What is beauty??

jmc1243

Hi ladies, i've taken an interest recently in how the media portrays female beauty, in advertisements, the models they use etc.
I really want to get other women's opinions on how beauty is portrayed in the media and how this affects our self-esteem, body image, and generally if it affects how we feel about ourselves.

For me personally, i think at times it does make me feel down about how i look and im constantly comparing myself to the perfect, flawless models that i see!

What are you're thoughts on this??

shopaholic01

I know what you mean but it used to bother me more when I was in my teens/early twenties. We've all agonised in front of a mirror wondering why we don't have long, 100% cellulite free legs, stomachs you could bounce off and perfect flawless skin.

Nowadays thankfully we all know about airbrushing and the publicicty it has received lately. You now see on ads where they tell you the model is wearing lash inserts, the image has been enahnced in post production, they're wearing hair extensions etc. I know a campaign is ongoing to force companies to say when an image has been altered - the Lancome ad with Julia Roberts is highlighted, she looks about 20!

We also now regularly see shots of celebs without make-up and on the beach with their saggy bits and cellulite. Of course some of them look good, but nothing like they appear in professional photos.

So the answer is: When you look at a picture and think ' I wish I looked like that', rest assured that the model looks at it and probably thinks the same:D

Honey-ec

Meh. I'm happy in my own skin, I don't really obsess about what other people look like at all. As Shopaholic says, none of those celebs actually look like that anyway.

sillymoo

It's in the eye of the beholder surely?

jmc1243

Funny you should say that sillymoo, i watched a documentary lately where someone said 'beauty isn't in the eye of the beholder, its in the eye of the moneyholder', referring to the companies that profit from making people feel inadequate about themselves. I thought that was really interesting and very true.

I know what you mean about all the airbrushing that's done shopaholic, and i think they should have to say if an image has been altered.
But in the documentary mentioned above they focused mainly on teenagers who mightn't be aware of all this airbrushing and photoshopping and it was so sad to see them compare themselves to these skinny models and call themselves ugly!!

Daisies

It's going to sound cliched but I think a lot of beauty is from within. I mean that by being confident and self assured (but not cocky) that you appear more attractive. If you are happy with your looks I think that shows and you tend to have a "glow" to you.

The certain type of beauty that we see in magazines/ on celebs is unrealistic, even the celebs can't achieve it. Nobody is perfect and no-one should attempt to be, if everyone in the world looked the same according to a certain "beauty" rules then it would be a very boring place.

dearg lady

It does kinda annoy me that these images of 'beauty' we're fed are pretty much unobtainable, even the celebs and models with all their money don't look like that without airbrushing. As much as I can tell myself this over and over again, I still have days when I look in the mirror and think ugh, I wish I looked better.
It can be hard for women to remain confident about their own unique looks when bombarded with images of what is 'beautiful'. I do find as I get older I'm getting more comfortable in my own skin tho

Honey-ec

I'll tell you what it isn't - that idiot Samantha Brick from the Daily Mail...

jmc1243

I totally agree with you daisies, i think if a person is confident and happy with themselves and how they look, they do come across more attractive!! And if only everyone had that kind of self-confidence I think it'd be fantastic.

Like dearg lady says, there are days when I look in the mirror and can't help but point out every little flaw. And i'm sure its the same for many others, I think its human nature to compare ourselves to others, and often this is comparison to these images of 'perfection' in the media which can't be good for anyone. I also think as we get older, we become less influenced by these images, we get more comfortable in our own skin you could say, but then there's the growing obsession with cosmetic surgery so maybe not for some.

dearg lady

Honey-ec wrote: »

I'll tell you what it isn't - that idiot Samantha Brick from the Daily Mail...

ha, I had to google her, funny article! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2124246/Samantha-Brick-downsides-looking-pretty-Why-women-hate-beautiful.html#ixzz1rAizdDyO I personally wouldn't find her particularly attractive but there is some truth to what she says for women who are typically beautiful, they can face a backlash from other women. I'm so relieved I don't have to deal with that!!

Daisies

jmc1243 wrote: »

I totally agree with you daisies, i think if a person is confident and happy with themselves and how they look, they do come across more attractive!! And if only everyone had that kind of self-confidence I think it'd be fantastic. +1. .

Oh totally and I wish I had that type of confidence myself. Like you have said there are days when I look in the mirror and hate what I see. There are days when I'm happy-ish with what I see. I think a lot of what it has come down to is finding what suits me. EG, for liking my figure, finding the clothes that suit me is skinny jeans= no no but straight legged jeans are much more flattering on me. For my face, finding a the right foundation and concealer and more importantly the right cleanser.

By doing those things you can minimise the things you dislike. Sure there are days when my hair is too frizzy, when my thighs are too big and my skin is playing up and those days it's very hard to feel pretty never mind beautiful. But, on the other hand there are days when I put on an outfit that I know flatters me, my hair has decided to behave itself and I don't have a whopper of a spot on my chin and I feel good. I know those days I look better because I feel like I look better

jmc1243

haha I had to google 'Samantha Brick' as well. I didn't know what to make of it, I mean she's very pretty but I wouldn't say she was disbelievingly good-looking and I think her confidence is kinda verging on cockiness, it's like shes throwing it in our faces, just because I've never gotten a bottle of champagne or bunch of flowers from a fella, I'm not bothered I'd rather be liked for my personality than my looks!!

dearg lady

jmc1243 wrote: »

haha I had to google 'Samantha Brick' as well. I didn't know what to make of it, I mean she's very pretty but I wouldn't say she was disbelievingly good-looking and I think her confidence is kinda verging on cockiness, it's like shes throwing it in our faces, just because I've never gotten a bottle of champagne or bunch of flowers from a fella, I'm not bothered I'd rather be liked for my personality than my looks!!

yeah, she's definitely crossed the line into cockiness which is quite unattractive in itself

Honey-ec

jmc1243 wrote: »

haha I had to google 'Samantha Brick' ... she's very pretty

We'll have to agree to disagree there...

awec

This post has been deleted.

dearg lady

awec wrote: »

I fail to see what is so extraordinary about her that she is treated like that.

I would agree, but I mean it does happen to some people!

FouxDaFaFa

I feel like the media doesn't represent women very well in the beauty industry. There is so much airbrushing and helping hands (like lash extensions in mascara ads) that not much of what we see is real. It confuses me people feel the need to alter or artificially enhance already-beautiful models.

My person idea of beauty is kind of similar to the one mentioned above. I find people with a wide variety of looks beautiful. I think Amber Heard is beautiful. I think Dawn French is beautiful. Sinéad O'Connor is beautiful. From that sample you have a blonde, brunette and a shaven-headed woman and a mixture of body shapes. But they're all beautiful.

I don't really look at ads and feel bad about myself. I just find them unhelpful because they don't, for example, give me an accurate idea of how that mascara will look on me.

krudler

awec wrote: »

I fail to see what is so extraordinary about her that she is treated like that.

she doesnt, 99% of that article smells of attention seeking bullsh1t.

speaking for myself, I dont tend to go for "hot" girls, the nightclub types with tiny skirts, pushed up boobs and makeup that looks like it was applied with a trowel, with some ronseal fake tan for extra effect, naturally pretty or cute girls ftw.

jmc1243

I couldn't agree more Fouxdafafa, I don't know why they feel the need to airbrush and photoshop models that are perfectly fine and beautiful just the way they are, it just shows how obsessed they are with perfection, which I don't think is sending a good message to us ordinary folk!

I personally find beauty in uniqueness, i mean many of the images you see in the media, they all look the same, skinny, tall, flawless skin, perfect hair, nothing at all unique about them, and if there is they've probably airbrushed it out.

metaoblivia

I think the way media represents beauty can be damaging to girls and women who don't realize the amount of image manipulation that goes on, i.e. professional make-up and hair stylists, lighting, and of course photoshopping. Knowing that though, I find it fairly easy to take those images with a grain of salt. Perhaps it's my own arrogance, but I look at a lot of those images and think, "Well, considering how much that image has been altered, I'm not doing too bad over here with my drugstore cosmetics and Instagram filters." :P

But the key is knowing about the image manipulation, I think, which is why things like that Dove advertisement a few years back are so important. Especially as a teenager, when you become hyper aware of appearance and fitting in, it can be easy to get caught up in media portrayals of beauty. One of the things I'm forever grateful for is that I wasn't really interested in fashion and beauty magazines as a teen. I liked National Geographic and International Gymnast. I think not constantly comparing myself to unattainable images didn't so much boost my confidence as it did not lower it, if that makes sense.

krudler

metaoblivia wrote: »

I think the way media represents beauty can be damaging to girls and women who don't realize the amount of image manipulation that goes on, i.e. professional make-up and hair stylists, lighting, and of course photoshopping. Knowing that though, I find it fairly easy to take those images with a grain of salt. Perhaps it's my own arrogance, but I look at a lot of those images and think, "Well, considering how much that image has been altered, I'm not doing too bad over here with my drugstore cosmetics and Instagram filters." :P

I'd love to know if anyone seriously thinks Cheryl Cole dies her own hair herself with a 10 quid product from Boots.

metaoblivia

krudler wrote: »

I'd love to know if anyone seriously thinks Cheryl Cole dies her own hair herself with a 10 quid product from Boots.

I find at-home hair dye commercials to be some of the funniest on television. Just the image of Beyonce dying her hair at home in her sink is hilarious to me. Like I'm supposed to believe these celebrity women with millions of dollars use drugstore hair dyes. And there's nothing wrong with drugstore hair dyes, but any reasonable person knows that's not what those women use.

jmc1243

I'm glad you brought up that Dove campaign, metaoblivia. I think that was a really important message to show people how these images we see on a daily basis are not reality.
However, it didn't change all that much in my opinion, we're still bombarded with these stick thin, flawless models on a daily basis and I couldn't agree more that it can be seriously damaging to young girls and women who aren't fully aware that in reality no one looks like these people, even the models themselves.

Do you find that people are becoming less influenced by these images as they become more aware of how unrealistic they are, because I feel that children and young people these days are becoming even more preoccupied with how they look and striving for this image of perfection??

Daisy78

I have no problem with people admiring beauty, its a natural human instinct. However its the narrow categorisation of what is considered to be beautiful, i.e tall, skinny, blonde that I have an issue with. We have become brainwashed into thinking that this is the standard to reach (don't get me started on those next top model shows grrrrrr) which will never be attainable for 99.9% of the population. It also doesn't help that unfortunatley (imo) most men tend to hold this as the required standard for prospective partners which leads to further self doubt. Quirkiness, uniqueness doesn't come into it.:(

metaoblivia

jmc1243 wrote: »

I'm glad you brought up that Dove campaign, metaoblivia. I think that was a really important message to show people how these images we see on a daily basis are not reality.
However, it didn't change all that much in my opinion, we're still bombarded with these stick thin, flawless models on a daily basis and I couldn't agree more that it can be seriously damaging to young girls and women who aren't fully aware that in reality no one looks like these people, even the models themselves.

Do you find that people are becoming less influenced by these images as they become more aware of how unrealistic they are, because I feel that children and young people these days are becoming even more preoccupied with how they look and striving for this image of perfection??

I really don't have any statistics or even anecdotes to make the call as to whether people are more or less influenced by these images. I believe that children and young people will always be more prone to buying into media images, and especially in modern society where you're bombarded with it everywhere, it can be harder to escape. So it's up to the adults in their lives to make sure they get another, healthier perspective and to show them things like the Dove ad.

And you're right, the Dove ad didn't change much, not because it wasn't a good ad, but because people kept buying the products sold by these 'flawless' models. It's an effective marketing scheme, and as long as that persists, so will this image of flawless beauty. If you look back on ads from decades ago, the theme of convincing women that they could be just a little bit more desirable/beautiful if they bought this product is quite prevalent. Advertisers have long fed off of female insecurity, and they won't stop until they stop making money.

Ayla

A thought popped into my head one day & I told it to my daughter who was 3 at the time..."you're only as beautiful as the smile you're wearing."

To me, that just about sums it all up.

krudler

I'll tell you one thing thats not beautiful: duckface.

Eve_Dublin

First things first: don't read Cosmo, Vogue.....and the rest of them. I've never bought any of them so I don't even know the names of them to list them off. You know the ones I'm talking about though. Have always had a fairly positive body image even when I've had extra weight on me. Wasn't overweight but wasn't slim. Didn't even realise it. I try and avoid toxic friends who give back handed "compliments" or bitch about other people's appearance and toxic marketing as much as I can. If you're young women, I promise it gets easier. Hang in there.

Wibbs

krudler wrote: »

I'd love to know if anyone seriously thinks Cheryl Cole dies her own hair herself with a 10 quid product from Boots.

given she has hair extensions she could do it by post. Advertisers really treat women like morons at times. "Here comes the science bit" BS. Now because of regulations they have to throw in small print which makes this even more blatant. "Gorgeous hair colour(done in a salon on hair extensions)", "Long luxurious eyelashes!(Model is wearing false eyelashes)", "Just like botox!(not like botox)", "In a survey women agreed!(we asked 30 women)" etc. It really is incredibly blatant. Sure men get treated like morons too, but not nearly to the same degree.

The real problem today is the image of beauty. Cultures from time immemorial have had images of beauty, but they were generally more rooted in reality. Less subtly exaggerated. A roman woman could look at a statue of Venus and it was much more based in everyday reality. More women would have had her bodyshape. Though it was more real in one way it was also unreal as it was clearly a human fashioned object and she was an unobtainable goddess. That line is blurred today because of technology. The very thin woman in the Vogue photoshoot is already an outlier and is made even more so by image manipulation further fooling our brains into thinking it's reality. Reality itself is subtly altered. Worse again, even if we realise this it also asks the question if even the model isn't "good enough", then what signal does this send?

jmc1243

I couldn't have put it better myself Wibbs, I think they've gone a bit overboard with their new 'toys'. I actually saw this thing in a documentary where a person showed how one 'model' in a magazine wasn't actually one person but loads of features picked from different people, then put together to make the 'perfect' face. I thought it was hilarious, not only do they manipulate faces by airbrushing but they've gone as far as creating entirely new faces that don't even exist!!

Also I was thinking about it today and the film the stepford wives popped into my head, is this what we're supposed to be haha??

boomtown123

beauty for me is confidence and belief in oneself

SarahBeep!

You know that look someone gets in their eyes when they smile?
Or their goofy laugh
Or their 'look deep into my eyes' face

Mhmmmm

Babybuff

What is love?

baby don't hurt me, don't hurt me no more



dodo dodo dodo dodo dodo dodo dodo dodo



on a more personal note, I find people who radiate an "aura" (for want of a better word) beautiful.

Daisies

Babybuff wrote: »

on a more personal note, I find people who radiate an "aura" (for want of a better word) beautiful.

That is very true, when you look at someone and think they are beautiful but you can't quite put your finger on why!

jmc1243

Ya, I think beauty comes in all shapes and forms, not the idealistic images magazines etc. show us, sur we could all look like that if we tried, I like individuality, someone unique who's confident in their skin, that's beauty.

I am a friend

jmc1243 wrote: »

companies that profit from making people feel inadequate about themselves

Thats like saying McDonalds makes you fat... People have a choice whether or not to buy into it given that 99.9% of people know the bulk of the pictures are photoshopped...

jmc1243

True, but they still show these images and the message that comes across is 'this is what beauty is and if you don't look like this your not good enough'.
The fact that there photoshopped makes the message even more damaging, its like a slap in the face.
The cosmetic surgery industry is getting bigger and bigger each year, so people must feel in some way inadequate about themselves or else why would they go to such extremes to improve their appearance and i think the media has a major part to play in it.