Munster centres

northernpower

So news today confirms Munsters signing of Casey Laulala

http://www.cardiffblues.com/news/5716.php

Combined with the signing of Downey, is it fair to say McGahan doesn't see Earls as a first choice centre in the coming years and what does that say about his selection for this weekend at 13.

I'm a Munster fan, so this isn't a provincial thing, but I don't think McFadden done a lot wrong at the weekend and I can't see Earls as a centre.

Fishooks12

northernpower wrote: »

So news today confirms Munsters signing of Casey Laulala

http://www.cardiffblues.com/news/5716.php

Combined with the signing of Downey, is it fair to say McGahan doesn't see Earls as a first choice centre in the coming years and what does that say about his selection for this weekend at 13.

I'm a Munster fan, so this isn't a provincial thing, but I don't think McFadden done a lot wrong at the weekend and I can't see Earls as a centre.

It's sometimes necessary to have more than one 13 in a squad you know

northernpower

Fishooks12 wrote: »

It's sometimes necessary to have more than one 13 in a squad you know

Ok yeah obviously thats a given, but does this imply that he's not first choice?

Podge_irl

northernpower wrote: »

Ok yeah obviously thats a given, but does this imply that he's not first choice?

I would think so.

MikeMacca

i played against keith at schools and club level and he is a perfect number 13,im just amazed its only taken this long for him to finally get the jersey.
competition is always needed. how many natural 13's are there at munster at the minute? most centres there are 12's. Laulala is a perfect signing

Tox56

MikeMacca wrote: »

i played against keith at schools and club level and he is a perfect number 13,im just amazed its only taken this long for him to finally get the jersey
competetion is always needed. how many natural 13's are there at munster at the minute? most centres there are 12's. Laulala is a perfect signing

I know this is pointing out the obvious, but the difference between that level and international is absolutely colossal.

Podge_irl

MikeMacca wrote: »

how many natural 13's are there at munster at the minute?

Zero

MikeMacca

Tox56 wrote: »

I know this is pointing out the obvious, but the difference between that level and international is absolutely colossal.

you dont say :eek:
im talking about his whole game, his strengths etc
he was never a fullback, he's wasted on the wing. centre and more specifically outside centre is his natural position

MikeMacca

Podge_irl wrote: »

Zero

besides earls, you are correct

Tox56

MikeMacca wrote: »

you dont say :eek:
im talking about his whole game, his strengths etc
he was never a fullback, he's wasted on the wing. centre and more specifically outside centre is his natural position

Wing is by far the position that plays most to his strengths. His weak defending can be hidden (to a degree) on the wing, and as a general rule his distribution is rarely tested, he just needs to put his head down and run, and most notably of all his fantastic finishing can be availed of on the wing.

We have seen from recent games he prefers to just run with it, and the distribution, decision making and vision needed for 13 I believe he does not posses (at least not at International level). These are all skills he needs little of, if at all, on the wing.

Kayless

any chance of Downey getting picked for next years 6 nations? would be good to have someone of his size in the centre against Wales and France

Fight_Night

MikeMacca wrote: »

you dont say :eek:
im talking about his whole game, his strengths etc
he was never a fullback, he's wasted on the wing. centre and more specifically outside centre is his natural position

Just because he excelled at playing 13 at schoolboy level doesn't mean he's international standard, his distribution is poor as is his defence(for international standard that is). Good finisher though. That would lead us to believe he is a winger

MikeMacca

incorrect. i have played against the man, i watch him live every single match whether it be munster or ireland.
he runs good lines , is a good passer, is speedy and a great off loader. all the traits needed for a 13. he is also a better tackler than anything we have at the moment. if darcy could tackle, imagine how many more wins than losses ireland would have

shuffol

My money is on James Downey turning out the same way as Johne Murphy, they look better from a distance.

totallegend

Duplication of a point I made on the general Munster thread, but if McGahan genuinely saw Earls as the future of 13 at Munster, he would never in a million years have signed Laulala.

The big NIQ signings should be reserved for positions of weakness, not a position which one of your best players is going to be occupying. Are Earls and Laulala going to be slugging it out for the jersey? No, Earls will play on the wing.

Tox56

MikeMacca wrote: »

incorrect. i have played against the man, i watch him live every single match whether it be munster or ireland.
he runs good lines , is a good passer, is speedy and a great off loader. all the traits needed for a 13. he is also a better tackler than anything we have at the moment. if darcy could tackle, imagine how many more wins than losses ireland would have

I don't really know what to say to that.

MikeMacca

Tox56 wrote: »

I don't really know what to say to that.

in other words you have no answer to my devastatingly accurate points

Podge_irl

MikeMacca wrote: »

incorrect. i have played against the man, i watch him live every single match whether it be munster or ireland.
he runs good lines , is a good passer, is speedy and a great off loader. all the traits needed for a 13. he is also a better tackler than anything we have at the moment. if darcy could tackle, imagine how many more wins than losses ireland would have

Earls is an absolute terrible passer.

MikeMacca

MikeMacca wrote: »

incorrect. i have played against the man, i watch him live every single match whether it be munster or ireland.
he runs good lines , is a good passer, is speedy and a great off loader. all the traits needed for a 13. he is also a better tackler than anything we have at the moment. if darcy could tackle, imagine how many more wins than losses ireland would have

I think you have confused Keith with someone else.

It's as if someone just described Ireland as "Hot, dry, and full of babes in bikinis"

Kannon

MikeMacca wrote: »

he is also a better tackler than anything we have at the moment. if darcy could tackle, imagine how many more wins than losses ireland would have

Totally untrue. the reason there is any doubt about Earls at 13 is due to his tackling ability. Eveyone knows he is very good going forward and his link up play is good too.
D'Arcy hasn't got two H-Cups and a GS to his name by being a bad tackler. Nonsense.

MungBean

MikeMacca wrote: »

oh dear, the leinster lads are in full force today. darcy is a shocking tackler,how can you disagree with this :eek:

keitho will prove all the doubters wrong this saturday and in the remaining HC games.

MOYROSS ABÚ

I hope your right but considering your of the opinion that he's a great passer and excellent tackler I dont have much faith in your expertise. I'm afraid will probably see more of the same from him with the added exception of Rougerie making him look like a tackle bag.

Podge_irl

MikeMacca wrote: »

oh dear, the leinster lads are in full force today. darcy is a shocking tackler,how can you disagree with this :eek:

keitho will prove all the doubters wrong this saturday and in the remaining HC games.

MOYROSS ABÚ

D'Arcy has been poor in defence of late. What that has to do with Earls poor passing is.beyond me.

Fireball07

If I could just return to the origin of the topic...

Laulala is a good signing, he's a pretty good player and is a natural 13...which is the first one we've had since Tipoki. Good step and well able to take the ball into contact. Maybe slight questions over his distribution but is still probably better than we have.

And if Bowe is going to Ulster and there are questions over whether Howlett's contract will be renewed, we're looking at a back 3 of Zebo-Earls-Jones which could be devastating in attack if they get supply. Serious pace there and I think if Earls can just play on the wing without getting shunted around all the time, it'll do his game a lot of good.

If we do need someone to slot into 13, he will do a job, he's not as terrible as some people suggest, he has had some good games there but he's so much better on the wing because he's a brilliant finisher.

northernpower

Ok, as the OP i think this thread has lost its way a bit from the discussion I wanted to see, which was the fact that McGahan prefers Earls on the wing yet Kidney is determined to make him into a 13.

Its not about Munster and Leinster

d-gal

totallegend wrote: »

WTF? You're the only one who has mentioned Leinster on this thread.

Your opinion of Earls as a 13 is clearly not shared by Tony McGahan. Is he a closet Leinster fan now?

Just because they've signed another 13 does not mean Earls is not seen as a centre.
Isn't it all about squad rotation for success?

I'd much prefer to have a Laulala in the mix than Mafi or Barnes.

thomond2006

I'm excited about Laulala, I've been impressed anytime I've seen him. Tipoki was 32 when he signed so I wouldn't be too worried about Laulala being 29/30 when he arrives. Finally we've signed an out and out 13 instead of trying to convert JdV or Mafi.

I expect Mafi will confirm his departure very soon. He divides opinion a lot but you can never doubt his commitment. He took a fair amount of punishement in Milton Keynes recently.

I don't think Earls will be at centre for Munster this year, unless they play him at 12 god forbid.

Murray, ROG, Earls, Downey, Laulala, Zebo, Jones would be a tasty backline next season with the likes of Barnes, Hurley and Murphy as backup.

Fireball07

d-gal wrote: »

Just because they've signed another 13 does not mean Earls is not seen as a centre.
Isn't it all about squad rotation for success?

I'd much prefer to have a Laulala in the mix than Mafi or Barnes.

This is also quite true...I'd be surprised if Earls didn't play 13 at all next season, but hopefully he'll be left on the wing for most of the season.

But it's a fair point that McFadden and EOM are rotated and it definitely works for Leinster, the more options Munster have that are capable of playing HC level the better.

Amazotheamazing

Whatever else about Earls, I don't see how anyone could say he doesn't run good lines, most his tries look easy because of the line he takes. As I always point out, if they were actually that easy we'd all be internationals.

Anyhow, going back to the OP, I'm reasonably hopeful Hanrahan will be a decent centre and that Smith and Barnes will come through to at least a Pro12 or HEC standard.

thomond2006

Is Smith any good?

Podge_irl

Earls isn't a bad tackler per se (though he's not great). It's his positioning that's the issue.

Hard to see Laulau not being first choice, though I haven't seen a massice amount of him lately so dunno what his form is like.

Tox56

I think Munster could have a pretty solid backline next year with these new guys brought in.

Won't be a world beater, but will more than hold its own, probable 4/5 IQ players isn't bad either.

Fishooks12

Tox56 wrote: »

I think Munster could have a pretty solid backline next year with these new guys brought in.

Won't be a world beater, but will more than hold its own, probable 4/5 IQ players isn't bad either.

I'd go as far to say that we'll have a backline that could cause serious problems for teams

A lot rests on O Gara's ability to get the best out of Downey

Fireball07

Tox56 wrote: »

I think Munster could have a pretty solid backline next year with these new guys brought in.

Won't be a world beater, but will more than hold its own, probable 4/5 IQ players isn't bad either.

Laulala should be the only NIQ there unless Howlett is re-signed. If Mafi stays, he'll probably have slipped down the pecking order.

If they get a proper gameplan for the backs that suits our team, could be pretty dangerous.

Clegg

It's quite obvious that Laulala has been signed as Munsters main 13 option. Earls is a quality wing and should play in his best position. He's never been that impressive at 13 imo. He had some decent games back in 2009/2010 but never anything to get that excited about. Also, his performance against Castres last month was one of the worst I've ever seen him have. He hasn't shown the passing or vision necessary to be a top quality 13.

A back 3 of Jones/Zebo/Earls has the potential to be amazing. Downey isn't that good but is can get over the gainline which is what Munster need. Laulala adds a bit of poise that Munster lack at 13. Munsters backline could be very good next season.

justsomebloke

Locked till I or another mod can look at this

mikedragon32

Right, I've had a pop at cleaning up the thread.

Anyone who hasn't read the charter yet, do so now. If you have a problem with a post, don't reply to it, report it! Tribal bullsh1t ends here.

MikeMacca is not to post in this thread again.

flutered

not alone will he have a strong contribution on field, but he will mentor the emerging back talent that we have in our squad, so said tony mcgahan.

danthefan

Clegg wrote: »

It's quite obvious that Laulala has been signed as Munsters main 13 option. Earls is a quality wing and should play in his best position. He's never been that impressive at 13 imo. He had some decent games back in 2009/2010 but never anything to get that excited about. Also, his performance against Castres last month was one of the worst I've ever seen him have. He hasn't shown the passing or vision necessary to be a top quality 13.

A back 3 of Jones/Zebo/Earls has the potential to be amazing. Downey isn't that good but is can get over the gainline which is what Munster need. Laulala adds a bit of poise that Munster lack at 13. Munsters backline could be very good next season.

No doubt about it.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Downey Lualua
Earls Jones Zebo

Makes a pretty good back line. I would hope that mentoring is big part of his role. Munster really need to bring through Hanrahan and hopefully another center in the next couple of years.

irishbucsfan

They're definitely short term options. Hanrahan needs to be playing by the end of the year.

Seems Munster are at least 3/4 years away from producing a 13 though. I think Earls could eventually move there full time, but the signing of Laulala would indicate it's not a short term plan.

danthefan

irishbucsfan wrote: »

They're definitely short term options. Hanrahan needs to be playing by the end of the year.

Seems Munster are at least 3/4 years away from producing a 13 though. I think Earls could eventually move there full time, but the signing of Laulala would indicate it's not a short term plan.

Definitely not going to happen, or else they wouldn't have signed Downey. He'll hopefully get a bit of league starts but Downey won't be involved in any Ireland squads most likely so he'll always be available.

irishbucsfan

danthefan wrote: »

Definitely not going to happen, or else they wouldn't have signed Downey. He'll hopefully get a bit of league starts but Downey won't be involved in any Ireland squads most likely so he'll always be available.

I meant to say by the end of next year

[Jackass]

1. Du Preez
2. Varley
3. Botha
4. Ryan
5. O'Connell
6. O'Mahony
7. Ronan
8. Ruddock

9. Murray
10. Keatley
11. Zebo
12. Downey
13. Laulala
14. Earls
15. Jones

Munster falling just short of supplying half of their own team for the future, with only two less Leinster men in the team than Munster men. (5 Leinster players, or one third of team).

The futures bright.

siltirocker

[Jackass] wrote: »

1. Du Preez
2. Varley
3. Botha
4. Ryan
5. O'Connell
6. O'Mahony
7. Ronan
8. Ruddock

9. Murray
10. Keatley
11. Zebo
12. Downey
13. Laulala
14. Earls
15. Jones

Munster falling just short of supplying half of their own team for the future, with only two less Leinster men in the team than Munster men. (5 Leinster players, or one third of team).

The futures bright.

Jesus, when you look at like that. . . well played McGahan, well played.

irishbucsfan

[Quote=[Jackass];77007753]1. Du Preez
2. Varley
3. Botha
4. Ryan
5. O'Connell
6. O'Mahony
7. Ronan
8. Ruddock

9. Murray
10. Keatley
11. Zebo
12. Downey
13. Laulala
14. Earls
15. Jones

Munster falling just short of supplying half of their own team for the future, with only two less Leinster men in the team than Munster men. (5 Leinster players, or one third of team).

The futures bright.[/Quote]
That could be a good long term goal for the leinster academy. Supply enough players for two provinces!

willit

[Quote=[Jackass];77007753]1. Du Preez
2. Varley
3. Botha
4. Ryan
5. O'Connell
6. O'Mahony
7. Ronan
8. Ruddock

9. Murray
10. Keatley
11. Zebo
12. Downey
13. Laulala
14. Earls
15. Jones

Munster falling just short of supplying half of their own team for the future, with only two less Leinster men in the team than Munster men. (5 Leinster players, or one third of team).

The futures bright.[/Quote]

I would say 6. Ruddock 7. POM 8. Butler

bamboozle

Downey will be a great foil at 12 for munster, he'll break the gain line, suck in defenders and this will create space for a sliky runner at 13 whether that is Earls or Lualua.

Earls might thrive playing at 13 alongside downey.

I watched Danny Barnes play for Dolphin last weekend against Clontarf, Lett the clontarf center looked the better 13.
Gleeson has been on a full contract for a few years now with no impact on the senior squad.

ed7890

willit wrote: »

I would say 6. Ruddock 7. POM 8. Butler

I don't think Ruddock is going anywhere

Flincher

I'm not overjoyed with the signing of Laulala to be honest, solely for the reason he will hit 30 before the summer is out. I don't think he has been as effective this year as in previous seasons, and I really hope it isn't age related. (Then again, Tipoki was ancient when he signed, and we all know how effective he was) If he hits his early Cardiff form then he will be a magnificent addition.

I would have preferred a younger player, somebody like Ryan Crotty or Robert Ebersohn who could fit into the team for 6 or so seaons like Mafi has done.

At least we can see where we are going with Downey and Laulala. Downey will hopefully give us a bit of front foot ball off first phase, and Laulala will spark things for the likes of Zebo, Jones and Earls.

Hope Downey and Laulala have an excellent few seasons coming up.

justsomebloke

Flincher wrote: »

I would have preferred a younger player, somebody like Ryan Crotty or Robert Ebersohn who could fit into the team for 6 or so seaons like Mafi has done.

The new NIE rules mean that you can't sign anyone for more then 1 contract term though

totallegend

bamboozle wrote: »

Downey will be a great foil at 12 for munster, he'll break the gain line, suck in defenders and this will create space for a sliky runner at 13 whether that is Earls or Lualua.

Earls might thrive playing at 13 alongside downey.

OK, I'm repeating myself a bit here but someone is going to have to explain this to me; when is Earls going to get the chance to play at 13?

Laulala is a pretty big-name signing and, presumably, is being paid accordingly. He's not being brought over to sit on the bench so Earls will be on the wing for the duration (his best position, IMO) and won't be playing alongside Downey.

Am I missing something?