Displaying discs on the windscreen.

CiniO

I know it's obligatory to display Tax, Insurance, and NCT where applicable on the windscreen.

Do they however have to be really affixed to the windscreen?

I never liked the idea of sticking anything to the windscreen, as it's not a display panel, but something which must provide you with a clear view.
After moving to Ireland I was shocked that you must display 3 big discs over the windscreen. I was even more shocked when I saw how some people affix them, and how much it blocks their view.

Anyway - considering all those, I had a windscreen exchanged some time ago (after stone crack) and I didn't affix my discs yet. Today I came up with an idea, to affix them into a passengers sunvisior so they can be seen through the windscreen only when sunvisior is open. When my sunvisior is open, it doesn't block any more view through my windscreen than when previously disc holder was there on old windscreen.
Obviously I'm not planning to drive with my sunvisior open at all times. However I understand that discs must be visible only when someone wants to look at them, so I can always open my sunvisior if I get stopped by gardai or when I park my vehicle on a public road (which actually happens very seldom).

My understanding is that if I park my vehicle not on a public road (on my driveway, on private parking, supermarket parking, etc) there is no need to display discs, so I wouldn't display them there. I like that idea, as I never enjoyed that anyone could get my vehicle first registration date just by looking my NCT disc. Or get mine insurance policy number and make some fake claim without me even knowing about it. That way very few people will be able to see my discs. Also considering my car does nearly 1/3 of it's mileage abroad where I don't need to display those 3 discs, I'm more and more convinced it's a good idea.

Do you think I might be putting myself into any trouble by doing this?

Mycroft H

Not a bad idea Cinio. I might do it myself.

However I might buy one of these

djimi

I can almost guarantee that you will park on a public road sometime and forget to put the sun visor down. No tax disc displayed when parked on public ground can lead to a fine.

djimi

CiniO wrote: »

I never liked the idea of sticking anything to the windscreen, as it's not a display panel, but something which must provide you with a clear view.
After moving to Ireland I was shocked that you must display 3 big discs over the windscreen. I was even more shocked when I saw how some people affix them, and how much it blocks their view.

I really dont understand the problem if Im honest. I have my discs at the bottom of the windscreen on the passenger side and I wouldnt even know they are there unless I looked for them. Unless they are stuck in your line of sight on the drivers side I really dont see what the problem with sticking discs on the windscreen is. Its not like youre creating a massive blindspot with them.

keithclancy

I think the idea is so they can give you a ticket when your parked and not in the car.

Personally I think they look stupid, reminds me of some african banana republic type setup.

Heres its all off your reg.

CiniO

djimi wrote: »

I can almost guarantee that you will park on a public road sometime and forget to put the sun visor down. No tax disc displayed when parked on public ground can lead to a fine.

I really park very seldom on public roads.

djimi wrote: »

I really dont understand the problem if Im honest. I have my discs at the bottom of the windscreen on the passenger side and I wouldnt even know they are there unless I looked for them. Unless they are stuck in your line of sight on the drivers side I really dont see what the problem with sticking discs on the windscreen is. Its not like youre creating a massive blindspot with them.

Of course they are not creating massive blindspot, but they do block some view. The best position I found for them is in passengers top corner, but still they annoy me a bit.
Also other thing with anyone being able to read details from them is something I don't like.

Actually I already sticked them into my sunvisor after writing this thread, and I'm happy with the result. We'll see how it goes

woody33

A lad I know put up L plates yesterday and told me they have to be in the windscreen. Now they take up a lot of screen area. Magnetic ones on the bodywork like in normal countries are not allowed. (Of course he could be misinformed). In the days of 2 disks, I sometimes stuck them on the rear-view mirror, looking out.

CiniO

OSI wrote: »

The NCT disk at least has to be affixed to the windscreen. I'm sure the other discs are the same, but I can't be arsed searching for them.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2009/en/si/0548.html

So it looks like my plan is against the law.
However I already made it, and I'm going to chance driving like that for nearest future... I'll see how it goes. I actually don't assume any problems, as so far over 5 years driving in Ireland, I was pulled over by gardai who looked at my discs only once.

djimi

CiniO wrote: »

I really park very seldom on public roads.

You never use a public car park?

CiniO wrote: »

Of course they are not creating massive blindspot, but they do block some view. The best position I found for them is in passengers top corner, but still they annoy me a bit.
Also other thing with anyone being able to read details from them is something I don't like.

Im going to be honest of the five cars Ive owned in my life of driving not once has the disc holder ever blocked even the slightest meaningful part of my vision when driving. If you put them in the very bottom corner of the passenger side there is absolutely no way that you will know that they are there.

Each to their own though. You dont have a choice about having people reading the details (the reason they are there is so Gardai and other relevant parties can see your information), and even if they can then I really dont see what people are going to do with said details, but more power to you if you want to be awkward about! The first Garda you come across might not have much time for your explanation though...

mathepac

I fail to see the problem with the discs attached to the windscreen and Ireland is not the only country with requirements of this nature.

Yes, as per OSI above, NCT disc must be affixed to the windscreen, but the requirement for tax and insurance discs AFAIK is merely that they be "on display".

The insurance disc is a key one as the insurance details of a vehicle involved in an RTA must be available to Gardai and others involved, thus displayed prominently on the windscreen seems to be the optimal solution.

seamus

The insurance disc must also be displayed "on the windscreen" according to the regulations.

Not 100% on the tax disc, but the Road Traffic Act 2010 states that an NCT test must not be carried out unless the car has a valid tax disc displayed on the windscreen.

keithclancy

mathepac wrote: »

I fail to see the problem with the discs attached to the windscreen and Ireland is not the only country with requirements of this nature.

Yes, as per OSI above, NCT disc must be affixed to the windscreen, but the requirement for tax and insurance discs AFAIK is merely that they be "on display".

The insurance disc is a key one as the insurance details of a vehicle involved in an RTA must be available to Gardai and others involved, thus displayed prominently on the windscreen seems to be the optimal solution.

A Piece of paper on the Windscreen doesn't mean you have insurance, it means you have a piece of paper on the windscreen. Having a central database whos tax, insurance and NCT is up to date would be far better.

Worst you'd see in other Countries is a Tax Disc and maybe a parking permit, can think of anywhere else in the EU where an Insurance, Tax and Road Worthiness disc is required on the Windscreen.

CiniO

djimi wrote: »

You never use a public car park?

I live in a very rural country side, so I use public car parks very seldom.

Im going to be honest of the five cars Ive owned in my life of driving not once has the disc holder ever blocked even the slightest meaningful part of my vision when driving. If you put them in the very bottom corner of the passenger side there is absolutely no way that you will know that they are there.

Passenger side bottom position is the most annoying for me. All cars I bought had discs displayed there, and it was always obstructing my view. Maybe it's because I like to have my seat as low as possible, and therefore sit as low as possible.

Each to their own though. You dont have a choice about having people reading the details (the reason they are there is so Gardai and other relevant parties can see your information), and even if they can then I really dont see what people are going to do with said details,

I heard on this forum of situation where someone when renewing insurance got a NCB statement and there was a claim against his insurance about which he didn't know. Availing insurance number to anyone IMHO puts you at risk.
Also NCT disc reveals exact date of first registration, and with this date anyone can actually log into NCT booking site, and book, cancel or rebook your NCT. Find out your details, etc.
Generally I don't want anyone to be able to read my discs.

I know I have to display them when parked on public road, but I think I don't need to display them when I park in private place, like private parking or supermarket parking. Am I right about it?

but more power to you if you want to be awkward about! The first Garda you come across might not have much time for your explanation though...

Whenever I see garda I'll flip my sun visor down and here they go - all my discs displayed

Mycroft H

You could get a real anal garda who will fine you for non displayal of the tax disc etc....

keithclancy

OSI wrote: »

I find it very difficult to believe that the first a driver heard about a claim against their insurance was when they got their NCB cert. In fact I would go as far as to say it's impossible.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056554553

creedp

djimi wrote: »

I really dont understand the problem if Im honest. I have my discs at the bottom of the windscreen on the passenger side and I wouldnt even know they are there unless I looked for them. Unless they are stuck in your line of sight on the drivers side I really dont see what the problem with sticking discs on the windscreen is. Its not like youre creating a massive blindspot with them.

I agree with this view. I can't see how 2 discs on the bottom passenger side corner of the windscreen cause a problematic blindspot. Granted they might look stupid but that's a seperate issue. I have 3 discs at present and will have 4 once car is NCT'd - the 4th one being a residential parking permit. I can assure you that is prominantly displayed as I don't want to be clamped. Rather than have 4 discs on bottom corner i have 2 at bottom and 2 at top corner. I also have a L plate on the top corner for the OH so all in all pretty conjested but doesn't create a blindspot problem. I think there is a difference here between not displaying discs becasue they cause a blindspot and not displaying because I simply don't like doing so.

djimi

CiniO wrote: »

I heard on this forum of situation where someone when renewing insurance got a NCB statement and there was a claim against his insurance about which he didn't know. Availing insurance number to anyone IMHO puts you at risk.
Also NCT disc reveals exact date of first registration, and with this date anyone can actually log into NCT booking site, and book, cancel or rebook your NCT. Find out your details, etc.
Generally I don't want anyone to be able to read my discs.

Im fairly sure I could make a claim against you using your reg number if I wanted to. If I make a claim against you through my insurance then they can get your details anyway, so I dont see how stopping people seeing your disc will stop this happening.

Im not really sure what someone can get from my NCT disc. All it has are the date the last test was taken and the date the NCT expires; neither of which are enough to log into the NCT website (which needs a booking ID or the date of the first registration; neither of which are on the disc).

Yakuza

CiniO wrote: »

Passenger side bottom position is the most annoying for me. All cars I bought had discs displayed there, and it was always obstructing my view. Maybe it's because I like to have my seat as low as possible, and therefore sit as low as possible.

I would say you're far in the minority of people if something on the far left of the screen would obstruct your view. My discs are there, and they barely register in my field of vision. Does your steering wheel also block your view?

With respect, I think that sitting down low in a car is not the safest position to be driving from, and I usually only see old ladies or boy racers doing it (and I'm not for a second suggesting that you're either of those )

djimi

Yakuza wrote: »

I would say you're far in the minority of people if something on the far left of the screen would obstruct your view. My discs are there, and they barely register in my field of vision. Does your steering wheel also block your view?

With respect, I think that sitting down low in a car is not the safest position to be driving from, and I usually only see old ladies or boy racers doing it (and I'm not for a second suggesting that you're either of those )

Agreed. If the disc holder is blocking your view then chances are the dashboard also is...!

keithclancy

Yakuza wrote: »

I would say you're far in the minority of people if something on the far left of the screen would obstruct your view. My discs are there, and they barely register in my field of vision. Does your steering wheel also block your view?

With respect, I think that sitting down low in a car is not the safest position to be driving from, and I usually only see old ladies or boy racers doing it (and I'm not for a second suggesting that you're either of those )

Well I'm with him so its more than one, my car doesn't have any Discs on the Window, I prefer it.

Seems kind of pointless anyway, they eliminated paper here because it was so easy to make fake copies.

Plus having more information about yourself on display is unnecessary.

Also, I don't need to wait for any stuff to come in the post before I can drive on the road.

listermint

keithclancy wrote: »

Well I'm with him so its more than one, my car doesn't have any Discs on the Window, I prefer it.

Seems kind of pointless anyway, they eliminated paper here because it was so easy to make fake copies.

Plus having more information about yourself on display is unnecessary.

Also, I don't need to wait for any stuff to come in the post before I can drive on the road.

it is if you want to abide by current regulations.

Have to agree with other posters, They dont obstruct anything. I have a black Holder and it blends directly into the dash. A big white one that most people have might catch your eye but black? not a chance.

Anyway youd want to be unbelievabley short for it to obstruct any view its just not plausible that it inhibits eyesight.

Yakuza

I agree that the windscreen would be better off without the discs in them (the relevant authorites can get any info they need now with ANPR) so I'd welcome not having to display them, but I just think that citing their being a blind spot *when in the bottom left of the windscreen* is not a particularly good reason. If I removed the holder that's in my car now, and while in my normal driving postion looked through the windscreen at that point, most of what I would see is my bonnet.

cruizer101

djimi wrote: »

Im not really sure what someone can get from my NCT disc. All it has are the date the last test was taken and the date the NCT expires; neither of which are enough to log into the NCT website (which needs a booking ID or the date of the first registration; neither of which are on the disc).

NCT goes from the date of first registration so the expiry date will match up with that, when I was booking my NCT I got all the details I need of the disk. So it is true from my disk someone could have booked me in for an NCT or could potentially change the date of my currently booked one.

creedp

keithclancy wrote: »

Well I'm with him so its more than one, my car doesn't have any Discs on the Window, I prefer it.

Seems kind of pointless anyway, they eliminated paper here because it was so easy to make fake copies.

Plus having more information about yourself on display is unnecessary.

Also, I don't need to wait for any stuff to come in the post before I can drive on the road.

I think a lot of people would prefer not to have them there but are of the opinion they are required to be there. I'd prefer a tax/insurance/nct disc on my wind screen that take the risk of an unnecessary fine. I'd also prefer the parking disc to avoid clamping. If someone told me there was no longer any need for these bits on paper then I'd be the first to take them down. This reminds me of a humorous comment by the great Bertie Ahern a couple of years back concerning e-voting in which he said we were the laughing stock of Europe with our pencils and paper until he was reminded that most EU countries continue to use the pencil and paper for voting.

keithclancy

listermint wrote: »

it is if you want to abide by current regulations.

Have to agree with other posters, They dont obstruct anything. I have a black Holder and it blends directly into the dash. A big white one that most people have might catch your eye but black? not a chance.

Anyway youd want to be unbelievabley short for it to obstruct any view its just not plausible that it inhibits eyesight.

No its not, becuase there is no regulation here stating you have to have proof of anything on your windscreen.

djimi

cruizer101 wrote: »

NCT goes from the date of first registration so the expiry date will match up with that, when I was booking my NCT I got all the details I need of the disk. So it is true from my disk someone could have booked me in for an NCT or could potentially change the date of my currently booked one.

Fair enough. What about an import? Youd have the day and month, but not the year surely?

listermint

keithclancy wrote: »

No its not, becuase there is no regulation here stating you have to have proof of anything on your windscreen.

??

Other posters have all ready given you links stating otherwise (Irish compliance btw)

djimi

keithclancy wrote: »

No its not, becuase there is no regulation here stating you have to have proof of anything on your windscreen.

Hes assuming you are in Ireland. There mightnt be regulations where you are but there are in Ireland.

Henry Ford III

How many windscreen discs are there in other countries like Poland for example?

Yakuza

In Spain, you're only required to display the ITV (NCT equivalent) in the window (and the insurance schedule should be in the car, normally it's kept in the glovebox). Not sure how old a car has to be before the tests kick in, but a new car would, in theory, have nothing.

fletch

I moved mine to the top of my windscreen. The windscreen has a sun visor built in (from the factory) at the top so at a quick glance from the outside you wouldn't spot the discs. Looks a lot neater than having them at the bottom IMO

Mr.David

I put mine all the way up in the top corner passenger side of the windscreen. Obstruct my view less and look neater imo.

keithclancy

listermint wrote: »

??

Other posters have all ready given you links stating otherwise (Irish compliance btw)

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=77742898&postcount=6

Henry Ford III

Henry Ford III wrote: »

How many windscreen discs are there in other countries like Poland for example?

In Poland there seem to be a sticker showing reg number of the vehicle. In Finland, and I would like to think in some other countries too, it's explicitly forbidden to stick anything at all on the windscreen (apart from a small tax disc that used to be around for a couple of years in mid-90's). Garmin etc. come with a dash disc for the GPS mount that has to be used.

I find the dash mounted pieces of paper waste of time too. Even with the discs the guards have a habit of asking one to show insurance at local station pretty much defeating the purpose for a valid disc.

As a side note about GPS: Having one placed incorrectly can be a real hazard. It's quite shocking to sometimes see people driving with a glaring display in bright day mode at night time bang on the middle of line of driver's sight.

piperh

seamus wrote: »

Not 100% on the tax disc, but the Road Traffic Act 2010 states that an NCT test must not be carried out unless the car has a valid tax disc displayed on the windscreen.

Ok but this negates itself surely, as you need an NCT to get tax so if the NCT has expired you can't tax it therefore you can't NCT it??

slimjimmc

piperh wrote: »

Ok but this negates itself surely, as you need an NCT to get tax so if the NCT has expired you can't tax it therefore you can't NCT it??

You don't.


As for the OP not parking in a public park does that include any public place where the public have access with vehicles, such as privately owned shop car parks, filling stations, garage forecourts, etc.
I have my 3 discs displayed in the top left corner and they never interfere with my view. In fact the biggest obstacle is the mirror.

_Kaiser_

To be fair to the OP I can kind of see his point. Two discs aren't so bad, but add on the NCT "disc" and now my new NCPS permit disc and the bottom left of my windscreen is starting to get a bit cluttered! I have them as low as I can get them though so they don't obstruct the view at least.

What I find worse though is people who have them displayed vertically "northern style" along the side, or horizontally along the top left.. can't imagine how they see things like traffic/filter lights at junctions, or round corners etc easily.

CiniO

Yakuza wrote: »

I would say you're far in the minority of people if something on the far left of the screen would obstruct your view. My discs are there, and they barely register in my field of vision. Does your steering wheel also block your view?

No, steering wheel doesn't
I never said they make any huge obstruction, but they do obstruct a bit, so it's annoying for me.
Also take note that I drive a good bit on the Continent in right hand traffic, so I need better view to the left.

With respect, I think that sitting down low in a car is not the safest position to be driving from,

I always liked that position. That's the least tiring for me, with my legs nearly straight when pressing pedals, and steering wheel as low as possible as well.

and I usually only see old ladies or boy racers doing it (and I'm not for a second suggesting that you're either of those )

I'm definitely not an old lady. And depends what's the definition of boy-racer, as without knowing this I never could find out if I'm one of them

slimjimmc

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

To be fair to the OP I can kind of see his point. Two discs aren't so bad, but add on the NCT "disc" and now my new NCPS permit disc and the bottom left of my windscreen is starting to get a bit cluttered! I have them as low as I can get them though so they don't obstruct the view at least.

What I find worse though is people who have them displayed vertically "northern style" along the side, or horizontally along the top left.. can't imagine how they see things like traffic/filter lights at junctions, or round corners etc easily.

Horizontally top left is not a problem for me even at traffic lights and certainly not on corners (baffled why you'd even think that). If your view of traffic lights is blocked by something on your top left then you're far far too close to the lights in the first place.
It's less intrusive than having your passenger sun visor down.

CiniO

djimi wrote: »

Agreed. If the disc holder is blocking your view then chances are the dashboard also is...!

It's dark now, but I'll try to take some sample pictures tomorrow with and without disc holder so you will see what's the difference.

_Kaiser_

slimjimmc wrote: »

Horizontally top left is not a problem for me even at traffic lights and certainly not on corners (baffled why you'd even think that). If your view of traffic lights is blocked by something on your top left then you're far far too close to the lights in the first place.
It's less intrusive than having your passenger sun visor down.

Suppose it also depends how close you're sitting to the windscreen as well. Never been caught in traffic at a set of lights when the car in front decided they weren't going to make it through after all (even though they would have easily made it) and are sitting in the yellow box with the car behind you so close as to make reversing impossible then?

That said I do 99% motorway driving where traffic lights, junctions and anything beyond a gentle left/right lane change is unnecessary

CiniO

djimi wrote: »

Fair enough. What about an import? Youd have the day and month, but not the year surely?

Imported cars were due NCT in accordance with their first registration in home country, so you can read it from two first digits of their number plate.
That's true that regulations changed something around 2010, and imports from after that, you can't say what year it is.
But so far there's only 3 choices (2010,2011 and 2012, so it's very easy to guess.

CiniO

Henry Ford III wrote: »

How many windscreen discs are there in other countries like Poland for example?

In Poland since 1999 you have to display a little sticker with your registration number (the same as on numberplate) in right bottom corner of your windscreen. I also consider it total nonsense, however this sticker is only about half size of NCT disc (same width but half height), so it doesn't obstruct a view that much as 3 big discs, but I agree it's the same annoying.

CiniO

slimjimmc wrote: »

You don't.


As for the OP not parking in a public park does that include any public place where the public have access with vehicles, such as privately owned shop car parks, filling stations, garage forecourts, etc.

No it doesn't include those. I park in such places very often actually.
However I don't think you need to display any discs when parked there, but I might be wrong.

I have my 3 discs displayed in the top left corner and they never interfere with my view. In fact the biggest obstacle is the mirror.

I always used to have them there as well, as I found this to be the least obstructing place. But I just thought about other idea, that's why I started this thread.

mathepac

keithclancy wrote: »

A Piece of paper on the Windscreen doesn't mean you have insurance, it means you have a piece of paper on the windscreen. Having a central database whos tax, insurance and NCT is up to date would be far better.....

I there was I thinking that the thread was about bits of paper on the wind-screen. Thanks for clearing that up for me; sorry I wandered off topic.

CiniO

seamus wrote: »

but the Road Traffic Act 2010 states that an NCT test must not be carried out unless the car has a valid tax disc displayed on the windscreen.

I never heard about it.
I did my NCT some time ago without valid tax disc, and there wasn't any problem.

slimjimmc

CiniO wrote: »

No it doesn't include those. I park in such places very often actually.
However I don't think you need to display any discs when parked there, but I might be wrong.

I always used to have them there as well, as I found this to be the least obstructing place. But I just thought about other idea, that's why I started this thread.

I'd say all of those places fall under the definition of a public place according to the Road Traffic Act in which case normal traffic law applies in the same way as on the public road.

b) any street, road or other place to which the public have access with vehicles whether as of right or by permission and whether subject to or free of charge

CiniO

slimjimmc wrote: »

I'd say all of those places fall under the definition of a public place according to the Road Traffic Act in which case normal traffic law applies in the same way as on the public road.

From what I remember tax disc is required to be displayed on vehicles used on public roads. (not public place).
I don't think NCT disc must be displayed on parked car.
And I'm not sure about insurance disc, if it must be displayed only if car is parked on public road, or in public place as well.

Ninap

Completely agree with op re clutter and blindspot. Sometimes even a minor impediment to visibility can make a big difference (eg, picking up the kids at school). Add in the extra parking permits and the average person's tendency not to pick the optimum place to locate the discs and you have a problem. If every country does something in a different way to Ireland, its usually the case that Ireland has it arseways. Simple answer is to make it necessary to furnish valid insurance and NCT to get a tax disc and just display that.

slimjimmc

CiniO wrote: »

From what I remember tax disc is required to be displayed on vehicles used on public roads. (not public place).
I don't think NCT disc must be displayed on parked car.
And I'm not sure about insurance disc, if it must be displayed only if car is parked on public road, or in public place as well.

Insurance disc definitely must be display on windscreen when the car is used in a public place (not just a public road) . See par 4 of SI 227/1986

corktina

scraping the bottom of the barrell for interesting posts now aren't we!