Turn Opera Centre site into a European style city square

bigpink

Me and my Dad were chatting about the Opera Centre site and my Dad said instead of trying to make ie retail houses etc maybe some part of it would be nice as a central square

What do people think?

ninty9er

It's not in the centre of the city. The Brown Thomas site is ideal....and that building is disgusting. Moving all the associated units could go some way towards filling empty units in the city.

Ideally BOI would not have renovated and the block comprising Bedford Row, Sarsfield, O'Connell and Henry Street would have also been knocked along with the newer part of William Street backing to Cruises Street.

The site for a large shopping centre is ideally the block comprising Bedford Row, O'Connell, Shannon and Henry Streets.

I'm going to set the cat amongst the pigeons with this one, but parking in the city centre needs to be outsourced to Park and Ride. Retailers say that parking is a big issue, but anytime I've heard this conversation take place it has been led by the retailer, not the customer. If you're in the city shopping in the first place, the obviously parking does not bother you.

A "Park and Ride" at the Ranks site, South Court Hotel, Corbally, Coonagh, Tipperary Road and about 2,000 parking spaces in multistory parking on the periphery roads of the city should facilitate ease of access.

Another part of the regeneration of the city centre has to be residential and creating a Central Business District as distinct from a retail district.

I could go on, but I have a Christmas tree to dismantle.

bigpink

Its just an idea,Maye keep the older nicer buildings around the square as a border

Good points also you made

kilburn

I always thought that the block opposite Brown Thomas would make an ideal City square with the Franciscans on one side, bedford row, sarsfield street all facing onto it.

Big fountain cafes and shops facing onto it happy days.

Cruises street is a kip that should never have been built, cant believe they demolished Cruises hotel, morons

Brian Lighthouse

The Idea of a big open space is an attractive one. Less nooks and crannies disguising anti social elements and behaviour, is one obvious advantage.
We do have Bedford Row and Thomas Street pedestrian areas, which are calming to walk.

Who is profiting from the current situation?
There are no tenants to pay rent.

Are there rates being paid to the city Council?
Even if the units are vacant, the city council still need to monitor litter and damage done to the footpaths surrounding the area.

The other day I saw a man painting over the graffiti where Emerald used to be, who does this man work for?

Who is responsible if something falls, or part of a building falls?
You may remember the large circular plaque/stone that fell from a brand new building (it`s now Keane`s Jewelers, I`ve never looked up to see if it was replaced, had Benetton occupied it before this happened?)
Quinn`s Hall had a portion of it fall in July 1962 (Corner of Ellen St. and Patrick St) according to the latest edition of "Limerick a Stroll Down Memory Lane".

On a side note:
What little money is generated here is vacuumed out to foreign bank accounts, we are entrenched here.
Maintaining a positive outlook is increasingly difficult when you walk around town.
The artist will paint the background of Limerick with, overcast skies, Dull paintwork, uncleaned windows, dank and decay.
By contrast the same artist has an amazing array of vivid hues to work with such as, our sense of humour, our community spirit, our smiles and our resilience to defeat.

CiaranMT

Brian Lighthouse wrote: »

The other day I saw a man painting over the graffiti where Emerald used to be, who does this man work for?

That was done by the Council afaik? They painted the row of former business there.

Brian Lighthouse

Thanks CiaranMT,
Does that mean that the City Council are extracting fees for the upkeep of the site?
I`m not hinting at anything like favours being done etc etc, but I am curious to know that while such a swathe of the city centre lies vacant, who is paying for the upkeep? Is it the taxpayer?
Surely such a large site is costing someone a lot of money to maintain.

CiaranMT

They own the block now, don't they? Bought it for a song.

Brian Lighthouse

Thanks again CiaranMT.

I missed this crucial element.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2011/1121/1224307907659.html

I thought it was still in private hands.
Please ignore my previous questions regarding the City Councils upkeep of the site.

Touch Fuzzy Get Dizzy

It's the best idea I've heard about what to do with the OC, would it myself.
If it were to become that, maybe it'd be great place to hold the German Christmas market that was talked about on here during Christmas?. If I were to pick a site myself other than the OC, would have picked Old Dunnes

constantg

IMHO

* Old Dunnes should be turned into some sort of multiple use convention centre with views of the river, castle, etc.

* BT Block should be levelled and turned into square to incorporate the pedestrianisation of the part of O'Connell St that is being planned.

* Opera centre should proceed slowly in modules? To allow for sluggishness in economy, say 5-10 units a time be built in the scheme (similar to how the crescent was expanded).

* Park and Ride is a good idea, more could be done with car parks for those commuting into and out of city.

* More Cafe/Pub licences should be granted on William Street.....Mickeys and Thomas St has a great buzz after dark while the revamped William St is dead as a doornail.....

clint_eastman

constantg wrote: »

IMHO

* Old Dunnes should be turned into some sort of multiple use convention centre with views of the river, castle, etc.

* BT Block should be levelled and turned into square to incorporate the pedestrianisation of the part of O'Connell St that is being planned.

I would love to see these 2 things happen, especially the dunnes stores eyestore, its location is ideal for this type of high profile/landmark status development...

kilburn

Old golden vale factory is ideal for a convention centre - concert venue you could incorporate the cool stone factory and chimneys into the design and it is on the riverfront

Kess73

kilburn wrote: »

Old golden vale factory is ideal for a convention centre - concert venue you could incorporate the cool stone factory and chimneys into the design and it is on the riverfront

Great shout

phog

kilburn wrote: »

Old golden vale factory is ideal for a convention centre - concert venue you could incorporate the cool stone factory and chimneys into the design and it is on the riverfront

The site must have great potential, when the economy improves.

I's love to see something go into the site off Carey's road, the old guinness store.

I always thought a conference centre or stadium would be great there with the bus and train station so close.

1huge1

I do agree a open space in the centre of a city really works, very common place in German and Austrian cities, even Eyre Square in Galway is amazing, everything emanates from it.

mastershake

Its great to just say knock a city block containing Georgian Houses and replace them with a square, but how would that actually work?

Its not that simple. Limerick has lost far too much in terms of historical fabric. The city has been disseminated by poor planing in the past and the same mistakes shouldn't be repeated.

I think a different site would probably be better suited for a square.

My recommendation would be to get street traders back into the derelict buildings ASAP.Funding should be made available for restoration.

I would advocate the existing shopping centre design proposal but with greater emphasis on restoration. Cinema as well as an arts performance centre should also be considered.

constantg

Its great to just say knock a city block containing Georgian Houses and replace them with a square, but how would that actually work?

Its not that simple. Limerick has lost far too much in terms of historical fabric. The city has been disseminated by poor planing in the past and the same mistakes shouldn't be repeated.

You're saying that the eyesore that is the Brown Thomas block should be preserved???

Funding should be made available for restoration.

Funding from where exactly?

phog

constantg wrote: »

You're saying that the eyesore that is the Brown Thomas block should be preserved???




Funding from where exactly?

The eyesore that is BT is not a georgian building.


Can we let Georgian Limerick go the same way as the Old City Walls, disappear to be replaced by cobble stone and wire strips to mark some of the locations - the wall stood here.

mastershake

You're saying that the eyesore that is the Brown Thomas block should be preserved???

I'm referring to the proposed square for the opera centre mentioned in the title of this thread not Brown Thomas, which is a kip to be fair.

Funding from where exactly?

Well presumably the council didn't buy the site so that they could just lay idle and let the place fall apart. I would expect them to have secured some funding for the regeneration of the place before they decided on buying the place out.(Although it is limerick council we're talking about).Think they will take funding that was earmarked for other parts of the city.

kilburn

I am sure that Brown Thomas would be delighted that you want to knock the store the own, empty buildings and units would be a better suggestion

constantg

kilburn wrote: »

I am sure that Brown Thomas would be delighted that you want to knock the store the own, empty buildings and units would be a better suggestion

Perhaps a quid pro quo? Give BT space in th Opera as an anchor tenant, level their hideous spot and make your square.


I don't think anyone was talking about levelling Georgian buildings, to be fair. The facades could be kept intact, which to be fair is the only part of them being 'used' for the last half dozen years at least???

Voy

Looks like something is going to happen anyway...

IT will cost in the region of the already ring-fenced €20million to prepare the Opera Centre site, claims Mayor Jim Long.
He told the Limerick Post: “We would have to go down 20 metres to build an underground car park, unless we link up to the Arthur’s Quay Car Park with an overhead bridge - that car park reverts to the ownership of Limerick City Council next year”.
Demolition, he said, will commence shortly, kick-starting development of the site.
“I’d like to see activity in May and June and that should be possible”.
Despite some concern that City Hall has so far not declared an interest in locating a new city library, the Jim Kemmy City Museum from Castle Lane and other municipal buildings to the Opera Centre, the mayor believes that siting a cultural cluster there would secure government funding.
Once the preparatory work, including legal issues, is out of the way, and an elevation site secured, he said:
“We will go to the public consultation process by the end of February and will engage with potential tenants - we’ve already been in touch with the universities and educational sector to interest them in establishing a presence in the Opera Centre and of course, we will be attracting the tier one retailers - my own preference here is for the Sainsbury, Marks and Spencer and the Asda chain, so successful in the North of Ireland.
“We want restaurants, a theatre and concert hall, overhead top class accommodation and other facilities so that the centre will not close at 6pm, but we are very mindful of the existing retailers in the city, and they will get “massive” exposure as well, so that footfall will link them directly to the Opera Centre.
He confirmed they had already received submissions from the public.
“One that comes from a nationally recognised fashion promoter is the establishment of a fashion design centre, and there are other interesting propositions”.

http://www.limerickpost.ie/index.php/navigation-mainmenu-30/local-news/4047-tune-of-20-million-to-prepare-to-prepare-opera-site.html

Berty

I think they should strongly move forward on this because it is an eyesore on the main artery into the city.

Linking the car park to Arthurs Quay is nonsensical because that car park could never sustain the amount of extras spaces required when it does open. Although argueably there is parking in AQ, Denmark Street and behind the Tax Office anyway along with the surface parking on Ellen Street.

If they are so interested in a library then let them take a visit to Douglas S/C where Tesco and M&S is because they have a rather discreet library buried in the building and FREE parking.

His suggestion about Sainsburys and Asda isn't very interesting though because both those shops are oversubscribed in Limerick with Dunnes and Tesco anyway. They are both a bit of a muchness really and I couldn't see either picking Limerick are their first Irish Republic store.

Kess73

Oh Arthurs Quay car park will be fun if it becomes council run next year.



Were they not on about knocking Arthurs Quay some time back once the building reverts to council ownership?

constantg

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.......................................................THIS is going to be FUN FUN FUN!!!

CiaranMT

What city's that from^?

What buildings from the current Opera Centre block would people choose to keep?

I'd like to see the Granary kept on, as well as the corner from Café Solo, up to the Sarsfield Bar, and around to the two buildings facing the river. I'd nearly keep the old Business Institute Building because it looks in good nick, but I'd imagine it'd be pretty difficult to tear down the buildings flanking it and not affect its stability.

I'd keep the grey stone building containing the gardening shop and the old pub (memories of lovely cheese toasties as a kid in there )... Other than that I'd say the rest of it could go.

I'd love to wander in around the middle of the block though, lots of little interesting nooks and crannies in there I'd say.

jmch81

CiaranMT wrote: »

What buildings from the current Opera Centre block would people choose to keep?

All of the building listed should be protected structures so a properly run council wouldn't knock them. Only a few building are new the closed AIB bank, the glass library building and the Call May Roberts building the which the entrances were going to be built
not sure how old this building is:
http://g.co/maps/wtyt2

CiaranMT

jmch81 wrote: »

All of the building listed should be protected structures so a properly run council wouldn't knock them. Only a few building are new the closed AIB bank, the glass library building and the Call May Roberts building the which the entrances were going to be built
not sure how old this building is:
http://g.co/maps/wtyt2

I think the Business Institute has a sign saying it's protected, but the rest of the block is hardly protected, is it?

Berty

Apparently as per todays Limerick Chronicle the old AIB bank is to become a new Temporary City Museum.

jmch81

CiaranMT wrote: »

I think the Business Institute has a sign saying it's protected, but the rest of the block is hardly protected, is it?

it all dates from the early 1800s. The block is included as a conservation area by the City Council. You can check it out in the below links(map is handier).

details:
http://www.limerickcity.ie/OurServices/PlanningandDevelopment/DevelopmentPlan2004-2010/Thefile,2863,en.pdf

map:
http://www.limerickcity.ie/OurServices/PlanningandDevelopment/DevelopmentPlan2004-2010/Thefile,2872,en.pdf

crackcrack30

Are there any draft plans or drawings..............?