Do I needto replace my headset?

Squidgy Black

I bought a used Charge Plug the other day, and when I got it home, I did the usual set up and maintenance that I do with my bikes and what not.

The forks had a bit of play in them though, and the problem I have is that when you loosen the stem bolts and tighten the headset to the point that there's no play, it's way too tight for steering and the bike has a mind of it's own. But when you loosen it so the handlebars turn when the bike is leaned to the side, (as the park tools guide says),there's still a bit of play in the forks.

It's not really visible that the headset's moving though, you can just hear a small clink and movement when you hold the front brake and rock the bike, not when just moving the fork alone. The dust cover can be moved with a bit of a spin, and there's two spacers under the stem.

Any advice?

Squidgy Black

Anybody have any ideas? I'd rather not just bring it straight to the LBS as more than likely it'd be case of 'yeah yeah definitely that definitely needs to be replaced' and then a hefty bill.

torydiver

You sound like you have done all reasonable checks yourself,
Its hard to know without seeing it for myself,
But it sounds like there could be some wear in the bearings,
What milage is on the bike.....
Also regarding wear of headset bearings......What type of surface do you normally ride on,
Is it generally smooth tarmac or do you mix it with some rough surfaces,
This can significantly increase wear rate in headset bearings, especially on road bikes.......

Squidgy Black

torydiver wrote: »

You sound like you have done all reasonable checks yourself,
Its hard to know without seeing it for myself,
But it sounds like there could be some wear in the bearings,
What milage is on the bike.....
Also regarding wear of headset bearings......What type of surface do you normally ride on,
Is it generally smooth tarmac or do you mix it with some rough surfaces,
This can significantly increase wear rate in headset bearings, especially on road bikes.......

I bought it used so not totally sure what kind of mileage it's done. It's an '09 model that was used as a commuter apparently, it's fixed gear so I can't imagine it having more than 6000km under it's belt. From what I was told it was just tarmac, in to town and back.

Would it be cheaper to get the bearings replaced as opposed to a new headset?

It's an FSA aheadset if that helps.

torydiver

stetyrrell wrote: »

I bought it used so not totally sure what kind of mileage it's done. It's an '09 model that was used as a commuter apparently, it's fixed gear so I can't imagine it having more than 6000km under it's belt. From what I was told it was just tarmac, in to town and back.

Would it be cheaper to get the bearings replaced as opposed to a new headset?

It's an FSA aheadset if that helps.

I cant answer that one for you,
Might be worthwhile at this stage to bring it to a "reputable" bike shop and get their opinion of it,
Even if it was just bearing only replacement, it would require specialised tools such as a headset press to do the job properly and not damage the bearings.
Sorry i cant be of any more help,
Someone on here might be able to suggest a reputable shop in your area to have a look at it.......

ravendude

I'm wondering if you are engaging the headset bearings properly (maybe, maybe not)

The important thing is that the stem bolts (on the sides, that clamp the stemp to the steerer) are loose before you go at the headset top cap.
If the stem bolts are tight you'll never get it sorted.

So, I'd do it like this.

1/ loosen top cap
2/ Loosen stem bolts
3/ Tighten top cap a just enough to engage the headset bearings, - don't overdo it, it should be just enough to take out play
4/ Tighten the stem bolts bit by bit. So give one bolt one turn, then the other and back to the first bolt. ie. So that the bolts are evenly tightened.
5/ Maybe (not necessarily) give the top cap a very small nip

If you do the above and still get play, - the chances are the bearings are shot.

Squidgy Black

ravendude wrote: »

I'm wondering if you are engaging the headset bearings properly (maybe, maybe not)

The important thing is that the stem bolts (on the sides, that clamp the stemp to the steerer) are loose before you go at the headset top cap.
If the stem bolts are tight you'll never get it sorted.

So, I'd do it like this.

1/ loosen top cap
2/ Loosen stem bolts
3/ Tighten top cap a just enough to engage the headset bearings, - don't overdo it, it should be just enough to take out play
4/ Tighten the stem bolts bit by bit. So give one bolt one turn, then the other and back to the first bolt. ie. So that the bolts are evenly tightened.
5/ Maybe (not necessarily) give the top cap a very small nip

If you do the above and still get play, - the chances are the bearings are shot.

Yeah I was following the park tools guide to it, it's a forge ahead stem so there's only one stem bolt on the one side. I've been loosening that, then adjusting the star nut, then tightening the stem.

I went to the LBS but the mechanic wasn't in today, just the salesman so I've to go back tomorrow.

I'm based in Artane over the northside, I might drop down to Little Sport and see what they say.

check_six

Had similar problems with a headset. Turned out that one of the ball bearing races had disintegrated and the bike was steering on a load of wee shards of metal instead of the ball bearings. If you already know how to tighten up a headset it will be no problem to replace this bit yourself. The ball bearing race is very cheap, you are talking <€5.

There is a race at the top and bottom of the steerer tube for the forks. It was the bottom one that went splat on me.

Squidgy Black

check_six wrote: »

Had similar problems with a headset. Turned out that one of the ball bearing races had disintegrated and the bike was steering on a load of wee shards of metal instead of the ball bearings. If you already know how to tighten up a headset it will be no problem to replace this bit yourself. The ball bearing race is very cheap, you are talking <€5.

There is a race at the top and bottom of the steerer tube for the forks. It was the bottom one that went splat on me.

Would this tutorial be what you're talking about? http://m.bikeradar.com/news/article/video-workshop-how-to-replace-headset-bearings-32053/

If so, then I just need to find out where to get the bearings.

check_six

stetyrrell wrote: »

Would this tutorial be what you're talking about? http://m.bikeradar.com/news/article/video-workshop-how-to-replace-headset-bearings-32053/

If so, then I just need to find out where to get the bearings.

Yes, that looks about right.

A word of warning, if you drop your fork out to check your race and the race is banjaxed you won't be able to put the bike back together again. Your best bet is to splash out on a new set of ballbearing races and do the checking and repair if necessary at home. I did the check in a shop (at 5 minutes to closing) and ended up walking home!

victorcarrera

stetyrrell wrote: »

The forks had a bit of play in them though, and the problem I have is that when you loosen the stem bolts and tighten the headset to the point that there's no play, it's way too tight for steering and the bike has a mind of it's own. But when you loosen it so the handlebars turn when the bike is leaned to the side, (as the park tools guide says),there's still a bit of play in the forks.
Any advice?

I can't say from your description whether you have an internal or integrated headset but if you have access to the bearing races rotate them 90 degrees from their current position and try again. Why? because a headset bearing race does not wear in the same way as wheel, crank or pedal bearings. Also ball bearings are much harder to damage than races so it is likely that just one small pit on the front or rear of the lower bearing race is causing the problem. So by offsetting it slightly you are moving the pit to a position which is never under stress. You can remove the seals on most bearings and put some grease in there too. If they are rusted from water ingress better to replace altogether.

Squidgy Black

I've managed to source the bearings, but they're almost £10 a pop....

Does anybody know whether the bearings are generally sold as pairs or just as one and then you have to purchase another? If it's the latter, I think it'd be more efficient for me to just replace the whole headset.

Here's the link http://www.tweekscycles.com/components/headset-spares/fsa-micro-acb-36-36-th-bearings-1-1-8-red-seal

It doesn't use standard size cartridges so it has to be the brand specific ones.

Squidgy Black

It's a threadless headset btw, an FSA Orbit MX

Squidgy Black

I sorted this out earlier, still not 100% sure how though.

I took out the fork and the bearings to have a look, and gave them a good cleaning out and a wipe of the fork. When I popped them back on, they sat a little higher than before, instead of the two cups under the stem resting right on top of each other there's a half a mm gap between the two but the bottom of the cup still covers it. I've given it rigorous testing (bouncing it up and down as if a gorilla got a hand on it) and there's no noise or grinding or slight movement, and there's not a bit of play in the forks at all.

The bottom bearing was covered in grime though, looks like there's not long left in it.

pprendeville

Could someone recommend ceramic/tiramic bearings that correspond to these sizes, that is if it s possible to buy them seperately. Nothing wrong with these but I'd like to upgrade as I was reading about stresses that a steerer is under and I think it would be worthwhile (reading the Chris King literature on integrated headsets would frighten you).