neighbours cats in the garden

booom

howdy all, new poster to this forum and am looking for some advice from those of you who are in the know. my in-laws have a problem with the neighbours cats (i think she has around 10 of them). They crap constantly in the front and rear gardens, because the houses are terraced, they can't leave any windows open or they climb in, they've begun digging and defacating beside the potato plants. I realise a bit of wire may solve the last issue and have looed into getting 'flock off' type railings along the wall between the houses- neither of which, to my mind, should be undertaken seeing as the in-laws are not the cause of any of the associated problems. I know there are some health issues associated with cat faeces but I'm unsure as to where they (the in-laws) stand in relation to the law. I know that if I let my dog crap in the neighbours, I'm liable to prosecution. The neighbour in question is not someone you can have a reasonable conversation with as she tends to take everything personally and so far pretty much all diplomatic efforts have been used to no avail. Suggestions anyone? thanks in advance.

kildare.17hmr

I take it from your post that the neighbour is aware of the problem but does nothing to stop it?

booom

yup- she's a bit of a nut. nice, but nuts.

saabsaab

There are products that will repel cats. One is scent based called Renedine? Put on rags and left around usually effective but smelly. Another is using a plug-in ultrasound cat scarer.

momg

Pricey but apparently they do work. A suggestion from Alley Cat Allies website: "Install an ultrasonic animal repellent or a motion- activated water sprinkler, such as the CatStop™ or ScareCrow™. Available at http://www.contech-inc.com." or in some gardening/DIY shops nationwide.

the_syco

Try putting a few clear bottles of water around the garden: they frighten some cats off.

furtzy

I have the same problem and have tried the ultra sonic devices. They didn't work. The next step is to contact your environmental health officer in writing. Looks like I will be taking this step myself :mad:

kildare.17hmr

If talking didnt work and this person continued letting this happen i would catch the cats and drop them to a rescue or pound

booom

thanks for all the replies. so far i've been onto the council, who say its possibly an environmental health issue, the hse say they can only deal with the area where there is a 'substantial' amount of faeces involved (the girl couldn't say if a handful, bucket, wheelbarrow or trailer full was a substantial amount) and the DSPCA who say you can trap them if they're feral. All three told me there's no legislation in place and you can't even eliminate them yourself.

fishy fishy

a cat and a dog are polar opposites as animals. Cats are independent hunters and their instinct is to hunt, kill and leave their scents around their territory. Dogs have to be told what to do.

I don't think you can stop a punish going to the toilet in certain areas - it goes against their very nature. Try getting some of that scent mentioned in previous post.

Bringing them to a pound is a bit nonsensical - you know they are owned by someone, and more than likely they would be put down there (who would do such a thing).

Are you pregnant? cat faeces is dangerous to pregnant women.

big_heart_on

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

If talking didnt work and this person continued letting this happen i would catch the cats and drop them to a rescue or pound

Stealing pets isnt a solution and could probably land the OP in legal trouble apart from being a disgusting thing to do a person and the animal.


OP this may border on a cruelty issue but a waterpistol kept handy for a few days will work wonders. Cats dont appreciate getting interrupted doing their business and very quickly wont feel safe pooping in your yard.

This may be a moment to invoke the "blast them with p*ss", you can add something non harmful (forget what) to the water to simulate urine which will be doubly effective in keeping them off your property.

ceekay74

I think your most realistic chance of success will be to use those cat repellent products combined with actually chasing the cats off the property (being armed with a water pistol will help massively).

The cats see this area as their territory so you need to make it clear to them when you see them that it isn't. A good repellent will help keep them away when you're not there.

TooManyDogs

fishy fishy wrote: »

a cat and a dog are polar opposites as animals. Cats are independent hunters and their instinct is to hunt, kill and leave their scents around their territory.

I'm sorry but dogs instincts are not the polar opposites to cats, they also have an instinct to hunt, kill and leave scents around their territory, they're simply not given the freedom to act on these instincts. The same can be applied to cats, there are plenty of posters in this forum with cat proof gardens to keep their cats safely on their own property and stop them becoming a pest to other people

fishy fishy wrote: »

Dogs have to be told what to do.

Dogs don't have to be told what to do, but responsible dog owners have conditioned their dogs to obey, doesn't mean it's not in a dogs instinct to be independant

fishy fishy wrote: »

I don't think you can stop a punish going to the toilet in certain areas - it goes against their very nature.

Of course you can punish them for going to the toilet in certain areas, other wise there wouldnt be thousands of litter trained cats in the world. Like others suggested the OP can arm themselves with a large water pistol

fishy fishy wrote: »

Are you pregnant? cat faeces is dangerous to pregnant women.

Any carnivore defecating in a vegetable patch is dangerous. There is potiental for the vegetables to become infected so regardless of whether OP is pregnant it is dangerous. Not to mention purely disgusting

booom

the waterpistol has been used, so has a cap gun- the neighbour had a canary- even called the gards (who couldn't do anything either way). just to recap a few replies (which are appreciated nonetheless); bottles filled with water are useless unless its sunny, repellant washes away in the rain, sprinkler systems etc. are possibly beyond the means of a pensioner who's getting chemo and is generally not in the best shape (can't go chasing them off either)- that's why I thought of the environmental health angle.

Heroditas

booom wrote: »

the neighbour had a canary- even called the gards (who couldn't do anything either way).

That's one smart canary! :pac:

ceekay74

booom wrote: »

the waterpistol has been used, so has a cap gun- the neighbour had a canary- even called the gards (who couldn't do anything either way). just to recap a few replies (which are appreciated nonetheless); bottles filled with water are useless unless its sunny, repellant washes away in the rain, sprinkler systems etc. are possibly beyond the means of a pensioner who's getting chemo and is generally not in the best shape (can't go chasing them off either)- that's why I thought of the environmental health angle.

You've always got the nuclear option - GET A DOG.

kildare.17hmr

big_heart_on wrote: »

Stealing pets isnt a solution and could probably land the OP in legal trouble apart from being a disgusting thing to do a person and the animal.


OP this may border on a cruelty issue but a waterpistol kept handy for a few days will work wonders. Cats dont appreciate getting interrupted doing their business and very quickly wont feel safe pooping in your yard.

This may be a moment to invoke the "blast them with p*ss", you can add something non harmful (forget what) to the water to simulate urine which will be doubly effective in keeping them off your property.

its not stealing, cats are not seen as property like dogs, they have no protection under law.

You say its a disgusting thing to do? Well the neighbour allowing their "pet" do its business in the OPs vegitable patch is disgusting plus its more than one pet and the neighbour knows but refuses to fix it!!

I have no problem with cats that do not bother me, i often visit friends with cats and my family have them too, honestly no problem with cats as long as the owners are responsible but if cats are acting like vermin they will be treated as such, iv had similar problems to the OP with my neighbours, its not nice especially when the kids like to dig in the garden and play in their sand pit but had to be stopped because of "pets" doin their business there every day.

Iv said it before but if people want their cats to have rights they must take full responsibility for them, if not and something happens your cat no one is to blame but the owner

furtzy

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

Iv said it before but if people want their cats to have rights they must take full responsibility for them, if not and something happens your cat no one is to blame but the owner

Exactly. It is not acceptable to have someone elses pet use your garden as a toilet. Its disgusting and irresponsible pet ownership. I for one will be using all available methods to rectify my problem cats

daveyeh

furtzy wrote: »

I for one will be using all available methods to rectify my problem cats

- What exactly?

christmas2012

spray them with a water gun everytime you see them in your garden they will soon be annoyed and get the message not to enter your garden again

Allison91

I never had a problem with cats but almost every family has a dog where I live we don't and they use our garden as their toilet the dog owners don't care as long as its not in their garden. It's disgusting.

christmas2012

ya dogs are worse,as when cats toilet they dig a hole first,and then cover it up again with the mud they dug out,so they are very clean like that,you will never see a ****e hanging around on a footpath or garden from a cat..the only thing is they could disturb bedding if somebody is gardening flowers etc..

booom

christmas2012 wrote: »

ya dogs are worse,as when cats toilet they dig a hole first,and then cover it up again with the mud they dug out,so they are very clean like that,you will never see a ****e hanging around on a footpath or garden from a cat..the only thing is they could disturb bedding if somebody is gardening flowers etc..

beg to differ here. toms do not necessarily bury their faeces. Last week the entire lawn was dug up to the front of the house and anti-weed sheeting put down before covering with gravel. Between the sheeting going down and the gravel arriving they had managed to go where they had habitually done. the back garden is all lawn and it's like a minefield when you go to cut the grass.

kildare.17hmr

christmas2012 wrote: »

ya dogs are worse,as when cats toilet they dig a hole first,and then cover it up again with the mud they dug out,so they are very clean like that,you will never see a ****e hanging around on a footpath or garden from a cat..the only thing is they could disturb bedding if somebody is gardening flowers etc..

Christmas thats pure crap! They may attempt to bury it, sometimes but not always. I recently redid my back garden, rotavated it and planted new grass, kept my dogs out of it since and cut it for the first time last weekend. I got a big shovel full of cat **** out of it before i cut it! Looks like the cats are back using my garden because i have not been using it. We also spent a fortune on new pots and plants for it and yeaterday the OH found more cat ****e in one of them, she loves cats but this even pissed her off. Our kids like to help sometimes and have some veg in pots that will be unusable if the cats get near it.

How people can think this is ok because 'its in their nature' is beyond me

sf80

RosieJoe

christmas2012 wrote: »

ya dogs are worse,as when cats toilet they dig a hole first,and then cover it up again with the mud they dug out,so they are very clean like that,you will never see a ****e hanging around on a footpath or garden from a cat..the only thing is they could disturb bedding if somebody is gardening flowers etc..

Oh, so dogs are worse? Really? See, when my dogs poo I pick it up with a doggy bag and dispose of it! But cats, sure they're OK as they have the common courtesy to booby trap gardens/vegetable patches/play areas bury it first :rolleyes:

furtzy

daveyeh wrote: »

- What exactly?

Anything that is suggested and that works. Whole plant bedding area was full of buried ****....disgusting and not acceptable

FloatingVoter

sf80 wrote: »

I'd watch the good doctors video (for laughs alone). Our genius narrator pisses on his own car. Then puts it on Youtube. :rolleyes:

ahal

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

its not stealing, cats are not seen as property like dogs, they have no protection under law.

First time I've seen this put forward as a positive :rolleyes:

gigawatt

if you select an area for the cats to use, they will probably use that place exclusively and not go in other places. maybe put some sand or cat litter down in an old tray/box in a discreet corner? at least it keeps the rest of the garden clean.
I don't know how the owner can realistically stop them from entering your garden and a lot or repellents and stuff don't tend to work. A small dog would keep them out too. I know cats cannot abide the smell of orange or eucalyptus so maybe a spray with some essential oil and water in the areas you don't want them to go and a tray in a place you dont mind them using could solve them problem.

kildare.17hmr

ahal wrote: »

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

its not stealing, cats are not seen as property like dogs, they have no protection under law.

First time I've seen this put forward as a positive :rolleyes:

It certainly is a positive if like the OP you have a big problem. Like i said with rights come responsibilities

iguana

christmas2012 wrote: »

Are you pregnant? cat faeces is dangerous to pregnant women.

No cat faeces is not dangerous to pregnant women. Developed humans have very little to worry about from toxoplasmosis. Cat faeces can however be extremely dangerous to the foetus carried by the pregnant woman (or any pregnant mammal) because if it contains toxoplasmosis it can cause spontaneous abortion or, much worse, the varying degrees of destruction to the developing brain which can result in the child being born with such severe brain damage that it's basically a vegetable for life. In less severe cases it can cause complete blindness in the child or severe to moderate developmental delay. Luckily neonatal toxoplasmosis is rare in this country and is much more commonly caused by eating meat that isn't thoroughly cooked but while it's rare the results can be so utterly devastating to someone's life people really shouldn't take the risk of letting their cats wander.

TooManyDogs

iguana wrote: »

Luckily neonatal toxoplasmosis is rare in this country

It is rare but it does happen, I know a girl who's baby contracted it while she was pregnant from cats, and is severly disabled as a direct result.

Taking toxoplasmosis aside, there are other health concerns with a carnivore pooing in a veggie bed, salmonella and ecoli being only the start. You wouldn't plant vegetables in a veggie bed contaminated with human poo so why do people think it's acceptable the OP should put up with their vegetables being contaminated with cat poo?

It's the usual onus on the garden owner to spend money on methods to keep cats out of their garden rather there being any onus on cat owner to become responsible

Cork boy 55

the_syco wrote: »

Try putting a few clear bottles of water around the garden: they frighten some cats off.

I have seen quite a few people do this.

What is the science behind it?

booom

(sun)light reflecting off the water is supposed to put them off- grand if you live in the south of france.

ahal

I think we've established that the cats aren't doing it on purpose, despite various posts here and there attempting to attribute human behavioural responsibility to cats / the "do something to the cats" (daft) mentality.

I'm not sure that there's much the neighbour can do about it either? She's probably taken them in as strays, because as Kildare17mph so elequently pointed out, there are no regulations regarding cats in this country hence folk don't get them neutered and they breed like mad. Cats don't tend to obey humans unless they're hungry and want feeding, so the water pistol sounds like the best solution mooted so far.

I've also heard that Tiger poo acts as a deterrent, but that could be difficult to source :pac:

I don't know your exact circumstances, but perhaps the previous tenant fed them?

Anyone with 10 cats arouses my suspicions tbh. If all else failed I'd feck the poop back over into her patch. Sh**e speaks louder than words, if you will

Zapperzy

booom wrote: »

(sun)light reflecting off the water is supposed to put them off- grand if you live in the south of france.

Worth a try but tbh my cat anyways would think it's an elaborate cat toy! She loves chasing light reflections.

Water pistol is the cheapest, most humane thing I think. Apart from a dog, only 1 or 2 brave cats have ever entered our garden in the last 4 years since we got a dog, a handful more have sat on the fence above him watching him bark at them!

kildare.17hmr

There is a very simple thing the neighbour can do, same thing you do with every other pet, keep them on your property! Its not hard or too expensive to catproof a garden, a couple of hundred quid should have it sorted. Imo if your not prepared to do this you shouldnt have them

Cork boy 55

booom wrote: »

(sun)light reflecting off the water is supposed to put them off- grand if you live in the south of france.

Why would sunlight reflecting off water scare a Cat?

It is perfectly natural.

Anyone have any Science to link to?

I declare this an urban myth!!

Years ago I have seen one of my neighbours do this with green coloured bottles!!

Cork boy 55

Well, I am sceptic this works as I do think Cats are smarter than to fall for this. Below is a video to prove it. ^^;

http://gordonator.com/2012/02/19/japanese-water-bottle-to-keep-off-cats/

fishy fishy

TooManyDogs wrote: »

I'm sorry but dogs instincts are not the polar opposites to cats, they also have an instinct to hunt, kill and leave scents around their territory, they're simply not given the freedom to act on these instincts. The same can be applied to cats, there are plenty of posters in this forum with cat proof gardens to keep their cats safely on their own property and stop them becoming a pest to other people




Dogs don't have to be told what to do, but responsible dog owners have conditioned their dogs to obey, doesn't mean it's not in a dogs instinct to be independant





Of course you can punish them for going to the toilet in certain areas, other wise there wouldnt be thousands of litter trained cats in the world. Like others suggested the OP can arm themselves with a large water pistol




Any carnivore defecating in a vegetable patch is dangerous. There is potiental for the vegetables to become infected so regardless of whether OP is pregnant it is dangerous. Not to mention purely disgusting

dogs are still scratching their heads wondering where they are while a cat has a days work done (by the way I love dogs - I have two - and two kitties).

as for the animals defecating on a veg pat - its a fact of life. In fact, here's a shocker - people use ANIMAL SH*TE in their organic gardening :eek::eek::D:D

kildare.17hmr

They dont use animal ****e from meat eating animals!

fishy fishy

iguana wrote: »

No cat faeces is not dangerous to pregnant women. Developed humans have very little to worry about from toxoplasmosis. Cat faeces can however be extremely dangerous to the foetus carried by the pregnant woman (or any pregnant mammal) because if it contains toxoplasmosis it can cause spontaneous abortion or, much worse, the varying degrees of destruction to the developing brain which can result in the child being born with such severe brain damage that it's basically a vegetable for life. In less severe cases it can cause complete blindness in the child or severe to moderate developmental delay. Luckily neonatal toxoplasmosis is rare in this country and is much more commonly caused by eating meat that isn't thoroughly cooked but while it's rare the results can be so utterly devastating to someone's life people really shouldn't take the risk of letting their cats wander.

forgive my phrase - I meant to say cats can be dangerous to the foetus inside a pregnant woman, but the woman will be fine - not a bother. Its just the foetus she's carrying that is at risk :rolleyes:

fishy fishy

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

They dont use animal ****e from meat eating animals!

does you cat sit down to a steak dinner every night. ??:D

SillyMangoX

fishy fishy wrote: »

does you cat sit down to a steak dinner every night. ??:D

They don't have to eat steak to be carnivores

Cats simply couldn't survive as a vegetarian, they would go blind from a lack of taurine as they can't synthesise it themselves, so therefore they are meat eaters.

Whats worked for someone I know is peeling a few oranges, lemons and limes and scattering them around the perimeter of the vegetable garden and even burying a few pieces to catch the cats off guard. They absolutely cannot stand the smell of citrus, my own 2 really hate it, one will fun away and the other physically pukes if he sees me eating an orange! That should hopefully deter them a bit anyway.

TooManyDogs

fishy fishy wrote: »

as for the animals defecating on a veg pat - its a fact of life. In fact, here's a shocker - people use ANIMAL SH*TE in their organic gardening :eek::eek::D:D

And I use sheep manure in my own veggie plot. It is safe to use well rotted manure from a herbiverous animal in a veggie plot. Well rotted because fresh manure has potiental to carry harmful bacteria, although far less of a chance with plant eating animals manure.

Cat and dog poo should never ever be added to a veggie garden because apart from the risk of bacterial pathogens there is also a risk of parsites. Cats and dogs carry roundworms and parasitic nematodes, and some lifecycle stages can remain indefinitely dormant waiting on ideal conditions. The same goes for the parasite responsible for toxoplasmosis, the oocysts can remain dormant in soil for years and are resistant to most disinfectants.

So how about I allow my dogs crap in my veggie and give you the vegetables to eat, you being fully aware that they had crapped in among the veggies and lets see if you're still so flippant, and if you actually eat anything.....

fishy fishy

SillyMangoX wrote: »

They don't have to eat steak to be carnivores

Cats simply couldn't survive as a vegetarian, they would go blind from a lack of taurine as they can't synthesise it themselves, so therefore they are meat eaters.

Whats worked for someone I know is peeling a few oranges, lemons and limes and scattering them around the perimeter of the vegetable garden and even burying a few pieces to catch the cats off guard. They absolutely cannot stand the smell of citrus, my own 2 really hate it, one will fun away and the other physically pukes if he sees me eating an orange! That should hopefully deter them a bit anyway.

taurine necessity is not exclusive to cats - all animals and humans need it. It is an amino acid - you can find taurine in any good cat dry food in vets in supermarkets and in your corner shop.

fishy fishy

TooManyDogs wrote: »

And I use sheep manure in my own veggie plot. It is safe to use well rotted manure from a herbiverous animal in a veggie plot. Well rotted because fresh manure has potiental to carry harmful bacteria, although far less of a chance with plant eating animals manure.

Cat and dog poo should never ever be added to a veggie garden because apart from the risk of bacterial pathogens there is also a risk of parsites. Cats and dogs carry roundworms and parasitic nematodes, and some lifecycle stages can remain indefinitely dormant waiting on ideal conditions. The same goes for the parasite responsible for toxoplasmosis, the oocysts can remain dormant in soil for years and are resistant to most disinfectants.

So how about I allow my dogs crap in my veggie and give you the vegetables to eat, you being fully aware that they had crapped in among the veggies and lets see if you're still so flippant, and if you actually eat anything.....

if a dog or cat craps on your veggies, and you don't see it, have they actually crapped at all ? Same goes for Pee and Scent - if a cat Pee's or "scents" your veggie patch and you don't see it, have the pee'd at all.

It's naive to think that dogs and cats don't do their business on veggies - of course they do. :rolleyes:

SillyMangoX

fishy fishy wrote: »

taurine necessity is not exclusive to cats - all animals and humans need it. It is an amino acid - you can find taurine in any good cat dry food in vets in supermarkets and in your corner shop.

And what's in those dry cat foods? Meat! (or derivatives of it - which is actually what you will find in inferior quality supermarket/corner shop foods) And I know taurine is necessary for everything, but most other species can synthesise it themselves, cats cannot. If they don't eat a source of it, they die. Humans can be vegetarians because we are omnivores, we can survive off any protein source be it meat or pulses etc, cats are obligate carnivores, meaning they absolutely have to eat meat. That doesn't mean they can't eat cereals and vegetables as well, but they absolutely HAVE to have meat in their diet.

TooManyDogs

fishy fishy wrote: »

if a dog or cat craps on your veggies, and you don't see it, have they actually crapped at all ? Same goes for Pee and Scent - if a cat Pee's or "scents" your veggie patch and you don't see it, have the pee'd at all.

It's naive to think that dogs and cats don't do their business on veggies - of course they do. :rolleyes:

This is not Schrodinger's vegetable patch. Whether you have actually seen the animal eliminate on the vegetables is immaterial, if there is dog or cat poo in the veggie patch there are health implacations and it is naive to think otherwise.