Dublin team to play in english non league?

kerosene

Did anyone see a small article in yesterdays evening herald by eamon scott about the possability of a team from Dublin entering the north west counties league in england with a view to eventually making it to the football league. Similar I would say as to what afc wimbledon have done. Details were scarce but its an interesting proposal.

losthorizon

You buy the Evening Herald?

doncarlos

Hope it fails miserably and all the investors lose a fortune

Mongarra

Bound to fail. They're obviously hopeless at geography, so how will they find the away grounds? Do they have a home ground?

homerjay2005

it will never happen.

Amirani

FIFA/UEFA are hardly going to allow it, and rightly so.

Jax Teller

They want mickey mouse non league teams to pay to travel over to ireland every second week ?

_blank_

Who would support them?

There is no appetite for Irish people to support locally based teams, no matter what league they play in.

• People who support LoI teams like Bohemians, SPA, Shels won't support this new venture
  
• People who support a English team won't stop supporting them.

Doomed to failure from the start really.

WesternZulu

What exactly are the advantages to this proposal?

It reeks of an inferiority complex that being part of any English division is better than being part of an Irish one!

bobbysands81

niallsparky wrote: »

FIFA/UEFA are hardly going to allow it, and rightly so.

There are plently of teams playing in leagues that are not in their political jurisdiction.

Derry City, Swansea, Cardiff, Berwick Rangers... so rules can be waived under some circumstances.

Still can't see this being a runner though.

Fr Tod Umptious

Back in the early 1990s there was a proposal, that was getting a lot more publicity than this one, of a team from Dublin entering the Scottish league.

It was suggested at the time that entering the English non-league system was not feasible because the pyramid was too big and it would take too long to reach the top.

super_furry

Christ the Herald are reviving their Dublin Dons fetish?

stovelid

Irish people in the main support big foreign clubs, not those at this level.

The Wimbledon idea from years ago unfortunately would have had scarily big legs probably because they would have been playing at the top level.

In general, I don't think clubs should play outside their own political constituencies. Derry had a valid reason at the time, not so much now although I have nothing against them as a club and acknowledge that they bring a lot to the league.

Gavin "shels"

This sh*te again! Anyone remembers Martin Cullens opinion! :rolleyes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0mEv4tPekI

losthorizon

bobbysands81 wrote: »

There are plently of teams playing in leagues that are not in their political jurisdiction.

Derry City, Swansea, Cardiff, Berwick Rangers... so rules can be waived under some circumstances.

Still can't see this being a runner though.

There has to be (very) exceptional circumstances.

1 First of all the welsh clubs ( and scottish) are within the same political jurisdiction but when they were admitted to the English League there was no Welsh League. The welsh league is only about 15 years old

2 Derry were thrown out of the Irish League for no reason what so ever and its UEFAS mandate to promote football across Europe

GavRedKing

Dont see it happening ever.

UEFA would veto any attempt as soon as it was proposed.

stovelid

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

and it would take too long to reach the top.

That - of course - being the very minimum requirement for garnering support from Irish football supporters.

stovelid

losthorizon wrote: »

2 Derry were thrown out of the Irish League for no reason what so ever and its UEFAS mandate to promote football across Europe

AFAIK, they withdrew from the Irish league because they were (unfairly and with sectarian motive) not allowed to play in the Brandywell.

Your point stands though: they were forced to leave the league under excpetional circumstances.

WestBrits FC

GLaDOS

stovelid wrote: »

AFAIK, they withdrew from the Irish league because they were (unfairly and with sectarian motive) not allowed to play in the Brandywell.

Your point stands though: they were forced to leave the league under excpetional circumstances.

Teams refused to play in the Brandywell because it was a Catholic area or something along those lines I think.

Re. the idea in the OP, moronic idea; both for the fact it won't happen, and the fact it's just plain moronic.

Fr Tod Umptious

ScienceNerd wrote: »

Teams refused to play in the Brandywell because it was a Catholic area or something along those lines I think.

Well not beacuse it was a 'Catholic area', more beacuse their safety and the safety of the fans could not be guaranteed in and around the ground.

RoryMac

losthorizon wrote: »

There has to be (very) exceptional circumstances.

1 First of all the welsh clubs ( and scottish) are within the same political jurisdiction but when they were admitted to the English League there was no Welsh League. The welsh league is only about 15 years old

2 Derry were thrown out of the Irish League for no reason what so ever and its UEFAS mandate to promote football across Europe

What about Monaco?

Also Gretna were a Scottish team playing in the English league from the 40's until they applied and were accepted to the Scottish league in 2002.

I'm sure there are plenty of other examples throughout Europe that don't involve exceptional circumstances.

I'd still be against it BTW

citytillidie

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Well not beacuse it was a 'Catholic area', more beacuse their safety and the safety of the fans could not be guaranteed in and around the ground.

B/S

We left the Irish league in 1972 as the IFA wanted Derry to play all home games in Coleraine, with "home games" V Linfield to be played at Windsor Park.

Same thing happened to Clifftonvile up until about 2000 all home games V Linfield were played at Windsor Park.

Yes there was a Ballymena bus hijacked at a game and burnt out, but security forces deemed the Brandywell no more dangerous than any other ground in the league, the IFA still would not let games take place there.

So with fans not going to Coleraine for plenty of reason and the club losing money they pulled out.

dan1895

RoryMac wrote: »

What about Monaco?

Also Gretna were a Scottish team playing in the English league from the 40's until they applied and were accepted to the Scottish league in 2002.

I'm sure there are plenty of other examples throughout Europe that don't involve exceptional circumstances.

I'd still be against it BTW

Without trawling through every club in Europe, there does always seem to be some valid reason for a team playing in a league in another country. Monaco for example are a club based in a principality that doesn't have a football association affiliated with UEFA/FIFA.

What would the reason the fools who came up with this give for entering into the English system?

Also these fools (and Martin Cullen) don't seem to grasp how football works.

losthorizon

RoryMac wrote: »

What about Monaco?

Also Gretna were a Scottish team playing in the English league from the 40's until they applied and were accepted to the Scottish league in 2002.

I'm sure there are plenty of other examples throughout Europe that don't involve exceptional circumstances.

I'd still be against it BTW

Monaco is not a member of FIFA or UEFA thats why.

Scotland and And England are under the same poltitical jurisdiction - its a country called the UK.

BTW - a new president of UEFA has been elected who wants to clean up UEFA and its image including getting rid of the four British associations so having teams from one footballing association in another wont help them.

It will make it worse if a Dublin club suddenly appears in England!

stovelid

citytillidie wrote: »

Yes there was a Ballymena bus hijacked at a game and burnt out, but security forces deemed the Brandywell no more dangerous than any other ground in the league, the IFA still would not let games take place there.

I remember reading that Balymena were actually one of the clubs that voted in favour on a motion (proposed by Portadown) to return to playing in Derry, despite being the club used as an excuse for not allowing games there.

citytillidie

stovelid wrote: »

I remember reading that Balymena were actually one of the clubs that voted in favour on a motion (proposed by Portadown) to return to playing in Derry, despite being the club used as an excuse for not allowing games there.

Yea just vote to return was defeated by 1 vote.

RoryMac

losthorizon wrote: »

Monaco is not a member of FIFA or UEFA thats why.

Scotland and And England are under the same poltitical jurisdiction - its a country called the UK.

BTW - a new president of UEFA has been elected who wants to clean up UEFA and its image including getting rid of the four British associations so having teams from one footballing association in another wont help them.

It will make it worse if a Dublin club suddenly appears in England!

I accept the point on Monaco but how exactly would getting rid of the four British associations clean up UEFA and its image?

Again I'm not in favour of the idea, it's ridiculous and can't see it happening but UEFA/FIFA rules on these issues are IMO open to be tested at some point.

Dotrel

If you dumped a Dublin team in the premier league it could be a success. However you'll never get Irish soccer 'fans' to sit thru decades of non-league and lower-league matches in order to finally get to that wonderful day when their heroes from ManU and Liverpool come to town to take 3 points.

losthorizon

RoryMac wrote: »

I accept the point on Monaco but how exactly would getting rid of the four British associations clean up UEFA and its image?

Treating some nations more favourably than others ie the UK has more votes than say France.

RoryMac

losthorizon wrote: »

Treating some nations more favourably than others ie the UK has more votes than say France.

I wish him luck in trying to change that.......he'll need it.

CSF

I full on passionately hate anyone who wants this to happen.

homerjay2005

rarnes1 wrote: »

WestBrits FC

plenty of people suitable to play and support them in dublin anyway

Dub13

losthorizon wrote: »

Treating some nations more favourably than others ie the UK has more votes than say France.

This is part of the reason why the Welsh & Scots are not supporting the British team in the Olympics,they see it as been a stepping stone to a united UK team.

tommyhaas

If it were to happen, the Irish club would have to pay for flights and hotel for the opposition to travel over every second weekend, as Gurensy have to do (there was a piece on SSN about it the other week). I can't see it being viable, particularly given the likely lack of support for the team in the lower leagues

The other, and more relevant point is why should it be allowed? As other's have pointed out, sides currently playing in foreign leagues all have legitimate reasons. I can't think of one legitimate reason why it should be allowed

I remember there was talk of an Atlantic league a while back. What would people think of Irish clubs competing in something similar? A second tier Atlantic league perhaps with Scandinavian, Scottish sides etc

bobbysands81

losthorizon wrote: »

Scotland and And England are under the same poltitical jurisdiction - its a country called the UK.

In that case should Wales, Scotland and England (and probably the 06) not just be one team?

Saint_Mel

Dublin Dons in reverse. Never gonna happen so wouldnt worry too much about it

RoryMac

tommyhaas wrote: »

The other, and more relevant point is why should it be allowed? As other's have pointed out, sides currently playing in foreign leagues all have legitimate reasons.

In Europe maybe but look at the inclusion of Canadian teams in the MLS to see that if enough money is involved FIFA will allow it to happen.

tommyhaas

RoryMac wrote: »

In Europe maybe but look at the inclusion of Canadian teams in the MLS to see that if enough money is involved FIFA will allow it to happen.

Yea sorry I meant Europe, I haven't a notion about non-European leagues

Dotrel

RoryMac wrote: »

In Europe maybe but look at the inclusion of Canadian teams in the MLS to see that if enough money is involved FIFA will allow it to happen.

Also, Wellington Phoenix play in the Australian top league so despite all these 'regulations' it seems to be that anything goes when it comes to start-ups.

I defo found it slightly odd watching my first A-League game in New Zealand!

themont85

tommyhaas wrote: »

If it were to happen, the Irish club would have to pay for flights and hotel for the opposition to travel over every second weekend, as Gurensy have to do (there was a piece on SSN about it the other week). I can't see it being viable, particularly given the likely lack of support for the team in the lower leagues

The other, and more relevant point is why should it be allowed? As other's have pointed out, sides currently playing in foreign leagues all have legitimate reasons. I can't think of one legitimate reason why it should be allowed

I remember there was talk of an Atlantic league a while back. What would people think of Irish clubs competing in something similar? A second tier Atlantic league perhaps with Scandinavian, Scottish sides etc

Wouldn't have a problem with that myself nor would I with Irish clubs playing over in the UK so they could actually compete in a decent sized market.

Martin Cullen was right. It would be fantastic if we had a team in a European League. Dublin is far too big to have been left with this gaping hole. Just look at the support of Leinster and Dublin GAA. They'll support you if you go somewhere.

LoI fans like flies to **** over any attempt to improve the club soccer scene barring the usual "get off the barstools".

Bodhisopha

If they somehow made their way into the top level of English football they would have a lifelong fan in me (unless they got relegated).

tommyhaas

themont85 wrote: »

Wouldn't have a problem with that myself nor would I with Irish clubs playing over in the UK so they could actually compete in a decent sized market.

Martin Cullen was right. It would be fantastic if we had a team in a European League. Dublin is far too big to have been left with this gaping hole. Just look at the support of Leinster and Dublin GAA. They'll support you if you go somewhere.

LoI fans like flies to **** over any attempt to improve the club soccer scene barring the usual "get off the barstools".

Didn't Martin Cullen want it to be a new Dublin club, as oppose to an existing club? I'd strongly disagree with that, what I meant was existing Irish clubs competing

themont85

tommyhaas wrote: »

Didn't Martin Cullen want it to be a new Dublin club, as oppose to an existing club? I'd strongly disagree with that, what I meant was existing Irish clubs competing

I couldn't care less if it's an existing club or not tbh.

Gavin "shels"

Are you a troll or just lacking a functioning brain mont?

doncarlos

themont85 wrote: »

It would be fantastic if we had a team in a European League.

Eh, we do have one. Shamrock Rovers.

Try reading a newspaper bud

themont85

doncarlos wrote: »

Eh, we do have one. Shamrock Rovers.

Try reading a newspaper bud

An actual European League. For the top clubs in Europe the Europa League is just a means to pick up a pay check. Once in it very few care of it.

If it's Shamrock Rovers/Shels ect in it then great but something has to change if Dublin is to consistently be up on the European stage. Franchises, whatever...

ArmaniJeanss

I shall bump this thread in 20 years for nostalgia value when the Dublin Viking FC win the Champions League.

Gavin "shels"

stovelid

Was wondering when the usual people would show up.

Thread downwhill from here, I guess.

themont85 wrote: »

I couldn't care less if it's an existing club or not tbh.

I'd rather they set up a Dublin United franchise that killed the LOI dead than the thought of people like you latching onto Rovers.

Gavin "shels"

themont85 wrote: »

An actual European League. For the top clubs in Europe the Europa League is just a means to pick up a pay check. Once in it very few care of it.

If it's Shamrock Rovers/Shels ect in it then great but something has to change if Dublin is to consistently be up on the European stage. Franchises, whatever...

Get you're cheque book out so. How do you think teams from Ireland can make it to the Champions League Group Stages when people don't go to matches and that the FAI don't give a flying toss.