Crap Apple Problems

PhotogTom

Planted a crab apple last year. This year it never looked healthy. One of two things - roots staying wet ( a bit of drainage problems ) or some sort of apple disease/fungus.
Symptoms are few leaves and those that are there are curling and turning dark. Any ideas/suggestions?

dardevle

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some photos would be helpful,


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ymurtagh

there is a plant invigourator and pesticide, cant think the name, it's not danger, can eat fruit next day, can be used on rose too, try NAD.ie they have it

PhotogTom

[I'll. take a photo tomorrow but not sure how to post it. Is there a guide anywhere? Quote=dardevle;78933964].......


some photos would be helpful,


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muckyhands

Usualy when plants are overwatered/ waterlogged the leaves droop (giving the impression they need more water :rolleyes:) and then start to yellow before rotting, whereas with under watering- after the drooping stage the leaves shrivel and go brown.

If its not down to waterlogged soil- Are the curling/ dark leaves remaining attached to the tree/ not falling off it?

If so Fireblight could be the problem.

Pic would defo help.

Below the box you type a post in is Additional Options- go to Manage Attachments- click Browse- a new box comes up, choose your photo from wherever it is (my document/ pictures/ removable disc or wherever...) then click Upload-

Job done

PhotogTom

First - I do apologize for the title of the thread - I didn't mean to call it what I did - just a typo which probably does suit.

I believe I've managed the attachment. Let me know what you think.

PhotogTom

Any suggestions?

dardevle

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Hi Tom
you seem to suggest that the roots are waterlogged - if this is the case then i would say it is the 'root' of the problem....an apple tree of any type will not tolerate wet feet and will usually die a slow death, while not the ideal time to suggest moving a tree, in this case i would - either to a more suitable location or by raising it up out of the wet,

there may be other problems such as infection but these will be secondary if the tree is waterlogged,



the photo you have supplied does not seem to be showing the classic fireblight symptoms ...fire blight is so called because it looks like the tree has been set on fire,scorched and blackened...nasty disease so hope not.



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PhotogTom

Someone said that waterlogged would look wilted. I don't see that but rather curled leaves, few leaves and spots on leaves.
I guess if it doesn't look better by end of the summer I'll move it this fall. Make sense?

Hi Tom
you seem to suggest that the roots are waterlogged - if this is the case then i would say it is the 'root' of the problem....an apple tree of any type will not tolerate wet feet and will usually die a slow death, while not the ideal time to suggest moving a tree, in this case i would - either to a more suitable location or by raising it up out of the wet,

there may be other problems such as infection but these will be secondary if the tree is waterlogged,



the photo you have supplied does not seem to be showing the classic fireblight symptoms ...fire blight is so called because it looks like the tree has been set on fire,scorched and blackened...nasty disease so hope not.



.....[/Quote]

muckyhands

Glad you got the photo up.

Brown spots and reddened curled leaves plus possible waterlogging.

Did you get any fruit last year? If so, were there any dark 'scabby' looking areas on them or anything else worth noting?

From the pic the leaves look reddened/ distorted, are there any aphids on it?

Also, what is more affected- old leaves or young leaves and do the leaves curl up, then turn reddish?

PhotogTom

Only planted last year - no fruit. We've had aphids before in the garden. I'll check that.


[uote=muckyhands;78971720]Brown spots andreddened curled leaves plus possible waterlogging.

Did you get any fruit last year? If so, were there any dark 'scabby' looking areas on them or anything else worth noting?

From the pic the leaves look reddened/ distorted, are there any aphids on it?

Also, what is more affected- old leaves or young leaves?[/Quote]

muckyhands

PhotogTom wrote: »

Only planted last year - no fruit. We've had aphids before in the garden. I'll check that.


[uote=muckyhands;78971720]Brown spots andreddened curled leaves plus possible waterlogging.

Did you get any fruit last year? If so, were there any dark 'scabby' looking areas on them or anything else worth noting?

From the pic the leaves look reddened/ distorted, are there any aphids on it?

Also, what is more affected- old leaves or young leaves?

[/QUOTE]

Maybe get a curled up leaf- uncurl it and see is there anything inside there, could be realy tiny and difficult to see.

Keep us posted.

PhotogTom

Thx will do. I'll check in the morning.

muckyhands wrote: »

PhotogTom wrote: »

Only planted last year - no fruit. We've had aphids before in the garden. I'll check that.


[uote=muckyhands;78971720]Brown spots andreddened curled leaves plus possible waterlogging.

Did you get any fruit last year? If so, were there any dark 'scabby' looking areas on them or anything else worth noting?

From the pic the leaves look reddened/ distorted, are there any aphids on it?

Also, what is more affected- old leaves or young leaves?

Maybe get a curled up leaf- uncurl it and see is there anything inside there, could be realy tiny and difficult to see.

Keep us posted. [/Quote]

Oldtree

It looks like aphid damage but there are no aphids in the picture and leaves do not appear to have honeydew all over them, no sooty moulds either.

Waterlogging affects the tree by the tree shutting down its root function to protect itself but the tree continues to transpire through the leaves, thus dries itself out, especially if windy conditions. The leaves would then dry up and blow away whereas they appear to be persisting here, apart from one leaf by the looks of it.

Fireblight may have more damage to bark and dead leaves, etc.

The older leaves look correctly formed but damaged. Did the older leaves look like the young leaves when they came out?

Apple trees were very badly damaged last year when there was windy storms that took salt inland up to 70 miles in places, trees in the open were badly damaged. How far are you from the sea? A reddish tinge can be a symptom of this.

Was there any ariel spraying lately, are you near forestry or have you sprayed recently?

muckyhands

Oldtree wrote: »

It looks like aphid damage but there are no aphids in the picture and leaves do not appear to have honeydew all over them, no sooty moulds either.

Waterlogging affects the tree by the tree shutting down its root function to protect itself but the tree continues to transpire through the leaves, thus dries itself out, especially if windy conditions. The leaves would then dry up and blow away whereas they appear to be persisting here, apart from one leaf by the looks of it.

Fireblight may have more damage to bark and dead leaves, etc.

The older leaves look correctly formed but damaged. Did the older leaves look like the young leaves when they came out?

Apple trees were very badly damaged last year when there was windy storms that took salt inland up to 70 miles in places, trees in the open were badly damaged. How far are you from the sea? A reddish tinge can be a symptom of this.

Was there any ariel spraying lately, are you near forestry or have you sprayed recently?

Aphids can do the damage, then up and leave like they were never there- one in particular comes to mind, and then I wonder if this could be a case of leaf midge, uncommon on apples though they can be affected. The reddened colour of the leaves, younger leaves appearing most affected/curled up from pic, but brown spots on leaves suggest scab, hmm.

Oldtree

Its a tricky one???

The leaves look a bit shiny too and dry, but if it had been aphids there would be honeydue all over the place and sooty moulds to follow. I have had an attack for the last few years on a bird cherry by aphids and the above photos dont tick all the boxes, but the affected new growth looks like it too.

and only bit scab here and there.

maby its been a combination attack???
2

PhotogTom

I've looked very closely and no sign of active aphids. In general, very few leaves. They seem to come in OK and then turn dry and curled - almost burnt. No problems on the bark. Intact leaves have brown spots. No sign of aphids like honeydew, etc. I have an eating apple in a remote part of the garden that shows these same symptoms. Other apples trees in an exposed part of the garden - ie lots of light and breeze - don't show any signs of any problems. I guess I'll spray for aphids (as its an ornamental and so can't hurt) and see if the problem clears up.

macraignil

Apple Scab?
If you have an apple tree in your garden that already shows the same symptoms it is very likely your new tree will be able to pick up the same disease. I have read that care must be taken when planting apples if you already have some growing.

I looked on the internet at some images of apple disease and your picture looks to be very similar to apple scab (Venturia inaequalis). This disease is common in areas with wet spring weather as we have in Ireland and I reckon some of the apple trees I have planted have been affected by it as well. Roses and pear trees can also be affected.

Infection is assisted when leaves stay wet so your more exposed trees would have some protection by surfaces being dried out faster by the wind. The affected leaves turn yellow and fall off the tree so this might explain why your tree has fewer leaves than it should. The spores of the fungus are said to be released from the diseased leaves so collecting and disposing of these in a way that will kill the infection could help. I have also heard that many trees take a couple of years to fully establish themselves on new ground and read that some varieties of apple are resistant to the disease.

muckyhands

I think it could have scab given the brown spots, but theres something else too-

The leaves have turned a reddish/ purplish colour (judging from the pic)- which can happen with rosy leaf curling aphid or leaf midge attacks.

Oldtree

PhotogTom wrote: »

I've looked very closely and no sign of active aphids. In general, very few leaves. They seem to come in OK and then turn dry and curled - almost burnt. No problems on the bark. Intact leaves have brown spots. No sign of aphids like honeydew, etc. I have an eating apple in a remote part of the garden that shows these same symptoms. Other apples trees in an exposed part of the garden - ie lots of light and breeze - don't show any signs of any problems. I guess I'll spray for aphids (as its an ornamental and so can't hurt) and see if the problem clears up.

No point in spraying unless the aphids are there and active, waste of spray otherwise.

Did you prune all the trees togeather? Did you steralize your scatures between trees? Might be prudent thing to do if there is a disease present.