Shannon Airport (Feb 2012 - Jan 2014)

branie

Anyone here hopeful that it won't close?

gufnork

Is it supposed to be closing?

Poxyshamrock

branie wrote: »

Anyone here hopeful that it won't close?

I can't imagine anyone (especially here in the Clare forum) is hoping for it to close.

Gerard93

OP Probably referring to this ...
http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0229/shannon.html

A Consultants report on the future of Shannon Airport has said that separation from the Dublin Airport Authority offers better growth prospects for its future.
The report by international consultants Booz, commissioned by Transport Minister Leo Varadkar has said that Shannon faces a significant threat to its future viability under the current ownership arrangement.
Shannon Airport has lost 2m passengers since 2007.
The airport had debts last year of around €8m and is understood to have a long standing debt of €100m.
Minister Leo Varadkar warned business and community leaders in Shannon last month that the status quo was not working for Shannon, and that change was needed.
The consultant's report has said that a move to a local concession model to include the local county councils in Clare and Limerick and possibly Shannon Development and other commercial interests would offer the greatest opportunities for developing business.
It also recommends that it examine new sources of revenue, including exploiting its 2,000 acre land bank around the airport, more emphasis on cargo including using its US pre clearance facility for cargo.
The report also looked at Cork airport, but said that it was performing well under DAA ownership and that it enjoyed a healthier financial position.
Minister Varakar has said that Shannon will be the first of the state airports to have certaintly about its future and he will make a recommendation to Cabinet on the best option for the future viability of Shannon by Easter.

CptSternn

Finally. The DAA have been killing Shannon purposely for years. Maybe it's not too late to turn it around.

dr.fuzzenstein

Finally, some positive noises.
To me it says the current management is not working and things will have to change if Shannon is to survive.
Good on the one hand, but exasperating to read something even my dog has known for years.
How much time and money was spent on this report?
This is part of the reason the country is in the state it's in, nothing is done about the bloody obvious until a report, taking years and costing millions, is compiled.
That report is then usually ignored for 10 years and a new one has to be done.
I'm sorry to be ranting about this, but it drives me up a bloody tree!
We should just turn the running of the country over to a bunch of monkeys, dogs and six year old, they would do a better job of it.:mad::mad::mad:

Anyways (deep breath), hopefully this will steer the airport into the right direction and signal the beginning of a bright, new future for the county, after all, we have nature, a lovely capital of the county, the sea, an airport, a major rail link, a motorway and an industrial estate. The materials for success are all there (I lived in an area of Bavaria in Germany that doesn't have the infrastructure that is here and they're successful), so let's make a go of this!

opinionated3

I think the American tourist market should be tapped into in a greater way. If I was a tourist where would I prefer to land if heading to the land of the auld sod etc.... Certainly not Dublin anyway. Land in Shannon....Kerry, cork, the burren.... Etc only a short drive away. Tourist heaven

Clareman

The other thing about the States it that it's now as easy for someone from the East coast of the US to get to Ireland as it is to get to the West coast of the US

opinionated3

My wifes elderly aunt lives in Boston. When she comes home once every two years she prefers to fly aer lingus. However when she goes to book her flight home to Shannon without fail every time, the travel agent will push Dublin airport at her. She insists every time that she wants to land at Shannon. I think its fair to say if aer lingus had their way Shannon would not be on their itinerary. Pity really. I think discover Ireland, bord failte or whatever its called now also have a lot to answer for too.

godfrey

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

nothing is done about the bloody obvious until a report, taking years and costing millions, is compiled.
That report is then usually ignored for 10 years and a new one has to be done.

I agree completely, with this addition:
The report will then be cherry-picked to suit some muppets personal and politically driven ideas of how it should be done, thereby making the entire report and recommendations useless. Look at the childrens hospital ballsup.

I was thinking about this yesterday and one thing sprung to mind:
Most airports around the world also have attractive business meeting facilities nearby (on campus) for hosting overnighters going to meetings in the area, and for hosting meetings themselves. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but SNN has only one small and aging hotel on the campus, right? I'm willing to bet it's broadband and other business facilities are in the dark ages too, not to mention lack of strategic marketing.

While I acknowledge the serious over-capacity of hotel rooms in the region, isn't it odd there aren't better hotel and meeting facilities on the SNN campus itself? Oh but of course, DUB is a far better place for such a thing as nothing happens outside the M50...

I think that's something to look into as just one part of and overall strategy making our airport more attractive as a business destination in itself, not just as a gateway. The adjacent golf club would be an excellent partner to a new hotel. As I said, maybe there are facilities I'm unaware of and I'm open to correction.

I'm also willing to bet the locals (Clare & Limerick generally) could come up with some practical ways to promote business at SNN, not only flight related.

g

Clareman

godfrey wrote: »

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but SNN has only one small and aging hotel on the campus, right? I'm willing to bet it's broadband and other business facilities are in the dark ages too, .........

As I said, maybe there are facilities I'm unaware of and I'm open to correction.

Yes you correct that there is only 1 hotel on the airport campus, but they do have excellent IT facilities, as does the airport itself, in fact it's free wifi was the first airport that I ever visited that had free wifi. The hotel (Park Inn) is a lovely hotel, great food and does rent out rooms for meetings, I've been to countless meetings there. I believe the Hotel Management college also makes rooms available for people looking for them.

golfball37

Cabinet discussed Shannon being split from the DAA yesterday. Announcement later today by all accounts.

godfrey

It would be a great day for Shannon, as long as the suggested collection of county and city officials are NOT involved in a new administration. What Shannon needs is business people to get it off it's knees.

Here's hoping

g

Mrsbrady

facebook....

"Joe Carey T.D.

Major Government announcement on the future of Shannon Airport will be made this morning. Will upload details to my site in a while.!"

Lady Chatterton

Finally some good news for Shannon Airport

Shannon Airport to be separated from Dublin Airport Authority under new plans

By Independent.ie reporters

Wednesday May 09 2012

SHANNON Airport is to be separated from the Dublin Airport Authority, the Government confirmed today.

But Cork Airport will remain under Dublin management, according to the plans.

It is understood that the Cabinet yesterday gave the green light to the plans following recommendations by consultants.

The loss-making airport is saddled with an estimated €100m in debt.

Traffic at the airport has halved in the past few years to about 1.6 million people annually.

Ryanair has lobbied hard in the past to have the DAA broken up and privatised.

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/shannon-airport-to-be-separated-from-dublin-airport-authority-under-new-plans-3103451.html

dr.fuzzenstein

Well, it's a good start, let's just hope that after being run by a bunch of clowns (I'm being extremely polite here, what I want to call them cannot even be expressed in any language) it is not handed straight to another bunch of local clowns.
Whoever runs it, his first duty should be picking up that phone to Michael O'Leary.
About the debt:
The DAA should be made pay that, it was under their management that traffic at the airport collapsed and in fact they should have to give Shannon another few million.
Any other country the running of Shannon Airport would attract the attention of the competition authority and the fraud squad, the way it was run can only have been for the purpose of money laundering. Otherwise, who runs a business deliberately into the ground?

Comhrá

Govt to separate Shannon Airport from DAA.....

Is this a good thing or a bad thing for Shannon and Mid-West?


http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0509/ministers-to-announce-new-plans-for-shannon-region.html

Raiser

Well something had to be done - hopefully Shannon hasn't been left fester so long tht its now beyond redemtption.

- As for the DAA running Shannon, what a nonsensical concept - most Dubs think Shannon is a popular girls name on US TV.

padma

It seems a good thing, ever since the DAA took over Shannon there is a massive decrease in Passengers there. Slowly but surely theyre policies messed with tourist numbers. Fair enough we had the American soldiers on their way to Vietnam I mean Iraq, but once they calmed down the true figures for Shannon came out while Cork Airport got a massive investment Shannon and the mid-west region was discriminated against by the powers to be.

vkid

tippman1 wrote: »

Govt to separate Shannon Airport from DAA.....

Is this a good thing or a bad thing for Shannon and Mid-West?


http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0509/ministers-to-announce-new-plans-for-shannon-region.html

Should have been done years ago, but didnt match what certain vested interests wanted imo

masalbeagdubh

I think the DAA are keeping the €100 million debt on their books, according to RTE;

Minister Varadkar said Shannon Airport will not have to carry the €100m debt into the new entity.
The debt will remain with the Dublin Airport Authority because the debt would not affect the DAA's credit rating and because the DAA would benefit from no longer carrying the cost of subsidising Shannon.

Delphi91

Now hand it over to Michael O'Leary to run it as a hub!

Lady Chatterton

Govt to separate Shannon Airport from DAA

Updated: 14:48, Wednesday, 9 May 2012

Minister for Transport Leo Varadkar said it is a significant step in developing the aviation sector in Ireland and securing the future of Shannon Airport.
He said: ''It heralds a new era for the Shannon region. I firmly believe that this is the best way forward for both Shannon Airport, Shannon Development and the mid-west region. ''We want to recapture the pioneering spirit of the people who gave us the airport and the Shannon Free Zone concept, so that we can provide exciting and innovative opportunities which benefit business, tourism, and job creation in the region, and across the country.''

Minister for Jobs, Enterprise & Innovation Richard Bruton said the announcement represents a new start for jobs and enterprise in the Shannon region.
''In developing our proposals, we were always focused on delivering the best possible outcomes for enterprise development and job creation in the region.
''By combining, into a new entity, a strong, independent Shannon airport authority with the extensive property holdings, expertise and experience of Shannon Development, we can focus the State's resources on developing a strong aviation industry in the area.''

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0509/ministers-to-announce-new-plans-for-shannon-region.html

europa11

Glad to hear this.

For too long Shannon was forced to charge the same landing and passenger charges as Dublin. Any potential new routes were routinely put past DAA, who decided on what was best from the Dublin Airport point-of-view, in particular since T2 opened.

Another instance that readily comes to mind was Aer Lingus: SNN-Paris. Despite pleading for an early departure time for the daily service, DAA insisted that Aer Lingus not fly out until some time like 4:00 or so in the afternoon, which meant business travellers either getting to Paris for work or to connect onwards from CDG would use Dublin, and for leisure travel, the same aplied with Dublin or Cork both offering pre-noon departures. Any wonder it was culled.

Plenty more examples out there, I'm sure, where SNN was compromised to facilitate the politicking that went on with DAA in charge. Now with the shackles off let's hope for some dynamic management over the coming years.

And while I'd like to see O'Leary back up his promise that lower charges would see him increase capacity, the new management shouldn't allow Shannon to become a one airline airport either. If competition is (now) good for the airports, then the same rule should apply to those using them.

Palmach

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Whoever runs it, his first duty should be picking up that phone to Michael O'Leary.

That is the last person they should phone. Ryanair are like a vampire that will suck the life out of an airport. Try quality instead of quantity.

Akrasia

This is very good news, and I think Shannon Development are probably the best organisation to take over the airport.

Congratulations to the cabinet, this looks like it has been a very good decision for balanced regional development.

ninty9er

Delphi91 wrote: »

Now hand it over to Michael O'Leary to run it as a hub!

That's what happened it last time. Shannon needs a decent portfolio of airlines (10+ to get it off its knees) flying to a decent portfolio of destination airports (read: not Ryanair sheds 3 hours from the stated destination)

Ryanair can form part of the mix, but the immediate target should be anything west of the Meridian and east of Hawaii. Sell it as "just 2 hours from Dublin"

A risk has to be taken on that airport that will either see it work or end up as a cargo hub, no bad thing either.

Nevermind_

Palmach wrote: »

That is the last person they should phone. Ryanair are like a vampire that will suck the life out of an airport. Try quality instead of quantity.

Really?

http://www.tumbit.com/news/articles/3876-ryanair-growth-forces-airport-to-erect-marquee-as-terminal.html

here is just a random recent one I pulled from google and theres plenty more where that came from

Bergamo, Hahn, Prestwick, Charleroi are just some of the Airports that have been transformed by Ryanair.

Care to list any airports that have had the life sucked out of them by ryanair?
Great to see Shannon debt free but there are probably serious structural costs still in place, Shannon is probably not the most efficiently run airport in Europe.
I'd rather have ryanair passengers than no passengers

seachto7

Sell it as slap bang "easy access" to the West of Ireland, Cliffs of Moher etc...
Hopefully it will have a ripple effect on the area, and present job opportunities that would otherwise have to be taken up in Dublin. Hopefully it will also benefit Ennis and Limerick, which with the motorway are even easier to get to from the airport these days.
Galway too will be quite easy to get to from here....

Kess73

I would be a bit concerned as to where the €100m+ debt that the airport has actually goes tbh, and I would also have concerns for the pensions of many of those who used to work in the airport. I know that many of the retired folk have seen their work pensions from the airport cut quite a bit each year for the last few years, and these were not big pensions to start with.

phog

Delphi91 wrote: »

Now hand it over to Michael O'Leary to run it as a hub!

That's probably the last thing that required to secure it's future, while Ryanair and O'Leary have a great company, they are not in for the success of any other business bar their own. He'd help make the airport very successful but would pull the plug at the drop of a hat as he has done in Shannon & elsewhere.

Give him slots by all means but that's it.

Palmach

Nevermind_ wrote: »

Care to list any airports that have had the life sucked out of them by ryanair?

Balaton, Durham, Manchester got badly hit by them, Reus. Once you get them in they come back for more and more until like Shannon you almost let them land for free. Shannon said that the deal to keep Ryanair at Shannon fell through because Ryanair wanted a fare structure that would almost have mean t Shannon paying Ryanair to land. Shannon is well shot of O'Leary.

Cookiemunster

Kess73 wrote: »

I would be a bit concerned as to where the €100m+ debt that the airport has actually goes tbh, and I would also have concerns for the pensions of many of those who used to work in the airport. I know that many of the retired folk have seen their work pensions from the airport cut quite a bit each year for the last few years, and these were not big pensions to start with.

Varadker was on the Right Hook earlier and said that the DAA was taking on the €100m debt leaving Shannon debt free. No mention of pensions though.

Clareman

Shannon Airport is in Clare, and now this thread is as well

Clareman

Also merging the 2 threads into 1

source

Clareman wrote: »

Shannon Airport is in Clare, and now this thread is as well

Have to disagree with the decision to move this, as the airport while in Clare, has massive links to limerick and the decision made today has big economic ramifications for Limerick city.

As such I reckon the thread should have stayed in the limerick forum, so it may be discussed from the point of view of Limerick people.

Nevermind_

Palmach wrote: »

Balaton, Durham, Manchester got badly hit by them, Reus. Once you get them in they come back for more and more until like Shannon you almost let them land for free. Shannon said that the deal to keep Ryanair at Shannon fell through because Ryanair wanted a fare structure that would almost have mean t Shannon paying Ryanair to land. Shannon is well shot of O'Leary.

when you say got hit badly by them, you mean they eventually pulled out for various reasons, for example Durham introduced a £6 passenger tax, Ryanair left Balaton because the numbers were poor.
I dont think anyone expects them to operate routes at a loss, Shannon included.
They did leave Manchester for about 18 months but are back there now after they got a better deal from the airport and currently operate 26 routes.
Ryanair whether we like them or not are the only game in town who have a realistic shot at driving passenger numbers in Shannon, the spin off for the local economy also has to be taken into consideration.
Like i said any passenger increase is better than the status quo.
But I do take your point that if they do decide to leave it can be catastrophic for any small airport, however is that better than if they never came at all?

Clareman

source wrote: »

Have to disagree with the decision to move this, as the airport while in Clare, has massive links to limerick and the decision made today has big economic ramifications for Limerick city.

As such I reckon the thread should have stayed in the limerick forum, so it may be discussed from the point of view of Limerick people.

You are more than welcome to follow the relevant steps to bring this to the attention to the relevant parties. In my opinion this decision has a massive impact to the whole region but the airport is in Clare and as result the discussion can stay here.

dr.fuzzenstein

Palmach wrote: »

That is the last person they should phone. Ryanair are like a vampire that will suck the life out of an airport. Try quality instead of quantity.

Perhaps, but they tried neither.;)

ger664

Also need to consider O Leary has muted a low cost Trans Atlantic carrier. With Pre Clearance in Shannon this could now be very possible with DAA out of the loop.

christmas2012

Ya i head the DAA and SNN airport are now seperating which could be good for shannon.
Ive been to shannon airport recently and dont see much activity..Its not very busy at all..

jbkenn

Clareman wrote: »

You are more than welcome to follow the relevant steps to bring this to the attention to the relevant parties. In my opinion this decision has a massive impact to the whole region but the airport is in Clare and as result the discussion can stay here.

Idiot, I would suggest, when acting as a moderator, you leave your parochial gob****ery at home, this announcement has enormous implications for the entire region, not just Clare, perhaps, it was being discussed on the Limerick forum because some people recognise this fact.

zulutango

Clareman wrote: »

You are more than welcome to follow the relevant steps to bring this to the attention to the relevant parties. In my opinion this decision has a massive impact to the whole region but the airport is in Clare and as result the discussion can stay here.

The forum shouldn't really be subdivided on a county by county basis. Many important discussion topics are equally relevant to a number of counties.

Perhaps there should simply be a 'Midwest' forum. Given Limerick City's location on the Limerick - Clare border, a lot of 'Limerick' issues are important to Clare people, and many 'Clare' issues are important to Limerick people. Dividing the discussion along county lines significantly stifles it, and that's not a good thing, is it?

the drifter

jbkenn wrote: »

Idiot, I would suggest, when acting as a moderator, you leave your parochial gob****ery at home, this announcement has enormous implications for the entire region, not just Clare, perhaps, it was being discussed on the Limerick forum because some people recognise this fact.

jbkenn will not be joining us again for a week

golfball37

The pension issue is completely un-related and uneffected by yesterday. Aer Rianta employees pay into the Irish Aviation pot which includes Aer Lingus and IAA I believe. Its not a DAA pension so nothing has changed for retired Shannon staff. The airlines pension fund is in serious bother but thats unrelated to anything that has happned at Shannon in recent years.

Raiser

Akrasia wrote: »

This is very good news, and I think Shannon Development are probably the best organisation to take over the airport.

Congratulations to the cabinet, this looks like it has been a very good decision for balanced regional development.

Have you seen Shannon recently???

- I've two big dreams in life, one is to win the lottery and the other is to get a job with Shannon Development - Either way I'll be handed ridiculous amounts of money and never have to work again.......

Clareman

I think the way they are going about setting up the airport on it's own is a very intelligent way, they are forming 1 big company so there won't be hassle with land or space or remits and they are removing the debt so they can compete. Hopefully it won't be messed up

Born to Die

A Global logistics hub would be suited to Shannon. Add Ryanair to the scenario and the work would flow. Especially if the transatlantic routes can be put in place.

Clareman

The pre-clearance is such a massive thing to have they should use that to try to sell the airport to as many companies as possible. I also don't think they should just be concentrating on Ryanair, I'm sure companies like Ethiad could be convinced to fly some flights here as well as the whole corporate jet sector.

dr.fuzzenstein

I just don't understand this "We don't want Ryanair here" mentality.
You cannot view an airport in isolation, the airport and the region work together, they live and die with each other.
If thousands of people are brought to the region, they will spend money and be the life blood of the region.
Any person that says "Well, we're better off without O'Leary" is simply fiddling while Rome is burning.
It is ignorance of the highest order and shows a business understanding that does not stretch beyond a farm or a B&B.
Here's a simple test as to how your airport is doing:

Is your airport busy, the car parks full (that alone will pay for the running of it you silly goose), loads of flights going in and out?
Then you're doing well and if it's losing money, it is run by incompetent gobsh*tes.

Or is there tumbleweed blowing down the runway and the car parks can be used for football, rollerblading or company picknicks?
The you're not doing well and your airport is run by incompetent gobsh*tes.

Hiding behind excuses and explanations of "It's not that simple", another sign that it is run by incompetent gobsh*tes.
That is business, forget the waffle, forget the bullsh*t and the excuses.
If you're not succeeding, you're doing something wrong, if you're being supported by bailouts and state money, you're simply being kept on life support, but it's still not working.
An airport needs passengers, I don't see any arriving and personally I haven't used Shannon for the last 10-15 years, the airport is about as useful as the pope's balls.
It needs to change and this is the chance for it to shine.

MarkR

They were mentioning aircraft recycling on the radio. Also as a kind of hub for humanitarian aid at some stage? I also seem to recall something about a refrigerated cargo centre.

Michael O'Leary wasn't too impressed on the radio yesterday. Was very skeptical about what changes would actually happen. No harm to be out from under the thumb of the DAA, but hopefully we don't get more of the same lack of planning.