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North West NO GI 25th March 2012

  • #2
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 381 ✭✭ manga_10


    Next North West NoGi on 25th March at long tower community centre in Derry

    Still great value at 10 pound entry

    We shall revert to a decision being made if fights go the 5 minutes

    More details to follow


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Comments

  • #2


    Will it be Beginner, Intermediate and Advanced or done by belt also are all subs legal or will it be done as per IBJJF rules and......will there be an absolute? :)


  • #2


    We shall revert to a decision being made if fights go the 5 minutes

    Why, when there is a perfect scoring system available for use... do you try and run tournaments like this?


  • #2


    Sorry guys to clear things up , I posted this from the facebook page so that everyone would be kept up on the details for the competition.I'm sure Jason will let everyone know as the details becoming readily available. Sorry for the inconvenience :)


  • #2


    Chris89 wrote: »
    We shall revert to a decision being made if fights go the 5 minutes


    Why, when there is a perfect scoring system available for use... do you try and run tournaments like this?


    This is not a BJJ comp. It is meant to appeal to people who wrestle, do BJJ, train traditional JuJitsu, MMA or judo

    The first one we ran had no issues. We tried something different at last comp and it did not work.

    Peter Lavery and Aidan Marron have agreed to ref this one

    We are more than happy to receive any feedback as it helps us improve.


  • #2


    This is not a BJJ comp. It is meant to appeal to people who wrestle, do BJJ, train traditional JuJitsu, MMA or judo

    The first one we ran had no issues. We tried something different at last comp and it did not work.

    Peter Lavery and Aidan Marron have agreed to ref this one

    We are more than happy to receive any feedback as it helps us improve.

    But you score point when you achieve a dominant position, surely this understanding is universal through all grappling systems


  • #2


    The refs and two judges will decide who was more dominant throughout the round if it goes to a decision

    That seems pretty fair to me


  • #2


    From what I have heard and seen of the previous tournaments, I shall not be attending.


  • #2


    This is not a BJJ comp. It is meant to appeal to people who wrestle, do BJJ, train traditional JuJitsu, MMA or judo

    I would have thought the majority of competitors train BJJ though, and most people who train MMA would train BJJ (as part of MMA); do you know if you have been getting roughly an equal amount of people from each area? Otherwise it would seem that a well known rule system is being disregarded for the sake of a slim minority.

    It's not like there are many grappling arts that discourage mounting someone or sweeping them. Judges decisions (even as high profile as the UFC) can often be controversial while point systems are rarely so, as long as they are clear beforehand. It just seems that using the IBJJF point system would leave less room for error.


  • #2


    Well lads I can tell you this. This competition will be run better than the last one. We will also be running more in future. We aim to improve everytime we do something whether it be Chaos or these competitions. Will we make some mistakes. Yes of course. Will we learn from them yes.

    People in the north west need competitions on their door step to help them improve. We are doing our best to provide that for them


  • #2


    MarkB_ wrote: »
    This is not a BJJ comp. It is meant to appeal to people who wrestle, do BJJ, train traditional JuJitsu, MMA or judo

    I would have thought the majority of competitors train BJJ though, and most people who train MMA would train BJJ (as part of MMA); do you know if you have been getting roughly an equal amount of people from each area? Otherwise it would seem that a well known rule system is being disregarded for the sake of a slim minority.

    It's not like there are many grappling arts that discourage mounting someone or sweeping them. Judges decisions (even as high profile as the UFC) can often be controversial while point systems are rarely so, as long as they are clear beforehand. It just seems that using the IBJJF point system would leave less room for error.


    At the last two comps less than half were BJJ. Traditional JJ and MMA are far more prevalent up here


  • #2


    never goin back to that, not worth the trek


  • #2


    How does someone expect to win if they do not score a takedown, sweep, pass, mount, back control or a submission? It doesnt matter what style of grappling a competitor is from, even if theyre grappling background is 'mma'..... They will need to do one or more of the above techniques to win a match.

    Why leave the decision up to someone who still uses the term 'butscooting' when there is a perfect points system, albeit one used in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu tournaments.. which awards for techniques universal to all styles of grappling and which are vital to win a fight where strikes are not allowed.

    Nice to see you took all of the suggestions from the last thread on board. :)

    Best of luck with it anyway, I wont be attending.


  • #2


    The refs and two judges will decide who was more dominant throughout the round if it goes to a decision

    That seems pretty fair to me

    I think you stand alone with this one, Jason. I expect you will have your hands full as in my experience 5 minute matches go the distance more often than not.
    Especially at the beginner and intermediate levels.

    P.s. How are Aidan and Peter going to decide the winner? Will they assess who has 'scored' the most 'scoring' moves? Or will the bouts be judged on style control damage and aggression?

    Judges.jpg


  • #2


    At the last two comps less than half were BJJ. Traditional JJ and MMA are far more prevalent up here

    Well, I looked up traditional JJ rules and points are awarded for throws and passing the guard (called "Osae-komi") so I don't think any traditional JJ practitioners would be lost in IBJJF rules. The reason to use the IBJJF rules is that they are more commonplace and used at high levels. And as for MMA, BJJ is so often the grappling component in it that it doesn't even make sense to differentiate the two for a grappling competition.

    Of course, at the end of the day, it's your competition and you seem adamant about the judges decision method, but as you said, you want all the feedback you can get.


  • #2


    MarkB_ wrote: »
    And as for MMA, BJJ is so often the grappling component in it that it doesn't even make sense to differentiate the two for a grappling competition.

    i watched cage warriors 45 the other night, from what i could see half the guys were bjj and the other half were sambo and judo..

    i dont know the guy thats running this competition buts its a competition so why not just enter it and get some experience, just because the rules are not exactly what you normally do shouldn't matter. i think its a bit childish to say if your not doing it my way, im not playing. surely the more competitions held in Ireland the better...


  • #2


    The most dominant sport in MMA is actually wrestling

    The biggest and most prestigious competition in grappling does actually not use BJJ rules


  • #2


    We never asked that you use the bjj point system, we've said that it's the best but all that we want is a system where points are awarded for dominant positions and techniques.....kind of like what they do in the ADCC


  • #2


    The biggest and most prestigious competition in grappling does actually not use BJJ rules

    The Mundials?


  • #2


    The biggest and most prestigious competition in grappling does actually not use BJJ rules

    ADCC?

    Mount position = 2 points
    Back mount with hooks = 3 points
    Passing the guard = 3 points
    Knee on stomach = 2 points
    Clean Sweep = 4 points
    Sweep = 2 Points
    Clean Take down (Ends passed the guard)= 4 points
    Take down (Ends Guard or Half Guard)= 2 points


  • #2


    Chris89 wrote: »
    ADCC?

    Mount position = 2 points
    Back mount with hooks = 3 points
    Passing the guard = 3 points
    Knee on stomach = 2 points
    Clean Sweep = 4 points
    Sweep = 2 Points
    Clean Take down (Ends passed the guard)= 4 points
    Take down (Ends Guard or Half Guard)= 2 points

    Running the ADCC on judge's decision would make more sense :cool:


  • #2


    OLDMAN1 wrote: »
    i dont know the guy that's running this competition buts its a competition so why not just enter it and get some experience, just because the rules are not exactly what you normally do shouldn't matter. i think its a bit childish to say if your not doing it my way, im not playing. surely the more competitions held in Ireland the better...

    Very true, good points.

    However, a number of the people commenting in this last thread actually were at the last competition, and afterwards expressed their concerns with how some of the matches were decided (first to a take down wins) I actually won a couple of matches this way, but still thought it an unfair way to decide the winner of a match.

    A points system is undoubtedly the fairest way to decide a winner in the absence of a submission, it doesn't even have to be the bjj points system, just one where dominant positions are rewarded on the scoreboard. There is absolutely no argument for a refs decision, this just allows for too many mistakes and I'm sure the individuals making the decision will have the ears chewed off them should they make a dubious call.

    A points system doesn't favor any particular style, nor does it disadvantage anyone.


  • #2


    OLDMAN1 wrote: »
    i think its a bit childish to say if your not doing it my way, im not playing. surely the more competitions held in Ireland the better...
    It definitely is, but I wasn't saying that at all. I don't mean to sound like I'll only be attending if IBJJF rules are used. Truth is I have no idea if I'll be able to go but I just don't think a judges decision is a good idea.
    The most dominant sport in MMA is actually wrestling

    It probably is because wrestling in high school and college is hugely popular in America. However, I would think that there are more BJJ schools in Ireland than there are wrestling schools.


  • #2


    How do i sign up sir? hopefully guard players who are doing all the work on bottom get recognition this time :P


  • #2


    Ok folks we have amended rules after listening to concerns rules as follows


    No heel hooks
    No cranks
    No toe holds teens
    No flying submissions teens

    Fights goes distance.  Goes to points
    5 minute round
    Upper weight limit 120 kgs


    Sections 

    Teens
    Under 60,70,80 over 80

    Beginner
    Under 60,70,80, 90 over 90

    Intermediate
    Under 60,70,80, 90 over 90

    Advanced
    Under 80 and over



    Mount position = 2 points
    Back mount with hooks = 3 points
    Passing the guard = 3 points
    Knee on stomach = 2 points
    Clean Sweep = 4 points
    Sweep = 2 Points
    Clean Take down (Ends passed the guard)= 4 points
    Take down (Ends Guard or Half Guard)= 2 points
    Sitting down = -1
    Submission attempt = 2 points


    Registration will be done online. Will post link next week as site is not 100% finished


  • #2


    Will spinal locks be allowed?


  • #2


    No cranks


  • #2


    Register here

    http://www.evolvemartialarts.com/competitions/


    Rules here

    http://www.evolvemartialarts.com/competitions/rules/no-gi/


    10 pound entry


    Address here
    Long Tower Youth & Community Centre
    Long Tower Centre,
    Ann Street,
    Derry
    BT48 6PB



    Weigh ins from 10am to 11am
    Sunday 25th March


  • #2


    Entries are coming in rightly now

    Register now. Event this weekend

    Only 10 pound to enter


  • #2


    This is a great competition, great gym too. For a tenner its defintely worth the experience and its good to see that people arent ripping you off either


  • #2


    wingnut4 wrote: »
    This is a great competition, great gym too. For a tenner its defintely worth the experience and its good to see that people arent ripping you off either

    Many entering from kyojin then ?


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