Ban Over 70's From Driving ?

Plazaman

Driving home yesterday evening I was in a line of traffic approaching a junction with traffic lights. There was only a Ford Ka in front of me. The lights had turned red before any of us reached the junction but to my utter amazment the Ka sailed through the red light. The inevitable happened as the Ka went into the side of a bread van. Luckily no one was hurt but when the driver of the Ka stepped out he was in his mid 80's (heard him say it) and probably was just about able to see over the steering wheel.

When a Garda car arrived to direct traffic, the guy was still in the middle of the road going around his car picking up glass and generally looking confused or in shock. He ignored Gardai to stand off the road onto the footpath and eventually they had to nearly lift him out of harms way.

When I see stories like THIS and THIS, should there be a ban on elderly drivers?

They have free travel passes and/or thousand of grandchildren, why not use them? Plus there are now "Sunday drivers" all through the week. IMO the only Gerry in a car should be the name of the driver or am I being too harsh?

jester77

I wouldn't ban them outright, but a driving license shouldn't be for life. You should be made resit the exam every few years with this frequency reducing as you get older.

force eleven

My old man is a youthful 72, still likes a bit of rallying.

xzanti

Plenty of over 70s are perfectly lucid and well able to drive, I would say a lot of them are better drivers than some of the young people on the roads...

Afaik they are given more regular eyesight tests etc? and if they're deemed to be unfit for the roads their licences are revoked..

I think it is very unfair to tar all elderly people with the same brush..

RachaelVO

OH, OP, I hope they have cameras there when you hit 70 and they go to take your driving rights away from ya... that'd certainly make for interesting footage!

membersonly

Do they not have to do some sort of test every so often once they reach a certain age? Could be the states I'm thinking of.

mikemac1

Plazaman wrote: »

They have free travel passes

Great if you live in a city

Rural post offices are being closed around the country and if you are lucky there is one bus a week to get you to town to collect the pension.
If you are unlucky, there is no bus at all so they have to nominate someone to collect it

A car is a necessity for most of Ireland

biko

From AH
I don't think you should ban old drivers, maybe at most make them sit a test at 65.
On the other hand, they have 40/50 years of driving experience...

andyseadog

what a **** idea.

maybe a medical for over 80's (for example) to be sure they are still ok to drive, but an automatic removal of a privelige like driving at the young age of 70, stupid.

I think that only those over 70 should be alowed to drive.
But they have to drive the younger people around. Same for taxis, trucks, busses, trains etc.
Not sure about planes and ferries. I'll have to have a think about it

User Friendly

jester77 wrote: »

I wouldn't ban them outright, but a driving license shouldn't be for life. You should be made resit the exam every few years with this frequency reducing as you get older.

One day jester,you may get old,and if you do,you might find having a car is a great freedom.

membersonly wrote: »

Do they not have to do some sort of test every so often once they reach a certain age? Could be the states I'm thinking of.

My Father i mid 70s,he doesnt have a licence for life,he has a 3 year licence afaik which is revied by his GP

Our man in Havana

I knows quite a few auld chaps in their 90's driving away not a bother on them. I don't see it as a problem as they must have a yearly medical to keep driving.

DEFTLEFTHAND

What about the old bachelor types living in rural isolation who rely on their car as a lifeline?
Like a previous poster said I would introduce a continuous assessment programme for drivers over a certain age, to have a blanket ban for everyone over 70 is inequitable not to mention ageist.

Atomic Pineapple

No option in the poll to let over 70's drive but have them sit the test frequently????????

jester77

User Friendly wrote: »

One day jester,you may get old,and if you do,you might find having a car is a great freedom.

I've already managed to get to my mid 30's without every having or needing a car

Gareth2011

membersonly wrote: »

Do they not have to do some sort of test every so often once they reach a certain age? Could be the states I'm thinking of.

I think its only an eye test every year or so once you hit 65 I think but not 100% on it.

staker

Plenty of capable and incompetent drivers at all ages.
My father,72,used to drive for a living and would have always considered him a safe and steady driver. Got back in the car with him over the Christmas-unbelievable. How his driving has deteriorated in the last 15 years is astonishing, no indications, slow driving,no gear changes, general meandering down the road.
He definitely needs to be re-tested.
I can see the experience factor brings a lot of credibility to their capabilities,but a lot of this generation would have been driving in very different circumstances(traffic volume,speed of cars today, road markings and general layouts of traffic systems).
I'd be all for more stringent testing on over 65's.

vetstu

jester77 wrote: »

I've already managed to get to my mid 30's without every having or needing a car

Try living in rural Ireland from age 18/19 without a car.

Gareth2011

It all depends on the person, age doesn't really come into it. Ive seen elderly people driving and their fine and then some are driving so slow its dangerous cause they cause other road users to get angry and try do stupid manovours.

The mother in law can drive ok and she is in her 70's but she is very very bad at judging distances. She will stop 6 ft from a gate cause she thinks she is going to hit it and she can't read something without holding it upclose so maybe she shouldn't drive because of what I just said but not automatically because she is in her 70's.

jester77

jester77 wrote: »

I've already managed to get to my mid 30's without every having or needing a car

Have you bummed off friends/parents?
If they didn't have cars where yould u be?

Not trying to start a row but i think it would be very difficult for someone to go for a long time without using a car, not necessarly driving one.

User Friendly

jester77 wrote: »

I've already managed to get to my mid 30's without every having or needing a car

Mabe i should start a thread on Elderly people always asking for a spin to somewhere as they couldnt be bothered getting a drivers licence in their lifetime!:D:pac:

Only kidding of course,fair play to you.

celticbest

I believe that everyone under the age of 65 should have to resit there driving test every 10 years in order to renew there licence.

Over 65's should have to resit every 5 years.
Over 75's should have to resit every year.

Some of the driving on Irish roads especially Motorways is atrocious, at least when you go to resit your test you are a qualified driver and can be tested on Motorway driving as well as all the original requirements you needed to pass your test.

Edit : forgot to say, once you are over 65 resit should be free.

MajorMax

After the recent grey revolution over the Medical card debacle and the Revenue cock-up, no sane Government would do anything else to upset the wrinklies.
It only remains to see if we have a sane Government

Gareth2011

celticbest wrote: »

I believe that everyone under the age of 65 should have to resit there driving test every 10 years in order to renew there licence.

Over 65's should have to resit every 5 years.
Over 75's should have to resit every year.

Some of the driving on Irish roads especially Motorways is atrocious, at least when you go to resit your test you are a qualified driver and can be tested on Motorway driving as well as all the original requirements you needed to pass your test.

Thats all good and well but people could do their test and pass with flying colors. But over time bad habits get in and imagine living out in the country with no buses close by and you can drive safely but you fail the test because of bad habits. As for the 65 and 75 year old test, they will singled out as being bad drives by insurance companies because they have to resit their test evey year or 5. I do agree that the older you get the worse you get with judging distances , noticing others vehicles, pedistrians etc. Maybe if an eye test was required year on year and if you do bad at that or get less then 50% you shouldn't be allowed to drive. We all know cars are lethal weapons and can do lots of damage if in the wrong hands.

Any chance of an option in the poll for readers who have more than one functioning brain cell?

Seweryn

Plazaman wrote: »

When I see stories like THIS and THIS, should there be a ban on elderly drivers?

They have free travel passes and/or thousand of grandchildren, why not use them?

Because drivers under 30 years old should be banned from driving .

jester77

Deleted User wrote: »

Have you bummed off friends/parents?
If they didn't have cars where yould u be?

Not trying to start a row but i think it would be very difficult for someone to go for a long time without using a car, not necessarly driving one.

My parents have picked me up from the airport a few times when I come home to visit, but apart from that no. I've always lived where there has been good public transport so no need for a car.

My girlfriend had a car but she sold it as it was never used. It was only sitting there for a few years costing money. She used it twice, once the battery was dead, the second time the brake pads were stuck.

Seweryn

vetstu wrote: »

Try living in rural Ireland from age 18/19 without a car.

Get one of these:

Our man in Havana

Gareth2011 wrote: »

I think its only an eye test every year or so once you hit 65 I think but not 100% on it.

It is a full medical each year once you hit 70.

celticbest

Gareth2011 wrote: »

Thats all good and well but people could do their test and pass with flying colors. But over time bad habits get in and imagine living out in the country with no buses close by and you can drive safely but you fail the test because of bad habits.

This is the whole reason I believe people should have to resit there test on a regualar basis, if you fail the test then you are not a safe driver.......

Plazaman

Our man in Havana wrote: »

It is a full medical each year once you hit 70.

That's something I suppose, how the guy got past the eye test I don't know

I know in some States in the US they have specific facilities for testing elderly drivers. Relations of mine told me they had to bring their Dad (78) there as he suffers slightly from dementia and his memory isn't that good. Took off in the car one day and forgot his way home but still they allowed him back on the road with conditions which I think were to be enforced by the family not the law (i.e. don't drive for more than 1 hour at a time etc).

Not getting into the state of the country here but anything similar would eventually be a money making excercise.

staker

Seweryn wrote: »

Picture of bike

Try the non-motor tax paying forum>>>>

vectra

Ah,
That's nothing.. I have seen younger drivers doing a lot worse.:P

suzie987

staker wrote: »

Plenty of capable and incompetent drivers at all ages.
My father,72,used to drive for a living and would have always considered him a safe and steady driver. Got back in the car with him over the Christmas-unbelievable. How his driving has deteriorated in the last 15 years is astonishing, no indications, slow driving,no gear changes, general meandering down the road.
He definitely needs to be re-tested.
I can see the experience factor brings a lot of credibility to their capabilities,but a lot of this generation would have been driving in very different circumstances(traffic volume,speed of cars today, road markings and general layouts of traffic systems).
I'd be all for more stringent testing on over 65's.

Found the same with my mother (61yo). She used to be a good driver - to my knowledge. She was off the road for a year about 5-6 years ago due to illness, and is one of the worst drivers I have ever seen. I genuinely am suprised she hasn't been in a serious accident. She went down the wrong side of a dual carriage way one day I was with her :eek:

My grandmother is 92 and was driving up until a year ago. To be honest I don't think she should have been driving for the last few years, she didn't have the strength to turn the steering wheel (no power steering) or press the clutch (bad hip), but her GP kept passing her medical for the driving licence because she was bribing him!!!!!

Zubeneschamali

It shouldn't be age related, we should just ban anyone who drives while wearing a hat.

This will take care of the backwards-baseball-cap youngfellas as well as the flat tweed cap old codgers.

It BeeMee

The last poll option is an interesting one. This subject often comes up around here, mostly in relation to slow drivers.

I suspect the drivers that complain most about slow drivers holding them up are mostly under 30. They need to get everywhere as fast as they can, and can't understand why anyone else wouldn't be the same.

Between 30 - 40, it's a mixture of "get outta my way" and "take your time, bud" - depending on the mood at the time.

Over 40, the realisation sets in that "someone else's quality of life is worth a few minutes extra of mine".

So while I was tempted to tick the last box in the poll, I voted for "Leave them be"

Littlehorny

Watch/ listen to the news and the majority of lives lost on the road are younger drivers so the wrong group are being targeted here as regards road safety. The learning to drive should be stricter here and then we might all have good driving habits that will last a lifetime.

simit

A ban is pretty harsh but they should definatly be re-tested once they reach a certain age.

Caxton

If safety is your objective, you should rely on the statistics and ban the under 25's

simit

simit wrote: »

A ban is pretty harsh ...............

A blanket ban for over 70s is nothing short of moronic.

endabob1

Littlehorny wrote: »

Watch/ listen to the news and the majority of lives lost on the road are younger drivers so the wrong group are being targeted here as regards road safety. The learning to drive should be stricter here and then we might all have good driving habits that will last a lifetime.

http://www.rsa.ie/Documents/Road%20Safety/Crash%20Stats/2009_Road_Collision_Fact_Book.pdf

The most up to date I could find, but it certainly supports the fact that young people are more accident prone.

Standards in the UK are much higher imo, because testing is more stringent and it's been a way of life (proper driving lessons, as opposed to being taught by a parent) for longer.

There are rules in place but GP's are not fulfilling their obligations, my mother is in her 70's and gets her GP to sign what ever she wants, no issue.

AugustusMinimus

Caxton wrote: »

If safety is your objective, you should rely on the statistics and ban the under 25's

And what statistic are you basing that on ?

How do the over 70s compare to under 25s for accidents per miles driven ? Is it fair to compare total accidents or deaths in a grouping considering young people drive more miles each year ?


I'd also be interested to see how most over 70s would do during a driving test considering the vast majority of them have never sat one.

Cantona's Collars

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

And what statistic are you basing that on ?

How do the over 70s compare to under 25s for accidents per miles driven ? Is it fair to compare total accidents or deaths in a grouping considering young people drive more miles each year ?


I'd also be interested to see how most over 70s would do during a driving test considering the vast majority of them have never sat one.

+1
Older people do less miles,their driving tends to be very localised,they go to the local shop or to mass and very little else.
I do a lot of miles and am horrified by some of the things I see older people doing while driving.In rural areas they have a habit of driving on whatever side of the road suits them.You just have to be prepared for the unexpected when it comes to old folk and cars.

A yearly assesment should be mandatory once drivers reach a certain age.

I read in the press the other day where an elderly man refused to hand up his license in England after being deemed unfit to drive and killed a 16 year old after he drove onto a footpath a couple of days later.

Cuddlesworth

The western world has a issue with Stats at the moment. Organisations are throwing out numbers but not placing them in context.

With Road deaths being in around the 200-300 mark, statistics are becoming negligible in terms of trends because of the lack of numbers. Looking at the 7k or so road injury's would paint a much better picture of actual problems to look at but there are no viable figures presented in this area.

I'm not arguing that young drivers are dangerous. They are. But there seems to be a general ignorance towards driving re-education in western countries and old people do present a risk. There are stats available in other countries(america mainly) that clearly show older drivers(70+) have a huge crash risk when in comparison to both driving population and miles driven. I'd love to see some real figures from the RSA about this.

As for the Medical. From personal experience, my girlfriends grandfather with full blown dementia was still driving at 78 with his license. He lost it after ramming a family car three time and driving off home without being aware of it.

emick

Three times more drivers under the age of 25 are involved in car accidents than drivers who are aged over 65.

GreeBo

emick wrote: »

Three times more drivers under the age of 25 are involved in car accidents than drivers who are aged over 65.

Is that adjusted for the numbers of under 25 drivers versus the numbers of over 65?

galwaytt

jester77 wrote: »

I've already managed to get to my mid 30's without every having or needing a car

So why are you in the Motor's forum then ? ...I like fish fingers, but I'm not hanging around the Fishing Forum.......

Plazaman wrote: »

..... should there be a ban on elderly drivers?
.....or am I being too harsh?

Poorly worded Poll. I voted 'Leave Them Be' as it was the nearest to the only thing to control it - the over 70's medical. You should have had a 'test at XX age/frequency', really.

Seweryn wrote: »

Get one of these:

Yes, except RSA say it's too dangerous on minor roads. And, they're always right And there's more minor than major, roads.

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

As for the Medical. From personal experience, my girlfriends grandfather with full blown dementia was still driving at 78 with his license. He lost it after ramming a family car three time and driving off home without being aware of it.

BTDT -very difficult position to be in, i.e. that you should report one of your own to authorities to get their licence revoked. Unpleasant all round.......but, sometimes, like your case, has to be done...........my case involved hitting an empty car. But it could have just as easy been a pedestrian......

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

The western world has a issue with Stats at the moment. .

Indeed, they say 99% of all statistics are........made up.

I'm 68% certain that statement is true. The other 40% I'm not sure about

Cuddlesworth

emick wrote: »

Three times more drivers under the age of 25 are involved in car accidents than drivers who are aged over 65.

Per miles driven? Age grouping/Percentage of driving population? All Vehicle Types/Motorbike/Truck/Bus? Pedestrian deaths? Accident and injury statistics? Professional/Non professional drivers?

I like to use insurance costs as a better indicator for actual danger then the RSA stats. And insurance costs rise past a certain age, around 55 if I'm not mistaken. And continue to do so, considering that car usage would decline at the same time.

AugustusMinimus

GreeBo wrote: »

Is that adjusted for the numbers of under 25 drivers versus the numbers of over 65?

I doubt it's adjusted for average miles driven either.

emick

GreeBo wrote: »

Is that adjusted for the numbers of under 25 drivers versus the numbers of over 65?

The stats from the RSA are fairly clear. If you are under 25 then you are more than 3 times more likely to be involved in an accident than a driver over 65. That is why insurance companies charge higher premiums for young drivers.

bladespin

Age is no reason to ban someone, the problem here is that once you've passed your test that's it, there should be a retest every 10 years or so, that's dramatically improve the standard I'd bet.