Scrap Rent Allowance

Joko

Rent allowance should be scrapped. It is keeping rents at a ridiculously high level and is hurting those on low wages like myself who are actually trying to contribute to this country. Rents in Dublin are still a fortune and it is because this handout scheme has created a floor in the market.

In 2011 the Government paid €500m in rent to landlords for 94,000 social welfare tenants living in private apartments and houses.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0116/rent.html

500,000,000euro/94,000 = €5,319

I focking hate this government handout society we have become.

Why on earth would pyjama girl take a minimum wage job when she gets €9,776 on the dole and free accommodation.

super_furry

Ok. Anything else?

dirtyden

Joko wrote: »

Rent allowance should be scrapped. It is keeping rents at a ridiculously high level and is hurting those on low wages like myself who are actually trying to contribute to this country. Rents in Dublin are still a fortune and it is because this handout scheme has created a floor in the market.



500,000,000euro/94,000 = €5,319

I focking hate this government handout society we have become.

Why on earth would pyjama girl take a minimum wage job when she gets €9,776 on the dole and free accommodation.

Yawn

MungBean

If only we had thousands upon thousands of empty homes on the states books that we could put to good use.

Oh well, yeah cut rent allowance. People can sleep on the streets, gonna be mild enough from now on anyway.

admiralofthefleet

Joko wrote: »

Rent allowance should be scrapped. It is keeping rents at a ridiculously high level and is hurting those on low wages like myself who are actually trying to contribute to this country. Rents in Dublin are still a fortune and it is because this handout scheme has created a floor in the market.



500,000,000euro/94,000 = €5,319

I focking hate this government handout society we have become.

Why on earth would pyjama girl take a minimum wage job when she gets €9,776 on the dole and free accommodation.

go write another book mr o carroll kelly

Fromthetrees

Joko wrote: »

Rent allowance should be scrapped. It is keeping rents at a ridiculously high level and is hurting those on low wages like myself who are actually trying to contribute to this country. Rents in Dublin are still a fortune and it is because this handout scheme has created a floor in the market.



500,000,000euro/94,000 = €5,319

I focking hate this government handout society we have become.

Why on earth would pyjama girl take a minimum wage job when she gets €9,776 on the dole and free accommodation.

So people who are out of work should be made homeless?

super_furry

Indeed. Ship everyone currently out of work to Leitrim, Cavan, Carlow and wherever else these empty houses are.

micropig

super_furry wrote: »

Indeed. Ship everyone currently out of work to Leitrim, Cavan, Carlow and wherever else these empty houses are.

Why not just ship them the whole way to australia or canada, job done:D

TreesAreCrowd

There are people who genuinely need it, and there are leeches who gamed the system for a long time now who should be dealt with. It isn't fair to deal with the latter in a manner that destroys the lives of the former.

Ergo, it is the long term welfare recipients who need to be dealt with as a broader group, not a targeted attack on a specific form of welfare.

super_furry

Doesn't go far enough. Shoot em I say.

Dubit10

Joko wrote: »

Rent allowance should be scrapped. It is keeping rents at a ridiculously high level and is hurting those on low wages like myself who are actually trying to contribute to this country. Rents in Dublin are still a fortune and it is because this handout scheme has created a floor in the market.



500,000,000euro/94,000 = €5,319

I focking hate this government handout society we have become.

Why on earth would pyjama girl take a minimum wage job when she gets €9,776 on the dole and free accommodation.

You do know not everyone on rent allowance wears PJ's right?

fedor.2.

Joko wrote: »

Rent allowance should be scrapped. It is keeping rents at a ridiculously high level and is hurting those on low wages like myself who are actually trying to contribute to this country. Rents in Dublin are still a fortune and it is because this handout scheme has created a floor in the market.



500,000,000euro/94,000 = €5,319

I focking hate this government handout society we have become.

Why on earth would pyjama girl take a minimum wage job when she gets €9,776 on the dole and free accommodation.

Shut up

M cebee

lets have a fight

taxpayers versus dole scroungers

micropig

M cebee wrote: »

lets have a fight

taxpayers versus dole scroungers

Round 999298017869187697691916:D

starviewadams

Okay fine,it's been scrapped,now go away.

Signed,

Everyone.

K-9

Joko wrote: »

Rent allowance should be scrapped. It is keeping rents at a ridiculously high level and is hurting those on low wages like myself who are actually trying to contribute to this country. Rents in Dublin are still a fortune and it is because this handout scheme has created a floor in the market.



500,000,000euro/94,000 = €5,319

I focking hate this government handout society we have become.

Why on earth would pyjama girl take a minimum wage job when she gets €9,776 on the dole and free accommodation.

So a system designed to help people with no job should be scrapped because you are on low wages?

Rent Allowance does get abused but the majority of people need it. It is also a big player in forcing rents down when it gets cut, which it has again. Bet you'll see a drop in rents as landlords have to adjust for the drop, so its all good, even for you.

MungBean

I'd like to know why the OP is too lazy to go out and get a better paying job.

micropig

MungBean wrote: »

I'd like to know why the OP is too lazy to go out and get a better paying job.

Or not lazy enough to quit their job to get the rent allowence;)


OP, there's loads of options:D

regress

For gods sake man. Will you not think of the landlords. They deserve our help.

witnessmenow

In fairness if the ops figures are correct that's roughly €450 a month per person. Seems reasonably high.

What really needs to happen is to stop forcing people to take the piss.

A person without a job will get no money if living at home (well means tested), but gets the dole and rent allowance if they moves out. Why not give them some money while at home so they dont have to move out!? And also while im here ranting... for the love of god change it to be hours worked welfare , not days! My girlfriend got a job working a 12 hour contract in a shop, 3 x 4hour days.. was on less than when she started, and she had to pay to go to work (had to buy clothes from that shop too) Great incentive to work

uberalles

Lots of other countries give you help for a few months then 0. It's a good incentive to get a job and become independent or Fcuk off somewhere else. I'm particularly talking about whole families who have never worked even during the boom.

This cradle to grave welfare wonderland is a joke.

risteard7

Joko wrote: »

Rent allowance should be scrapped. It is keeping rents at a ridiculously high level and is hurting those on low wages like myself who are actually trying to contribute to this country. Rents in Dublin are still a fortune and it is because this handout scheme has created a floor in the market.



500,000,000euro/94,000 = €5,319

I focking hate this government handout society we have become.

Why on earth would pyjama girl take a minimum wage job when she gets €9,776 on the dole and free accommodation.

How dare you suggest that about people who never worked a day
in their lives! What about single mothers, think of the children! :rolleyes:

Their the likely replys on this op but i aggree with you

starbelgrade

State funded rental schemes account for over 50% of the entire rental market at a cost of around €650 million a year.

You can't make people homeless by not paying it, but you can certainly get better value for money. It's yet another area where our government fail to try & gain some benefit from economies of scale. Instead of using the massive buying power that €650 million gets you, the rental schemes actually drive the costs of rentals up across the board.

And yet, there's not even simple checks to ensure that all landlords who receive rent supplements from the government are tax compliant.

It would make a hell of a lot of sense for the government to move people away from rent supplements over to a more sustainable method of providing rental accommodation.

micropig

risteard7 wrote: »

How dare you suggest that about people who never worked a day
in their lives! What about single mothers, think of the children! :rolleyes:

Scroungers the lot of them especially the children!:p:D

TreesAreCrowd

I will agree on one thing though, rent allowance is keeping the rent levels in the country artificially high.

The cost of living has remained ridiculously high here as a result of these measures.

starbelgrade

witnessmenow wrote: »

for the love of god change it to be hours worked welfare , not days! My girlfriend got a job working a 12 hour contract in a shop, 3 x 4hour days.. was on less than when she started, and she had to pay to go to work (had to buy clothes from that shop too) Great incentive to work

It's a sad fact that the biggest competitor in both the rental & lesser paid employment markets is, in fact, the government.

micropig

starbelgrade wrote: »

It's a sad fact that the biggest competitor in both the rental & lesser paid employment markets is, in fact, the government.

Do you mean those on Social Welfare?

Smidge

OP I dont think it quite works that way. If you are in an area of the country that you are allowed to rent a property of up to 430 euros per month you are allowed roughly about 280 towards that. You must make up the difference yourself. So for a person on 188 per week it leaves them with about 150 per week to pay for everything else

Owen_S

Stop working
Acquire Rent Allowance
????
Profit

micropig

Owen_S wrote: »

Stop working
Acquire Rent Allowance
Sell free communion dresses
Profit

Deank

Owen_S wrote: »

Stop working
Acquire Rent Allowance
????
Profit

Then sublet for more profit - simples.;)

Monty Burnz

uberalles wrote: »

Lots of other countries give you help for a few months then 0. It's a good incentive to get a job and become independent or Fcuk off somewhere else. I'm particularly talking about whole families who have never worked even during the boom.

This cradle to grave welfare wonderland is a joke.

You're going to be chucked out of Sinn Fein with heretical ideas like that!

Monty Burnz

Owen_S wrote: »

Stop working
Acquire Rent Allowance
????
Profit

The crazy thing is that many people are better off or at least as well of if they don't bother working.

Nuts, I know.

K-9

witnessmenow wrote: »

A person without a job will get no money if living at home (well means tested), but gets the dole and rent allowance if they moves out. Why not give them some money while at home so they dont have to move out!?

Nope, you wont get RA unless you've rented for 6 months. I'd say it was aimed at your post and rightly so!

previous user

council dwelling scum.

Jesus Shaves

I get rent allowance
ahahahahahahahahaha

SUCKERS!

micropig

darokane wrote: »

I get rent allowance
ahahahahahahahahaha

SUCKERS!

Are you making millions off the sub-letting?;):D

Jesus Shaves

micropig wrote: »

Are you making millions off the sub-letting?;):D

Multi-millions!

Micky Dolenz

I think they should scarp everything that doesn't benefit me.

Logical Fallacy

Full article, as OP only posted the part that suited his ire.

Important part is bolded, once again landlords are being *****, once again tenants are being blamed for landlords actions and are the ones being called scum.

Fair play OP, I'd say your parents own properties.

Landlords face cuts in rent of up to €270 in some parts of the country as reductions in welfare rent allowances take effect.
While some of those in receipt of these allowances face eviction as landlords refuse to reduce the rent to the new lower thresholds.
In 2011 the Government paid €500m in rent to landlords for 94,000 social welfare tenants living in private apartments and houses.
The Department of Social Protection carried out a review of rents and found the State was paying well in excess of market value in many parts of the country. Minister Joan Burton says she's reducing the level of rent she's prepared to pay to private landlords in the hope of saving €22m this year.
The level of cuts varies across the country from less than €20 in some areas to €270 a month in others.
Landlords say the reduction in rent supplement is too much and will drive down rental rates and subsequently house prices.
Margaret McCormick from the Irish Property Owners' Association said some landlords will not be able to accommodate the reduced rates and will have to terminate their tenancy agreements.
She said others would try to accommodate their tenants if possible. However she said it was deeply unfair and unreasonable that the Government was trying to set market rental rates by reducing rental supplements.
It is not just the reduction in rent supplement payments that is troubling tenants. They also now have to make an increased personal contribution €30 for single people, €35 for a couple.
The Irish National Organisation of the Unemployed said it had received a significant number of telephone calls from concerned recipients of rental allowances.
Brid O'Brien of the INOU said she felt many social welfare recipients would find themselves struggling to hold onto their accommodation as a result of the cuts. She said much of the wriggle room that both tenants and landlords had been using in recent years was gone now. She said tenants could not top-up rental allowances any further, and many landlords could not afford to reduce rents any further.
The range of cuts vary, but taking the example of a one or two parent family with two children.
In Cork, the new maximum rent supplement is €715 a month...according to figures from the latest Daft.ie rental reporter, the average rent for a two-bedroom property in Cork city is €775 Euro .
In Galway, the maximum rent supplement is €700, average rent is €728.
In Waterford, the allowance is €540, average rent is €538
In Dublin Fingal the family's allowance has been cut from €1000 a month to €825, the average rent for a two bedroom property in the region ranges from €788 to €971 a month.
For the rest of Dublin, the allowance is down from €1050 a month for a family with two children to €925.
Average two bedroom rents range from €844-€1329 a month.

fat__tony

I hear ya OP, bloody dole scum, they should be all rounded up and shot!

micropig

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Full article, as OP only posted the part that suited his ire.

Important part is bolded, once again landlords are being *****, once again tenants are being blamed for landlords actions and are the ones being called scum.

Fair play OP, I'd say your parents own properties.

While some of those in receipt of these allowances face eviction as landlords refuse to reduce the rent to the new lower thresholds.


The bit you bolded


Is there not a surplus of empty houses in Ireland? If some landlords won't lower the rent, you'll find some who will

Jesus Shaves

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Full article, as OP only posted the part that suited his ire.

Important part is bolded, once again landlords are being *****, once again

In fairness if tenants are in contracts they don't have too, i'm not siding with landlords here but tenents are being forced to break contracts and maybe onto the streets by the manner in which these cuts were brought in.
As i've said previously rent limits should be set for both private and RA receiving tenants. that would make it fair for everyone

K-9

K-9 wrote: »

It is also a big player in forcing rents down when it gets cut, which it has again. Bet you'll see a drop in rents as landlords have to adjust for the drop, so its all good, even for you.

Very, very srange reasoning here. You're saying that cutting rent allowance forces rent down, when in actual fact cutting rent allowance simply brings rent prices closer to what they would be if it wasn't for the landlord dole keeping them up artificially.

If I may use an analogy,

"Drink driving is good, because whenever the Guards implement an anti drink driving campaign it brings road deaths down."

Can you see the problem with this line of reasoning now?

dirtyden

Deleted User wrote: »

Very, very srange reasoning here. You're saying that cutting rent allowance forces rent down, when in actual fact cutting rent allowance simply brings rent prices closer to what they would be if it wasn't for the landlord dole keeping them up artificially.

If I may use an analogy,

"Drink driving is good, because whenever the Guards implement an anti drink driving campaign it brings road deaths down."

Can you see the problem with this line of reasoning now?

What are you on about?

The original reasoning was logical. Yours makes no sense.

dirtyden

dirtyden wrote: »

What are you on about?

The original reasoning was logical. Yours makes no sense.

Ok, I'll use another analogy. Let's say bread was too expensive and you wanted the government to help less well off people pay for their sliced pan. If the government were to introduce a "bread allowance" that they paid to bread producers on behalf of those who were deemed to be unable to pay for bread on their own, it would help these people afford bread.

Problem solved right?

Wrong.

This is where the market economy comes in to completley undo your good work, and then some.

Bread producers now realise that they can charge more for their product because even if it is too expensive for people to afford, the government will help them out. The price of bread skyrockets. Now the bread allowance people are once again struggling to buy their sliced pan and everyone else buying bread is also being ripped off due to the government artificially inflating the bread market.

If in this situation the government were to partially undo the damage by reducing the bread allowance would you praise them for driving the price of bread down?

No, you'd say they shouldn't have driven it up in the first place.

Make no mistake about it, rent allowance has very little to do with helping the poor afford homes, and a lot more to do with lining the pockets of the buy to let landlords that inflated Fianna Fáil's friend's property bubble.

Jesus Shaves

Deleted User wrote: »

Ok, I'll use another analogy. Let's say bread was too expensive and you wanted the government to help less well off people pay for their sliced pan. If the government were to introduce a "bread allowance" that they paid to bread producers on behalf of those who were deemed to be unable to pay for bread on their own, it would help these people afford bread.

Problem solved right?

Wrong.

This is where the market economy comes in to completley undo your good work, and then some.

Bread producers now realise that they can charge more for their product because even if it is too expensive for people to afford, the government will help them out. The price of bread skyrockets.

wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong
Your argument is only what might happen, you have no proof
It didn't happen in the 80's/90's when they were giving out butter vouchers so what makes this any different.
Don't get me wrong, everyones entitled to an opinion

Born to Die

Deleted User wrote: »

Ok, I'll use another analogy. Let's say bread was too expensive and you wanted the government help less well off people pay for their sliced pan. If the government were to introduce a "bread allowance" that they paid to bread producers on behalf of those who were deemed to be unable to pay for bread on their own, it would help these people afford bread.

Problem solved right?

Wrong.

This is where the market economy comes in to completley undo your good work, and then some.

Bread producers now realise that they can charge more for their product because even if it is too expensive for people to afford, the government will help them out. The price of bread skyrockets. Now the bread allowance people are once again struggling to buy their sliced pan and everyone else buying bread is also being ripped off due to the government artificially inflating the bread market.

If in this situation the government were to partially undo the damage by reducing the bread allowance would you praise them for driving the price of bread down?

No, you'd say they shouldn't have driven it up in the first place.

Make no mistake about it, rent allowance has very little to do with helping the poor afford homes, and a lot more to do with lining the pockets of the buy to let landlords that inflated Fianna Fáil's friend's property bubble.

You are correct but until a fair way of keeping people off the streets when they lose their income through no fault of their own in place then rent allowance must remain. I say this as a person who for 20 years worked and now find myself unemployed with a mortgage I am worried I won't be able to pay. I have 10 years of mortgage payments made on time every time but now I face the prospect of losing my home if I can't find a new job.

I may need rent allowance or some other means in the future to keep me off the streets.

snubbleste

I'm so confused now.
I thought rent supplement was just a state subsidy for landlords to maintain their capital investment and further leverage upon it.

Jesus Shaves

snubbleste wrote: »

I'm so confused now.
I thought rent supplement was just a state subsidy for landlords to maintain their capital investment and further leverage upon it.

are you an idiot?

snubbleste

darokane wrote: »

are you an idiot?

:cool: