Moving home from the US

lilly032371

Hello, I am seriously considering moving home to Ireland from the US after 20 years. I have no permanent ties in the US no children etc. My parents and siblings live in Ireland and that is the main reason for returning. Will it be hard for me to establish the habitual resident requriement? I want to know if I could get the jobseekers allowance if i am unsuccessful at getting a job.

ResearchWill

lilly032371 wrote: »

Hello, I am seriously considering moving home to Ireland from the US after 20 years. I have no permanent ties in the US no children etc. My parents and siblings live in Ireland and that is the main reason for returning. Will it be hard for me to establish the habitual resident requriement? I want to know if I could get the jobseekers allowance if i am unsuccessful at getting a job.

This is a real issue, as you are aware the habitual resident test is often misused in these case. In my opinion the centre of interest part of the test is vital. So no property or ties in US will help, ageing parents that you want to take care of property interests in Ireland (including buying a plot to be burried in all help). But get advice from people who know what they are talking about before you make any application. Citizens information, family solicitor maybe able to help.

lilly032371

Thanks for the quick response. Originally, I left Ireland for lack of work and of course adventure I was young what can I say. The older I get my priorities change. I really want to be closer to my family. I am flat broke so I have to live with my parents for a while until I get settled. I know the economy is rough over in Ireland but I live in Florida and its bad here. I do have a job but that could go in the next budget crunch and honestly, it’s not a good enough reason to stay anymore. I do have us citizenship so I could go back if things don't work out but honestly I am sick of the rat race here so I don't think that is going to happen. I will be able to show closed bank accounts, foreclosed property however I am only bringing my documents, clothes and of course the most important thing I have my pet dog. I am hoping since bringing a pet to Ireland is quite a hassle that shows my serious intent in staying. Who knows I may get lucky and find a job quickly. I just don't want to become a burden on my parents.

ResearchWill

lilly032371 wrote: »

Thanks for the quick response. Originally, I left Ireland for lack of work and of course adventure I was young what can I say. The older I get my priorities change. I really want to be closer to my family. I am flat broke so I have to live with my parents for a while until I get settled. I know the economy is rough over in Ireland but I live in Florida and its bad here. I do have a job but that could go in the next budget crunch and honestly, it’s not a good enough reason to stay anymore. I do have us citizenship so I could go back if things don't work out but honestly I am sick of the rat race here so I don't think that is going to happen. I will be able to show closed bank accounts, foreclosed property however I am only bringing my documents, clothes and of course the most important thing I have my pet dog. I am hoping since bringing a pet to Ireland is quite a hassle that shows my serious intent in staying. Who knows I may get lucky and find a job quickly. I just don't want to become a burden on my parents.

All you say is very good except "I do have us citizenship so I could go back if things don't work out" if you said that to a Social Welfare officer he/she would more than likely refuse you. That statement could be interpreted as Ireland is not my center of interest, hence why you need really good advice before you speak to anyone in relation to benefits.

lilly032371

ResearchWill wrote: »

All you say is very good except "I do have us citizenship so I could go back if things don't work out" if you said that to a Social Welfare officer he/she would more than likely refuse you. That statement could be interpreted as Ireland is not my center of interest, hence why you need really good advice before you speak to anyone in relation to benefits.

Of course I wouldn't be volunteering my citizenship status to anybody I speak to in the benefits department. I really don't intend to return to the US to live. I want to be able to stay in Ireland and hopefully get a job and a place to live. Leaving the states means I will have no job and debts that I will not be able to pay so I could end up on the streets so I don't think that will be an option anyway. The citizens place just give you general advice and my family is poor so we have no lawyer so where would the best place to be to get good advice?

gustafo

Do you know you are coming back to a really dark depressing country now which is going to get severely worse year by year for this and the next generation i would think twice if i was you.

Ok your family are in ireland but i would think it would be best to visit and stay where you are.

But if you are intent on going back to pass that **** habitual rule just make sure you can show that all your ties are finished in america as much as you can get together on paper.

ResearchWill

lilly032371 wrote: »

Of course I wouldn't be volunteering my citizenship status to anybody I speak to in the benefits department. I really don't intend to return to the US to live. I want to be able to stay in Ireland and hopefully get a job and a place to live. Leaving the states means I will have no job and debts that I will not be able to pay so I could end up on the streets so I don't think that will be an option anyway. The citizens place just give you general advice and my family is poor so we have no lawyer so where would the best place to be to get good advice?

Its not your citizenship that the issue, its that you said I would return to the US if I need to. But getting advice will depend on where you are returning to some areas will have a FLAC centre "Free Legal Advice Centre". Others may have community groups for people who are returning to Ireland. Also ask around to see if any local solicitor works in this area, he may be able to do the work for a fixed price, even lawyers are looking for work and will do deals.

Balagan

Would really recommend that, if you can at all, come back for a visit before deciding to make the move. No advice can take the place of judging for yourself.

This document http://www.welfare.ie/EN/OperationalGuidelines/pages/habres.aspx?cssFont=0
is very helpful especially on the key point which has been mentioned to you by other posters i.e., the necessity to prove that Ireland will be your main centre of interest.

"Returning migrants or Resuming previous residence
A person who had previously been habitually resident in the State and who moved to live and work in another country and then resumes his/her long-term residence in the State may be regarded as being habitually resident immediately on his/her return to the State.

In determining the main centre of interest in such cases the DO should take account of:

purpose of return e.g. expiry of foreign residence permit
the applicant's stated intentions
verified arrangements which have been made in regard to returning on a long-term basis e.g. transfer of financial accounts and any other assets, termination of residence based entitlements in the other country, or assistance from Safe Home (see below) or a similar programme to enable Irish emigrants to return permanently
length and continuity of the previous residence in the State
the record of employment or self employment in another State and
whether s/he has maintained links with the previous residence and can be regarded as resuming his/her previous residence rather than starting a new period of residence.
Replies to the following questions may assist in determining whether an applicant has retained or resumed his or her main centre of interest in Ireland after a period spent abroad:

how long did the applicant live in Ireland before leaving?
why did the applicant come to Ireland originally?
when and why did the applicant leave Ireland?
how long did the applicant remain or intend to remain abroad?
did spouse/civil partner and children, if any, also leave Ireland?
was accommodation retained in Ireland?
if the applicant owned property in Ireland, was it let, and was the lease timed to coincide with the applicant's return to Ireland?
what links did the applicant keep with Ireland?
can the applicant verify cessation of employment, lease or rental agreement etc. abroad?
when and why did the applicant return to Ireland?
have there been other brief absences? If yes, obtain details.
The following examples are acceptable as proof of permanent return to Ireland: (Allow 28 days for documentation to be submitted)

Documented evidence of transportation of personal possessions
Proof of cessation of employment
Proof of termination of lease on rented property or proof of sale of home
Evidence of closure of financial accounts and transfer of funds
Evidence of completion of studies abroad (where applicable)
Copy of passport and expiration of visa at the time they returned
(In a case where a person says they were resident illegally in a country outside the EEA, the entry visa to that country, stamped on their passport, will clearly show the permitted duration of their stay in that country. For example, a person who went to the USA in 2007 and was granted an entry visa to remain there for 90 days but continued to live there until 2009, that person was resident in the USA illegally after the expiry of the 90 days. In a case like this, the fact that a person cannot return to that particular country, would mean that they may be likely to be habitually resident in Ireland).

This list is not exhaustive..."

This is also helpful on the subject of Residence Requirements for Social Assistance Payments in Ireland http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/irish_social_welfare_system/social_assistance_payments/residency_requirements_for_social_assistance_in_ireland.html

lilly032371

Balagan wrote: »

Would really recommend that, if you can at all, come back for a visit before deciding to make the move. No advice can take the place of judging for yourself.

This document http://www.welfare.ie/EN/OperationalGuidelines/pages/habres.aspx?cssFont=0
is very helpful especially on the key point which has been mentioned to you by other posters i.e., the necessity to prove that Ireland will be your main centre of interest.

"Returning migrants or Resuming previous residence
A person who had previously been habitually resident in the State and who moved to live and work in another country and then resumes his/her long-term residence in the State may be regarded as being habitually resident immediately on his/her return to the State.

In determining the main centre of interest in such cases the DO should take account of:

purpose of return e.g. expiry of foreign residence permit
the applicant's stated intentions
verified arrangements which have been made in regard to returning on a long-term basis e.g. transfer of financial accounts and any other assets, termination of residence based entitlements in the other country, or assistance from Safe Home (see below) or a similar programme to enable Irish emigrants to return permanently
length and continuity of the previous residence in the State
the record of employment or self employment in another State and
whether s/he has maintained links with the previous residence and can be regarded as resuming his/her previous residence rather than starting a new period of residence.
Replies to the following questions may assist in determining whether an applicant has retained or resumed his or her main centre of interest in Ireland after a period spent abroad:

how long did the applicant live in Ireland before leaving?
why did the applicant come to Ireland originally?
when and why did the applicant leave Ireland?
how long did the applicant remain or intend to remain abroad?
did spouse/civil partner and children, if any, also leave Ireland?
was accommodation retained in Ireland?
if the applicant owned property in Ireland, was it let, and was the lease timed to coincide with the applicant's return to Ireland?
what links did the applicant keep with Ireland?
can the applicant verify cessation of employment, lease or rental agreement etc. abroad?
when and why did the applicant return to Ireland?
have there been other brief absences? If yes, obtain details.
The following examples are acceptable as proof of permanent return to Ireland: (Allow 28 days for documentation to be submitted)

Documented evidence of transportation of personal possessions
Proof of cessation of employment
Proof of termination of lease on rented property or proof of sale of home
Evidence of closure of financial accounts and transfer of funds
Evidence of completion of studies abroad (where applicable)
Copy of passport and expiration of visa at the time they returned
(In a case where a person says they were resident illegally in a country outside the EEA, the entry visa to that country, stamped on their passport, will clearly show the permitted duration of their stay in that country. For example, a person who went to the USA in 2007 and was granted an entry visa to remain there for 90 days but continued to live there until 2009, that person was resident in the USA illegally after the expiry of the 90 days. In a case like this, the fact that a person cannot return to that particular country, would mean that they may be likely to be habitually resident in Ireland).

This list is not exhaustive..."

This is also helpful on the subject of Residence Requirements for Social Assistance Payments in Ireland http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/irish_social_welfare_system/social_assistance_payments/residency_requirements_for_social_assistance_in_ireland.html

Wow, that is a lot of information, although it is very vague. I can get proof of employment cessation, foreclosure documents for my resident. I have no assets and I was 24 when I left and had no long-term plans at that time. I’m older now and as I stated before my priorities have changed. I do visit every year or so. As it stands right now, I hate it here so the only difference about hating it in Ireland is that I will have my family near me and a roof over my head. Thanks for the link I will take my time looking over it. Everybody thanks for the great advice. It’s very hard to decide what the best thing to do. I wish I had a crystal ball!