Change from 08 petrol Golf to 08/09 diesel-potential savings?

toby2111

The wife has 08 GT Sport petrol golf 1.4,does about 15,000 miles per year and could be doing more from now on.Theres 88000 km on clock,just serviced last week.We're thinking of switching to a diesel(08/09),our mechanic recommended looking around now before it goes over 100k km cos it may not be worth as much.She wants a comfy,reliable diesel.Mechanic recommended Toyota,her family all drive Toyota so looks like thats our aim.I'm not bothered but Toyota seem most reliable.
I called to a Toyota garage during the week,saw a nice low mileage 2008 diesel Avensis,also had 2009 Corolla.Guy said I would have to put about €4500 along with the Golf for either of them.That seems a bit much to me.So,the question is-what would be the potential savings of switching from 08 Golf petrol, to 08 or 09 diesel?
I know tax is about €200 cheaper per year in diesel Avensis/Corolla.What about fuel efficiency?How much roughly might we save per year by going diesel(considering she could be doing up near 30k km).If it meant saving over €1000 a year,then maybe its not such a bad deal.
Sorry about long winded explanation!

650Ginge

Suggest you get your figures into excel and work it out. Do u know ur current l/100. See if you are above or below the average for that car. Then take a similar point average for the replacement car. Use www.spiritmonitir.de to get these figures. Work out the fuel per year cost. Then add in the tax insurance and any other cost and see how long to will take to get your money back.

If u are really interested in saving money on fuel then record every fill and work out the fuel consumption. Try to adopt a more efficient style of driving and most importantly slow down. It is possible for 20% saving to be made in the car you have by driving better and smarter.

My brother wife's gets 45-50mpg from their v50. He gets 55-60 from the same car.

Atlantic Dawn

The max savings in fuel would be about 30% so you need to ask yourself first what is that per year in savings and how many years will it take to save that, probably 5 or 6 so it doesn't make financial sense to change to save fuel.

L-M

You would also have to consider the higher depreciation of the newer car. What kind of driving do you do? City or motorway?

toby2111

Limerick man wrote: »

You would also have to consider the higher depreciation of the newer car. What kind of driving do you do? City or motorway?

Wife drives from town to town so mostly motorway. Insurance will be extra €70 which is not too bad. Her golf does about 9l/100km according to dash computer. Would a toyota have less depreciation than other cars?
Basically wondering if it makes financial sense to switch to a diesel now. Don't mind forking out 4 odd grand if it means we'll make most of it back over the next few years.

Leonard Hofstadter

What about looking at a Ford?

Toyota have been selling awful crap over the last 3-5 years (have you been in the latest Corolla?) and are no more reliable than anything else out there.

That said, if your Golf is the 1.4 non turbo 80 bhp engine I would try and get rid of it sooner rather than later, those engines have quite a reputation for burning oil and basically not working after 100,000 miles/160,000 km, plus the gearboxes can go as the miles pile on. If it's a 1.4 TSI on the other hand I would stick with what I have!

A Ford Focus is far superior to any Toyota and will be every bit as reliable (I would say probably more reliable) once it is serviced on time every time. They might not have the same expensive feeling dash of a VW, but it's still nicer than the interior of a Toyota and isn't that bad at all really.

Also consider the Mondeo, that does feel every bit as classy as any VW, is very reliable and would be more comfortable especially for someone who is doing over 15,000 miles a year.

pburns

Does it have to be a saloon? The Kia Ceed diesel is as good or better than any Toyota/Ford. Many came generously equipped with half-leather etc. 7 yr warranty shows the faith the Korean's have in their product.
There's the estate version as well and the Proceed which is an A3/Astra coupe type hatch.

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=213224705849340

There's a new model out in coming months as well so values will drop - good for s/h buyer.

captainspeed

captainspeed wrote: »

...:........

Toyota have been selling awful crap over the last 3-5 years (have you been in the latest Corolla?) and are no more reliable than anything else out there.
r....

Did you not recently say Toyota diesel were the default choice if looking for reliability ?
0P is the golf the normally aspirated model, 31mpg is woeful from one on motorway driving.

toby2111

I drine a diesel Ceed myself,grand wee car,economical.I like the Mondeo myself but my mechanic says they could give trouble,he fully recommended Toyota for reliability.
Test drove Corolla and Avensis yesterday,Avensis wins easily.Dealer wont budge from €4500 along with the 08 Golf for an 08 diesel Avensis.Seems a bit pricey to me.

EPM

RoverJames wrote: »

Did you not recently say Toyota diesel were the default choice if looking for reliability ?
0P is the golf the normally aspirated model, 31mpg is woeful from one on motorway driving.

And the dash reading on vags is anywhere from 3-7% on the optimistic side too. I has a similar car to the OP's and Cork-Dublin was well under 30mpg in it. Gearing is hopelessly short for anything over 100kph.

bazz26

toby2111 wrote: »

I drine a diesel Ceed myself,grand wee car,economical.I like the Mondeo myself but my mechanic says they could give trouble,he fully recommended Toyota for reliability.
Test drove Corolla and Avensis yesterday,Avensis wins easily.Dealer wont budge from €4500 along with the 08 Golf for an 08 diesel Avensis.Seems a bit pricey to me.

Shop around, there is more than one dealer in the country.

toby2111

bazz26 wrote: »

Shop around, there is more than one dealer in the country.

Yeh,will look around this week.
So,taking all things into consideration i.e tax,insurance,fuel,servicing etc,would a 2 litre diesel Avensis save about €1000 a year to run in comparison with Golf 1.4(80 bhp)?

EPM

EPM wrote: »

And the dash reading on vags is anywhere from 3-7% on the optimistic side too. I has a similar car to the OP's and Cork-Dublin was well under 30mpg in it. Gearing is hopelessly short for anything over 100kph.

I used to get very close to 40mpg from my ole 1995 214 rover years back when I worked in dublin and was up and down to cork every few days, used to be 4000rpm on the motorway.
OP you should see at least 40 to 50 from the diesels you mention.

bazz26

RoverJames wrote: »

I used to get very close to 40mpg from my ole 1995 214 rover years back when I worked in dublin and was up and down to cork every few days, used to be 4000rpm on the motorway.
OP you should see at least 40 to 50 from the diesels you mention.

To be fair RJ, a Rover 214 with 105bhp was alot lighter than a 85bhp MkIV Golf. 40mpg might be a bit high for the Golf.

Nissan doctor

Just work out the toltal cost, people are getting blinded by the 'It'll use less fuel' notion.

Work out the difference in insrance,
Difference in tax,
Difference in maintenace costs(which includes potetial future issues)
Difference in potential fuel usage(real life usage not factory quoted figures as your wife isn't getting anywhere near the factory figures for the golf she has)

Then see how long it would take for any savings which may exist in the above figures to cancel out the cost of changing cars.


Have you looked into how a change of driving style may hugely help fuel consumption? Short shifting(not reving as high between gears), having a ton of stuff in the boot, driving at a constant 100kph instead of 120kph on a motorway, accelerating away from stationary more gently, regularly checking tyre pressures etc etc can all have a huge effect on fuel economy.

Squall19

You will notice a big difference in fuel economy alright.I had that 1.4 80bhp Golf for 2 weeks before and it drinks petrol, especially when you put the foot down.

Which you have to do all the time, as the thing is dog slow, I had to drop into 3rd going up any kinda of a hill.By myself 4th gear might have done the job, but with 2 passengers over 15st it had no chance, nice car to drive and well built but that engine is horrible.

"Diesel is cheaper" is a fallacy for most people.

But for you it wouldn't be a fallacy.

1.9tdi Golf which has none of the problems of the 2.0tdi engine is way way better on fuel than your current car, I know as I had a 1.9 tdi Fabia Vrs for 3 years, remapped to near 170bhp, 50mpg easy, good power and never a problem.

toby2111

Guys-whats your opinion on Skoda Octavia?Going to look at 2008 Octavia 1.9 TDi Elegance tomorrow,48000km on clock for €13000.What would be an acceptable trade in price?3 or 4k with the Golf?
Are Octavias reliable?I know they're fuel consumption is good.

EPM

It's the exact same car as the Golf so differences in reliability are minimal. Elegance spec is decent. It's not as nice looking but comfortable and economical.

You will of course be a target of abuse though for driving one;)

toby2111

EPM wrote: »

It's the exact same car as the Golf so differences in reliability are minimal. Elegance spec is decent. It's not as nice looking but comfortable and economical.

You will of course be a target of abuse though for driving one;)

Honestly, I don't care, I'm not a badge snob. Wife just needs comfy, economical diesel. 08's seem to be goin for €12–€13k on carzone.ie so price seems OK. Just wondering what would be a decent trade in price?

Kristopherus

The Octavias are up at the top end for reliability and running costs are very acceptable. The Elegance has excellent interior. You won't go far wrong with it.

650Ginge

You said you were changing to save money. Can you put up the sums that lead you to believe changing and handing over thousands of euro will ever be repaid and in what time frame?

toby2111

I'm certainly no expert on cars but I figure we will save €200 a year on tax and possibly(but I could be wrong) €800 on fuel-a previous poster said I should save about 30% on fuel costs by switching to diesel as its more economical.So based on this,and I know my figures could be wrong, we stand to save about €1000 a year.Again thats based on the car not needing major services over the next few years.So thats why I'm prepared to spend a few grand by switching......but correct me if my logic is arseways!

Leonard Hofstadter

I think it is absolutely crazy to spend €4,500 to get a car of the same age in order to save €1,000 a year. You'll be waiting for 4.5 years before you actually save any money and at that stage you will have an eight year old car, so it won't be much regardless of whether or not it's petrol or diesel.

I would not spend that money in a million years for a car that is the same age as what you already have. It's one thing spending a fair whack of money on a car the same age as what you already have if you want to upgrade say from a Golf to a Passat or a BMW or Audi, but it seems crazy to me at least to spend €4,500 now in order to save money but you won't actually save any money until at least 4.5 years time, and if say a dual mass flywheel went in the diesel you'll be down another grand, so then 4.5 years now becomes 5.5 years.

In fairness a 1.4 Golf is pretty crap for reliability (engines love to burn oil and gearboxes can be pants on them too) and a 1.9 TDI is very reliabile for a diesel, but still I think it is a bit mad really. You may never have any trouble with your current car, they only really start going wrong after 100,000 miles/160,000 km.

It never fails to amaze me how people will spend seveal thousand more just to save a small amount on car tax.

toby2111

As I said,I'm no expert so I welcome all opinions.Got the Golf serviced 2 weeks ago and mechanic said that the starter motor was starting to show wear&tear and that timing belt will need replacing in a few months(89k kms on her).So both jobs will be,say €700-€800.Just figured now might be a good time to switch,taking mileage,costs etc into consideration.But if its a foolish move,I won't bother.

Nissan doctor

toby2111 wrote: »

As I said,I'm no expert so I welcome all opinions.Got the Golf serviced 2 weeks ago and mechanic said that the starter motor was starting to show wear&tear and that timing belt will need replacing in a few months(89k kms on her).So both jobs will be,say €700-€800.Just figured now might be a good time to switch,taking mileage,costs etc into consideration.But if its a foolish move,I won't bother.

Whatever about the starter motor, but timing belts will be due on the new car too.

toby2111

Nissan doctor wrote: »

Whatever about the starter motor, but timing belts will be due on the new car too.

True,but thats why I'm looking at low mileage car.Maybe its just best to fix starter motor and timing belt on Golf in a few months and drive it into the ground.Who knows whats the best decision.

Matthewjohn

The Volkwagen Passat is stylish, practical and good to drive and its not as bland as the Avensis.
http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volkswagen/Passat/PASSAT-1/813257541504390/advert?channel=CARS

Leonard Hofstadter

toby2111 wrote: »

True,but thats why I'm looking at low mileage car.Maybe its just best to fix starter motor and timing belt on Golf in a few months and drive it into the ground.Who knows whats the best decision.

Timing belts have an age limit as well as a mileage limit! On a 2008 car you'll probably need to get it done in 2014 even if your mileage is low.

Nissan doctor

Its every 4 years on the 1.9PD golfs.

So, @op if you buy an 08 diesel golf then the timing belt will be due just as your 1.4 one is.

As for hoping that the diesel golf won't need anything major for the next few years....that's just not a practical outlook IMO. As has been said, a clutch and flywheel replacement adds another full year onto the making your money back timescale.


Spending hundreds to save thousands is good financial sense.

Spending thousands to save hundreds isn't.

Seweryn

toby2111 wrote: »

True,but thats why I'm looking at low mileage car.Maybe its just best to fix starter motor and timing belt on Golf in a few months and drive it into the ground.Who knows whats the best decision.

If I wanted to save money in your situation, I would rather keep the car you have, or get an older (cheaper), more economical one. Or better, I would change my driving style. You can save quite a lot by driving the right way. Spending 4 to 5k to change to a very same car that may get an expensive one if anything goes wrong, makes not much sense in my opinion.

bazz26

Matthewjohn wrote: »

The Volkwagen Passat is stylish, practical and good to drive and its not as bland as the Avensis.
http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volkswagen/Passat/PASSAT-1/813257541504390/advert?channel=CARS

Anyone who thinks that Passat is in anyway stylish, less bland than an Avensis needs to take off their VW fanboy shades and drive a few more cars.

Matthewjohn

I am not the only one who thinks that.............
http://www.whatcar.com/car-reviews/used/volkswagen/passat-saloon/su

bazz26

Matthewjohn wrote: »

I am not the only one who thinks that.............
http://www.whatcar.com/car-reviews/used/volkswagen/passat-saloon/su

I prefer to form my own opinion rather than rely on a tabloid car magazine. I've driven both. The Passat might have nicer quality plastics and more chrome around the windows but where it matters, handling, refinement, there is nothing on the scale you are suggesting anyway. A Mondeo or Mazda 6 would out handle both cars. You should either one for a test drive.

Anyway this has gone O/T.