Partner in crisis

LegacyUser

Hi,

this may be something more for teh psychology thread but i couldn't post there without registering so here I am.

What do you do if you think your partner is loosing it? Not in a violent or physically dangerous way but I really fear for my partner's mental welbeing. She is away from her family adn feels alone and things are going very badly between us and she is unwell(physically) with a difficult to diagnose illness.

To my unprofessional eyes she is suffering from severe depression, which may also be the cause of her illness but not necessarily, or bipolar disorder. She will not entertain the thought of either other than say she is depressed because of her circumstances, so the solution is to move (which we are saving to do but obviously it is taking a lot longer than we'd hoped because of wages etc).

So I can't force her to see a psychologist even though I think it would do her good. Nor can I afford to, as it goes. What do i do? This has been going on for a long time to a lesser degree. She is very negative generally and looks at situations, and often herself, in a very negative light. But I try to support her and be sympathetic, but I'm not a doctor and am unable to give her the support she needs.

I really don't know what to do.

Mr Bump

IMHO, I would get her to agree to go to a doctor, if not sign her in for depression, you have to be crual to be kind, as you said you are not a doctor, either am i, so the only answer is a doctor and take it from there, she will not thank you for it, but it might save everything long term and at least you know or will start to get a feel for whats wrong from a person who deals with this kind of problems, good luck

Dontknowwhatotdo wrote: »

Hi,

this may be something more for teh psychology thread but i couldn't post there without registering so here I am.

What do you do if you think your partner is loosing it? Not in a violent or physically dangerous way but I really fear for my partner's mental welbeing. She is away from her family adn feels alone and things are going very badly between us and she is unwell(physically) with a difficult to diagnose illness.

To my unprofessional eyes she is suffering from severe depression, which may also be the cause of her illness but not necessarily, or bipolar disorder. She will not entertain the thought of either other than say she is depressed because of her circumstances, so the solution is to move (which we are saving to do but obviously it is taking a lot longer than we'd hoped because of wages etc).

So I can't force her to see a psychologist even though I think it would do her good. Nor can I afford to, as it goes. What do i do? This has been going on for a long time to a lesser degree. She is very negative generally and looks at situations, and often herself, in a very negative light. But I try to support her and be sympathetic, but I'm not a doctor and am unable to give her the support she needs.

I really don't know what to do.

LegacyUser

Mr Bump wrote: »

IMHO, I would get her to agree to go to a doctor, if not sign her in for depression, you have to be crual to be kind, as you said you are not a doctor, either am i, so the only answer is a doctor and take it from there, she will not thank you for it, but it might save everything long term and at least you know or will start to get a feel for whats wrong from a person who deals with this kind of problems, good luck

Thanks Mr Bump. We talked last night.

I came home and she was in a state, crying, hyperventalating, and then holding her chest as if she were having a mild heart attack . Nothing sparked it in that moment, rather I think she was working herself up in her head. And that is the crux of the problem; a situation occurs and it may be benign or mildly annoying but she seems to escalate things for the worse in her head and piles on the stress.

So we talked last night, back and forth. Things are bad between us. But one thing I did say was that I wanted her to see someone. I told her what my impression was, and while she didn't disagree, she didn't agree to anything eaither. I didn't push it because I hope she will reflect on it, but admitedly I am not hopeful.

So it may come to a point, and it wouldn't be long is my guess, where she has refused to tackle this issue, so I would be left with the option of signing her in for depression.

But what is that? I've never heard of that, so how would I go about it? First step her (our) gp? How would it work?

And yes, it would be very very scarey, not just for our relationship but I would be afraid for the impact on our child. That doesn't mean I wouldn't do it if neccessary, just that this is all very scarey.

Beruthiel

Dontknowwhatotdo wrote: »

so I would be left with the option of signing her in for depression.

OP
You have to be related to someone before you can have them committed to a psychiatric hospital. Info here.

That is a last resort imo.

Firstly, tell her how worried you are for her health. That you care and want to help. Try to get her to see a doctor.

If she still refuses, go see your family doctor and ask them to help you. Perhaps they will come to your home and talk to your partner there.

Mr Bump

She is your wife, you can call the GP to the home, and with his assessment and support she can be signed in, (my friend had this done last year as his wife was so depressed it was not even good for the children to see the changes daily), as far as I know this is all the support you need to make it happen, you do not need her consent to call the doctor for her, and when he arrives he will be able to put a very basic assessment on her reaction / behaviour to his presence, at that stage if he agrees that it is needed and she is a danger to herself then she can be signed in by you and the doctor, she will not like you for it, but if it helps her then it’s worth it to you and the children,
Go see your GP and get the finer detail on how it can be done 100% correctly,
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Beruthiel wrote: »

OP
You have to be related to someone before you can have them committed to a psychiatric hospital. Info here.

That is a last resort imo.

Firstly, tell her how worried you are for her health. That you care and want to help. Try to get her to see a doctor.

If she still refuses, go see your family doctor and ask them to help you. Perhaps they will come to your home and talk to your partner there.

LegacyUser

Beruthiel and Mr Bump,

Thank you both for your help and advice.

Believe me this would be the last resort and I am not ready to do this yet. Hopefully I won't have to either, but it is good to know I have an option other than leaving her if things go on.

Last night was very distressing. She has settled down but the issue remains. Hopefuly she will see someone of her own accord. If she is not willing then possibly it wouldn't do any good either?

It is a very unhappy situation.

Thanks,
Dontknowwhatotdo

Fluorescence

OP, why not find a checklist of symptoms of Depression or Anxiety (as examples), print them off and show them to her. It might give her the motivation to get an initial assessment from a medical professional. For this, you should be as supportive as you can - make it clear you don't judge her for anything that may or may not be wrong with her. You just want to help her to be happy. Ask her if she'd like you to go with her to any appointments, or even offer to make that first step for her and arrange the thing. Reassure her that she is under no obligation to return if she doesn't like the therapist.

Mental illness is a very scary thing, but it has to be tackled because it doesn't go away on its own if you ignore it. Don't try to have her committed unless every other avenue has been exhausted because it's a very serious step.

Lastly, there are counselors in Dublin who offer their services for free or for however much you can afford to pay. People are starting to wake up and be serious about tackling mental illness - not being able to afford care is no longer the huge barrier it once was. Look into it a little.

Best of luck.

Mr Bump

Your welcome anytime, i find this topic very close to my heart, i really wish you and you good wife all my best wishes, Do take some professional advise as peoples health in this area can hit rock bottom very fast (this was the case with my very close long term friend), so be in top form supporting her,
I will do something i have not do in a long time, say a prayer for both of you asking for health and happiness
Also Beruthiel / Fluorescence has also provided you with very sound advice, well done !!!

Dontknowwhatotdo wrote: »

Beruthiel and Mr Bump,

Thank you both for your help and advice.

Believe me this would be the last resort and I am not ready to do this yet. Hopefully I won't have to either, but it is good to know I have an option other than leaving her if things go on.

Last night was very distressing. She has settled down but the issue remains. Hopefuly she will see someone of her own accord. If she is not willing then possibly it wouldn't do any good either?

It is a very unhappy situation.

Thanks,
Dontknowwhatotdo

LegacyUser

Thanks Fluorescence,

It's complicated. She knows, I think, that she is depressed, but blames it where we live (she is American). She wants to go home and we are even working on that but saving enough money to move is hard. So she says, dealing with the depression is a waste of time unless we move. But like I say, we are trying to save.

I really don't want to have her committed but I almost wish a judge could order her to go to counseling or therapy.

Another problem is that no matter what I say, she applies an alterior motive to it. She says I'm trying to blame her for all our problems, or I'm only saying this because I want/mean that.

We were getting on great a couple of weeks ago. Then things started to cool down and now the're awful She said I did something that put her off me. She can't remember what. But I have no idea what.

I feel like, what chance do I have? I feel like she goes out of her way to take the worst possible meaning out of anything I (or someone else) say. And she holds on to that. It's like she's determined to be angry or feel hard done by. It's awful and I don't see a way out unless she can be helped with this very negative thought pattern. But I don't know if she can be helped.

I would be happy to go with her, or drive her there or arrange it for her or anything like that that would help. I didn't know there were free counseling services for mental health issues so I will look into that.

Thanks again. PI really is a great place.

LegacyUser

Mr Bump wrote: »

Your welcome anytime, i find this topic very close to my heart, i really wish you and you good wife all my best wishes, Do take some professional advise as peoples health in this area can hit rock bottom very fast (this was the case with my very close long term friend), so be in top form supporting her,
I will do something i have not do in a long time, say a prayer for both of you asking for health and happiness
Also Beruthiel / Fluorescence has also provided you with very sound advice, well done !!!

Thanks Mr Bump. I appreciate that although i don't pray myself.

Monkey61

Before anyone loses the run of themselves with all the talk of having the OPs girlfriend sectioned, I'd just like to give a few thoughts.

Firstly, from what you have told us OP, there isn't a chance in hell that a team of professionals are going to swoop into your home and take her againist her will to a mental health facility! Not to give medical advice of any kind obviously, but it takes a lot more than someone being depressed for them to be involuntarily admitted somewhere (as the link Beruthiel gives will explain!)

She doesn't sound happy, but really it is entirely up to her how she chooses to deal with it. All you, as her partner can do, is support her and encourage her to seek help. If she is completely unwilling to do so for the sake of your family, then it is up to you to decide whether you want to continue in the relationship.

Depression is a bloody awful thing, but the sufferer has to want help before it can be given. Perhaps her circumstances are awful, perhaps she is unhappy in the relationship, perhaps any number of situational things have triggered other symptoms. As you have described it, things aren't great between you anyway, which isn't going to help matters.

Ultimatums aren't a great thing, but if your relationship is suffering, if you are suffering, then there may come a point where you have to say (in so many words) "seek help or we cannot carry on together." It could be done in a constructive enough way to give her the push that she needs. If she is still unwilling, well then you will have to decide whether you want to pursue the relationship or not.

LegacyUser

So we talked last night, back and forth. Things are bad between us. But one thing I did say was that I wanted her to see someone. I told her what my impression was, and while she didn't disagree, she didn't agree to anything eaither. I didn't push it because I hope she will reflect on it, but admitedly I am not hopeful.

But I try to support her and be sympathetic, but I'm not a doctor and am unable to give her the support she needs.

OP "you talked to her", in what context?
by that I mean have you ever actually sat down when she was down or whatever and let her talk openly about her feelings, let her talk about what's going on inside her head? really listen to her.

I know you say you're sympathetic and forgive me if i'm wrong but the general sense I get from your posts is that you almost just tell her everything will be grand, kind of a positive thinking vibe? and then encourage her to see a councellor.

As someone who suffers with depression, (and i can only speak for myself here) for me that is the least helpful thing anyone could do. When I'm down, people can throw all the positive thinking/motivational/encouragement they want at me, but when i'm in that head space it's quite honestly so so patronising. You're not thinking logically, depression is not rational, it all seems like empty words. I'd rather someone just listened to me and gave me a cuddle just be there for me. I just think treating her like she's "ill" and needs to see a doctor is not particularly helpful to her.

What do you do if you think your partner is loosing it

Even how you describe depression is quite derogatory tbh. I suffer from depression and i can assure you i am not "losing it".

I came home and she was in a state, crying, hyperventalating, and then holding her chest as if she were having a mild heart attack

I've often been in this state, but it passes eventually, it's not nice to witness, but honestly it's just run of the mill depression tbh, All this talk of getting her sectioned is bizzare to me as I can't see anything in your posts with regards to her behaviour which would warrent it?

No of course you are not qualified to help her, but if she has depression it's part of her life, and always will be, I personally don't think it's something you're ever "cured" of as such, just something you learn to deal/live with. Maybe I'm completely wrong but you're post comes across as "go to the doctor he'll help you deal with that, I don't want to try and understand". Maybe that's how your partner feels too?

If you see a future with this woman and she does have depression then it will always be a part of hers and your life, Yes she absolutely should see a councellor, but it's something like it or not you're going to have to try and understand and talk about and deal with together too.

I honestly hope i haven't come across too harsh OP, but just thought maybe my outside perspective as as someone who can relate to your OH might shed some light on stuff for you,

All the best.

LegacyUser

Monkey61 wrote: »

Before anyone loses the run of themselves with all the talk of having the OPs girlfriend sectioned, I'd just like to give a few thoughts.

Firstly, from what you have told us OP, there isn't a chance in hell that a team of professionals are going to swoop into your home and take her againist her will to a mental health facility! Not to give medical advice of any kind obviously, but it takes a lot more than someone being depressed for them to be involuntarily admitted somewhere (as the link Beruthiel gives will explain!)

She doesn't sound happy, but really it is entirely up to her how she chooses to deal with it. All you, as her partner can do, is support her and encourage her to seek help. If she is completely unwilling to do so for the sake of your family, then it is up to you to decide whether you want to continue in the relationship.

Depression is a bloody awful thing, but the sufferer has to want help before it can be given. Perhaps her circumstances are awful, perhaps she is unhappy in the relationship, perhaps any number of situational things have triggered other symptoms. As you have described it, things aren't great between you anyway, which isn't going to help matters.

Ultimatums aren't a great thing, but if your relationship is suffering, if you are suffering, then there may come a point where you have to say (in so many words) "seek help or we cannot carry on together." It could be done in a constructive enough way to give her the push that she needs. If she is still unwilling, well then you will have to decide whether you want to pursue the relationship or not.

Hi Monkey,

The last thing I want to do is get her sectioned. I really want her to see a psychiatrist or counselor as I think that talking to a professionally trained, neutral person in a safe environment will help a lot in dealing with all the issues that are leading to or exacerbating her depression.

You're right that she is unhappy. There are things we can do about some of the causes of her unhappiness, like moving back to the US, when we've saved enough. But there are other situations where she seems to only focus on the negative, but also to exagerate the negative also. Or even completely misread a situation so an otherwise benign comment is taken offense at or someone's actions are judged as mean or offensive, where there was clearly (to me) no intention to cause offense or harm or anything. I'm not talking about me here, but other people.

Sometimes I find her extremes hard to deal with, sometimes she seems to have a level of extreme intolerence towards people or situations that don't measure up to her standards and I feel desperate and hopeless.

Now maybe I sound depressed or in need of help. But I have sought counselling and it has helped me and I think it would help her too. I'd be happy to see someone again myself in tandem if that was what she wanted.

The situation is more complicated because we have a child together so I am worried about the affect on her, now and as she grows up.

Like you say, things aren't great between us, at times they are but at other times, like now, they are very bad. Of course there are various issues on both sides and our maritial problems are not all to do with this. But I do think her negative thought process is really detrimental and it is really difficult to talk through things if I am continually being mis interpreted and malaigned in her mind.

I don't want to issue an ultimatum, and I don't want to separate (especially for our child's sake) and I don't want her committed, but I am just in a terrible situation and feel like I am fighting for our relationship mostly on my own.

LegacyUser

beenthereeqe wrote: »

OP "you talked to her", in what context?
by that I mean have you ever actually sat down when she was down or whatever and let her talk openly about her feelings, let her talk about what's going on inside her head? really listen to her.

Hi Beenthereeqe,

I can't multi quote so I'll reply best I can. I had answered this just now and then somehow deleted it so apologies if this is a bit brief.

Sometimes I run out of patience. I feel overwhelmed and I have snapped on a number (2 or 3) occasions. But in all honesty I can say I do listen like you describe, lots and lots of times. Sometimes we kind of work together and sometimes I only listen, which is a bit hard for me and it doesn't come naturally. I am trying though and I am getting better at it. So I definately do let he talk about her feelings, and what's going on inside her head. I don't know if it's easy for her to always express what's going on inside her head though, if that makes sense. I think she may hold back some stuff, and that may be down to me being a dick on occasions, or saying something in anger which made her feel vunerable about expressing her most intimate feelings.


beenthereeqe: "I know you say you're sympathetic and forgive me if i'm wrong but the general sense I get from your posts is that you almost just tell her everything will be grand, kind of a positive thinking vibe? and then encourage her to see a councellor."

I don't think that's the case. I think some situations need sticking with for a while and perservering before throwing in the towel. I don't really think, ah sure it'll be grand, but sometimes you've got to keep going with something you don't like for other reasons, like a bad job for money for example. I also think that how you approach things, ie with a posative attitude or a negative atttitude can have a big influence on how things will turn out. So much of what is around us in our own personal world is about perception. We have a choice about that and while I don't think we should all be skipping around the place saying everything's great when it's not. I also think it's self destructive repeat how bad things are like some kind of mantra. It's a balance, and I feel that in my wife's case, her perspective isn't balanced. It is extremely over negative.
I try to be supportive but she has told me I am not supportive enough. And I mean it that I have really tried, and continue to try, but I am now also aware that I cannot do this on my own. I feel like her need for support is never ending and that we are not getting anywhere or she is not getting anywhere. I think a professional therapist of counsellor would be able to help her a lot. I also think that by the psychologist/therapist/counsellor's being a completely neutral person, specifically no tme, would be good as well as they could off a neutral perspective.


beenthereeqe: "As someone who suffers with depression, (and i can only speak for myself here) for me that is the least helpful thing anyone could do. When I'm down, people can throw all the positive thinking/motivational/encouragement they want at me, but when i'm in that head space it's quite honestly so so patronising. You're not thinking logically, depression is not rational, it all seems like empty words. I'd rather someone just listened to me and gave me a cuddle just be there for me."

I really appreciate your insight here and when I read this it clicked with me straight away as something that makes total sense but that I was somehow missing. I find it hard to just listen and not offer advice or try to "fix" things. I try and save that for a time when she asks for it and try to just be supportive rather than fix things.
But



beenthereeqe: " I just think treating her like she's "ill" and needs to see a doctor is not particularly helpful to her."

It's not so simple and it sounds like you think I can't be bothered with what's upsetting her so just want to send her to the doctor. You may not mean it like that and it's certainly not the case, but depression is an illness and there are steps that can be taken to help. I think talking to a good psychologist could help a lot.


beenthereeqe: "Even how you describe depression is quite derogatory tbh. I suffer from depression and i can assure you i am not "losing it". "

I don't mean it in a derogatory way but see how it sounds. I am not very literate in the correct terminology to be used but what I meant was that she was loosing perspective and self control. She was misinterpreting everything, making situations worse, getting angry, shouting, crying. She was paranoid, thinking that everyone hated her, was out to get her. This was all infront of our child. It wasn't like an extreme sadness, it was anger and paranoia adn extreme extreme defensiveness.



beenthereeqe: "I've often been in this state, but it passes eventually, it's not nice to witness, but honestly it's just run of the mill depression tbh, All this talk of getting her sectioned is bizzare to me as I can't see anything in your posts with regards to her behaviour which would warrent it? "

It seems extreme to me as there was no outside trigger for this but I am inexperienced in this kind of thing. Having said that, I don't want to section her. I want her to see a counsellor or psychologist, someone who can help her deal with these feelings and perceptions.

You are wrong in your impression of me as being someone who doesn't want to understand. I do and I try but I am ill equipted to deal with this so constantly and need help doing so. I'm not necesasarily looking for a cure but a way to live with this. If she is aware she of destructive thinking patterns then maybe she can off set them before they take hold and spiral out of control.

To be honest you did seem a bit harsh to me, and you don't know me, but i really do appreciate your input and your honesty. You have helped open me up to how it feels for her and made me think about how some of my responses may be adding to the situation rather than helping (both her and myself).

Thanks.

LegacyUser

Me again OP, sorry reread my post and i prob did come across a little harsh.
but i just had to respond to this as it really jumped out at me:

I don't think that's the case. I think some situations need sticking with for a while and perservering before throwing in the towel. I don't really think, ah sure it'll be grand, but sometimes you've got to keep going with something you don't like for other reasons, like a bad job for money for example. I also think that how you approach things, ie with a posative attitude or a negative atttitude can have a big influence on how things will turn out. So much of what is around us in our own personal world is about perception. We have a choice about that and while I don't think we should all be skipping around the place saying everything's great when it's not. I also think it's self destructive repeat how bad things are like some kind of mantra.

OP depression takes away that choice. You don't choose to "have a negative attitude" with depression. It's incredibly hard to explain but while you may view your OHs perspective as her deliberately focusing on the negative, for her those negatives are absolutely real,, it's not that you chose to focus on them, it's that they are all you can see.
There was a really good thread in After Hours called lets laugh at people with depression or something similar, which I won't link to as i'm not sure it's allowed but you really should give it a read, it gives a great insight into how people experience depression.

It's a balance, and I feel that in my wife's case, her perspective isn't balanced. It is extremely over negative.

You are absolutely right. But that is what depression is (Imho), an inability to balance your perspective, and that is what my councellor helped me with and I am in a much better place now, but even still it doesn't come naturally. Your wife isn't going to get through this without professional help, but she has to come to that decision herself, it's a very scary place when you first admit to yourself that you are depressed, she may just need time, it's a huge step to make, once you make it you realise you should have done it sooner but it is so incredibly daunting.

In saying all that OP I really feel for you, it must be incredibly difficult to live with someone who is depressed, I honestly don't know how my own family put up with me. And I totally understand your concerns about your child, as my own mum had depression when I was growing and it really really warped my own outlook on life. There does come a point though if your OH chooses to not seek help (because that is a choice) where you may have to decide if the relationship is too unhealthy to survive. While I sympathise with your wife and I do think maybe a bit of research into depression and what it feels like to her may really help you cope and understand, it's a 2 way street and your OH has to do her part to work at the relationship too.

Hope it all works out OP

LegacyUser

beenthereeqe wrote: »

OP depression takes away that choice. You don't choose to "have a negative attitude" with depression. It's incredibly hard to explain but while you may view your OHs perspective as her deliberately focusing on the negative, for her those negatives are absolutely real,, it's not that you chose to focus on them, it's that they are all you can see.
There was a really good thread in After Hours called lets laugh at people with depression or something similar, which I won't link to as i'm not sure it's allowed but you really should give it a read, it gives a great insight into how people experience depression.

Hi Beenthereeqe,

That all makes sense and once again something that maybe I was not considering. I really appreciate your perspective as it helps me understand my wife's perspective and the context of her "attitudes". I will have a look for that thread in after hours too.
Hopefully we, my wife and I, can work through it together. Things are calmer again now and will hopefulyl continue like that. When is a good time to suggest she see someone? I don't want to ignore it until the next time as that might cost us too much (relationshipwise), but I don't want to make her defensive either when she seems calmer either.
Either way, thanks for your insight and words of support.

MissDepressed

Hi Op,

Just from my experience-I have suffered with depression for about 10 years now and what your wife is feeling is "normal" if you want to put it like that, for somebody suffering with this illness. I have no doubt that it must be very hard to understand for people who arent in that situation but believe me when I say it that what she is feeling is 100% the truth in her head, no matter how irrational it sounds. Those thoughts are painfully difficult to fight off and I urge you to make her go and see a psychiatrist or a psychologist or both even as they have different methods of teaching how to do that.
It is so so difficult to make that first step and actually reveal these horrible thoughts to a professional. I remember thinking I was completely insane and the worst thing you can do is imply that she needs to be sectioned! But it does get easier..because believe it or not..they have seen it all and are not one bit suprised with feelings like that. Could i suggest that you offer to bring her there and go in with her if she wants or just sit outside either so she knows you are there? I know it will be impossible for her to see now but she will have such a weight lifted after that first appointment.
One more thing-i understand this may be difficult for you but doing active things like this and finding more info on it is really caring of you-unfortunately my partner was at the stage where you are now a while back and he did snap and couldnt handle it which devestated me even more..please please remember no matter how hard she tries to push you away, she needs you right now more than ever..not even to talk..just be there..give her a hug or hold her hand..thats it, she need to know that you love her and that she is not fighting this on her own..That is the toughest part I found when dealing with my depression.
Hope this helps and best of luck x