Can a heron puncture a butyl liner?

Degsy

Recently saw a heron hanging round by my pond and discovered one of the fish missing afterwards. I've also noticed the level of the water dropping substantially not long afterwards.

I refilled the pond and it took a week or so but the level is on the way down again.

Is it possible the heron punctured the lining,and if so,how do i go about trying to fix it?

magicbastarder

leave the pond to drain (as long as it doesn't drain to the point where it's endangering fish, of course), and when the level stops, you should find the leak on that line.

i know someone whose pond was punctured by a heron; at least, he seems satisfied it was a heron.

Degsy

Thanks..i will do that while trying to protect em in case he returns.

And if he returns he's a dead heron!

the_syco

Degsy wrote: »

Thanks..i will do that while trying to protect em in case he returns.

And if he returns he's a dead heron!

Leave it drop to a level where it doesn't leak anymore. Fill it up two inches higher, and put some non-lehal dye into the pond, to see where it marks.

Long term: get a fake heron statue (they don't seem to like other herons), and/or some netting over your pond.

paddy147

Degsy wrote: »

Recently saw a heron hanging round by my pond and discovered one of the fish missing afterwards. I've also noticed the level of the water dropping substantially not long afterwards.

I refilled the pond and it took a week or so but the level is on the way down again.

Is it possible the heron punctured the lining,and if so,how do i go about trying to fix it?

If you can,also install netting and/or some lengths of plastic coated wire along the length of the pond.

This will protect the pond and fish and deter the heron from swooping in,in the future.:)

magicbastarder

Degsy wrote: »

And if he returns he's a dead heron!

if you're not able to keep a pond without killing herons, i'd suggest you rethink your pond idea.

i'd be far more chuffed with a heron visiting my pond than i would be with the fish in the pond.

Degsy

magicbastarder wrote: »

if you're not able to keep a pond without killing herons, i'd suggest you rethink your pond idea.

i'd be far more chuffed with a heron visiting my pond than i would be with the fish in the pond.

Well i'm more pissed off that he managed to puncture my liner than the fact he killed a fish.

The pond took ages to build and i have no doubt this poxy leak wont be easy to find either.

Anyway there's a river and a canal within 300 metres so i'd prefer if the heron went there and left my fish alone.

paddy147

Degsy wrote: »

Well i'm more pissed off that he managed to puncture my liner than the fact he killed a fish.

The pond took ages to build and i have no doubt this poxy leak wont be easy to find either.

Anyway there's a river and a canal within 300 metres so i'd prefer if the heron went there and left my fish alone.

Tech 7 sealent or else a small tub of WaterStop in any builders providers.

Both can be applied underwater and give an immediate watertight seal.

who the fug

Degsy wrote: »

Well i'm more pissed off that he managed to puncture my liner than the fact he killed a fish.

The pond took ages to build and i have no doubt this poxy leak wont be easy to find either.

Anyway there's a river and a canal within 300 metres so i'd prefer if the heron went there and left my fish alone.

Suggest you try these options first , can't see why the bird has to die because you opened up a fast food joint

paddy147

For anyone who was wondering what "WaterStop" is....this is it.

It thicker than emulsion paint and is applied with either a brush or a roller.And it makes an instant watertight/waterproof seal.

Can be used on fibreglass boats and also on ponds/pond liners.

Discodog

If a Heron did puncture the liner then it must of been a poor quality or badly fitted one. A Heron could never puncture a decent Butyl liner especially with a fleece behind it.

If your pond has a pump then simply link it to a PIR so that it comes on as the Heron approaches.

Degsy

Discodog wrote: »

If a Heron did puncture the liner then it must of been a poor quality or badly fitted one. A Heron could never puncture a decent Butyl liner especially with a fleece behind it.

If your pond has a pump then simply link it to a PIR so that it comes on as the Heron approaches.

Was thinking that myself. I've had a good look and i cant see any holes in the liner at all.
Is there any other reason the water level would drop so quickly?

Discodog

Fill the pond & then monitor it closely. Once the level stops dropping then you can look for anything at that level that might be causing the loss. A common cause is where the edge of the liner gets pushed down or drops below water level. But you have to monitor the level preferably when there is no rain. A leak will often tend to partially seal itself as the level drops & pressure decreases. Also sediment can start to block the leak. But as the pond fills the pressure can build up sufficiently to restart the leak.

yank_in_eire

Discodog wrote: »

If a Heron did puncture the liner then it must of been a poor quality or badly fitted one. A Heron could never puncture a decent Butyl liner especially with a fleece behind it.

I beg to differ - I had to do quite a bit of research on herons for an anatomy class in uni. They have an elongated vertebra (6th or 7th cervical verterbra IIRC) in their neck that in addition to allowing them to tuck their neck in when they fly, also gives them crazy thrusting power. Combine that with a very strong sharply pointed beak and you have a bird that can stick that beak through a wooden canoe paddle. It sounds like a load of crap but I have seen a pic of it. I will try to dig it up and post it. If it goes through a canoe paddle then a butyl liner (even one of the high end nice thick ones) would be no trouble.
Stiil no need to croak it though - that plastic heron trick actually does work.

Edit - haven't found the pic yet but there is a reference to the canoe-paddle thing on pg 162 of Madsons's book "Up on the River - the people and wildlife of the upper Mississippi"

Discodog

I disagree. The tip of a herons beak isn't that sharp - I should know as I have handled quite a few. A proper butyl liner is very hard to puncture because the fleece & sand behind it absorbs the shock - that's why it is there. The liner get pushed back rather than puncturing where as a canoe paddle is rigid. I am not saying that it's impossible but it's highly unlikely & I have never heard of it.

In any event a heron would only stab if it were fishing. So it would have to be a coincidence of it missing a fish & being in the right place to puncture the liner. I bet that there is a more plausible reason for the water loss.

Degsy

Discodog wrote: »

I bet that there is a more plausible reason for the water loss.

You might be right..after filling the pond a few times i notice its tending to settel at a level 4-5" below the maximum.

On one side there's a flat area of liner that constantly has a small pool of water in it,ive removed the water and it reaapears..is it possible that a fold in the liner is "wicking" the water away from the pond to evaporate?

Discodog

Impossible to say without seeing it but I would never rule anything out.

Degsy

paddy147 wrote: »

For anyone who was wondering what "WaterStop" is....this is it.

It thicker than emulsion paint and is applied with either a brush or a roller.And it makes an instant watertight/waterproof seal.

Can be used on fibreglass boats and also on ponds/pond liners.

Do you know anywhere in Dublin that stocks it?

ericl

Degsy wrote: »

Do you know anywhere in Dublin that stocks it?

Gerard Kelly Builders Providers.
3 Spring Garden St,
Fairview
Telephone:
01 855 5000.

www.gerardkellys.ie/product.php?id_product=99

Discodog

Is Waterstop suitable for Butyl liners ? There is no mention of this is the product data page & very few products, apart from specialist adhesives, will stick to rubber.

Degsy

Discodog wrote: »

Is Waterstop suitable for Butyl liners ? There is no mention of this is the product data page & very few products, apart from specialist adhesives, will stick to rubber.

Shiite..i never thought of that.
I have a large section of liner left over and some Pond sealant i got ages ago..it sticks to rubber alright..if i could just find the hole i'd be laughing.