Clinton to certify Egypt eligible for U.S. Military Aid

geeman

In spite of tensions with Egypt over its recent crackdown on democracy support groups, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton will issue a national security waiver allowing $1.3 billion in foreign military financing to flow again to the Cairo government, a senior State Department official told CNN.

Clinton to certify Egypt eligible for U.S. aid

Egypt officials expect U.S. to unblock military aid

U.S. Prepares to Continue Egypt Military Aid Amid Dispute

Essam el-Erian is the vice chairman of majority ruling party 'Freedom and Justice Party' AKA Muslim Brotherhood.

According to the ADL, he once said:

"My dream is to live together as we did before the state of Israel… Americans and Europeans exported the conflict created by Hitler to our land.

he also said.

Israel cannot tolerate peace… Because they want to live in war. It is the history of Jewish people.

another also said of Israel..

"We do not recognize Israel at all. It is a raping, occupying, criminal enemy entity"

"The Egyptian nation supports and welcomes Iran's anti-Zionist stance because the two nations view the formation of the Zionist regime on the Palestinian territories as a brutal act and against the interests of the regional nations and Muslims."

:confused:

I'm completely confused here....WHY on earth would the US be giving $1.3 billion in military aid to a regime which is clearly Anti-Israeli?

Someone care to help me figure this one out?
The mind boggles..

wes

The US wouldn't be the first world power to hedge there bets. However, its likely to keep the Egyptian military dependent on aid, so they can't attack anyone with out the say so of the US.

geeman

Just thinking about Pakistan and all the military aid they received from the US.
The latest story seems counterproductive to Israeli security and US interests over the long term.

Come to think of it, all the Arab spring uprisings seem counterproductive to Israeli security.

May be something bigger brewing..given all the rhetoric, it would make sense for Egypt to fight on the side of Iran if there was an attack by US/Israel.

wes

geeman wrote: »

Just thinking about Pakistan and all the military aid they received from the US.

The US and Pakistan, have some of the same interests, but at the same time, they have quite a few different ones, which causes issues between them.

geeman wrote: »

The latest story seems counterproductive to Israeli security and US interests over the long term.

I would disagree, taking 1 side in the conflict has actually been detremental to US interests in the ME. US and Israeli interests are not one and the same. The US is still hugely pro-Israel, and throwing military funding at the Egyptian military is probably more an attempt to control them, then going against Israeli security.

geeman wrote: »

Come to think of it, all the Arab spring uprisings seem counterproductive to Israeli security.

Why should the ME be viewed soley through the prism of Israeli security? I think views like created a distorted view of the region, where only Israel deserves security and peace. Surely that is something everyone deserves.

geeman wrote: »

May be something bigger brewing..given all the rhetoric, it would make sense for Egypt to fight on the side of Iran if there was an attack by US/Israel.

Egypt won't get involved in any conflict between Israel and Iran. I doubt the US wants to be involved in such a stupid conflict either, but they may be dragged in, as there complete support for Israel, may have the Iranians consider the US complicit in any attack. Which again is another point against completely taking one side in the conflict that wouldn't involve the US, if they didn't support one side.

bmaxi

Probably the General Mc Carthy philosopy. It's also the case that the U.S. is very wary of China's growing influence in the area.
Rumour has it that the Obama administration is becoming increasingly pissed off with the Israeli attitude to the Palestinian problem, maybe they're looking for a new buddy.:)

geeman

wes wrote:

Why should the ME be viewed soley through the prism of Israeli security? I think views like created a distorted view of the region, where only Israel deserves security and peace. Surely that is something everyone deserves.

Well, the uprisings were reputed to result in "freedom" and "democracy" being established ...everything would be perfect, however very little has changed at all, much like nothing has changed in some of the Ex-Soviet states that went through the color revolutions.

Libya is a complete mess right now with lots of weapons flooding out of the country into the hands of Israeli enemies.

If Syria were to collapse tomorrow, I'm sure a lot of their arsenal would end up with Israeli enemies too.

I'm just wondering why there's so much support for the uprisings which result in outflow of sophisticated weapons from these destroyed states ...surely that must harm Israeli security?

Take Saudi Arabia for example, their authoritarian regime propped up by the US for decades in return for cheap oil in dollars must enrage the local Saudi people...how long before they have a revolution?

When the oil starts to run out, can't imagine a smooth transition to democracy there

They'll have access to billions of dollars in weapons, thanks mainly to the US.

wes

geeman wrote: »

Well, the uprisings were reputed to result in "freedom" and "democracy" being established ...everything would be perfect, however very little has changed at all, much like nothing has changed in some of the Ex-Soviet states that went through the color revolutions.

Very few people expected things to change over night. Democracy will take time to work, and there will be set backs. It may take decades for things to change, but at least the possibility for change exists now.

geeman wrote: »

Libya is a complete mess right now with lots of weapons flooding out of the country into the hands of Israeli enemies.

Libya is certainly a mess, but I haven't head of weapons flooding out. I think that while some people are overly positive in regards to these revolutions, there are at the same time those who are overly pessimistic.

geeman wrote: »

If Syria were to collapse tomorrow, I'm sure a lot of their arsenal would end up with Israeli enemies too.

You seem to only think Israel matters, and are viewed everything in regards to Israel. This is imho creates a contorted view of the region. Everything isn't about Israel.

geeman wrote: »

I'm just wondering why there's so much support for the uprisings which result in outflow of sophisticated weapons from these destroyed states ...surely that must harm Israeli security?

You assume that everyone has the same view of the region as only being about Israel. Again, not everything is about Israel.

geeman wrote: »

Take Saudi Arabia for example, their authoritarian regime propped up by the US for decades in return for cheap oil in dollars must enrage the local Saudi people...how long before they have a revolution?

When the oil starts to run out, can't imagine a smooth transition to democracy there

The Saudi regime seems perfectly secure in the short term. I can't really make any long term predictions.

geeman wrote: »

They'll have access to billions of dollars in weapons, thanks mainly to the US.

The US has pretty much armed everyone in the region. They do it for the weapon sales.

RichieC

It's amazing that they're killing each other in the states over programs to help each other yet there's never a national debate on this kind of spending. One would think they're being manipulated by something or other.

wes

RichieC wrote: »

It's amazing that they're killing each other in the states over programs to help each other yet there's never a national debate on this kind of spending. One would think they're being manipulated by something or other.

A lot of the military aid to Israel, Egypt, Pakistan etc are spent on American weapons (i think that may be a condition), so it can be seen as a subsidy for there weapons industry.

Cork boy 55

Egypt was intially a soviet client state. before 1970's
After the various wars between 1967 and 1973
Which resulted in tens of thousand of deaths
, intermittant closure of the Suez canal and the 1973 oil crisis

There was a peace treaty between Egypt and Israel in 1979 brokered by the USA, the U.S. has provided Egypt with Mil Aid and twice as much economic aid ever since as part of the peace settlement.

The USA has to deal with the Egypt as it is and not as it would like it to be
And the USA has always pushed Egypt on human rights and reform (read wikileaks cables)
The USA taxpayer by giving weapons and AID to egypt as part of the peace deal ensures the free movement of shipping lanes and secure oil supplies for Ireland and others and as well as substaning peace in the region.

Arms and USA taxpayers money for Peace.

BlaasForRafa

RichieC wrote: »

It's amazing that they're killing each other in the states over programs to help each other yet there's never a national debate on this kind of spending. One would think they're being manipulated by something or other.

What, is it a c********y by any chance?

geeman

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

What, is it a c********y by any chance?

You could start by enlightening the rest of us with your high powered perception of the middle east and why the US are so interested in it.

Does it make sense to arm every single middle eastern country hostile to Israel if you're pro-israel? ...could you explain the long term strategy here with weaponizing the ME? I'm genuinely interested!

You can atleast agree that Saudi Arabia isn't free country, yes?
So why sell $60 billion of weapons to them?

Is that going to bring stability in the ME?

RichieC

What's c********y meant to be anyway?

geeman

RichieC wrote: »

What's c********y meant to be anyway?

It's the standard response from the highly intellectual, misunderstood clique of ME analysts here.

geeman

wes wrote: »

Very few people expected things to change over night. Democracy will take time to work, and there will be set backs. It may take decades for things to change, but at least the possibility for change exists now.

Agreed. It will take a lot of time but It hasn't started well in Libya specifically with an outflow of weapons which were provided to Gaddafi by Eurozone countries 5 years prior to his removal.

If it weren't for the "rogue rebels" that killed Gen. Abdul Fattah Younis there might have been a chance for Libya.

I'm not entirely convinced outside influences didn't have a role in his death considering we now know special forces from the UK were on the ground the whole time.

When this claim was made a year ago, most people dismissed it as CT but we now know special forces such as SAS were on the ground.

Libya is certainly a mess, but I haven't head of weapons flooding out. I think that while some people are overly positive in regards to these revolutions, there are at the same time those who are overly pessimistic.

Well, I've read reports of weapons flowing into Egypt, Niger and other African nations.

"Arms were stolen in Libya and are being disseminated all over the region," President Mahamadou Issoufou told reporters following a meeting with South Africa's President Jacob Zuma. "Saharan countries are facing terrorist threats, arms and criminal trafficking. The Libya crisis is amplifying those crises."

Israeli intelligence also indicates that Hezbollah have got Gaddafis old SAM (Surface to Air Missiles)

All this amounts to further compromising Israeli security because these weapons would not normally be sold to their enemies...I think it's safe to say Israel is more under threat with the destabilization of further ME countries such as Syria or indeed Saudi Arabia.

You seem to only think Israel matters, and are viewed everything in regards to Israel. This is imho creates a contorted view of the region. Everything isn't about Israel.

No, not at all. I'm just trying to find reason to support destabilizing countries in the ME and North Africa if you're pro-Israeli.

If I were pro-Israeli, I wouldn't be selling weapons to countries hostile towards Israel that could in future become destabilized or decide to use those weapons against Israel...that's all, just trying to understand if there's something more behind it all than just making money.

You assume that everyone has the same view of the region as only being about Israel. Again, not everything is about Israel.

Well, If I did, It wasn't intended.

The Saudi regime seems perfectly secure in the short term. I can't really make any long term predictions.

Short term, yes but long term, absolutely not.
Saudi Arabian people live in poverty and are only happy to keep quiet so long as the oil continues to flow, at some point that will come to an end.

I think even Israel would agree with me as they opposed the sale of weapons to SA from US

Last year, Israel tried to prevent the contract going through, fearing it would undermine its air force superiority.

The US has pretty much armed everyone in the region. They do it for the weapon sales.

But is it really all just about money? If you're pro-Israeli, you don't arm their enemies.

SamHarris

wes wrote: »

A lot of the military aid to Israel, Egypt, Pakistan etc are spent on American weapons (i think that may be a condition), so it can be seen as a subsidy for there weapons industry.

It is usually, although I read somewhere that Israel's is only partly tied to certain American products. The benefits for the US are manyfold, and given their relative superiority the dangers are minimal.



Being "pro-Israel" certainly does not preclude you from having strong military ties with other countries that are not and have not been at war with Israel for decades. I cant imagine why it would.