Ugh, Saorview - help!

Zascar

Hey guys, I would really appreciate some help here. My parents live in the country in Gorey where there is no cable - and the ariel reception is awful. A couple of years ago they got a guy up who fitted a satellite dish and put two sky boxes in each of the rooms to pick up the free to air channels. (Parents will not pay a Sky subscription). Thing is the system is awful. You need to use the TV for the Irish channels, and then switch over to the Sky box for the UK channels - horrible and I have no idea why it is so complicated.

So, I told them to get Saorview hoping it would be really simple. they did it without consulting me first, and all the guy did was put in another box on top of the sky box, so now they have four remotes and a system that is even more complex than before. They cannot use it - they are hopefully with technology and have already taken it out.

I thought they could get rid of the Sky box, and basically have the Saorview give them 20 or so channels on one remote. Surely there is an easier solution than this?? I have never used Saorview so can anyone advise what is the best solution to make it as easy as possible? My mum still uses the VCR every day and wants to keep this.

I really need someone who can help them out and put in a really simple and straight forward system. Any suggestions anyone?
Thanks

Lord Derpington

First off Saorview will not give you 20 or so channels, it will give you at present;

RTÉ One
RTÉ Two HD
TV3
TG4
RTÉ News Now/Euronews (Timeshares)
3e
RTÉjr / RTÉ One +1. (Timeshares)

It sounds to me what you want is a box like this that will allow you to watch both Saorview and freesat on the same box.

Saorview requires an aerial, which I assume the other installer fitted or there was one in place, and Freesat a satellite dish. So this box should fit snugly into the your situation.

Zascar

Ahh ok - thanks so much Lord Derpington. Ok I did not know that, I though saorview boxes acted as a combo anyway. Seems odd that most guys would not just put in a combo box to make things easier.

Ok great, I called that guy Tony on Satellite.ie - really helpful, I think that box seems what they need. Is there any others I should consider or am I ok to just go and get that one?
Thanks

Ronnie Raygun

Bear in mind that these combo boxes are "free to air" (FTA) receivers. "Freesat" only applies to receivers branded as such intended for the UK market (work fine here though).

Freesat receivers have a proper EPG & will automatically carry out retunes of satellite channels when the need arises, as indeed do the Sky boxes you currently have installed. A FTA box won't do this & will need to be retuned manually, although the main channels don't seem to change frequency much.

Zascar

Hmm ok. Can I ask what is the difference between freesat and free to air? Is one better than the other?

My parents are only really interested in the standard bbc/itv channels - no need for anything more but any discovery/history type channels etc would be nice if possible.

The EPG is not essential as they use the paper and "Up and down" on the remote to change channel - however whichever is easier to use is what is desired - just in case they ever do start to use it.

How hard is it to do the retuning?

Thanks again for the help

Ronnie Raygun

Assuming the Sky boxes are standard def. & your next receiver is HD, the only new channels you'll get will be the BBC, ITV & C4 HD channels.

Retuning is simple enough & a combo certainly seems the best solution here.

Should also mention that there is currently only 1 Saorview approved combo; the Triax TSC114, with another from Walker expected in the near future.

watty

Zascar wrote: »

Ahh ok - thanks so much Lord Derpington. Ok I did not know that, I though saorview boxes acted as a combo anyway. Seems odd that most guys would not just put in a combo box to make things easier.

Because there are:

• Zero true PVR combos (2 x DTT tuners, 2 x Sat Tuners and internal HDD)
• Zero true Freesat HD Combos (A real "Freesat HD" box is FAR better)
• There is only one recently certified Combo. It's not "Freesat", just generic Satellite.
• Combos are more expensive
• Only one Combo is properly compatible with Saorview, none are "Freesat HD".
• Recording is only a "feature", no Combo is real PVR.

Zascar

Ok thanks. Well HD is not an issue, they would not even be able to see the difference! DVR is not important either, it took me years to teach them how to use a VCR I'm going to stick with that... So really I think the Ferguson HD Ariva 120 will be fine for what they need - are there any others I should consider? It really is simplicity and easy of use that are important - I don't want to have to go down and teach them how to use it every week!

The Cush

Zascar wrote: »

DVR is not important either, it took me years to teach them how to use a VCR I'm going to stick with that...

In 6 months a DVR may become important with analogue switchoff happening. To continue using the VCR after that date it will have to be attached to a Saorview STB via scart with the VCR set to record from the scart input with the the Saorview STB set to the correct channel.

By that time Saorview approved recorders will hopefully be available.

In either case it will be a whole new learning process for them.

A Saorview approved TV would overcome the problem of having another STB under the TV for the moment and make things easier for now. Come the 24th Oct the VCR could be replaced by a saorview PVR.

watty

Zascar wrote: »

Ok thanks. Well HD is not an issue, they would not even be able to see the difference! DVR is not important either, it took me years to teach them how to use a VCR I'm going to stick with that... So really I think the Ferguson HD Ariva 120 will be fine for what they need - are there any others I should consider? It really is simplicity and easy of use that are important - I don't want to have to go down and teach them how to use it every week!

Freesat HD box is better for UK channels than the Ariva.

Also the Ariva lacks full Saorview compatibility. It's selling point isn't simplicity (especially if there are UK satellite channel changes, or you want BBC Interactive for Wimbledon Olympics etc). , but having Irish and UK channels in one cheap box.

HD is only an issue in the sense that some channels are ONLY transmitted in an HD format.

STB

watty wrote: »

Freesat HD box is better for UK channels than the Ariva.

Also the Ariva lacks full Saorview compatibility. It's selling point isn't simplicity (especially if there are UK satellite channel changes, or you want BBC Interactive for Wimbledon Olympics etc). , but having Irish and UK channels in one cheap box.

HD is only an issue in the sense that some channels are ONLY transmitted in an HD format.

The man wants ONE box with ONE remote for his parents. He does not want 2 boxes and switching source scenarios. They also dont want freesat menus to confuse them even further.

I know exactly where he is coming from. Some people dont want to know about technology and dont care, they just want to watch the stations.

They want to watch Coronation Street, Eastenders, Fair City, the 6 & 9 O'Clock news, Prime Time, Late Late Show and odd bit of Horse racing on Ch4 and bit of sport on RTE/TG4. The want ALL of that on one remote with a simple + and - buttons to change the channels. They DONT want True DVR etc etc.

Thats why Combo boxes are the ideal solution.

They are simplistic to use. Freesat boxes and source switching is not a viable alternative. Combo boxes have all the channels programmed in sequential order according to how you want to taste. And Combos are not more expensive, they are €95, some Saorview boxes are being sold for this price alone.

Also BTW BBC Interactive streams are broadcast as seperate TV channels and can be added to his list of 50 or so channels.

To the OP yes, on Combo boxes you can mix the Saorview Channels and the BBCs etc in one channel list and they will easily go up and down the channels via simple buttons.

Occasionally you will have to retune the satellite stations for them as sometimes they move them around.

Zascar

Thanks STB, yes you are totally correct. 10 or so channels on "Up and Down" on the remote, and being able to use the VCR is all they want. Anything more is just a reason for them to get confused and want me to come down and sort it out! I was getting pretty confused myself there - although I'm fairly techy I know very little about Satellite. Just to clarify, will there be a stage where recording via VCR & Scart not work, or will I be ok with this combo box for the future?
Thanks

Zascar

Lads two more questions if I may. How does this work with getting it to the TV's in the other rooms? Also, I'm told there are Saorview compatible TV's - but these I guess will only get the Irish channels, are there any tv's that get both Saorview and Free to Air?

Maybe pushing them to get sky would be easier in the long run. The problem I see is that (and I may be wrong here) If you only have a basic package the channels are miles apart and the on screen guide shows them all of them. Anyone's house I've ever been in I've never seen the menu/guide with just the channels they have and watch it. I know that would drive them nuts, which would have them driving me nuts!

Ugh, parents! :rolleyes:

dodzy

Zascar wrote: »

Lads two more questions if I may. How does this work with getting it to the TV's in the other rooms? Also, I'm told there are Saorview compatible TV's - but these I guess will only get the Irish channels, are there any tv's that get both Saorview and Free to Air?

Maybe pushing them to get sky would be easier in the long run. The problem I see is that (and I may be wrong here) If you only have a basic package the channels are miles apart and the on screen guide shows them all of them. Anyone's house I've ever been in I've never seen the menu/guide with just the channels they have and watch it. I know that would drive them nuts, which would have them driving me nuts!

Ugh, parents! :rolleyes:

All due respect zascar, you will be complicating the issue, and the budget, looking at tvs with integrated satellite tuners.

Get the combo box. Arrange the channels to your liking in one list. Rte1, rte2, tv3, bbc1, bbc2, itv, ch4........... You get the idea. Store the list. Each time they power on the tv, they just move the channel up /down ( a quick display of what's on will display and quickly dissapear ) and that's it, your job is done. With the exception of the rare sat relocation of one of your folks mainstream channels, you're laughing.

Don't under estimate the parents ability to find their feet either. When it comes to their soaps or the old mans sport fix at the weekend, they'll find their channel quick enough, believe me, I've seen it more than once;)

wil

Zascar wrote: »

Hey guys, I would really appreciate some help here. My parents live in the country in Gorey where there is no cable - and the ariel reception is awful. A couple of years ago they got a guy up who fitted a satellite dish and put two sky boxes in each of the rooms to pick up the free to air channels. (Parents will not pay a Sky subscription). Thing is the system is awful. You need to use the TV for the Irish channels, and then switch over to the Sky box for the UK channels - horrible and I have no idea why it is so complicated.

So, I told them to get Saorview hoping it would be really simple. they did it without consulting me first, and all the guy did was put in another box on top of the sky box, so now they have four remotes and a system that is even more complex than before. They cannot use it - they are hopefully with technology and have already taken it out.

I thought they could get rid of the Sky box, and basically have the Saorview give them 20 or so channels on one remote. Surely there is an easier solution than this?? I have never used Saorview so can anyone advise what is the best solution to make it as easy as possible? My mum still uses the VCR every day and wants to keep this.

I really need someone who can help them out and put in a really simple and straight forward system. Any suggestions anyone?
Thanks

As dodzy rightly suggests dont underestimate peoples ability to cope. I too have dealt with many of your requirements for exactly the same reasons.

Your questions involve 2 different systems from 2 different countries and the simplest system is in the long run also the most expensive. If money is an issue then you are going to have to compromise a certain amount between simplicity and cost and in some cases older technology may still have its benefit.


Simplest single remote, one box per TV system is probably Sky+ multiroom but if terrestial channels are your main interest then you royally pay for what is essentially free. Main limitation here is cost and channel location on the epg. Channels can be ordered in a fashion by putting them on Favourites list.


Best compromise between cost and ease is as dodzy/stb suggest a combibox but as these combine systems from 2 different systems and countries they may also introduce compromises such as occasionally retuning channels, quirky epgs, more limited recording options and probably no RF out for other rooms.
Better more user friendly combiboxes may become available soon but likely to have premium prices.


If your TVs are Saorview capable then you save yourself the hassle of a separate Saorview box and can have a free from sub single box freesat Skybox, 2 remote system. This is probably the cheapest set up.
Recording can be a little complicated though. You wont have Sky+ recording. You may have Saorview epg recording to usb option in TV, or in some cases possibility of connecting Saorview to VCR via scart. Same for Sky via second scart input.


Multiroom gets a bit more complicated again, depending on whether you just want same channel in other rooms or different one. Gone (almost) is the idea of having all channels coming on one rf lead to each tv. However Skyboxes and vcrs can still send rf simply and cheaply to other tvs allowing you to view whatever is on these in other rooms.


Before you decide, I would see what is they watch and record. If it turns out to be Fair City, Corrie, Dancing on ice and GAA then you might find you have little need of extra boxes in other rooms. The cost of any stb purchase might be better served upgrading to Saorview TVs in bedroom/kitchen. Piping the rf from Skybox in living room to other rooms is the cheapest method for multiroom. If there are only 2 people in the house, there is little need for multiple channel choices in each room.