Starting back after injury - Need help with a routine

funkey_monkey

Hi,

Been off exercising for a few months now due to injury and want to get back into the swing of things.

My goal is to put on a couple of kg's of lean muscle. I'm currently at my heaviest (66kg @ 5'6) - quite lean - and would like to keep it that way if possible.

I appreciate that there is a good chance that I'll go a bit soft when putting on this amount of muscle - can this be avoided, or is it just the genetically lucky that get away with this?

I'm looking to get a 3 or 4 day programme to add lean muscle - can someone please point me to some routines which I could use? I don't really frequent the online fitness sites so I'm a bit lost as to where to start. I don't want to end up with an unbalanced routine.

I look at routines like this: (http://www.illpumpyouup.com/articles/sample-workout-routine.htm) and it seems too many exercises and I know it would take ages in my busy gym.

I was thinking of this one: http://bodybuilding.about.com/od/weighttrainingprinciples/a/10setsof10reps.htm. Although again, I've read that just 3 - 5 reps at heavy weight would be better.

It's all really confusing so I would appreciate some help - google returns loads of stuff that I just can't get my head around.


Thanks.

Mellor

funkey_monkey wrote: »

I look at routines like this: (http://www.illpumpyouup.com/articles/sample-workout-routine.htm) and it seems too many exercises and I know it would take ages in my busy gym.

I was thinking of this one: http://bodybuilding.about.com/od/weighttrainingprinciples/a/10setsof10reps.htm. Although again, I've read that just 3 - 5 reps at heavy weight would be better.

Better by what measure.
Low reps a higher weight is typical of strength programs. BillStarr, Starting Strength, Stronglifts, Madcow, Texas Method, WS4SB all use 5x5, heavy triples, doubles, singles etc for the primary exercises.
Bodybuilding routines are typically higher reps ones, like 10x10 above, German volume training follows the same set/rep scheme.

Which you choose is up to you, your goals and how you'd rather train.

funkey_monkey

Thanks for the reply Mellor. Yes, I'm looking for a bodybuilding routine. I'll take a more detailed look at 10x10 and GVT.

Any other suggestions welcome!

Thanks.

funkey_monkey

Mellor wrote: »

Better by what measure.
Bodybuilding routines are typically higher reps ones, like 10x10 above, German volume training follows the same set/rep scheme.

I was told that these type of routines would not suit my stature as I'm quite a hardgainer and overdoing the exercises would not help me gain any muscle.

Confused

Mellor

Who told you that you are a hardgainer, how did they (or you) come to that conclusion.
I'm not saying hardgainers don't exist, but a lot of people who claim to be hardgainers are simply not eating enough.

funkey_monkey

Mellor wrote: »

Who told you that you are a hardgainer, how did they (or you) come to that conclusion.
I'm not saying hardgainers don't exist, but a lot of people who claim to be hardgainers are simply not eating enough.

I took this test and scored 2.58 which put me between Ecto & Meso. I pondered over some answers which would have probably put be much closer to ecto:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/becker3.htm

My current diet was 10% Fat, 70% Carbs & 20% Protein totally approx 2,400 calories.

For maintenance, I've calculated this to be 2,600 calories per day (although it does seem to vary from 2,200 calories to 2,600 calories depending on thew website/calculator).

I'm looking to alter this to 50% carbs, 30% protein and 20% fats and a calorie consumption around 2,900 calories. Determined from:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/ectomorph_diet_bulking_plan.htm
This works out as approx 65g fats, 300g carbs and 218g protein.

However, there is a problem. I have a condition called phenylketonuria which means that my liver cannot metabolise phenylalanine into tyrosine. This results in me being on a low protein diet - approx 20g natural protein per day.

I can take supplements which increase my protein intake but not to the level of 218g - I can take supplements giving me an intake to the value of approx 140g per day. I'll need to see how close I can actually get to 218g.

However, that is diet and this is a worry for another day. I need to get a routine as it's been quite a few months now since I've had any structured time in the gym and I need to get backinto the swing of things.

What are the recommended (reliable) online resources for getting bodybuilding routines?

Brian?

funkey_monkey wrote: »

I took this test and scored 2.58 which put me between Ecto & Meso. I pondered over some answers which would have probably put be much closer to ecto:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/becker3.htm

Ignore this. Completely.

You are not a hard gainer, you are not eating properly:

My current diet was 10% Fat, 70% Carbs & 20% Protein totally approx 2,400 calories.

See, .

For maintenance, I've calculated this to be 2,600 calories per day (although it does seem to vary from 2,200 calories to 2,600 calories depending on thew website/calculator).

I'm looking to alter this to 50% carbs, 30% protein and 20% fats and a calorie consumption around 2,900 calories. Determined from:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/ectomorph_diet_bulking_plan.htm
This works out as approx 65g fats, 300g carbs and 218g protein.

That's better, but I would go with higher protein and fats and less carbs. That is unless you have some condition where you can't, which you have.

However, there is a problem. I have a condition called phenylketonuria which means that my liver cannot metabolise phenylalanine into tyrosine. This results in me being on a low protein diet - approx 20g natural protein per day.

I can take supplements which increase my protein intake but not to the level of 218g - I can take supplements giving me an intake to the value of approx 140g per day. I'll need to see how close I can actually get to 218g.

Have you ran this by your doctor?

However, that is diet and this is a worry for another day. I need to get a routine as it's been quite a few months now since I've had any structured time in the gym and I need to get backinto the swing of things.

What are the recommended (reliable) online resources for getting bodybuilding routines?

I wouldn't bother with a body building split. Get strong. Do Bill Starr beginner 5x5, Starting Strength, Westside for Skinny Bastards or so on. Add in some arm work if you feel you need it, but not too much.

funkey_monkey

briankeating wrote: »

Ignore this. Completely.

That's better, but I would go with higher protein and fats and less carbs. That is unless you have some condition where you can't, which you have.

Have you ran this by your doctor?

Yes, previously - I was given some supplements which I can take to increase protein intake. However, I doubt they would be happy ingesting that amount of protein.

I wouldn't bother with a body building split. Get strong. Do Bill Starr beginner 5x5, Starting Strength, Westside for Skinny Bastards or so on. Add in some arm work if you feel you need it, but not too much.

Will that give me the results I'm looking for? I want to increase lean muscle mass.

Brian?

funkey_monkey wrote: »

Yes, previously - I was given some supplements which I can take to increase protein intake. However, I doubt they would be happy ingesting that amount of protein.

I'm afraid that any further diet advice might be contrary to medical advice so I'll refrain from commenting.

Will that give me the results I'm looking for? I want to increase lean muscle mass.

Absolutely, once you train hard enough and eat well enough.

Mellor

funkey_monkey wrote: »

Yes, previously - I was given some supplements which I can take to increase protein intake. However, I doubt they would be happy ingesting that amount of protein.

I imagine that they are special protein supplements that don't contain phenylalanine. There may be no issue with 200g protein as long as the phenylalanine isn't present, but you'd really want a doctor to give you the go ahead.

Here's some links of relevance.
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=4092843&page=1
http://www.pku.com/forum.php?iid=1&c=topic&op=index&cid=5&tid=1832

Take to a doctor, and then get your diet nailed down.

funkey_monkey

I already have. They give me a supplement called Phlexy-10 to take which is an amino acid supplement with phe removed and no vitamins or minerals - unlike my other supplement Lophlex which does contain these items.

Just rechecked some other online resources and they are quoting less than 165g protein per day.

Can someone please tell me if there is such thing as a reliable calculator, so that I know what I'm going to the doctor with? My dietition said that 140g should be enough for me, but she does not specialise in sports.

Brian?

A loose guideline is 2grams of protein per kg of bodyweight, at a minimum.

Edit: I did my maths backwards.

Mellor

funkey_monkey wrote: »

I already have. They give me a supplement called Phlexy-10 to take which is an amino acid supplement with phe removed and no vitamins or minerals - unlike my other supplement Lophlex which does contain these items.

I meant to him specifically about taking higher doses of your supplement, c.200g a a day.

Can someone please tell me if there is such thing as a reliable calculator, so that I know what I'm going to the doctor with? My dietition said that 140g should be enough for me, but she does not specialise in sports.

Your body will use different amounts on different days, so ther is no magic number. 120-200 would be the range I'd be aiming for @66kg

funkey_monkey

Mellor wrote: »

I meant to him specifically about taking higher doses of your supplement, c.200g a a day.

Nope. Doubt he would be happy. TBH - I'm more concerned about getting the balance between carbs, protein and fats sorted as my diet naturally tends to be high in carbs due to PKU.

Your body will use different amounts on different days, so ther is no magic number. 120-200 would be the range I'd be aiming for @66kg

Well, I'm currently floating around 140g per day.

Mellor

funkey_monkey wrote: »

Well, I'm currently floating around 140g per day.

Honestly, I think thats ok. It's 1g per lb bodyweight. Which is definitely the right ballpark. More might be a slight help sometimes, but as long as you get the cals in you should be ok.

Add in 100g fat and 350g Carbs and you are looking at 50% carbs, 20% protein, and 30% fat. Totaling 2800 cals.
not the worst place to start if you are consistant with your diet.

funkey_monkey

Mellor wrote: »

Honestly, I think thats ok. It's 1g per lb bodyweight. Which is definitely the right ballpark. More might be a slight help sometimes, but as long as you get the cals in you should be ok.

Add in 100g fat and 350g Carbs and you are looking at 50% carbs, 20% protein, and 30% fat. Totaling 2800 cals.
not the worst place to start if you are consistant with your diet.

Thanks - I'll see if I can get into that ball park.


Also, back onto routines now. I need a 4 day programme for muscle gain. Can someone please help me out? I screwed up last time with my routines and am having do to additional exercises to correct an imbalance in my front and rear delts. Hence I don't want to generate anything myself without getting it from a relaible source.

For fitness I intend to undertake some interval/Tabatas.

Ta.

funkey_monkey

What about one of the following options:

This one is well laid out:
http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/himl-4-maximum-muscle-building-workout-system.html

http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/bulldozer-training-4-day-mini-dozer-workout-split

http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/bulldozer-training-4-day-workout-split

http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/10-week-mass-building-program.html

funkey_monkey

Sorry, don't mean to be pushy, but can anyone on here critique these routines?

Currently I'm leaning towrds the first link...

funkey_monkey

I'm currently doing the first link above. However on the page for week 2 it states:

After the pre-exhaust sets, each exercise is performed using 4 second negatives. Perform all non pre-exhaust sets to failure. Once you reach failure, rest for 15 seconds, and then perform 3 drop sets at, or near failure, with no rest in between sets.

Excuse my ignorance but what does this mean I should be doing?

Brian?

funkey_monkey wrote: »

I'm currently doing the first link above. However on the page for week 2 it states:



Excuse my ignorance but what does this mean I should be doing?

I'm not being condescending but that workout is probably not for you if you're a beginner.

funkey_monkey

I'm not a beginner - just been off training for a few months due to injury.

Brian?

funkey_monkey wrote: »

I'm not a beginner - just been off training for a few months due to injury.

Sorry, I should have read back over the thread. Even still this programme, IMHO, is over complicated and probably not for a natural lifter.

Are you looking for an explanation of drop sets etc?

Mellor

"4 second negative to failure drop sets with 15 seconds rest"

Sounds like its trying its best to be awkward.

funkey_monkey

Okay, I'm going to try GVT. Any recommended routine out there?

funkey_monkey

Back again

From my other thread, I've updated my eating regime using the IF calculator. So, I'm looking at doing the beginner/advanced GVT routine outlined here:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/luis13.htm

Good choice?

funkey_monkey

Okay, so I've started into the GVT now for a forrtnight and must admit I'm only now getting to grips with it as the first week and this week was mainly trying to get a baseline from which I could manage 10x10.

I know they say 60% of your max, but I found that my strength varied greatly from exercise to another.

Presently, I'm doing bench press @ 55kg, should press @ 27.5kg. Triceps were a mess as I underestimated. Hence was skullcrushing @ 15kg (+ez bar weight). I'm doing rows @ 57.5kg and bicep curling @ 27.5kg too.

I'm not sure if these are great numbers. Only two weeks in so I'll reserve judgement. My weight is pretty static so I'll monitor it over the next month and see where I end up.

I've also been trying my best to keep in with an IF eating plan. So far I'm not too far off the target calories for the day - based on my estimates of portion sizes. The split seem to be 50% carbs, 25% fat and 25% protein.

funkey_monkey

Just done legs tonight:

Squats @ 70kg
Good Mornings @ 50kg
Calf Raises @ 110kg

+ 5kg for each next week