Scratching Holes

BoardsMember

I'm not at wits end, but I should be. I'm hitting the ball well, but keep scoring in the late 20's/early 30's. I play off 9. My typical round would usually have 1 or 2 birdies, lots of pars & bogeys, and maybe 3 scratches and 2 or 3 one pointers.

The scratches & 1 pointers can come at the easiest or the hardest holes, I make them happen, its not like it is due to the difficulty of the hole, they happen on different holes each week. they are usually spaced out in my round.

I know my main problem is focus/concentration, and this leads to poor decision making, or mental errors as some might call them. I need to work on being fully concentrated on each shot, for all aspects of it

• reviewing the options
• selecting the one that minimises risk (i.e. one that might leave me with short side/difficult next shot etc)
• deciding on correct shot to play and the correct club to play it with
• visualising the shot I intend to play
• actually focusing on the shot as I hit it, concentrating on keeping head still and keeping good tempo

So the above is the checklist that I'd like to go through, or something similar, but it rarely happens. Does anyone have any advice on how to get better at approaching shots more methodically to improve the chances of having the best plan and executing it well.


I think one of my main problems is appreciating that golf is difficult, and each shot needs my full attention. I'm a good striker of the ball, and can hit the ball beautifully at times (sorry for immodest comment, but its relevant to my problem). I think I almost conclude that I'm playing well and that it will just happen, and then I have some absolute shockers. I find my bad shots are terrible, and guys with way less ability and quality of strike are scoring way better. Again, immodest comment, but probably goes a long way to explaining why I am so bad at scoring.


Anyone else have this poor approach to playing golf? Anyone got any tips on how to take it more seriously, or how to get the most out of your ability and maximise score/minimise bad holes? I know all about getting it back in play, it's kind of at a higher level I am talking about.

matt-dublin

i think i've a similar issue, my problem is i know i have the shots, the issue is being able to consistantly pull them off.

i think containment is the issue, if you're having difficulty don't play aggressivly, try to contain the damage.

perfect example was myself this weekend when i went out in 19, had 3/4 bad holes and came back in with 12 parring the last 4 holes.

i think just trying to turn those scratches into bogeys will get you back into the mid 30s.

If you've played a bad shot or 3 off the tee, just try and play simple, don't try to force something thats not gonna happen. On a par four with 3 off the tee, look to save a double bogey rather than trying to get the bogey.

Mr. Larson

I had the same problem for the longest time (play off the same Hcap as you also) and it can be very frustrating, so I feel your pain. I've definitely improved on reducing penalties/scratches so I'm worried that by saying what I'm saying now will but the Hex on myself and I'll start doing it again .

In short, the key for me is has been a tried and trusted plan/strategy for every shot on every hole regardless and forgetting about your score as you play, each hole as a mini-round. I never walk up to a tee wondering if I'll hit driver or an iron, it's decided before I get on the course. Sometimes if the pin is on a difficult spot I might miss left or right on purpose to leave an uphill putt but for the most part it's all pre-determined. Takes the faffing out of it, I pick conservative targets and commit to them.

Things that always hurt me were wrong club choice off the tee, picking dangerous shots, changing my hole strategy based on current score (thereby compounding a bad one by chasing or messing up a good one by getting too cautious). Also being clued into the score all the way is a killer as you subconsciously re-adjust. Your head might drop if you've only bogeyed a few holes with shots and are facing into a run of 3 or 4 with no shot, the mindset can kick into attack mode and you're already then deviating from your strategy.

Right now I rarely hit a shot that will result in trouble, trouble being defined as OB, Hazard, a position from where the next shot might be fraught with danger for e.g. down the left on a hole with O.B. left. I think it's all about having a plan for every shot for every hole. I am finding myself hitting from the same place most of the time and it becomes a habit, for e.g. Always in the right rough on 1st off the tee, then 5i or hybrid to the left fairway for shot 2 leaving a SW into the green. Of course conditions can change and into the wind it might be Driver, Hybrid, 6i or with it could be Driver, 6i SW but you get the picture. 4th & 12th holes are 4i off the tee regardless. Over the weekend I played 4i off the tee then 3W for the 2nd shot because I know the 4i won't hit trouble.

That turned into a bit of an unstructured ramble but I feel I've a lot to say about it so just blurted it all out - hope it helps. It's been key for me.

diarmuid05

Was having pretty similar problem early this year.
What fixed me was a stroke competition.
1st Stroke competition of the year i had 2 9's on the card.

Ever since i play all rounds of golf as stroke... Finish every hole no matter what

Nothing like a 9 or 10 to concentrate the mind

BoardsMember

Thanks for that, particularly when taking into account the possibility of jinxing yourself!!

Mr. Larson

diarmuid05 wrote: »

Was having pretty similar problem early this year.
What fixed me was a stroke competition.
1st Stroke competition of the year i had 2 9's on the card.

Ever since i play all rounds of golf as stroke... Finish every hole no matter what

Nothing like a 9 or 10 to concentrate the mind

That's fine if you're out messing on your own but you're supposed to pick up your ball once you're unable to score on a hole in Stableford/V-Par. Otherwise we'd all be out there all day (like we are for the Monthly Medals).

diarmuid05

Jabberwocky wrote: »

That's fine if you're out messing on your own but you're supposed to pick up your ball once you're unable to score on a hole in Stableford/V-Par. Otherwise we'd all be out there all day (like we are for the Monthly Medals).

Within reason obviously...

But i'm guessing off 9 his scratches are more like doubles with no shot.
and probably the majority of the scratches, he'll be still putting for a point. so i don't really think time comes into it

peepee

Thats single figure handicap golf! Its tough! Sounds like your trouble is on the approaches into the greens?

If you cant get up and down from around the green a certain percentage of times per round you wont score 36 points consistently. Pros groove their swing for hours every day. On full iron shots its routine for them but we can feel different every time we go out. So expecting high GIR percentage every time you play is unlikely.

But if you practice a bit more on your chipping around the green you'll get more result for less effort. You also will be under less pressure to make the green as you will feel confident of making par from anywhere. Then you'll probably find GIR will go up anyway!

newport2

Similar issue myself at the moment. Playing off 8, currently turning in 33-34 points, with about 2 scratches. Usually comes down to successive bad shots. Am making some swing changes at the mo though, so hoping it will go away once they're engrained.

Jazzzman

nothing to see here..

charlieIRL

I think i need to step back from golf for a while before my head melts!!

Like the OP the last few rounds I have been scratching holes consistently, regardless of index rating. That and missing 3 foot putts is killing me. Had 5 scratches & missed at least 5 short putts in Naas on Saturday and still had 30 points. I had 8 points for the first 3 holes and then went on to scratch the next 3 with silly mistakes then had 7 points for the last 3 holes. I know if I can cut out half the scratches / missed putts then my HC will head in the direction I want it to.

Cutting them out is the problem though!!!

matt-dublin

i think what we all have to remember is that Pros do this too, even Mcilroy shot a +7 last week so we're all human.

the key thing it to try and contain any massive damage and get a decent number off the card.

don't try changingn anything and just try and keep focused. forget your overall scored and concentrate on the shot in hand not the overall hole/round

Dr.Silly

Hope this doesn't come across the wrong way, but

if you keep scoring late twenties, early thirties,
maybe it's your handicap that's out of sorts, as well as some of your shots ?

newport2

Instead of just scratching your holes lads, why not get out there and practice?

PARlance

I suffer (suffering less) from the same thing.
OP, I think you know the answer as youve said it yourself, that being focus.
Everything else falls around this.

I play my rounds as 6 sets of 3 holes. Pick a target for those 3 holes and try to hit it, then move onto next 3.

I'm still being let down with other aspects of my game, but this has certainly helped my scoring of late.

I know people will say focus on each shot/hole but in my case I've tried that, works for a while and then I forget it mid round.

With the 6 sets of 3, it helps to keep me on my toes.

Oh look....theres a bird

With this focus... The other aspects like club selection, pre shot routine etc will fall into place.

PARlance

ajcurry123 wrote: »

I suffer (suffering less) from the same thing.
OP, I think you know the answer as youve said it yourself, that being focus.
Everything else falls around this.



With this focus... The other aspects like club selection, pre shot routine etc will fall into place.

That said I had 6 scratches last Saturday! Ignore any of my advice.

CageWager

I found that the key to getting from high to low single figures was the ability not to compound errors. I hit a few dodgy shots here and there but rarely will I hit two of them in a row. You also need to understand the value of what I call a "good bogey". Dropping only one shot is not the end of the world, taking the doubles and worse off my card made the difference in my game. Needless to say the lower you go the better you must putt, especially when a missed 4 footer can represent a significant portion of you handicap. Leave a putter and a few balls lying around in the living room and stroke a few putts every time you get a chance. Works wonders IMO. Sounds like you already have the shots, you just need to get out and grind out a score.

In terms of pre shot routine, your on the right track with the list in your OP. Steadying yourself on every shot and being very clear about what you are trying to do is important. Remember to sip on water the whole way around as even slight dehydration can cause a lapse in concentration. I usually eat some nuts and dried fruit for slow release energy. I avoid chocolate and anything with a lot of sugar.

dak

There are loads of reasons for scratching ! Too much beer...not enough beer ...hangovers ..tiredness ..lack of sleep...injury...too much golf ... all lead to poor concentration and scratches as a result.

And here was me always wating to be a scratch golfer !!

BoardsMember

Thanks all for the input.

As some have pointed out, I kinda know the answer, I suppose I am just seeking the wisdom of those who are better than me, or better at grinding out results, or who have been through this and have improved their scores. So thanks for the replies.

CageWager - I intend to try sipping water, in work I get through a huge amount of water, on the course for 4 hours I bring one 75cl bottle of powerade or something similar as I'm too tight to buy any more. I will bring my own! Someone mentioned dissolving salt into it, which I might also try. I had a big match last year and I definitely felt the effect of dehydration. Madness to drink so little, and our on course taps are woeful.

I have also not been great at playing safe, and/or sometimes compounding errors. I like the idea of having a plan too, i.e. trying to play to the same position. I think if my hydration is better I have a better chance of sticking to it, and thinking clearly, but sticking to it is as much about concentration as anything too I suppose.

I'm intending to make a vow to myself to never hit a shot that I'm not ready to hit, and to ensure I have it visualised etc, but that is so hard to keep when things start going bad!!

Happy golfing all, thanks for the input.

Kace

Dr.Silly wrote: »

Hope this doesn't come across the wrong way, but

if you keep scoring late twenties, early thirties,
maybe it's your handicap that's out of sorts, as well as some of your shots ?

Yes and No. I have exactly the same issues - I float anywhere from eagles to quad bogeys and everywhere in between. However I used to play off 5 (once upon a time) and am now 13. Even off this handicap I'm not shooting greater than high 20s low 30s most days.

For me it's swing changes to try and keep drives and woods in play I feel I'm improving slightly and have seen some improvement in stats over recent weeks.

What a frustrating game, but I suppose it serves me right as I don't practise and I only play once a week.

DiegoWorst

I was in the same boat, regularly hitting three or four birdies a round, but also having two or three disaster holes, I clocked a nine and a ten in one strokeplay event.

This year I've lowered my expectations on each hole, just get the ball in play off the tee without trying to burst it, and getting the approach somewhere near the green, without trying to hit Hail Mary's at tight pins. I haven't lost a ball in three months, and have scored only one double-bogey in that time. I'm not saying this is the answer for all, but it has helped me get my handicap going in the right direction again.

newport2

DiegoWorst wrote: »

I was in the same boat, regularly hitting three or four birdies a round, but also having two or three disaster holes, I clocked a nine and a ten in one strokeplay event.

This year I've lowered my expectations on each hole, just get the ball in play off the tee without trying to burst it, and getting the approach somewhere near the green, without trying to hit Hail Mary's at tight pins. I haven't lost a ball in three months, and have scored only one double-bogey in that time. I'm not saying this is the answer for all, but it has helped me get my handicap going in the right direction again.

One double-bogey in three months is very impressive. Don't think any of the pros could even match that.

Kace

DiegoWorst wrote: »

I was in the same boat, regularly hitting three or four birdies a round, but also having two or three disaster holes, I clocked a nine and a ten in one strokeplay event.

This year I've lowered my expectations on each hole, just get the ball in play off the tee without trying to burst it, and getting the approach somewhere near the green, without trying to hit Hail Mary's at tight pins. I haven't lost a ball in three months, and have scored only one double-bogey in that time. I'm not saying this is the answer for all, but it has helped me get my handicap going in the right direction again.

Wow !! What handicap do you play off ? I think the only way that I could match that ball stat is to go around with a 7 iron.

moycullen14

The 8-10 handicap range is an interesting one. You should be able to par each hole but not all the time. It's hard to know whether a par is normal and bogey an exception or the other way round.

I'm off 8 and have had great round where I have barely hit a green in regulation - just getting up and down all the time. OTOH, I've had round with lots of GIR but failed to scramble when not on the green and had a slew of three putts. You pays you money.........

As stated above, concentration and not compounding errors seems to be the key. If there is one piece of advice it would be to focus on the NEXT shot only - forget about your score, the 3-putt on the last, everything.

Last weekend, in 17 holes I had 9 pars & 8 bogies. I ground out what was a very good round in difficult conditions. No heroics, just sensible golf. Then comes the 18th hole - index 16. I was pissed because I missed a shortish putt on the previous hole - PROBLEM 1. I turned over a 5 iron (it's a par 3) because I got my stance wrong, ball in bunker - now I'm even more pissed PROBLEM 2. Now it looks like I'll have another bogey which throws out my 1 bogey per 3 holes plan - PROBLEM 3. Lie is crap, try ridiculous shot to get a par - PROBLEM 4 - with open face club, thin ball through green into heavy rough. Now I'm fuming and feel the whole round is coming apart - PROBLEM 5. Anyway, 2 hacks later I'm on the green and a 3 putt for a 7! Point is, the descent into chaos was gradual with each shot compounding the error of the previous one and, worst of all, I was thinking about my score when I should have been concentrating on the next shot. If I had been concentrating EVERY one of the shots - with the exception of the 3rd hack and the 7th tap in - would have been better.

• NO MATTER HOW BAD A SHOT IS, GET BACK ONTO THE FAIRWAY ASAP
• YOU SCORE AROUND THE GREENS, LONG IRONS AND WOODS ARE JUST TO GET YOU THERE.
• THERE IS A SENSIBLE OPTION FOR EVERY SHOT, TAKE IT.
• IF YOU WANT TO IMPROVE YOUR SCORE, GET RID OF DISASTERS, 3 PUTTS, FAILED UP 'N DOWNS AND SAND SAVES

TheFarneyman

I am a 12 h/c on the way to 13 if this doesnt stop. I used to play of 7/8 as a young lad and getting back into the swing of things-pardon the pun. The last few rounds have been very frustrating. Usual round consists of 9-10 pars possibly a birdie or two,3/4 bogeys and then 3/4 miserable holes. doubles and trebles, shooting my h/cap but i feel i should be shooting much better scores! Striking the ball well again, short game is improving and putting is prob the best part of my game. JUST CANT SEEM TO KEEP IT ALL TOGETHER OVER 18!!!! Help please! Similar problem!

GreeBo

matt-dublin wrote: »

i think i've a similar issue, my problem is i know i have the shots, the issue is being able to consistantly pull them off.

Without meaning to offend, but if you cannot pull them off consistently I would argue that you do not in fact "have" these shots?

Thinking you have them because you pulled them off once or twice is what leads to high scores IMHO.
Week in week out I see lads off 18 hitting 3 woods for their second shots on long par 4s and par 5s. Then they wonder why their scores are not coming down.
I very rarely "go for" shots...there is just no need at *our* level to be attempting to hit a 3w to a green in a strokes competition. The one birdie or eagle you get a year is not offsetting the 8's and 9's that happen every Saturday.

I'm sick saying it, but try to play to 18 before you try to play to 5. If you dont need to hit a GIR then dont risk a double or worse by going for it if you are hitting more than a 5 iron. As for attempting the miracle shots over water and trees with 5woods etc etc...just madness.
If your game is so bad that you dont think you can lay up and get up and down 50% of the time then why on earth do you think you can hit the green with a 3iron from 200m out over water?

matt-dublin

Greebo, when i say i can't consistantly pull them off i mean i miss two in about 10.

I don't get one birdie a year, i get on average two or three a round and i don't think i've played one round this year where i've not gotten a birdie.

I play to nine now, and i know i can play better, im consistantly getting 12-13 GIR a round so i dont usually find my ball striking to be a massive issue unless im dehydrated, hungover, hungry or all three. (1 over for 8 holes with 5 shots, scratched index 2 on the front)

i know what my major problems are, one being able to hole putts. There's plenty of occassions i've had two or three scratches and still beaten 36, sure i had 19 on the front nine of the heath last week with a scratch.

Your arguement also kinda says because a pro doesn't pull off a shot a few times that they don't have the shot either??

PARlance

GreeBo wrote: »

Without meaning to offend, but if you cannot pull them off consistently I would argue that you do not in fact "have" these shots?

Thinking you have them because you pulled them off once or twice is what leads to high scores IMHO.
Week in week out I see lads off 18 hitting 3 woods for their second shots on long par 4s and par 5s. Then they wonder why their scores are not coming down.
I very rarely "go for" shots...there is just no need at *our* level to be attempting to hit a 3w to a green in a strokes competition. The one birdie or eagle you get a year is not offsetting the 8's and 9's that happen every Saturday.

I'm sick saying it, but try to play to 18 before you try to play to 5. If you dont need to hit a GIR then dont risk a double or worse by going for it if you are hitting more than a 5 iron. As for attempting the miracle shots over water and trees with 5woods etc etc...just madness.
If your game is so bad that you dont think you can lay up and get up and down 50% of the time then why on earth do you think you can hit the green with a 3iron from 200m out over water?

I'm pretty sure you have taken his post out of context there, he does say he "has" these shots, which is fair enough to say I think (even if there's a low percentage chance of coming off). He quickly goes onto say the problem is consistency and echoes your thoughts of restraint etc

newport2

I find most of my scratches come in the form of a double bogey where I've no shot. The strange thing is that I'm starting to realise they usually come after a good tee shot. I'll hit a drive down the centre of the fairway and before I know it I'm walking off the green with a double-bogey. (these are also the ones easiest to get annoyed with yourself for, having snatched defeat from the jaws of victory) Maybe I get complacent after the good tee-shot, maybe I need to drink more water (will try that) or just a concentration lapse.
All I know is that I rarely scratch a hole after hitting a bad drive (once I find my ball of course), probably because after a bad drive my options are limited and I can often only chip out onto the fairway. My focus is probably increased then knowing it's my thrid shot into the green and there's no more room for error.
Sound familiar to anyone or is it just me?

GreeBo

matt-dublin wrote: »

Greebo, when i say i can't consistantly pull them off i mean i miss two in about 10.

I don't get one birdie a year, i get on average two or three a round and i don't think i've played one round this year where i've not gotten a birdie.

I play to nine now, and i know i can play better, im consistantly getting 12-13 GIR a round so i dont usually find my ball striking to be a massive issue unless im dehydrated, hungover, hungry or all three. (1 over for 8 holes with 5 shots, scratched index 2 on the front)

i know what my major problems are, one being able to hole putts. There's plenty of occassions i've had two or three scratches and still beaten 36, sure i had 19 on the front nine of the heath last week with a scratch.

Your arguement also kinda says because a pro doesn't pull off a shot a few times that they don't have the shot either??

Well 8/10 is pretty consistent in anyones book. Perhaps the problem then is more of a course management issue. If the result of the shot not coming off is a disaster (shooting an 8) then I would say the rewards of maybe getting a birdie are not worth it for this scenario?

I'm not attacking you, I'm saying that often higher handicaps remember that one time they hit index 1 in regulation and holed the birdie putt and so from then on, thats their "plan" for how to play that hole.

I was 1 over on the back 9 last week and 1 under the week before, that doesnt make me a scratch golfer or mean that my ability is better than my current handicap, that I can just start shooting at every pin.

I dont follow your point about the pro?.
As I said in my original post, consistency is the key. I would argue about the Pros ability to recover from the 2/10 times versus yours/ours. Also, the top pros are trying to win, at all costs, they are not worrying about 0.1s or buffer zones. Its a very different scenario from your monthly medal.

GreeBo

newport2 wrote: »

I find most of my scratches come in the form of a double bogey where I've no shot. The strange thing is that I'm starting to realise they usually come after a good tee shot. I'll hit a drive down the centre of the fairway and before I know it I'm walking off the green with a double-bogey. (these are also the ones easiest to get annoyed with yourself for, having snatched defeat from the jaws of victory) Maybe I get complacent after the good tee-shot, maybe I need to drink more water (will try that) or just a concentration lapse.
All I know is that I rarely scratch a hole after hitting a bad drive (once I find my ball of course), probably because after a bad drive my options are limited and I can often only chip out onto the fairway. My focus is probably increased then knowing it's my thrid shot into the green and there's no more room for error.
Sound familiar to anyone or is it just me?

You are probably hitting an inappropriate approach shot for your ability in these scenarios. Since you have no shot, its fair to say that its an easier type of hole, probably short but with a well protected green. You need to determine where the safe place to aim is. Typically thats centre of the green, erring on being long rather than short. A good drive doesnt automatically mean you get a green light to go pin seeking. With no shot on the hole your par is far more important than the chances of getting a birdie by trying to stitch one to a dangerous flag.

GreeBo

ajcurry123 wrote: »

I'm pretty sure you have taken his post out of context there, he does say he "has" these shots, which is fair enough to say I think (even if there's a low percentage chance of coming off).

My point is that if there is a low percentage of it coming off then you clearly dont have these shots!
Anyone can hit a miracle driver off the deck over the hump but keep it under the trees and find the green...I doubt many people would try to say that they "have" that shot and can rely on it when they need it.

newport2

GreeBo wrote: »

You are probably hitting an inappropriate approach shot for your ability in these scenarios.

I'm talking about a lack of focus here really, my shot selection doesn't change whether it's my second or third shot in.

GreeBo wrote: »

Since you have no shot, its fair to say that its an easier type of hole, probably short but with a well protected green.

Don't really get this at all. If I hit a bad drive and end up blocked out with no shot to the green, why would this lead you to assume it's an easier type of hole? This can happen on any type of hole, long or short. All you need are a few trees. More likely on a difficult hole too.

GreeBo wrote: »

You need to determine where the safe place to aim is. Typically thats centre of the green, erring on being long rather than short. A good drive doesnt automatically mean you get a green light to go pin seeking. With no shot on the hole your par is far more important than the chances of getting a birdie by trying to stitch one to a dangerous flag.

Like I say above, my shot selection is exactly the same whether I've hit the fairway, or have just chipped out and am playing my third. But I feel my success rate is better on the latter. I think this is something mental or focus related.

Keano

I'm agreement with Greebo on this one. I'll give you an example. 1st hole in on my home course is a par 4, OOB on the right and tree's to the left. I myself always try go for it in 2 and I can honestly say I've double bogey it more times than I have anything else, down to trying to play the shot I think I can play! If you take GreeBo's approach. It would be driver, then maybe a 8/9 iron to lay it up. Chip on and if you 2 putt you have a nice handy bogey.

Actually going to give that a shot evening and see how I get on.

Mr. Larson

newport2 wrote: »

I find most of my scratches come in the form of a double bogey where I've no shot. The strange thing is that I'm starting to realise they usually come after a good tee shot. I'll hit a drive down the centre of the fairway and before I know it I'm walking off the green with a double-bogey. (these are also the ones easiest to get annoyed with yourself for, having snatched defeat from the jaws of victory) Maybe I get complacent after the good tee-shot, maybe I need to drink more water (will try that) or just a concentration lapse.
All I know is that I rarely scratch a hole after hitting a bad drive (once I find my ball of course), probably because after a bad drive my options are limited and I can often only chip out onto the fairway. My focus is probably increased then knowing it's my thrid shot into the green and there's no more room for error.
Sound familiar to anyone or is it just me?

+1. + 1,000 actually. That sounds so familiar now that you say it. I usually Par the 1st three holes (shots on 1st, 2nd, 3rd is easy) and 3 wood up the 4th and walk off with a 5 or 6. I'm averaging 1.25pts on the hole all year. The 1st & the 2nd are low enough indexes yet I'm averaging 2.83 & 2.75pts on them respectively. If I could only keep the focus I have down the 1st & 2nd for 18 holes she'd be my uncle!!

GreeBo

newport2 wrote: »

I'm talking about a lack of focus here really, my shot selection doesn't change whether it's my second or third shot in.

well thats a whole different problem so!

newport2 wrote: »

Don't really get this at all. If I hit a bad drive and end up blocked out with no shot to the green, why would this lead you to assume it's an easier type of hole? This can happen on any type of hole, long or short. All you need are a few trees. More likely on a difficult hole too.

no shot as in the index is too high...

KeanoALegend wrote:

I'm agreement with Greebo on this one. I'll give you an example. 1st hole in on my home course is a par 4, OOB on the right and tree's to the left. I myself always try go for it in 2 and I can honestly say I've double bogey it more times than I have anything else, down to trying to play the shot I think I can play! If you take GreeBo's approach. It would be driver, then maybe a 8/9 iron to lay it up. Chip on and if you 2 putt you have a nice handy bogey.

Actually going to give that a shot evening and see how I get on.

If you are going to do it the "GreeBo-Way" then you would be hitting a driver off the tee. Hit a 5 iron and then a 7/6 iron to lay up with. No point in adding the risk of a driver off the tee if you are not going to go for the green.
Its the same as people laying up as close the the green as possible with a 3 wood. If you are not going for it then lay up with a club that consistently goes where you want it.
Id wager thats rarely a 3 wood off the deck for most people.
Hit a 5 or 6 iron and then an 8 iron instead of 3w and SW.

PARlance

GreeBo wrote: »

My point is that if there is a low percentage of it coming off then you clearly dont have these shots!
Anyone can hit a miracle driver off the deck over the hump but keep it under the trees and find the green...I doubt many people would try to say that they "have" that shot and can rely on it when they need it.

I am not disagreeing with you over that fact that people should not attempt these low % shots. They lead to higher scores overall I agree.

Slight disagreement, semantics really, over the fact that I would say that even if someone can hit a shot 1% of the time then they DO have the shot in them. And it's this very fact that it is doable that gets a lot of people into trouble.
Doable... just not sensible.
If they Dont have the shot, then it doesn't even come into the equation.

I've spent the last while trying to teach myself not to hit these low % shots in favour of better course management and seeing the rewards.

PRAF

BoardsMember have you looked at any of the Karl Morris Mindfactor stuff on the web? www.themindfactor.com/. Some interesting thoughts on it around things like focus, staying in the present, effective practice, etc. Might be a help, might not.

Golf is a really tough game and playing your best for 18 holes is almost impossible IMO. That's where a tidy short game comes in, turning doubles into bogies and bogies into pars. The answer here is regular practice if you can devote enough time to it.

Happy golfing anyway!

BoardsMember

Thanks PRAF, will have a look.

Did I mention I have the yips on my short game? There....I said it, its out in public. I am struggling on with them, and know I will again be a good chipper. But I have knifed one (or 101) too many through the green in the last 12 months and now when I get up to chips often I am unable to think clearly and compose myself, visualise, and execute.

But apart from chipping, my irons are soaring and I am sinking a good few putts. I do tend to be an all or nothing scorer, so that's my challenge, to knuckle down and execue each shot as well as I possibly can.

The answer is divorce the wife and sell the kids and I'll be half way there.....

Mr. Larson

Keep a slow tempo throughout, keep the top of the club pointed toward your belt buckle as you chip (i.e. open your torso as you swing), don't be afraid to hit down on the ball to make it go up . Some of the things that help me with (ch)yips.

PRAF

Jabberwocky wrote: »

Keep a slow tempo throughout, keep the top of the club pointed toward your belt buckle as you chip (i.e. open your torso as you swing), don't be afraid to hit down on the ball to make it go up . Some of the things that help me with (ch)yips.

Also playing the ball back in your stance pretty much eliminates any chance of fat or thin chips. You are pretty much guaranteed a clean strike. Bye bye chipping yips!

DiegoWorst

newport2 wrote: »

One double-bogey in three months is very impressive. Don't think any of the pros could even match that.

Pros play a much different game, on much different course set ups.
It's not that impressive, only 7 singles comps in those three months. But still far better than what I achieved in the previous two years.

Kace wrote: »

Wow !! What handicap do you play off ? I think the only way that I could match that ball stat is to go around with a 7 iron.

Playing off 7 at the minute, was 9 about 8 weeks ago. I used to lose a lot of balls off the tee, but my objective this year is to get every tee shot in play, even if I have to hit half swing shots, seems to be working thus far.

finchkerry

newport2 wrote: »

I find most of my scratches come in the form of a double bogey where I've no shot. The strange thing is that I'm starting to realise they usually come after a good tee shot. I'll hit a drive down the centre of the fairway and before I know it I'm walking off the green with a double-bogey. (these are also the ones easiest to get annoyed with yourself for, having snatched defeat from the jaws of victory) Maybe I get complacent after the good tee-shot, maybe I need to drink more water (will try that) or just a concentration lapse.
All I know is that I rarely scratch a hole after hitting a bad drive (once I find my ball of course), probably because after a bad drive my options are limited and I can often only chip out onto the fairway. My focus is probably increased then knowing it's my thrid shot into the green and there's no more room for error.
Sound familiar to anyone or is it just me?

I am in the exact same boat. Recently I scratched three holes all in which I didn't have shots on and ended up with 34 points. I birdied 2 holes I had shots on (4 pointers) but in the end could not claw back to level with my handicap which is 8. 

I have come to the thinking that if I scratch a hole in which I have a shot... it is the worst give away in he world. On holes I have a shot my mind frame is... right 3 points here, give myself a look in for a birdie and see how I end up... and to be fair I generally get on ok with these holes, admittedly it obviously doesn't always go my way but that's golf for you. Par 3's in which I dont have a shot are holes I regularly bogey and have silly one pointers which wreck my card. 

In my last round at Strandhill I scratched three simple holes the par 5 5th, not overly difficult, evaluated tee box but you can get home in two and I had this on my mind and pulled the tee shot left and couldn't find my ball. My next scratch was the short par 4 8th again going for the big one off the tee and pulled it left into the heavy stuff and couldn't find my ball. The other scratch was the par 3 2nd again pulling my tee shot left, leaving a hopeless 2nd shot in. I birdied the 3th and 15th giving me much needed four pointers but the damaged was done at that stage and I was playing catch up.

newport2

GreeBo wrote: »

no shot as in the index is too high...

when I said no shot, I meant no shot to the green, eg in the trees and must chip out, not no shot in the handicap sense

moycullen14

finchkerry wrote: »

I am in the exact same boat. Recently I scratched three holes all in which I didn't have shots on and ended up with 34 points. I birdied 2 holes I had shots on (4 pointers) but in the end could not claw back to level with my handicap which is 8. 

I have come to the thinking that if I scratch a hole in which I have a shot... it is the worst give away in he world. On holes I have a shot my mind frame is... right 3 points here, give myself a look in for a birdie and see how I end up... and to be fair I generally get on ok with these holes, admittedly it obviously doesn't always go my way but that's golf for you. Par 3's in which I dont have a shot are holes I regularly bogey and have silly one pointers which wreck my card. 

In my last round at Strandhill I scratched three simple holes the par 5 5th, not overly difficult, evaluated tee box but you can get home in two and I had this on my mind and pulled the tee shot left and couldn't find my ball. My next scratch was the short par 4 8th again going for the big one off the tee and pulled it left into the heavy stuff and couldn't find my ball. The other scratch was the par 3 2nd again pulling my tee shot left, leaving a hopeless 2nd shot in. I birdied the 3th and 15th giving me much needed four pointers but the damaged was done at that stage and I was playing catch up.

That's because you're playing holes, rather than shots.

Your approach to a hole is based on whether you have a shot on it or not. That's fatal. Playing off 8 you should play each round as a medal, forget about where you have the shots. Easier said than done, I know.

My handicap alternates between 8 & 9 and I find that I par index 9 when I have a shot on it and bogey it when I don't. I stand up on the tee and think '3 pointer, no pressure' when I do have a shot and 'Must get a par here to keep the card going' when I don't - with obvious results.

Anyway, stroke indices are (or at least should be) as much about distribution as difficulty. We have even/odd nines - most clubs do? - and the indices are fairly well distributed in - each 3 holes has a low/medium/high index.

BoardsMember

PRAF wrote: »

Also playing the ball back in your stance pretty much eliminates any chance of fat or thin chips. You are pretty much guaranteed a clean strike. Bye bye chipping yips!

Yeah, you'd think. But the yip is something slightly different, the arms spasm and the head/shoulders/whole body lifts up. I know I can beat them, I do hit good shots. Actually trying to take the hands out of the shot is my biggest challenge, when II do that chipping becomes easy again. I feel opening the shoulders when swinging back helps, or the feeling of swinging with shoulders/rocking them.

GreeBo

BoardsMember wrote: »

Yeah, you'd think. But the yip is something slightly different, the arms spasm and the head/shoulders/whole body lifts up. I know I can beat them, I do hit good shots. Actually trying to take the hands out of the shot is my biggest challenge, when II do that chipping becomes easy again. I feel opening the shoulders when swinging back helps, or the feeling of swinging with shoulders/rocking them.

What club are you chipping with?
If you are blading them over the back of the green then it sounds like you are making a big swing with a SW or PW or something?
Have you tried a chip and run with a 8i or 7i or something?
Dont go airborne unless you have an obstacle to go over...

newport2

moycullen14 wrote: »

My handicap alternates between 8 & 9 and I find that I par index 9 when I have a shot on it and bogey it when I don't. I stand up on the tee and think '3 pointer, no pressure' when I do have a shot and 'Must get a par here to keep the card going' when I don't - with obvious results.

Sounds familiar......

Anyone find they hole a lot more good putts for par than they do for birdie?

I was away with 2 mates playing golf for the week a couple of years ago and one of them was making this point. While we could relate to what he was saying, we thought it was down to the way you remembered things. Anyway, to prove him wrong, we monitored each others putts outside 6 feet and outside 12 feet for the week. Sure enough, the percentage holed for par was substantially higher than those for birdie. For all of us!! :eek: (playing off 12, 8 and 1) . I think the least difference was about a 2:1 ratio, and this was over 7 rounds of golf, so not a once off. It was surprisingly consistant.

BoardsMember

GreeBo wrote: »

What club are you chipping with?
If you are blading them over the back of the green then it sounds like you are making a big swing with a SW or PW or something?
Have you tried a chip and run with a 8i or 7i or something?
Dont go airborne unless you have an obstacle to go over...

I use the appropriate club for the shot required, so use anything from a 7iron up. Unfortunately yipping is possible with all clubs

PRAF

BoardsMember wrote: »

Yeah, you'd think. But the yip is something slightly different, the arms spasm and the head/shoulders/whole body lifts up. I know I can beat them, I do hit good shots. Actually trying to take the hands out of the shot is my biggest challenge, when II do that chipping becomes easy again. I feel opening the shoulders when swinging back helps, or the feeling of swinging with shoulders/rocking them.

Sounds nasty! I may have had something similar with my pitching but maybe not as bad. About one in 5 are either duffed or bladed to some degree (and every once in a while I shank one). If you find a cure, let me know!

GreeBo

BoardsMember wrote: »

I use the appropriate club for the shot required, so use anything from a 7iron up. Unfortunately yipping is possible with all clubs

Fair enough, but I would argue that its not really possible to blade a chip and run through the green.
If you are doing this that would say to me that you are taking a bigger swing with a more lofted club, thus relying on the loft to control the distance. When you blade it all the force is going forward and none up into the air.
A putting motion with the appropriate club for the distance makes blading it off the green nigh on impossible.
Maybe something to think about?