Who has right of way

Randy Anders

Hi folks, quick question here regarding who has the right of way in this instance

The road in question is in the google maps link below.

If a cyclist is on the bike track going by the Beacon hotel and wants to continue straight through the lights, should the motorist who wants to turn left give way to the cyclist who is on the track to the drivers left?

Thanks in advance

Edit, link fixed


http://maps.google.ie/maps?q=Holly+Avenue,+Stillorgan+Industrial+Park,+Stillorgan&hl=en&ll=53.276852,-6.220622&spn=0.009649,0.033023&sll=53.401034,-8.307638&sspn=9.862266,33.815918&oq=holly+avenue+still&t=h&hnear=Holly+Ave,+Stillorgan+Industrial+Park,+Stillorgan,+County+Dublin&z=16&layer=c&cbll=53.276814,-6.220741&panoid=QkRKWvB5ArUSrP1P4d29gg&cbp=12,237.97,,0,0.58

Cuddlesworth

I don't see what the problem is, plenty of water there for everybody.

tunney

Right OF way

Your question is - does the vehicle turning left across a lane of traffic have right of way over the vehicles in that lane?

Answers itself really.

Mint Sauce

Without seeing the actual photo/map. The cyclist.

For Forks Sake

irish-stew wrote: »

Without seeing the actual photo/map. The cyclist.

I'm not the only one getting a link to a river somewhere in Brazil then?

Randy Anders

OSI wrote: »

Obviously the cyclist would have right of way as they are already in the lane.

I thought as much. I was nearly creamed off my bike earlier at that junction and got a load of verbals for my troubles

The fact that he was so adamant that he was in the right and the weird layout of the road had me doubting myself

biko

Randy Anders wrote: »

The fact that he was so adamant that he was in the right and the weird layout of the road had me doubting myself

Ah, the old "when in doubt, get aggressive" defence.

Cuddlesworth

Randy Anders wrote: »

I thought as much. I was nearly creamed off my bike earlier at that junction and got a load of verbals for my troubles

The fact that he was so adamant that he was in the right and the weird layout of the road had me doubting myself

As a motorcyclist I can say this with 100% certainty. You should have expected it well in advance and prepared for the eventuality. Might save your life someday.

Randy Anders

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

As a motorcyclist I can say this with 100% certainty. You should have expected it well in advance and prepared for the eventuality. Might save your life someday.

The things is, I'm always extremely cautious at this particular spot. I make it well known to the cars in the left lane behind me that I will be going straight on

The problem today was that the driver was actually in the middle lane so I had no reason to believe he was turning left. He obviously realised he was in wrong lane to be going left and veered in without even looking

danhiggins10

From that picture though the driver is in a slip lane and the bike is crossing that lane of traffic to contiue on but on the other hand the driver is crossing the bike lane, its a tricky one

keithclancy

Its a bike lane, the car has to yield to bicycles when going left.

bijapos

danhiggins10 wrote: »

From that picture though the driver is in a slip lane and the bike is crossing that lane of traffic to contiue on but on the other hand the driver is crossing the bike lane, its a tricky one

Not tricky at all. Cyclist has right of way as the car is crossing a lane. The car should indicate and proceed when the way is clear, but of course feck all people do that, they just drive straight through.

Very dangerous crossing for a cyclist but they do have right of way there.

Big Nasty

....CiniO

CiniO

MCMLXXV wrote: »

....CiniO

I'd be flying there with my bicycle so you wouldn't even notice there was anything coming

Big Nasty

CiniO wrote: »

I'd be flying there with my bicycle so you wouldn't even notice there was anything coming

Damn! Caught rapih'! :pac:

alias no.9

Funny you should describe a situation like this, today I was turning right into James's hospital at the James's street entrance and noticed that as the cycle lane coming outbound rejoined the road after crossing the luas tracks right at the entrance, there's a yield marking on the cycle lane. As it happens, there was a cyclist coming along the cycle lane and with no other traffic coming outbound so it would seem I would have had the right of way to enter the hospital but basic common sense told me that there's no benefit in being right when a cyclist hits the pavement.

Sorry about the longwinded description but maybe the op could clarify if there were any markings in the cycle lane that would have required them to yield at the intersection? If not, they were entirely in the right, otherwise there's an idiot doing road markings in Dun Laoighre Rathdown Co Co who's been spending too much time with the idiot doing the same job in DCC.

enas

Cyclist going straight has right of way obviously, but this is an extremely bad (but all too common unfortunately) design. Putting traffic going straight to the left of left-turning traffic can only result in conflict, for quite obvious reasons. At least some signs that make the required behaviour more explicit wouldn't harm, such as the obvious yield signs we can see in the other direction, where motorists joining the road clearly have to yield to cyclists on the cycle lane.

keithclancy

enas wrote: »

Cyclist going straight has right of way obviously, but this is an extremely bad (but all too common unfortunately) design. Putting traffic going straight to the left of left-turning traffic can only result in conflict, for quite obvious reasons. At least some signs that make the required behaviour more explicit wouldn't harm, such as the obvious yield signs we can see in the other direction, where motorists joining the road clearly have to yield to cyclists on the cycle lane.

Continental European Idea plonked in Ireland, just try turning right at any green light with a pedestrian crossing / bike crossing, they have right of way

ciotog

alias no.9 wrote: »

Funny you should describe a situation like this, today I was turning right into James's hospital at the James's street entrance and noticed that as the cycle lane coming outbound rejoined the road after crossing the luas tracks right at the entrance, there's a yield marking on the cycle lane. As it happens, there was a cyclist coming along the cycle lane and with no other traffic coming outbound so it would seem I would have had the right of way to enter the hospital but basic common sense told me that there's no benefit in being right when a cyclist hits the pavement.

Sorry about the longwinded description but maybe the op could clarify if there were any markings in the cycle lane that would have required them to yield at the intersection? If not, they were entirely in the right, otherwise there's an idiot doing road markings in Dun Laoighre Rathdown Co Co who's been spending too much time with the idiot doing the same job in DCC.

I think someone would be doing well to post a clear guide on how to handle that - while I don't know that area I do know it's a something of a cycling blackspot from the posts about it on the Cycling forum. Issues with where you end up in relation to cars and some nasty injuries from falls associated with crossing the Luas tracks. So I'm just going to go with acknowledging you were considerate and courteous towards the cyclists and that was a nice gesture.

opti0nal

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

As a motorcyclist I can say this with 100% certainty. You should have expected it well in advance and prepared for the eventuality. Might save your life someday.

As a motorcyclist, you should not be driving in a cycle lane.

wonski

opti0nal wrote: »

As a motorcyclist, you should not be driving in a cycle lane.

I think Cuddlesworth was talking about being very careful when approaching junction like this. The right of way does not stop one from looking around.
Sometimes you just need to stop, even if you know you are right...

2 stroke

Drivers that drive that road every day could have difficulty decifering that junction, but watch out for the driver that is unfamiliar with that junction. The engineer that drew it up must have had something against cyclists.

**Timbuk2**

As said, the cyclist definitely has right of way, but it is dangerous.

If you are the cyclist, it would be safer to move out of the cycling lane into the prime position of the lane to go straight on (once it's clear to do so, depending on traffic speed etc, signal right before you move out if necessary) - this will prevent cars in that lane from overtaking you then immediately turning left across you. The fact that there's a cycle lane there means it may not be strictly legal to do this, but it definitely is safer (and you will be more predictable to motorists). Still keep an eye out for traffic which looks like it may turn left (cars slowing down, looking into the side road, don't just rely on idicators!)

cabrwab

I know from experiance this is a horrible junction for cars, cyclists especially, i would always try to give a cyclist right of way, you are after all crossing the lane they are in there is no yeild marking for the cyclists.

You know the people that drive at that junction everyday and the idiots that don't know were they are going.

I was watching that best form of defence is attack the other day, guy ran into the back of a polo and his first thing to do was give out to the guy in the polo for slammin on his brakes, eh the truck in front of him slammed on twit.

You were in the right OP, as you were cycling through, the person driving was in the wrong got a fright and blamed you.

Mycroft H

Another horribly designed cycle lane but the cyclist has the right of way.

BostonB

This is the problem of the cyclist keep left dogma.

Its not the safest thing to do mandatory cycle lane or not.

Move out into the car lane before the junction and make it difficult for cars to swing across you and cut you up.

UDP

This is a crazy way to design a junction and is asking for a cyclist to be killed.
What happens at night time when it is wet and hard to see the cycle lane goes straight on? What happends when the cycle lane eventually fades, gets covered with black marks/dirt making it hard to see? Madness!

The worst thing is how does a cyclist approach this junction? From what I can see the only safe way to do so is to leave the cycle lane and take over the driving lane otherwise there will be nothing but confusion if a cyclist tries to play it safe and slow down but then the driver knowing the cyclist has right of way slows down also.

Alanstrainor

**Timbuk2** wrote: »

As said, the cyclist definitely has right of way, but it is dangerous.

If you are the cyclist, it would be safer to move out of the cycling lane into the prime position of the lane to go straight on (once it's clear to do so, depending on traffic speed etc, signal right before you move out if necessary) - this will prevent cars in that lane from overtaking you then immediately turning left across you. The fact that there's a cycle lane there means it may not be strictly legal to do this, but it definitely is safer (and you will be more predictable to motorists). Still keep an eye out for traffic which looks like it may turn left (cars slowing down, looking into the side road, don't just rely on idicators!)

+1. This is the way to deal with this from a cyclists perspective, and is what I do in similar situations.

Anan1

The cycle lane sticks out like a sore thumb - it's even a different colour - I think you'd want to be one dope of a driver not to see it and know you had to yield to bikes on it. Just my 2c.