dozens X the street value (in which I was) getting away with the charity box? That screams of 'Overhaul' to me.
I'm not just having a moan.

I have since then, given it up and I will be going to my GP to provide tests of soberness.

NoQuarter

ThisNoize wrote: »

Yeah of course I'm upset by people with previous convictions and/or court summons who also were caught with dozens X the street value (in which I was) getting away with the charity box? That screams of 'Overhaul' to me.
I'm not just having a moan.

They clearly dont get lucky all the time then do they. You were caught breaking the law and were convicted, you need to accept it but for what it is worth, I agree that its harsh. The appeals process is there if you wish.

McCrack

If that wasn't a poor box donation (no conviction) but a conviction and fine of €500.00 then that's very harsh in my opinion for a person that co-operated with the Gardai and has no previous.

FreudianSlippers

I'm no Cheech Marin, but surely it's about time we did something about our legislation to tax and control "personal" amounts of marijuana.

Anyway, digressions aside... don't listen to anyone here - not that they are incorrect by any means - the reason we do no legal advice is that it is almost impossible to get all of the nuances of the story if you aren't involved in the matter most of the time.
Discuss this with your solicitor and be sure he explains the possible dangers of appealing as well as the possible positives to appealing.

kneemos

Sounds like something you would get if you did'nt turn up in court.

MagicSean

ThisNoize wrote: »

Wasn't the case at all, what a stupid thing to say.

Actually it sounds like it was exactly the case and you owe that poster an apology

drunkmonkey

ThisNoize wrote: »

I handed it straight over to the Garda when asked. (Garda himself called me the 'perfect civillian' as I was co-operative and polite)

The next time eat it or throw it away, he'd have a hard time finding €10 worth. He shouldn't have put you in front of the courts for such a small amount, he's a disgrace to the uniform, it's a complete waste of tax payers money and could quite possible damage your future.
From reading the posts over the years here it's become quite apparent the only reason for the war on drugs in Ireland is to keep judges and lazy officers in a Job. There's a 101 things that officer could have done to make life better for the citizens than drag your ass into court. Shameful practice.

Make sure and make your case know to Ming and the terrible fine you received and the damage it could do. You can contact him here, it would be no harm to drop him an email. http://www.lukemingflanagan.ie/contact/

MagicSean

drunkmonkey wrote: »

The next time eat it or throw it away, he'd have a hard time finding €10 worth. He shouldn't have put you in front of the courts for such a small amount, he's a disgrace to the uniform, it's a complete waste of tax payers money and could quite possible damage your future.
From reading the posts over the years here it's become quite apparent the only reason for the war on drugs in Ireland is to keep judges and lazy officers in a Job. There's a 101 things that officer could have done to make life better for the citizens than drag your ass into court. Shameful practice.

Make sure and make your case know to Ming and the terrible fine you received and the damage it could do. You can contact him here, it would be no harm to drop him an email. http://www.lukemingflanagan.ie/contact/

A stupid post. First of all, you can hardly call him a disgrace for doing his job. It is not up to him to decide what laws are passed and which he can and can't enforce. Second, judges get paid the same no matter how many drugs cases go through the court. If anything keeps them in a job it's alcohol and bad driving. By lazy officers I presume you mean Gardaí, they'd still have plenty to do if cannabis were legalised in the morning.

As to your hero Ming? What exactly do you think he could do?

drunkmonkey

Sean your detached from modern life if you think any of what happened is anyway ok. If my hard earned euro is being used by officers and judges is being used to destroy the lives of teenagers well then I have a serious problem with what is considired the justice system and also the people who support what is an injust law like yourself.
The kid done nothing wrong, if anyone deserves a day in the stocks its your angel of justice.

GarIT

Because nobody else has to answer the question about traveling, unfortunately it probably will prevent you from going to the U.S.A. or Australia, at least for a few years.

GarIT

drunkmonkey wrote: »

The kid done nothing wrong

It is an offence to carry drugs. You can't do it by accident, you know what your are doing and that there will be consiquences if caught.

You may feel that the law is unfair but thats not the issue here, we have to follow the law of the state if it is fair or not.

Holsten

Quite harsh alright but it's not the end of the world.

Your conviction will be spent in a few years with the new Spent Convictions Bill, so you won't have to answer 'Yes' on any job applications.

I'm pretty sure you'll be allowed into the states in a few years, you'll just have to apply for a visa instead of the visa wavier program.

johnnyskeleton

I don't understand how a conviction for a criminal offence can be considered harsh. The probation act / poor box is discretionary and for exceptional cases. Some judges will apply it because they have been moved by a person, others won't apply it at all. Saying it is harsh is like saying that not winning a bet is harsh. The fact that you may have expected a special benefit and only got regular treatment cannot possibly be called harsh.

Then again, you could always appeal to the circuit court and try your luck again.

Oh and saying that magic sean is not living in the real world is, in effect, advocating that gardai and judges refuse to uphold the law.

Kristopherus

You broke the law, then had the taxpayer pay for your defence, and then you come on here claiming its unfair:eek: Pay up and thank your lucky stars its only €500.:(

Predalien

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

I don't understand how a conviction for a criminal offence can be considered harsh. The probation act / poor box is discretionary and for exceptional cases. Some judges will apply it because they have been moved by a person, others won't apply it at all. Saying it is harsh is like saying that not winning a bet is harsh. The fact that you may have expected a special benefit and only got regular treatment cannot possibly be called harsh.

Then again, you could always appeal to the circuit court and try your luck again.

Oh and saying that magic sean is not living in the real world is, in effect, advocating that gardai and judges refuse to uphold the law.

That's all fair enough, but in a common law system the punishments are also set by what similar crimes were punished with (a reason constantly used in apparent lenient sentencing for sexual offences, Judge Carney often refers to what appeal courts reduce sentences to) so in this case I think it's fair for the OP to consider his punishment harsh taking into consideration the previous clean record and co-operation.

Holsten

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

I don't understand how a conviction for a criminal offence can be considered harsh. The probation act / poor box is discretionary and for exceptional cases. Some judges will apply it because they have been moved by a person, others won't apply it at all. Saying it is harsh is like saying that not winning a bet is harsh. The fact that you may have expected a special benefit and only got regular treatment cannot possibly be called harsh.

Then again, you could always appeal to the circuit court and try your luck again.

Oh and saying that magic sean is not living in the real world is, in effect, advocating that gardai and judges refuse to uphold the law.

It's harsh that this guy had €10 worth of hash, a nothing amount, and he was brought through the criminal justice system.

It cost the state more to prosecute him than the value of drugs he had.

A total waste of time for everyone involved. The Garda should have simply destroyed the drugs, perhaps given an adult caution.

Waste of time and money basically.

drunkmonkey

GarIT wrote: »

It is an offence to carry drugs. You can't do it by accident, you know what your are doing and that there will be consiquences if caught.

You may feel that the law is unfair but thats not the issue here, we have to follow the law of the state if it is fair or not.

So your saying gay people should be done for buggery? I don't get your point that the law must always be your rule book even when it's wrong. The war on grass is a war on people anoyone that supports it knowing the facts deserves the wrath of the ordinary man/woman on the street!!!

NoQuarter

drunkmonkey wrote: »

So your saying gay people should be done for buggery?

That law is abolished since 1993. And people were done for it. DPP v. Norris being the most famous case.

SarahLxx

Well, That my friends, is life

MagicSean

drunkmonkey wrote: »

So your saying gay people should be done for buggery? I don't get your point that the law must always be your rule book even when it's wrong. The war on grass is a war on people anoyone that supports it knowing the facts deserves the wrath of the ordinary man/woman on the street!!!

There is no war on grass. Keep your dramatics. The law will remain there until the majority of people show a willingness to legalise it. While it is there it will remain illegal to posess cannabis, much like it is to posess a knife. If you choose to break that law you are doing it freely and must accept the consequences of your choice. You are destroying your own life. It doesn't cost massive amounts of money to enforce it, no matter what your americanised friends tell you. Gardaí, solicitors and judges get no extra pay for dealing with drugs so you don't have to worry about your tax money either.

GarIT

drunkmonkey wrote: »

So your saying gay people should be done for buggery? I don't get your point that the law must always be your rule book even when it's wrong. The war on grass is a war on people anoyone that supports it knowing the facts deserves the wrath of the ordinary man/woman on the street!!!

I'm saying anyone that commits a crime deserves to be punished accordingly.

You don't get me point, I'll flesh it out a bit. The country is ruled by laws, these laws prevent anarchy. All laws must be followed or else the country could fall to pieces. You can't choose to follow laws based on which one you believe is right. By your logic a murderer can murder because they believe murder is right.

If you want to say that the law is wrong provide factual evidence to prove so.

I am not aware of anyone that has a problem with grass, it would be interesting to meet someone who has.

Vadakin

GarIT wrote: »

I'm saying anyone that commits a crime deserves to be punished accordingly.

You don't get me point, I'll flesh it out a bit. The country is ruled by laws, these laws prevent anarchy. All laws must be followed or else the country could fall to pieces. You can't choose to follow laws based on which one you believe is right. By your logic a murderer can murder because they believe murder is right.

If you want to say that the law is wrong provide factual evidence to prove so.

I am not aware of anyone that has a problem with grass, it would be interesting to meet someone who has.

The issue with grass or whatever you want to call it (like Satan it has so many names) as it relates to the law is that there is a growing percentage of people who want to have the law changed but there is no political will to do so.

Some favour decriminalisation, I personally favour legalisation. But we have to have the discussion as a society. It's brought up many times in the debate but it makes it no less true - alcohol is a greater danger than marijuana. Maybe we should ban alcohol. It seems unlikely in this country but if we assume that the laws that make drugs illegal are there to protect us, then it should probably extend to alcohol as well.

You may ask, what about harder drugs? Should they be legal too? Maybe. There is a debate to be had about the role of the state when it comes to personal choices. We're not having that debate as a society and those elected to represent us refuse to discuss it.

But that's a topic for a different thread. Getting back to what you said about obeying the law, I have one thing to say - God is a genocidal maniac who sodomises goats, tortures children and regularly drinks monkey urine and the Catholic Church is the epicentre of a Satanic conspiracy to corrupt our children into worshipping this sodomite of a God.

I just broke the law there...a little thing called blasphemy. It's actually in the constitution and a couple of years ago there was talk of a referendum to change it but it never happened. Blasphemy is against the law in this country. Are we expected to follow that law? What about homosexuality? That was against the law for a long time.

Not all laws are just and not all laws should be followed...most should. Murder is murder. Theft is theft. Is the illegality of narcotics unjust? Well we need to debate that.

GarIT

Vadakin wrote: »

The issue with grass or whatever you want to call it (like Satan it has so many names) as it relates to the law is that there is a growing percentage of people who want to have the law changed but there is no political will to do so.

Some favour decriminalisation, I personally favour legalisation. But we have to have the discussion as a society. It's brought up many times in the debate but it makes it no less true - alcohol is a greater danger than marijuana. Maybe we should ban alcohol. It seems unlikely in this country but if we assume that the laws that make drugs illegal are there to protect us, then it should probably extend to alcohol as well.

You may ask, what about harder drugs? Should they be legal too? Maybe. There is a debate to be had about the role of the state when it comes to personal choices. We're not having that debate as a society and those elected to represent us refuse to discuss it.

But that's a topic for a different thread. Getting back to what you said about obeying the law, I have one thing to say - God is a genocidal maniac who sodomises goats, tortures children and regularly drinks monkey urine and the Catholic Church is the epicentre of a Satanic conspiracy to corrupt our children into worshipping this sodomite of a God.

I just broke the law there...a little thing called blasphemy. It's actually in the constitution and a couple of years ago there was talk of a referendum to change it but it never happened. Blasphemy is against the law in this country. Are we expected to follow that law? What about homosexuality? That was against the law for a long time.

Not all laws are just and not all laws should be followed...most should. Murder is murder. Theft is theft. Is the illegality of narcotics unjust? Well we need to debate that.

Blasphemy has been ruled to be unenforceable by the supreme court, it is now only a meaningless refrence.

All laws should be followed. A law does not need to be considered just for the law to be followed. If a law is unjust get it changed or removed, untill it is changed or removed don't break it.

krd

MagicSean wrote: »

A stupid post. First of all, you can hardly call him a disgrace for doing his job.

Ah the Nuremberg concentration camp gaurd defence. Dies hard that chesnut.

It is not up to him to decide what laws are passed and which he can and can't enforce.

No. Judges have no input into the laws of the land. Their just victims of the establishment as the rest of us.

By lazy officers I presume you mean Gardaí, they'd still have plenty to do if cannabis were legalised in the morning.

Well, why didn't the Garda just give him a caution then. Instead of wasting everyone's time.

mikom

God be with the days when suicide was illegal (pre 1993).
That prohibition saved many's the life....

retroactive

Legal positivism. (Jurisprudence, soothes the soul on a wednesday night)

You can't employ an economic argument to this situation or any situation involving criminal law. Firstly because judges and Gardai do not get paid on a commission basis or per case / penalty. Secondly, maybe less importantly, because there there is an inherent price in upholding the laws and fabric of our society.

Tying in with the above is the notion that you cannot now pick and choose which laws to abide by. It has been done already - by a legislature with a democratically elected mandate. The law is the law and the penalties are provided within the act. He broke the law. He knowingly carrying a controlled substance and now he faces the prescribed penalty.

The greatest property of our legal system, in my opinion, is its organic nature. It grows and changes, developing in line with societies view. Yes, Buggery was illegal but societies attitude changed towards homosexuality and now we have a gay pride parade. It may be a harsh reality but a few outspoken 'activists' and the **** Ming Flanagan do not represent societies will. I have no doubt that society's attitude to cannabis will change - but right now - it hasn't. It is against a law, enacted by a democratically elected government and supported by the people, that cannabis is illegal.

zenno

That's very harsh for sure OP but there are a few arseholes here that probably need a pliers to pull their lips away from the arse of arse-laws. €500 fine for that when it's the likes of magicsean that should be fined such monies for being a muppet.

OP who did you attack or harm to get such a fine ? I know, it's a disgrace the justice system is here, quite backward like it's people.

Zambia

krd wrote: »

Ah the Nuremberg concentration camp gaurd defence. Dies hard that chesnut.

That is a stupid comparison do you spout this line when getting a Parking ticket or paying a toll charge. What is your job?

Do you not perform tasks then state to your employer
"I decided I knew better and did not charge the customer?"

krd wrote: »

No. Judges have no input into the laws of the land. Their just victims of the establishment as the rest of us.

Victims of the establishment "Dude" you are the establishment unless you live in a cave somewhere.

krd wrote: »

Well, why didn't the Garda just give him a caution then. Instead of wasting everyone's time.

I would agree however I dont believe the garda has the power to issue a on the street caution*. Here in Vic there is such a thing and its designed to be signed by the offender there and then. However if the Garda has no such option well then the only option left is to bring the matter before a judge.

To call the officer lazy is totally out of order and naive. If anything the lazy option would be to just witness the OP destroy the drugs.

Ireland is in a pretty sh1t state if a civil servant is doing his/her job to this level the last thing everyone should be doing is screaming Jobsworth and crying foul.

Its no secret that there will always be a drug trade as long as there is a demand, so targeting the people who create the demand is a fair call IMO.


*Please correct me if this is not right or such a scheme exists.

I know someone in a similar situation who got a conviction and was hit in the pocket more than twice as you so no matter how indignant a solicitor may be you might want to bear in mind that an appeal could make things a lot worse.

zenno

Realistically speaking, The judge i'd say just went hard on you as he knew there and then you had no previous convictions and it was your first offense and decided to give you a shock to place you in a situation that you will think twice about doing it again. Either that or the judge was a hard-line case when it comes to even a herb. Now if you had maybe three previous convictions for cannabis then he would probably tell you to put €10-€20 in the poor-box.

Mance Rayder

If you do appeal offer 1000 euro to a drug abuse related charity as a gesture. It might get you off without a conviction.

zenno

Mance Rayder wrote: »

If you do appeal offer 1000 euro to a drug abuse related charity as a gesture. It might get you off without a conviction.

That's a Gamble, but it could turn out worse if you get the wrong judge via appeal so think about it. You got it really bad there but as was already said speak to a good solicitor about it.

krd

Zambia wrote: »

That is a stupid comparison do you spout this line when getting a Parking ticket or paying a toll charge.

A twist on the Nuremberg defence. No. A toll boot operator is not on a par with a concentration camp guard.

And different jobs are different from others. Some people are assholes, and will be assholes whatever job they have.

Victims of the establishment "Dude" you are the establishment unless you live in a cave somewhere.

No I don't run the place. That's done by a bunch of conservatives - I just wipe their bottoms for them.

I would agree however I dont believe the garda has the power to issue a on the street caution*.

Here, they can caution you on the street. And usually for a small amount of cannabis, say ten quids worth, there would be no charge.

Guards in general are really not concerned with cannabis. The chances are, if they see someone on the street, smoking a joint, they will just ignore them - they won't even caution or make an attempt to seize the "drugs haul". Not that I suggest you try that - but I have seen guards ignore people blatantly smoking in front of them.*

Some garda even go to dealers, and buy some for their own personal consumption.

To call the officer lazy is totally out of order and naive. If anything the lazy option would be to just witness the OP destroy the drugs.

We're talking about ten quids worth of cannabis here. Not 30 kilos of cocaine.

Ireland is in a pretty sh1t state if a civil servant is doing his/her job to this level the last thing everyone should be doing is screaming Jobsworth and crying foul.

Some people are jobsworths. Charging someone for 10 quids worth of cannabis is being a jobs worth. The judge handing out a big fine is being a jobsworth too.

Its no secret that there will always be a drug trade as long as there is a demand, so targeting the people who create the demand is a fair call IMO.

Right. Like it worked in the US in the prohibition days - or how it works in America now that they have something like 3 million people in jail for drug possession.

The most dangerous thing that can happen to you with cannabis is you get a conviction. So, why don't we remove the harm by decriminalising it.

The old approach in Ireland when the conservatives wanted to stop people from having sex - they made sure contraception was illegal. Stop the sex by punishing the people demanding the sex. In the Kerry Babies incident in Kerry i the 80s, the only person prosecuted was a protestant doctor who had a few bocks of condoms for personal use.


*I knew someone who was rolling a joint on O'Connell street one day. A guard walks up to him and says "WTF do you thinking you're doing", and he says "I'm trying to roll a joint" and the guard says "Get the F out of here".....And that was the end of that.

MagicSean

krd wrote: »

Ah the Nuremberg concentration camp gaurd defence. Dies hard that chesnut.



No. Judges have no input into the laws of the land. Their just victims of the establishment as the rest of us.



Well, why didn't the Garda just give him a caution then. Instead of wasting everyone's time.

The defence you refer to is "I was just following orders" not "I was enforcing a law passed democratically". If you can't see the difference then that's your problem.

Judges have no input into laws. It's a basic part of our constitution. To be honest, I don't see how you can be on this forum so much and know nothing about the separation of powers. Inany case, I was referring to the Garda having no input but I think you know that.

Why would he caution him? The op could easily have made a complaint about a Garda stealing his cannabis and the Garda would have no way of justifying it. If he left him with the cannabis he could face a complaint of not doing his job. That's the reality of what the ombudsman has resulted in. Gardai have to follow procedure or face sanction.

ThisNoize

So you're telling me if I want to appeal it and I get rejected, I could face hotter water?

That is nothing short of disgraceful. I should of ate it.

kneemos

ThisNoize wrote: »

So you're telling me if I want to appeal it and I get rejected, I could face hotter water?

That is nothing short of disgraceful. I should of ate it.

Did you speak in court and what did you say.

rubberdiddies

MagicSean wrote: »

Gardaí, solicitors and judges get no extra pay for dealing with drugs so you don't have to worry about your tax money either.

A guard however will get overtime for his appearance in court if that appearance is in ther day off or outside of their roster

MagicSean

rubberdiddies wrote: »

A guard however will get overtime for his appearance in court if that appearance is in ther day off or outside of their roster

Rarely happens anymore. Non existent outside Dublin. Court services set date based on when the Garda is rostered.

NoQuarter

ThisNoize wrote: »

So you're telling me if I want to appeal it and I get rejected, I could face hotter water?

That is nothing short of disgraceful. I should of ate it.

An appeal is a full appeal, the Circuit court will hear the full case again so, of course, the setence could be worse. It makes sense, you just dont like it because youre in the situation.

If I was you I would take the chance and just appeal the sentence and get a very very good solicitor who will make the case that a conviction really hampers you.

ThisNoize

I didn't speak much in court.
I pleaded guilty and the Judge, Guard and Solicitor basically went through what I said in the OP.

I can not afford a Solicitor so I took free legal aid.
Solicitor called me in to see him today.

krd

MagicSean wrote: »

The defence you refer to is "I was just following orders" not "I was enforcing a law passed democratically". If you can't see the difference then that's your problem.

Adolf Hitler was democratically elected.

The jobsworth's defence, by the way, is "It's more than my job's worth" hence the name jobsworth.

Judges have no input into laws. It's a basic part of our constitution. To be honest, I don't see how you can be on this forum so much and know nothing about the separation of powers.

The job of the judge is to uphold the values of Irish conservatism. Their input into the laws is more subtle, nebulous and indirect. No one gets made a judge unless they're seen as a safe pair of conservative hands. They have plenty of leeway in sentencing and fines. Which is why, if you're from a wealthy part of town - and you get caught with a kilo of cocaine, you might only receive a suspended sentence. Come from the wrong part of town and you're getting banged up for a long stretch.

Inany case, I was referring to the Garda having no input but I think you know that.

Garda have a good deal of discretion in what they do on the streets.

They could be wasting millions in hunting down and prosecuting pot smokers They just don't.

And when homosexuality was illegal they weren't chasing the gays down the street either.

if someone has a small amount of pot, and they are not making a nuisance of themselves it's not moral for anyone to intervene.

Why would he caution him? The op could easily have made a complaint about a Garda stealing his cannabis and the Garda would have no way of justifying it.

Come on the garda is fully within their rights to seize the cannabis. Just like they can seize alcohol on the street. I doubt anyone would be foolhardy enough to complain that their drugs have been seized and they want their property back.

I've had prescription medication seized from me. They didn't have any right to keep it but I wasn't going to make a fuss.

If he left him with the cannabis he could face a complaint of not doing his job. That's the reality of what the ombudsman has resulted in. Gardai have to follow procedure or face sanction.

Are you telling me there has been a specific incident of this happening. Specifically relating to marijuana.