Unregistered Vat Refund

bob charles

Just doing this years Vat Refund on Capital expenses. Anyway up to last year I used to have no problem of reclaiming the Vat on diesel used on capital projects but last year they refused. Considering I have about €6k of diesel spent on Capital projects this year using self drive hired machinery that I employ a guy to drive(360 and dozer) has anyone had success recently in reclaiming VAT on diesel. Im going giving them a call but not expecting to get far

viztopia

I would be very surprised if they did not allow a refund of this vat. however if you look at the information on the vat 58 it clearly states that you cant claim for fuel or oil. I would say that this is to avoid people claiming for motor and tractor fuel for the normal daily business. I think you will have to argue your point with revenue and refer to the invoice for the rental of the machinery and show that you had to provide the diesel, without getting into an argument. If you could also show that you have other fuel costs dueing the year for which you are not trying to claim for, i think that would help. you should also argue taht if you were to hire in a machine and driver this owul include the fuel cost and you could claim this way. One thing that youhave to be careful of is that you have accounted for the machine driver correctly i.e. has he supplied a valid invoice or did you process him through the payroll. If the revenue dont allow the vat to be reclaimed then i think you will have to take this into account in the future if you are ever considering unertaking a similar project. You could also consider trying to get the company that rented you the machine to provide fuel also so it would be included on the rental invoice and should be easier to claim.

bob charles

I was talking to the revenue about this and they said its not something they come across. I was told to include as much detail as possible about the job in question. What I will do is for the hire company to state that a dozer will use 30l of fuel an hour and that I clocked 200hr of work while I had it on hire and also that a 360 will use 10l an hour and I clock X hours and hopefully this will keep them happy, and then provide the fuel invoices. Should be simple really:D:D yeah right

red bull

can I reclaim vat on roofing material I used in 2008

Username John

red bull wrote: »

can I reclaim vat on roofing material I used in 2008

If its a new build (not repairs)

I would say send it in. They can only refuse it, if its too far back - but I have it in my head you have 4 years to apply. (I think)

red bull

It was for re roofing a cubicle shed does that qualify

bob charles

red bull wrote: »

It was for re roofing a cubicle shed does that qualify

yes, dont show your hand ffs, I taught you put up a new bit of a leanto a few year back:rolleyes:

red bull

A nod is as good as a wink to a blind man !!!

funny man

I got a call from someone in the VAT office wanting to know what were tex screws used for!

lakill Farm

Its 4 years so you better get the vat58b to limerick by mid december

Put in details "new roof".

I checked about the diesel and they said to me "absolute no way"

I was trying to claim back 30e vat on diesel i used in the digger and tractor
Considering i used the tractor to draw the gravel and mix the concrete

funny man

just one to watch if you claim for a repair as a new shed, and your audited make sure you have a new shed to show them, by that i mean that is writen down over so many years as a new shed not as a repair.

bob charles

lakill Farm wrote: »

Its 4 years so you better get the vat58b to limerick by mid december

Put in details "new roof".

I checked about the diesel and they said to me "absolute no way"

I was trying to claim back 30e vat on diesel i used in the digger and tractor
Considering i used the tractor to draw the gravel and mix the concrete

unfortunatley I had invoices for around 8k of diesel used on dozer and digger on self drive hire. They paid me on the same about 3 yrs ago but not last time round. Unfair as if I had got a contractor in to do the work I would have being able to claim the vat back on all the work which would include a fuel bill

lakill Farm

bob charles wrote: »

unfortunatley I had invoices for around 8k of diesel used on dozer and digger on self drive hire. They paid me on the same about 3 yrs ago but not last time round. Unfair as if I had got a contractor in to do the work I would have being able to claim the vat back on all the work which would include a fuel bill

Why not register for vat and back date the registration

bob charles

lakill Farm wrote: »

Why not register for vat and back date the registration

it was a once off (twice) situation. Total vat would be around a grand and wouldnt be worth registering.

lakill Farm

bob charles wrote: »

it was a once off (twice) situation. Total vat would be around a grand and wouldnt be worth registering.[/QUOT

Ok 13.5percent of the 8k. Ok

So why not go a back way around it?

Ie. Give the vat receipts for the fuel to the digger contractor lad and let him invoice you 8k for driver and digger

His vat would be T1 1000
T2 1000
0. Diff

Currently you cant claim vat
You claim his hire invoice. 1000 refund

Difference of 1000 in your account

bob charles

lakill Farm wrote: »

bob charles wrote: »

it was a once off (twice) situation. Total vat would be around a grand and wouldnt be worth registering.[/QUOT

Ok 13.5percent of the 8k. Ok

So why not go a back way around it?

Ie. Give the vat receipts for the fuel to the digger contractor lad and let him invoice you 8k for driver and digger

His vat would be T1 1000
T2 1000
0. Diff

Currently you cant claim vat
You claim his hire invoice. 1000 refund

Difference of 1000 in your account

No, I hired the digger and dozer from a hire company and then put a guy or myself on them. put the fuel in aswell myself so no contractor involved. If I had gotten a contractor to do the whole lot I could have claimed the VAT back.

just do it

Swings and roundabouts Bob. I assume if you were allowed claim the vat as it's a capital expense you'd have to right it off over 8yrs at 12.5% per year.

Scenario 1. No VAT reclaim. 8k can be written off this years income.
Scenario 2. VAT reclaim. 1.5k refunded and then €813 written off for each of the next 8 years.

Now I suppose it all depends what rate of tax you're paying. If 41%+USC+PRSI lets say you get 52% off your tax bill. Therefore in scenario 1 you get a €4,160 reduction on your tax bill and next years preliminary tax.

Now Scenario 2 at 41% rate. This year €1,500 VAT refund and €423 off tax bill = €1,923. And then €423 less tax for each of the next 7 years. But your preliminary tax bill is €3,737 higher this year.

Scenario 2 on the 20% income tax rate you get 28% off your tax bill (20+4%+4%). So this year in scenario 1 you'd get a €2,200 reduction.
Scenario 2 at 20% rate. This year €1,500 VAT refund and €228 -> €1,728 this year and €228 reduction of your tax bill for the next 7 years.

I'm not sure about the USC as this seems to charge differently and capital expenditure mightn't be allowed to be written off against it.

And the one final point. If a bank loan is required to cover the cost of recovering your tax over the 8 year period that also costs a few bob.

Anyway some food for thought. I got a small VAT refund this year and between the swings and roundabouts (8 year recoup time for writting off tax, and increased preliminary tax this year (I really wonder if it was worth it.

bob charles

just do it wrote: »

Swings and roundabouts Bob. I assume if you were allowed claim the vat as it's a capital expense you'd have to right it off over 8yrs at 12.5% per year.

Scenario 1. No VAT reclaim. 8k can be written off this years income.
Scenario 2. VAT reclaim. 1.5k refunded and then €813 written off for each of the next 8 years.

Now I suppose it all depends what rate of tax you're paying. If 41%+USC+PRSI lets say you get 52% off your tax bill. Therefore in scenario 1 you get a €4,160 reduction on your tax bill and next years preliminary tax.

Now Scenario 2 at 41% rate. This year €1,500 VAT refund and €423 off tax bill = €1,923. And then €423 less tax for each of the next 7 years. But your preliminary tax bill is €3,737 higher this year.

Scenario 2 on the 20% income tax rate you get 28% off your tax bill (20+4%+4%). So this year in scenario 1 you'd get a €2,200 reduction.
Scenario 2 at 20% rate. This year €1,500 VAT refund and €228 -> €1,728 this year and €228 reduction of your tax bill for the next 7 years.

I'm not sure about the USC as this seems to charge differently and capital expenditure mightn't be allowed to be written off against it.

And the one final point. If a bank loan is required to cover the cost of recovering your tax over the 8 year period that also costs a few bob.

Anyway some food for thought. I got a small VAT refund this year and between the swings and roundabouts (8 year recoup time for writting off tax, and increased preliminary tax this year (I really wonder if it was worth it.

jasus, its a bit late to digest all that but I get what your saying

just do it

bob charles wrote: »

jasus, its a bit late to digest all that but I get what your saying

After doing the accounts so in that zone at the moment. :rolleyes:

Brinan

We are putting in a claim since 2008, do we have to submit all receipts for the last four years, or can I just submit for 2008?
It is a lot of work preparing four years receipts at this time of year. Any answer appreciated.:o

Username John

Brinan wrote: »

We are putting in a claim since 2008, do we have to submit all receipts for the last four years, or can I just submit for 2008?
It is a lot of work preparing four years receipts at this time of year. Any answer appreciated.:o

I don't think so - as far as I know you can send receipts in whenever, they don't need to be in order of year, etc. I know I ave sent in older receipts, in random order, and no issues...

They will stamp receipts and send them back to you, you'll get a cheque in the post.

maxxuumman

Just on earlier posts about turnaround.
Sent receipts 13 days ago. On Monday got receipts back and a letter to say that refund would be issued to bank. Money in there this morning.
Great service