1 in 5 retail units in the city empty!

deRanged

There's a report in the echo that one in 5 retail units in the city are currently vacant.
I could well believe it. There are some areas, like MacCurtain St that just have lots of empty units beside each other (like where the xtravision was).

What do you reckon the cause is - easy/free parking in the shopping centres outside town?
The "Opera Lane" effect, where only shops right by Opera Lane are thriving?
Or is it just a feature of a recession ...

gbee

You've touched on a few factors, don't forget previous city managers had a dictatorship in city redevelopment that was often at odds with the business association [including the idle tower].

The structure is pretty permanent the philosophy is inflexible and authorities too slow to react and also short sighted.

This is not a new problem, it's probably just a little worse now that we are in the great depression, but let's take one example.

Bourne's electronics, creating 300 new jobs in Mahon: Reality, ONE new job was created in Mahon and the other 299 commuted from the Norhtside and left a commercial park to the travellers, increasing rush hour traffic chaos citywide and a new ghetto on the northside.

This formula has been repeated many times in the past: Thinking that Opera Lane would 'revitalise' the city was simply stupid thinking. Our Celtic Tiger was never going to support all existing outlets as well as the multitude of new developments that has planning permission, doubling Mahon Point, a new massive centre in Little Island, another on the North Side [North Point] ~ we'd need like four million people in the city to support all those, and so on.

A big problem too is on-line shopping: I'm simply fed up with assistants telling me I can get it cheaper on-line. A disk enclosure from Maplin UK has stock and is £20 Blackpool wanted €60!!!!

TheGimp

Cork is booming compared to Limerick...you should see how bad it is here, it must be 3 in 5 units idle

Mainly recession I would think.

Oafley Jones

I'm surprised that it's only 1 in 5. Take a look at the likes of Cornmarket Centre, Grand Parade from the cinema up around to Patrick St. etc. There's tons of spare capacity in the city centre.

deRanged

so what are we missing in the city centre?

More coffee shops? I definitely think there's scope there, specially if they'd open late.

What else though, given Cork's population. We've enough phone shops anyway

Lyaiera

A scone shop.

A chilled out coffee place that does lots of types of coffees and teas and even hookahs, and they don't mind you sitting in big comfortable chairs as long as you buy something every hour or so.

I can really see it on McCurtain St. I investigated (out of curiousity and boredom) opening a shop there and rents aren't the worst for the size of premises you get there.

SomeFool

deRanged wrote: »

so what are we missing in the city centre?

More coffee shops? I definitely think there's scope there, specially if they'd open late.

What else though, given Cork's population. We've enough phone shops anyway

A nice gelateria, with fresh home made ice cream and good coffee would make a killing.

54kroc

Lyaiera wrote: »

A scone shop.

A chilled out coffee place that does lots of types of coffees and teas and even hookahs, and they don't mind you sitting in big comfortable chairs as long as you buy something every hour or so.

I can really see it on McCurtain St. I investigated (out of curiousity and boredom) opening a shop there and rents aren't the worst for the size of premises you get there.

Can I ask how much, Last time I checked they were asking silly money but it's been a while.

Imo the rent and especially the rates are putting off new businesses moving into the city.

Hogzy

Are ye being sarcastic about the coffee shops??? Theyre feckin everywhere.

Most is down to the recession. Consumer spending is down and city center rates are through the roof so its much much harder for businesses to make a profit.

Online shopping is also having a massive effect on high street retailers especially in Ireland, But imo irish retailers can blame them selves for that. Only a hand full of retailers have an online presence and even less allow you to buy from their website. Its ridiculous.

Mccurtain street wouldn't have the footfall for another coffee shop, outside of kid central island area rents are seemingly not bad for good reason imo.

619C

“Cork is a fantastic city and there has been huge investment made in recent years. However, we must capitalise on that to make sure the city centre remains the main shopping area. If we don’t act now, Cork could end up being turned inside out, with an empty city centre and busy shopping centres on the outskirts,” Mr Durcan said.

Thats what is happening - everyone seems to go to their local shopping centre and dont go to the city unless they have to.

deRanged

RoverJames wrote: »

Mccurtain street wouldn't have the footfall for another coffee shop,

It's already got 2 or three hasn't it? Down by Bridge street.

Maybe there's just not enough people and money out there for the city centre and the outlying shopping centres.

Hogzy

619C wrote: »

“Cork is a fantastic city and there has been huge investment made in recent years. However, we must capitalise on that to make sure the city centre remains the main shopping area. If we don’t act now, Cork could end up being turned inside out, with an empty city centre and busy shopping centres on the outskirts,” Mr Durcan said.

Thats what is happening - everyone seems to go to their local shopping centre and dont go to the city unless they have to.

I dont blame them. The cost of parking in the city center is ridiculous. I parked in Q park the other day and it was over €3 an hour to park there. Thats almost the same price as parking in Dublin City. Now i know that Q park is the most expensive but all the other car parks are around the same price or close to it.

When people 'go shopping' they usually go for a good 3-5hrs so the cost of parking in that sense can be astronomical. The selection of shops in the suburbs is just as good as those that are in town so why bother paying the huge parking prices.

IMO disk parking should be abolished on a Saturday. That might help give the city center an edge especially on weekends.

It's a struggle to get on street parking on a Saturday in town, so too on Sunday and that's including all the loading bays which aren't loading bays on Saturday as such. I reckon its just that folks have less spending power for discretionary items and little pleasures. Lots of folk out of work, on reduced hours and those who haven't had pay cuts are taking home less and their expenses are the same if not higher. Also many people have moved away from the habit of battering the credit card and are trying to save what little they can for Christmas or summer hols rather than spend a few quid in town passing the afternoon.

pwurple

For me, it's mostly the parking.

Pre-baby I used to go in on the motorbike, and park over by the crawford. As it'd not cool to stick a one-year-old on the motorbike, I use the car. I'd love to use the bus or train, but I'd need to take two of them to get to the city, plus a long walk with smallies. Not feasible when I have their gear, plus shopping.

I used to go into the city every single saturday morning for food in the market, a wander around the crawford, and a cup of tea with buddies. I just can't justify it anymore with the parking charges. I get in once a month... if that...

They removed most of the street parking, and the carparks have gone bananas with the charges. It's a an expensive cup of tea with friends when I add 12 euro of parking to it.

12 euro isn't representative of parking charges for a few hours.

grenache

As already mentioned by a poster, it could be much worse, it could be like Limerick! Where all you see are €2 stores and empty retail units in the city centre, with the shopping being done in the suburban shopping centres. A Donut City if ever there was one.

Cork seems fine to me.

gbee

grenache wrote: »

Cork seems fine to me.

It's just taken us a little longer to run out of money, AND we spent a King's ransom dickiying up the place, or destroying it ~ the proverb of the pig's ear and silk purse come to mind.

Cork had previous, like moving the whole population out of the city to ghettos in Knocka, Mayfield etc.

Cork was and is a pig's ear, we were the best city the empire, outside of London for royalties, trade and exports, we had an international stock exchange, we were a business orientated society, very successful and industrious.

Then came Cork City Council and an agenda to 'beautify' the City, the most recent event was the five year €600 million 'redevelopment' of the inner City that was inherently anti trade by design [either deliberate or ineptness] and now we are counting the cost ~ traders know what's happening up to five years in advance, the traders were worried and were very vocal at the city manager who plowed on like 'Nero' classically did, ..... Isn't Limerick now the second City and not Cork?

sandin

From a retailers point of view the following are reasons why not to open in the city area.

Parking
Rates
Other empty Units
Over shopped
Funding
Rent

Rent is last as even if rent was free a retailer must "turn" its product to keep it fresh.

The Internet does not affect the town centres except where the likes of books/cd's are concerned. People still want to feel, try and smell goods. Shopping is also seen as a pastime and enjoyable experience. The internet will account for approx. 10% of retail spending - about the same that catalogues accounted for in the eighties.

Parking has to be made easier especially at weekends.

Rates have to be brought in line with the new reality.

Empty units should be let out free to non profit/non competing enterprises such as galleries.

Shopping areas that simply are past their sell by date need to be changed into something else.

Bank funding - a decent shop will need about 100k - 150k of cash to fitout & stock.

I will be opening a store in Cork later this year - but I have to have paking outside the door due to weight /size of items so the City Centre was ruled out immediately.

Fuzz McG

Reduce rents.

Landloard are still incredibly greedy. The amount of business' that move a couple of doors down in the last year because landlords are still trying to charge pre-'08 rents. Or actually upping the rents. It's ridiculous.

evilivor

Fuzz McG wrote: »

Reduce rents.

Landloard are still incredibly greedy. The amount of business' that move a couple of doors down in the last year because landlords are still trying to charge pre-'08 rents. Or actually upping the rents. It's ridiculous.

Upward only rent reviews in Ireland.

Hogzy

Fuzz McG wrote: »

Reduce rents.

Landloard are still incredibly greedy. The amount of business' that move a couple of doors down in the last year because landlords are still trying to charge pre-'08 rents. Or actually upping the rents. It's ridiculous.

Most of them have to in order to pay their mortgages.

pwurple

RoverJames wrote: »

12 euro isn't representative of parking charges for a few hours.

Park at 8:50 and leave at 12pm... just over 3 hours parking will cost you exactly 12 euro.

See charges below:
http://www.q-park.ie/ie/parking-with-q-park/our-parking-facilities/cork/q-park-grand-parade

Park in Paul street and leave 10 minutes earlier and it's 6 euro, that's more representative of the cost of a few hours parking, 12 is an extreme. There's also the citi car park across the road from the one you linked to, 2 euro an hour too iirc.

pwurple

What's your malfunction Rover. I've given you the website, I've given you the times, and the amount I was charged. You want me to scan the receipt? I'm not making this up. Those are the exact correct charges for 'a few hours' as I claimed.

Citi park is also 3 euro an hour, as is city hall, and I'm coming from the wrong side of the city to go to Paul Street. I don't go to the one across the road as I'm usually hauling a buggy with me, and you can't get out their pedestrian access with a buggy or wheelchair. I'm not a fan of shoving my baby in front of traffic.

Yeah, I could stay less time and it would indeed be cheaper. What a genius you are. :rolleyes:

I parked for 20 minutes in the center of Barcelona three weeks ago and it cost me 40 cent. They charge by the 10 minute slot, rather than per hour. Makes much more sense.

I've solved my own problem anyway. I put a babyseat in the van and throw it in the loading bays. It doesn't solve Cork's problem though, but I'm well aware the current council don't give a toss about local business.

I don't have a malfunction thanks.
I pointed out that €12 was not a representative charge for parking in Cork City for a few hours and pointed out that there are at least a couple of options for parking for €2/hour. It turns out the extra 10 minutes or so is crucial to you and so too is parking in overpriced car parks. If I spend €200 on a pair of jeans that does not mean that €200 is a representative cost for a pair of jeans.

Throwing your van into a loading bay won't work on a Saturday and Mon to Froi the limit is 30 mins so I can't see how that has solved your problem, if you have only gotten the van recently you'll be finding that out over the coming weeks.

Would be much easier to just park in one of the €2/hour parking lots

You probably wasted a right few quid actually changing from the car to the van, cost to change etc. Doesn't seem worth it to avail of a loading bay for 30mins at a time tbh, each to their own though

pwurple

Paul street is an extra 15 to 20 minutes in traffic around the wrong side of the city. I work and have a family... Extra time in a car with kids is not good for them, or me. We go to the library, the market, get a cup of tea and go home again. We use the car parks or street parking near our destination. It's hardly outrageous behaviour, it's all perfectly average / normal and a fairly ordinary example of what families who come into the city do regularly.

I am well aware there are other behaviours, I used to come in on the bus, train cycle in, motorbike park over by the crawford, walk in from college, zoom in and park for half an hour, all across my life, but now I do it this way now, as do many of my peers. I am put off town altogether for the reasons I stated. The thread title is asking why the city is losing business, and I am answering with my own experience. Feel free to add your own.

I have the van four years, thanks for asking. I don't see how I wasted anything on it. It costs absolutely nothing to move the carseat into the van instead of the car. I have never seen them enforce that 30 minutes on weekdays in that time, and yes, I have managed to read the signage about saturdays with my own eyes as well. Amazeballs.

Do you have something to actually contribute to the thread title at all by the way, or did you just want a vaguely misguided poke at something trivial? No worries anyway, I see from your posting history you like to drag threads off topic with random bickering about sweet feck all. I *think* there's a name for that behaviour... but I'm sure you know that already. I'll leave to your pasttime. Enjoy!

pwurple

pwurple wrote: »

............

Do you have something to actually contribute to the thread title at all..........

I'd hate for anyone to actually think that €12 is a representative figure for a few hours parking in Cork city when it isn't

Shocking to think loading bays are cluttered up with vans for hours on end while the folks who left them there are fannying about in the library and drinking coffee.

'tis no wonder they had to turn them into parking areas on Saturday when they are being abused like that.

Manach

evilivor wrote: »

Upward only rent reviews in Ireland.

The Government decline to move on this issue. Reasons of the constitution were mentioned, but underlying this were fears that NAMA rents could also be effected.

kart

RoverJames wrote: »

I'd hate for anyone to actually think that €12 is a representative figure for a few hours parking in Cork city when it isn't

.

Be it 12 or 6 euros, it is still too much.
In mainland Europe shopping centre carparks are huge. And i mean huge even in city centre. Normally (theres exeptions) they do not cost, but allowed time is 2 hours. If you leave your car there for 3+ hours, u must either pay or it gets clamped.
Different shopping centres have different rules about it, but neverthless, if you come to city centre, u normally bring money there. Would certainly help for economy if there would be some sort of free parking, cos that is just insane. Even if it is 6 euros.

I think the main reason city shopping have ceased alot is actually the fact that people try not to spend much on things they dont necessarily need. Most money goes on general living, if something is left over, people spend it on something thats been long overdue (dentist for example) or just keep it for next week, cos they know they will be short again.
People are just spending more carefully.