Brand new clutch ,gearbox locking/sticking

gucciali

Hi there I would like any experience or advice on this please , so I got a brand new clutch put in to my Rav4 but ever since I got it back ,while changing gear they can go from really smooth changing to really sticky changing in a few seconds , sometimes gearbox will lock alltogether but if I wait a few mins and try again it's fine , while driving this morning first and second gear are particularly bad ,I almost have to shove them into gear ? any ideas anyone please ?
Also forgot to add when the gears locked yesterday there was a faint smell of burning and slight smoke but none of that today just sticky gears .

Anan1

What did whoever fitted the clutch say when you brought it back?

gucciali

I live in Dublin but got stuck in Cork last week so I had to leave it there to get clutch done and collected , back in Dublin now so I thought if it was a small problem no point in going all the way back down ?
Anyway I rang him he said maybe the clutch has an air bubble trapped and needs to be bled ?

2012 Rio

Yeah that sound like your clutch is not disengaging fully do to their being air in the hydraulic lines. Bring it back to him and get him to bleed it out properly.
Since the clutch has been smoking there's a chance it is now damaged or the release being being burnt or the flywheel being overheated, so get thick with him and stick him to put another new clutch in it aswell.
Must be some thick kunt to release a car without even checking if the new clutch was working.

George Dalton

Is this the one with the welded flywheel? If so what was done with the flywheel in the end? Was it replaced or left as it was with just a new clutch fitted?

gucciali

yes the very one ! just the new clutch went in, maybe the flywheel is the problem but getting a lot of different opinions , people saying it will be ok with the flywheel just keep driving it so I guess that's what I was hoping to do . Don't know what to do head is done in at this stage !

2012 Rio

For gods sake, bring it back to whoever did the work for them to do a proper job. THe longer you leave it the less likely they will be to fix it free of charge.

gucciali

Hey Rio the only problem is the garage is in Cork , I am in Dublin ,the mechanic told me he couldn't give me a guarantee with the clutch because of the flywheel , but still I didn't expect clutch problems on day 3 of a brand new clutch.
day 4 and the car is great gears are slipping into gear nicely

2012 Rio

Hi.
Glad to hear it's improving. That's a classic sign that there was air in the system. Some of it has worked it's way back up and out of the cylinder so the clutch is disengaging more when you press it. I'd still strongly advise that you bleed the lines out again properly just to be sure all the air is out. Otherwise the clutch or gearbox could sustain damage in the long run.

George Dalton

It will never be right with a welded flywheel in it. The clutch setup in the Rav4 depends on the dual mass flywheel to give clearance when selecting gears. There are no springs in the clutch disc. So when the flywheel is welded there is nothing to provide the clearance. You should have got it sorted properly as advised in your other thread.

2012 Rio

If there is no damper plate in the clutch he fitted, then it's the wrong one for use with a now non DMF. He should have fitted a clutch with a damper plate in the disc. You need a clutch kit for this, not the type that was originally in it.
You should have it changed otherwise there's going to be vibration and shock loading of the gearbox. thats bad.
you could do a proper job and either get a new DMF and it's matching clutch or else get a conventioanaly flywheel/clutch kit.

Personally I dislike the idea of weling flywheels - the could be stressed from the welding and could potentially fail. And when a flywheel goes, it goes spectacularly- like exploding out of the engine and up through the bonnet or worse- into the cabin. anthing in it's way is dead.

I think it's messing as I have worked with large engines with open flywheels and the rule is this: if a flywheel is in any way damaged be it craked, chipped, bent, that's it. Scrap. repairing and weling flywheels is suicide no matter how well it's done. There's far to much energy in them for a repair to be safe. So get a new flywheel.

gucciali

2012 Rio wrote: »

If there is no damper plate in the clutch he fitted, then it's the wrong one for use with a now non DMF. He should have fitted a clutch with a damper plate in the disc. You need a clutch kit for this, not the type that was originally in it.
You should have it changed otherwise there's going to be vibration and shock loading of the gearbox. thats bad.
you could do a proper job and either get a new DMF and it's matching clutch or else get a conventioanaly flywheel/clutch kit.

Personally I dislike the idea of weling flywheels - the could be stressed from the welding and could potentially fail. And when a flywheel goes, it goes spectacularly- like exploding out of the engine and up through the bonnet or worse- into the cabin. anthing in it's way is dead.

I think it's messing as I have worked with large engines with open flywheels and the rule is this: if a flywheel is in any way damaged be it craked, chipped, bent, that's it. Scrap. repairing and weling flywheels is suicide no matter how well it's done. There's far to much energy in them for a repair to be safe. So get a new flywheel.

unfortunately I didn't know there was a welded flywheel when I bought it .:eek: yeh I would definitely get a new flywheel as I do have a lot of vibration and noise , can I ask you now that I have spent 600 on a clutch if I was to get a new flywheel would it be ok with my now clutch ? or, do I need the whole lot again ? Also if I was to do this could you advise me on the price and somewhere I could get it done please ? Thanks for your help .

2012 Rio

If you get a new flywheel, whether it's a dual mass or conventional, you should definitely replace the clutch with a MATCHING kit. Since your clutch was burning/smoking it's life is already shortened as it could be damaged or the release bearing ruined. As I mentioned on another thread, a clutch is a consumable wearing part - if a gearbox/engine is ever split, a good mechanic will always replace the clutch assembly as amatter of course even if it is fine or even reatively new. A clutch kit (parts) is relatively cheap, the labour of ripping a gearbox to change a clutch is expensive.

So basically, you should change the clutch - keeping the present one would be a false economy. It's been over heated and could if damaged, potentially, disintegrate tomorrow or next week if your unlucky. Then you'd be dismantling your car for a third time.

That mechanic you got in Cork must have been some f*cking donkey!

gucciali

2012 Rio wrote: »

If you get a new flywheel, whether it's a dual mass or conventional, you should definitely replace the clutch with a MATCHING kit. Since your clutch was burning/smoking it's life is already shortened as it could be damaged or the release bearing ruined. As I mentioned on another thread, a clutch is a consumable wearing part - if a gearbox/engine is ever split, a good mechanic will always replace the clutch assembly as amatter of course even if it is fine or even reatively new. A clutch kit (parts) is relatively cheap, the labour of ripping a gearbox to change a clutch is expensive.

So basically, you should change the clutch - keeping the present one would be a false economy. It's been over heated and could if damaged, potentially, disintegrate tomorrow or next week if your unlucky. Then you'd be dismantling your car for a third time.

That mechanic you got in Cork must have been some f*cking donkey!

ok so maybe I should start fresh with the whole lot , d'ya think I should ask Cork muppet for a refund ?!

2012 Rio

Definitely. Yeah, you should haunt that cowboy for a refund. He's a pure cowboy for not only releasing a car that was not only not working properly but potentially dangerous. What if the clutch wouldn't disengage coming up to a juntion, or in an emergency stopping situation? what then?

He also released a car with an obviously botched previous repair.

I would haunt the bastard. You need to get the wind up him to have any chance of a refund - tell him you almost had an accident cos the clutch was not releasing. Tell him your thinking of calling the guards. If he refuses to pay up tell him your going to have to call your solicitor. (or threaten him with liveline. "its a disgrace joe, its a disgrace)
Now, of course, we're just trying to put the wind up him here to get him to reimburse him, but seriously you might have some sort of a case if you were to contact your solicitor on the issue as he gave you a vehicle that was not funtioning properly and it was potentially dangerous. I would consider brining him to the attention of SIMI, as he is conducting himself in an unprofessional manner and his actions could bring his trade into disrepute. Is he a member of SIMI? if he is, he will get a serious reprimand if.
If you had the time and energy, maybe you should consider persuing the matter.

Anyway I hope it works out for you. Keep us posted on any develpoments.

gucciali

Cheers Rio , I will definately let you know what's the story , thanks for your help .:)