Job Bridge scheme - A wolf in sheep's clothing?

Cawk n bawllz

If you're a job seeker like myself it's likely you're aware of Job Bridge; the national internship scheme.
Here's the link:
http://www.jobbridge.ie/

On the surface it seems promising. It gives jobseekers and graduates like myself a good training and experience opportunity through a 6 - 9 months work placement in which you keep your jobseekers allowance AND recieve an additional €50 per week while you're on this placement.

But... I see a huge problem with this and maybe some of you have spotted it too.
Wont this undercut the current workforce and worsen the unemployment problem?
Look at it from the perspective of an employer who runs a company.
Business isn't booming, the company is just keeping its head above water and his employees cost €400+ per week. Wouldn't it make sense for him to let a whole bunch of them go and take on these people from Job Bridge for free? He gains profit with his free workforce and only has to pay a proper wage to the higher up more important members of the team. Once the Job Bridge trainees' 9 month placement is over, take on another group!

Through this process, the recession worsens until it acquiesces to the point where all of Ireland becomes a cheap workforce for the heads of these companies. Everyone earns their dole plus 50 a week. And what's even sneakier is that it's not legislation. It's optional. But if you don't take part in it, the social welfare see it as a lack of effort and you risk losing your jobseekers benefit. So we're gently coerced into it.

So my theory sounds crazy but judging by our government's track record it's hardly something which is below them.
I could be totally wrong. There could be a certain stipulation in the scheme which prevents this from happening (I know they only have 5000 places but they could expand that if it's successful) and I've never studied business or economics so there could be some gaping holes in my theory but in this case I would be happy to have it debunked. I've lost all hope and faith in this country and I would like for Job Bridge not to be as sinister as I think it might be...

Well... that was a fair old rant. Thoughts?

Delancey

Take afew minutes to read through this forum - several threads already on the great con job that is Job Bridge and how it displaces real jobs in return for unpaid skivvying.

kadman

Cawk n bawllz wrote: »

If you're a job seeker like myself it's likely you're aware of Job Bridge; the national internship scheme.
Here's the link:
http://www.jobbridge.ie/

On the surface it seems promising. It gives jobseekers and graduates like myself a good training and experience opportunity through a 6 - 9 months work placement in which you keep your jobseekers allowance AND recieve an additional €50 per week while you're on this placement.

But... I see a huge problem with this and maybe some of you have spotted it too.
Wont this undercut the current workforce and worsen the unemployment problem?
Look at it from the perspective of an employer who runs a company.
Business isn't booming, the company is just keeping its head above water and his employees cost €400+ per week. Wouldn't it make sense for him to let a whole bunch of them go and take on these people from Job Bridge for free? He gains profit with his free workforce and only has to pay a proper wage to the higher up more important members of the team. Once the Job Bridge trainees' 9 month placement is over, take on another group!

Through this process, the recession worsens until it acquiesces to the point where all of Ireland becomes a cheap workforce for the heads of these companies. Everyone earns their dole plus 50 a week. And what's even sneakier is that it's not legislation. It's optional. But if you don't take part in it, the social welfare see it as a lack of effort and you risk losing your jobseekers benefit. So we're gently coerced into it.

So my theory sounds crazy but judging by our government's track record it's hardly something which is below them.
I could be totally wrong. There could be a certain stipulation in the scheme which prevents this from happening (I know they only have 5000 places but they could expand that if it's successful) and I've never studied business or economics so there could be some gaping holes in my theory but in this case I would be happy to have it debunked. I've lost all hope and faith in this country and I would like for Job Bridge not to be as sinister as I think it might be...

Well... that was a fair old rant. Thoughts?

That was a fair old rant.

But you have your finger right on the pulse. You only have to look at all the big corporations and multi nationals , that have signed up to take advantage of it.

If these positions are there, why dont they pay a fair wage for them. HP and BT have signed up for the benefit of getting some slaves. Now dont tell me that they need subsidised labour.

kadman

Cawk n bawllz

Delancey wrote: »

Take afew minutes to read through this forum - several threads already on the great con job that is Job Bridge and how it displaces real jobs in return for unpaid skivvying.

Ah. I should have had a look around the board first. Yeah I saw some of the comments in other threads. Everyone appears to be strongly against Job Bridge.
So does anyone oppose the notion that Job Bridge is a scam here?
Two of my friends are on it. One of them did it willingly as he's trying to help his career and the other was told that she has to be making some sort of effort to improve her situation or her benefits will be facing review and job bridge was the only available option.

7Sins

I quite enjoyed my interview a few months back with the fas lady, I don't know what her actual title was but she sat behind a desk and told me how to google for their jobs online.

It went something like this...

Her: Have you heard about our jobs bridge

Me: Yea (I know, I'm charming)

Her: The idea is to give people like you a lick of experience and at the end of the 9 months an employer might keep you on (she says smugly as though to say yeaaaaaa right :P)

*She googles stuff for me*

Her: Oh there's nothing coming up for your career but this sounds similar

Me: It's not similar....ummm....I'm kinda interested in going abroad for work, you guys got anything online like in England or something?

Her: Oh yes we do!

Me: I see, and is that like claiming welfare with a 50 quid bonus too?

Her: Oh no, they would be real jobs!

Me: I see


By the way, I'm 24 and it was 144 a week for me, so this extra 50 that I should've been soooo grateful for just brings it up to the normal dole. Am I wrong to assume that the internships where mostly meant for a below 25 jobseeker?

And what's up with these turnipships for jobs like waitressing and child minding :pac:

Cawk n bawllz

Something which greatly annoys me about Social Welfare and FAS is that they act as if the unemployment problem is due to people not having work experience or not having a good CV and not due to the fact that the country is having its proverbial backside brutally violated by our government, the banks and the IMF.

starrynightsky

I agree with the comments about it undercutting regular workers. It stinks when you look at the wider picture certainly. For me however it looks like the only way to get experience in a sector notoriously difficult to find work in. I'm hoping to gain as much from it as I put in, and maybe make contacts that will eventually offer me real work. It seems like a long shot but I've been unemployed now for 6 months, countless job applications resulting in nothing. Its basically Job Bridge or death-by-boredom it seems. I might as well give it a try. My issue is rent allowance, since I am moving county to start the internship. I have to have been privately renting for 6 months, which I haven't. The extra 50 doesn't nearly cover the rent, plus I need deposit and rent up front. Does anyone know where I can appeal this? Job Bridge/Fas themselves say its nothing to do with them and I keep getting directed around in circles.

experiMental

I don't see the Job Bridge scheme as a means to take advantage of people. If companies want to perform internationally, they have to make sacrifices. In Ukraine, for example, the minimum wage is set at 100 Euro per month. How can it be possible to compete with this?

Maybe the job bridge payment is too low for people with families, who need to retrain for a new career, but that's another story. For those that are single, unemployed and have no mortgages, job bridge is an opportunity.

Poverty is something that most of us have to deal with, in a country that hardly manufactures anything.

ourtrail

I have just recently started the Job Bridge programme and so far things are going great however I do realise I have struck lucky -
1. The business is a couple of hundred yards walk from my house so no travel expenses and is a large, well respected company
2. I live at home so no bills, no rent - except €24 deducted from JSA for living at home
3. Free meals on duty and I am receiving excellent training and hands on experience in the area of work I have my degree in.

I am also in the age bracket whereby I only receive €100 a week which after a €24 deduction for means leaves me with €76 a week so I am very glad of the extra €50. However if my circumstances were even slightly different there is no way I could afford to do it. If I had to travel even a bus ride to the premises or pay rent, the only thing I would be getting is experience which would be dampened by feeling like I was doing it for nothing. It appears the scheme only really benefits those at home of an age where they cannot earn full dole!

kadman

ourtrail wrote: »

I have just recently started the Job Bridge programme and so far things are going great however I do realise I have struck lucky -
1. The business is a couple of hundred yards walk from my house so no travel expenses and is a large, well respected company
2. I live at home so no bills, no rent - except €24 deducted from JSA for living at home
3. Free meals on duty and I am receiving excellent training and hands on experience in the area of work I have my degree in.

I am also in the age bracket whereby I only receive €100 a week which after a €24 deduction for means leaves me with €76 a week so I am very glad of the extra €50. However if my circumstances were even slightly different there is no way I could afford to do it. If I had to travel even a bus ride to the premises or pay rent, the only thing I would be getting is experience which would be dampened by feeling like I was doing it for nothing. It appears the scheme only really benefits those at home of an age where they cannot earn full dole!

Glad to hear that you feel it is of benefit to you.

Best of luck with it.

kadman

Broads.ie

Job Bridge does have a few great vacancies that I'd love to apply for, but once you scroll to the requirements section you see that very specific experience, degrees, masters or sometimes even PHD's are needed.

It is quite obvious that the majority of the companies are looking for free expertise and don't actually want to train anybody, unless the vacancy is shelf stacking in an shop, and the training for that would last about 4 and a half seconds.

Cawk n bawllz

Broads.ie wrote: »

Job Bridge does have a few great vacancies that I'd love to apply for, but once you scroll to the requirements section you see that very specific experience, degrees, masters or sometimes even PHD's are needed.

It is quite obvious that the majority of the companies are looking for free expertise and don't actually want to train anybody, unless the vacancy is shelf stacking in an shop, and the training for that would last about 4 and a half seconds.

Well I'm of the impression that there's a whole lot of winking and nodding going on among companies and the government and this whole "internship" thing is a cheap labour scam. Where was Job Bridge when times were good?

7Sins

experiMental wrote: »

I don't see the Job Bridge scheme as a means to take advantage of people. If companies want to perform internationally, they have to make sacrifices. In Ukraine, for example, the minimum wage is set at 100 Euro per month. How can it be possible to compete with this?

Maybe the job bridge payment is too low for people with families, who need to retrain for a new career, but that's another story. For those that are single, unemployed and have no mortgages, job bridge is an opportunity.

Poverty is something that most of us have to deal with, in a country that hardly manufactures anything.

The Ukraine?? I can't be bothered figuring out what currency this Ukraine of yours is on or what the exchange rate is, how on earth is that relevant? Austrailia's minimum wage is $15.51 an hour, How can it be possible to compete with this? I'm hardly enticed to go to the Ukraine for their "extremely competitive" 100 quid a month now am I.

How are the companies making the sacrifices here?, specifically in relation to the jobs bridge? They're getting an average of 8 to 9 employees for the price of 1.

Now how are they not taking advantage of people? The jobs on the bridge are menial to say the least and these certainly aren't classed as careers! sorry to burst people's bubble here like. There's a few interesting ones perhaps like accountancy? Go for that if you want a career change, chances are you don't have the required degrees for this career change. It wouldn't be a career change if you did. Go to college for a few years, say goodbye to a full time job, pay the fees, pay the rent ( assuming you're not naive enough to assume everyone will be able to go to a college next door to them or even one within 100km) say goodbye to rent supplement awell then graduate and be insulted with fas sticking their ore in. Offering you after 3, 4, 5 years of sacrifice and hard work a wage of 50 euros that you should be so grateful for. Internships have always been part and parcel of the higher paid jobs in alot of cases. Fas has no place here, and we know what's happening here, the ones with the experience, the mortages etc that need an extra 50 a week are getting these jobs. Exploitation? yes.

But this crap....Copy & pasted from their site:

School caretaker

Based in ENNISCORTHY (URBAN)

Description

The intern will gain practical experience in maintenance and caretaking of the premises, both internal and external. This will vary from landscaping & grass cutting to erecting shelving and notice boards etc inside the school. The Intern will receive formal/informal training in the following - checking the water pump and heating system, plastering and painting walls where necessary, day-to-day general maintenance such as plumbing, carpentry & electrical work. From time to time he/she will be shown how to deal with the maintenance of the computer system. On completion the intern will have attained skills in carpentry, plumbing, electrics and landscaping, together with basic skills in computer maintenance.


An internship to be a care taker?! I'll give them an A+ for the flowery diction, but ffs lads.


The sod has to clean up vomit and unplug toilets, pay him a wage like, don't insult him making out he needs to train for 9 months to do basic things that a 2 year old can do.

Cawk n bawllz

7Sins, your post has made me sad and angry and also I love you!

Sala

You don't need 9 months "training" for most of the positions. These are just jobs for which someone should be paid a fair wage. I bet all the caretaker/ receptionist / waiter / kitchen porter positions will give you a day or two training and leave you to slave away on your own along side the paid employees, which totally undermines the purpose of the scheme. Disgraceful.

There are some great internships, but they are few and far between.

If I ever see an "internship" for a waiter, porter etc I will never go to that restaurant again. I used to waitress and it is tough and demanding with long hours. It doesn't take 9 months slave labour to learn how to do it, and I can't imagine anyone would want to do it for 250quid a week unless the tips were amazing. Paying for a meal, and your taxes "paying" all their staff? Obviously not a viable business or just pure greedy f**kers

Oh_Noes

There are a small few exceptions where this scheme could be helpful, but the vast majority of what's on it is indeed taking the p1ss. I agree with the OP to an extent that it has the potential to undermine the job market but in all honesty I don't think it will because the evidence so far is that very few people are willing to participate in this scheme and I doubt that will change.

The problem to me seems to be the employers that are taking part in it. There's so much said in the media and everywhere else about how there's no jobs, yet the jobbridge scheme is full of positions in coffee shops and on factory floors or doing maintenance work. These are jobs which a lot of people who've been laid off would be happy to do in order to get by. That's if they were at least being paid minimum wage for them. The employers themselves should be means tested to see if they genuinely can't afford to hire a person to do this job. If they can't afford to pay someone minimum wage to do it then maybe the state should continue to pay the unemployment payment and the employer pays a 50% minimum wage.

angelfire9

There was a thread on here before highlighting the "Wonderful Opportunities" that Jobbridge gives
Here's a few examples in Clare:

Secretary/Receptionist


Based in ENNIS TOWN Ref. INTE-651115
Description
The intern will gain practical experience in all secretarial duties including client relations to include answering phones, greeting customers and dealing with queries. We are looking for a dynamic, energetic and efficient person. The position includes handling calls, organising appointments, providing secretarial and administrative support to senior staff. The Intern will receive formal/informal training in the following in Microsft Office packages including Word, Excel, Outlook and Publisher together with Dictaphone experience. On completion the intern will have attained skills in client relations/customer services, advertising/marketing, diary management, Dictaphone use.

Skills Requirements
The applicant will: be people orientated with a pleasant demeanour, be able to work within a small team, have a flexible nature in terms of working responsibilities, be computer literate with excellent knowledge Microsoft Office Suite, have typing and Dictaphone experience, have an excellent telephone manner

Please Note:
This is an Internship. An allowance of €50 per week will be paid in addition to your current Social Welfare payment.See eligibility criteria above.

Department
Reception

Mentor
The Organisation will assign a mentor to support you during the Internship.

Duration
6 Months

Number of Positions
1

Contract Type
Other

Days, Hours & Start Date
Days per week: To be Advised
Hours per day: Not specified
Hours per week: 32
Start Date: TBC

Experience Required:
No Experience Required
Education Requirements:
Other - Secretarial Course or similar completed. At least 1 years experience in a similar role Proven secretarial and administrative abilities working across multiple teams

Applicants can send CV or application to info@costelloe.com or Costelloe Estate Agents, No. 5, Abbey, Street, Ennis, Co. Clare (Attn. Mr. David Costelloe).

What will an "intern" who already has 1 years experience gain from this ^^

Administration/Marketing Co-ordinator


Based in ENNIS TOWN Ref. INTE-642297
Description
The intern will gain practical experience in general office administration and on-site/on-line marketing strategies in a busy service environment. Gathering information and setting up customer databases, disseminating promotional material/ information via texts, e-mails, social media and up-grading/updating web-site. The learner will gain experience in all aspects of organising a series of in-house promotional talks and demonstrations.

Skills Requirements
Ideally the candidate will have good organisational, planning and computer/social media skills and will be outgoing, hard working, sociable and able to work as part of a team. It is essential that the candidate will be able to take direction and instructions and the act on own initiative to carry out tasks as required. An interest in horticulture would be an advantage. Week-end working essential.

Please Note:
This is an Internship. An allowance of €50 per week will be paid in addition to your current Social Welfare payment.See eligibility criteria above.

Department
Office/Marketing

Mentor
The Organisation will assign a mentor to support you during the Internship.

Duration
9 Months

Number of Positions
1

Contract Type
Other

Days, Hours & Start Date
Days per week: To be Advised
Hours per day: Not specified
Hours per week: 30
Start Date: TBC

Experience Required:
No Experience Required
Education Requirements:
Leaving Certificate Ordinary - Or Equivalent. Excellent computer, writing and social media skills are essential. Qualification in office systems/ web-site development/ social media for marketing purposes, sales/marketing qualification or a qualification in horticulture desirable.

E-mail CVs and cover letter to the Manager - vaughan.ennis@eircom.net

Contact arrangements must be followed exactly as stated by the employer as they are the preferred method of contact.

Yes, we are too cheap to employ someone in marketing so we want a QUALIFED person to do it for us!


Bah HUMBUG!!!!!!! :mad:

angelfire9

And wait for it.... these jobs are looking for QUALIFIED persons as interns:

Accounts Assistant

Based in BALLYDESMOND Ref. INTE-651911
Description
The intern will gain practical experience in data entry, analysis and reporting, using Sage Accounts and MS Excel. The Intern will receive formal/informal training in the following; using Sage Accounts Package, MS Excel, accounts and other data entry, office procedures. On completion the intern will have attained skills in office procedures, data entry/analysis, updating accounts using Sage and MS Excel.

Skills Requirements
Willingness to learn and take instruction. Business or accounts third level qualification will be an advantage.

Please Note:
This is an Internship. An allowance of €50 per week will be paid in addition to your current Social Welfare payment.See eligibility criteria above.

Department
Accounts

Mentor
The Organisation will assign a mentor to support you during the Internship.

Duration
9 Months

Number of Positions
1

Contract Type
Other

Days, Hours & Start Date
Days per week: To be Advised
Hours per day: Not specified
Hours per week: 39
Start Date: TBC

Experience Required:
No Experience Required
Education Requirements:
Third Level - Accounting or book keeping background.

Email CV to harry@solgolfconst.com

Solicitor

Based in TULLAMORE Ref. INTE-651828
Description
The intern will gain practical experience in all aspects of general practice law e.g. Litigation, Conveyancing, Family Law, Employment Law, Commercial Lending, Debt Recovery etc. The Intern will receive formal/informal training in the following Litigation, Conveyancing, Family Law, Employment Law, Commercial Lending, Debt Recovery. On completion the intern will have attained skills in all areas of a legal practice.

Skills Requirements
Qualified Solicitor

Please Note:
This is an Internship. An allowance of €50 per week will be paid in addition to your current Social Welfare payment.See eligibility criteria above.

Department
Legal

Mentor
The Organisation will assign a mentor to support you during the Internship.

Duration
6 Months

Number of Positions
1

Contract Type
Other

Days, Hours & Start Date
Days per week: To be Advised
Hours per day: Not specified
Hours per week: 35
Start Date: TBC

Experience Required:
No Experience Required
Education Requirements:
Third Level - Qualified Solicitor

Forward C.V by email to info@scanlons.ie before 20th December 2011.

Accounts Assistant

Based in CARRICK-ON-SHANNON Ref. INTE-651656
Description
The intern will gain practical experience in the preparing of accounts and banking, bank reconciliations Invoice matching, Invoice posting, Accounts Payable including Supplier Reconciliations. The Intern will receive formal/informal training in the following Tas Books. On completion the intern will have attained skills in Tas Books, Excel and all of the accounts processing areas, Office skills including dealing with customers.

Skills Requirements
A person with accounts training

Please Note:
This is an Internship. An allowance of €50 per week will be paid in addition to your current Social Welfare payment.See eligibility criteria above.

Department
Accounts Dept

Mentor
The Organisation will assign a mentor to support you during the Internship.

Duration
6 Months

Number of Positions
1

Contract Type
Other

Days, Hours & Start Date
Days per week: To be Advised
Hours per day: Not specified
Hours per week: 35
Start Date: TBC

Experience Required:
No Experience Required
Education Requirements:
Third Level - Accountancy

To apply please E-Mail details to accounts@weschem.ie

:mad::mad::mad:

ruggerbugger1

Anyone know if you could actually go to a company and ask them to take you on on one of these schemes? what does a company have to do to qualify for it?
i would like to get experience on a golf course and was thinking of going and asking the local course would they do this.

Sala

Anyone know if you could actually go to a company and ask them to take you on on one of these schemes? what does a company have to do to qualify for it?
i would like to get experience on a golf course and was thinking of going and asking the local course would they do this.

#

You can. From their FAQs: "Alternatively, if you wish to acquire an internship within a specific organisation you can approach them yourself informing them of the National Internship Scheme (NIS) and direct them to the website to apply as a HO."

_feedback_

Customer Service Assistant/Forecourt Attendant

Another amazing opportunity.. Some of them are sickening.

Dealgan Service Station Dundalk should be ashamed of themselves.

Customer Service Assistant/ Forecourt Attendant
Description:
The intern will gain practical experience in dealing with customers in the retail operations in the Shop; co-ordinating stock, handling cash; using a modern computerised till; opening up and locking the premises. Intern will be responsible for a variety of aspects of the stations including car wash and car valeting duties. The Intern will receive formal/informal training in the following:- using the till; fire evacuation training, manual handling training and health and safety training as well as the rudiments of supervisory skills. On completion the intern will have attained skills in all aspects of the retail trade including customer care; complaints solving; stock control; assisting the Core Team.

Skills Required
The person will need to be responsible, reliable and have some experience of working in a customer environment. Experience of car valeting is also essential. The individual will also need to be able to work on own initiative and have good communication skills.

_Moss_

I'm currently on a JobBridge Internship. I really loved it in the beginning, I was out doing something and the extra €50 was very nice.. I was trained in just a few days and now going into my fourth month I'm cracking up.

Is there any way to means test a company before they can take part in an Internship Scheme?

SeaFields

elviscostello wrote: »

Another amazing opportunity.. Some of them are sickening.

Dealgan Service Station Dundalk should be ashamed of themselves.

Skills Required
The person will need to be responsible, reliable and have some experience of working in a customer environment. Experience of car valeting is also essential.

Interesting words to be included there in the skills required. How the likes of that got on the website is a disgrace. :mad:

I worked on a garage forecourt when I was 14. Didn't need any fcuking experience to do the job either.

Incompetent jobbridge knobs.

Cawk n bawllz

Sala wrote: »

If I ever see an "internship" for a waiter, porter etc I will never go to that restaurant again.

Sala, that is brilliant! Could we possibly organise a campaign to boycott any business which exploits the internship scheme trying to gain free menial task monkeys?

garfieldsghost

Cawk n bawllz wrote: »

Sala, that is brilliant! Could we possibly organise a campaign to boycott any business which exploits the internship scheme trying to gain free menial task monkeys?

Pizza Hut in Longford recently advertised through Job Bridge for an 'intern' to serve customers. Can't find the link now...

patwicklow

its 100% slave labour and its knocking other jobs off the market i seen an ad for bar manager for the extra 50 euro a week. so the pubs are taking advantage of this now to. and real bar managers like myself are not getting fully paid salaries
and have to head to london again to get the work.

Cawk n bawllz

The most insulting and almost... hurtful aspect of it is the substantial extra profit the business owner gets with his or her increased productivity at no cost while the worker must now work to live on LESS THAN the dole. Yes, they give you an extra €50 but travel and lunches, especially for someone living in a rural area, cost more than that each week.

Have to confess I've not paid much attention to Irish current affairs much recently. Has there been any uproar at all in the papers or news about Job Bridge?

Mrs OBumble

angelfire9 wrote: »

And wait for it.... these jobs are looking for QUALIFIED persons as interns:

:mad::mad::mad:

And that is exactly who internships should be for: people who are qualified, but have no experience.

I'd happily support a scheme that would boycott businesses that use internships to get people for low-quals-needed jobs.

However there are some challenges:

It couldn't just be based on listings, because not all listings will actually be filled with an intern - some simply will not get any applicants.

And in issue in real-world workplaces is that some qualified people expect to be doing "qualified" work immediately, and are disappointed that they have to start doing the "menial" work too, while they learn that a 75% job, which got a nice pass at university, counts for nothing in the workforce. So I wouldn't always rate the opinion of job-holders about whether they're gaining useful expereince or not.

Mrs OBumble

Cawk n bawllz wrote: »

The most insulting and almost... hurtful aspect of it is the substantial extra profit the business owner gets with his or her increased productivity at no cost while the worker must now work to live on LESS THAN the dole. Yes, they give you an extra €50 but travel and lunches, especially for someone living in a rural area, cost more than that each week.

You don't know that: in some cases, the "free" intern could the only thing stopping the business from going under.

And besides, having an extra staff member around is never really free: they use office space and materials etc, which cost sometimes as much as 20% of salary.

Also, a packed lunch could easily be made for less than a tenner a week (lunch that you'd be eating anyway if you were at home). Agree that there is an issue with transport from rural areas - but cheaper rent there should make up for that.

Cawk n bawllz

JustMary wrote: »

You don't know that: in some cases, the "free" intern could the only thing stopping the business from going under.

And besides, having an extra staff member around is never really free: they use office space and materials etc, which cost sometimes as much as 20% of salary.

Also, a packed lunch could easily be made for less than a tenner a week (lunch that you'd be eating anyway if you were at home). Agree that there is an issue with transport from rural areas - but cheaper rent there should make up for that.

Are you serious?
If they need workers but can't afford them then it's time for their business to go. The solution is not free labour.
An extra staff member in the building using THEIR office space and THEIR materials to do THEIR work is not costing them. Also it's pretty nice for them that a person who could be costing them over €400 a week now costs them nothing. So pittances like office supplies is completely immaterial.

You're right. A packed lunch costs less than a tenner a week. It surely does. But how insulting is it that a person who is putting in long hours working for a company who isn't paying them does not even have the luxury of being able to afford lunch at a cafe/canteen every day?
Remember, the person could just be at home doing nothing OR they could be working hard for a company and their weekly income would be the same- sorry, LESS if they actually go and work. That is ludicrous!

The rent in a rural area is still a struggle when you're on the dole and it doesn't get cheaper when you sign on for a Job Bridge scheme. It's still the same but now you have the added cost of travelling every day.

However... all of the above might be worth enduring if the internship were a genuine opportunity. But 9 months of free labor as a shelf stacker for tesco or a caretaker in a school is an insult by any standard.

kadman

JustMary wrote: »

You don't know that: in some cases, the "free" intern could the only thing stopping the business from going under.

And besides, having an extra staff member around is never really free: they use office space and materials etc, which cost sometimes as much as 20% of salary.

Also, a packed lunch could easily be made for less than a tenner a week (lunch that you'd be eating anyway if you were at home). Agree that there is an issue with transport from rural areas - but cheaper rent there should make up for that.

You sound like some one that is quite happy exploiting the unemployed. Is someone you know benefitting from using an intern for their business. A partner or family member perhaps.

Its just that you are singing the praises , from a business perspective. And after all its a win win situation for a business to use the scheme.

Its not an accusation by the way, its a serious question.

thanks

kadman

Question,

Are you working on an iternship, or is your partner that has a business, using the intern scheme.

SeaFields

JustMary wrote: »

And in issue in real-world workplaces is that some qualified people expect to be doing "qualified" work immediately, and are disappointed that they have to start doing the "menial" work too, while they learn that a 75% job, which got a nice pass at university, counts for nothing in the workforce. So I wouldn't always rate the opinion of job-holders about whether they're gaining useful expereince or not.

This wasn't an issue before the recession. Businesses happily took on employees fully in the knowledge they needed to be trained up.

Many 3rd level institutions (particularly the VECs and IT's) incorporate a work experience element into their courses - the passing of which is fundamental to gaining the qualification.

This scheme has simply opened up the door for exploitation of a failing economy and work force on its knees. The sooner its disbanded the better for the entire economy so real jobs can be created and not simply the government optics of reducing the live register through this disaster.

frag420

Hi Folks,

Just my input..............I started my internship this week. I approached the company I wanted to work for in Oct. They are a multinational company. I got a reply the following day from them. They basically said that they had a meeting the evening before(when I sent the mail) about advertising for an intern so I just saved them the cost and would I be interested in calling in for a chat.
Anyways I met the head of the dept I was interested in working in. We had a great chat, he told me where that dept was, where it was going and their aims going forward and how they needed to bolster the team by adding an intern. He even said that he would prefer if they got someone in on a salary and would look into it for me. A week later I met the MD of the company. We also had a great chat. I outlined how I would like to progress over the next 6 mths and where I want to be then. From the conversation I could see we were both on the same page and this put my mind at ease.

So here I am a few days into my internship. Ok so I did not get salary but I am happy so far. I am working with a great team, I am not the office coffee monkey and I am actually active in the role.

So my advice would be to approach the companies you want to work for and ask them would they be willing to offer you an internship. Have a couple of meetings with them to gauge if they are serious about getting someone in with the possibility of a full time position at the end of the internship or are they looking for free labour. If you are happy then outline and agree a learning path with monthly meetings to access where you are, anything you need to work harder on and what to expect the following month and work hard!!

Lastly remember that this is about gaining experience so if there is no position at the end of your internship(which may be the reality due to any number of reasons) that your experience will stand to you. Many employers in your industry will see the fact you worked unpaid in order to learn and will look at this favourably and it will open doors!!!

Anyways I am here to learn so must get back to work. I will try and pop back in here to update as the months go by.

frAg

kadman

frag420 wrote: »

Hi Folks,

Just my input..............I started my internship this week. I approached the company I wanted to work for in Oct. They are a multinational company. I got a reply the following day from them. They basically said that they had a meeting the evening before(when I sent the mail) about advertising for an intern so I just saved them the cost and would I be interested in calling in for a chat.
Anyways I met the head of the dept I was interested in working in. We had a great chat, he told me where that dept was, where it was going and their aims going forward and how they needed to bolster the team by adding an intern. He even said that he would prefer if they got someone in on a salary and would look into it for me. A week later I met the MD of the company. We also had a great chat. I outlined how I would like to progress over the next 6 mths and where I want to be then. From the conversation I could see we were both on the same page and this put my mind at ease.

So here I am a few days into my internship. Ok so I did not get salary but I am happy so far. I am working with a great team, I am not the office coffee monkey and I am actually active in the role.

So my advice would be to approach the companies you want to work for and ask them would they be willing to offer you an internship. Have a couple of meetings with them to gauge if they are serious about getting someone in with the possibility of a full time position at the end of the internship or are they looking for free labour. If you are happy then outline and agree a learning path with monthly meetings to access where you are, anything you need to work harder on and what to expect the following month and work hard!!

Lastly remember that this is about gaining experience so if there is no position at the end of your internship(which may be the reality due to any number of reasons) that your experience will stand to you. Many employers in your industry will see the fact you worked unpaid in order to learn and will look at this favourably and it will open doors!!!

Anyways I am here to learn so must get back to work. I will try and pop back in here to update as the months go by.

frAg

Good for you, and I hope things work out for you.

But in all fairness, saying that they would prefer some one in on a salary, and then not offer you one. Saying they will look into it, is a bit of a joke.

If they are a large multinational, they could have made that salary position happen for you immediately. I wouldn,t hold my breath on that one.

kadman

frag420

I maybe should have explained that better. When I met the head of the dept I was looking to work in he stressed he would prefer that the company offered a salary as he believed that it would produce a better performance from whomever came in. This however was just his idea and the final decision was not up to him. Remember they were looking for an intern initially and not someone for a salaried position. Having spoken to another person in the office who came in on an internship she was only an intern for three months before they made her permenent and on salary so I dont think they are looking to fleece me. Lucky though that the industry is in good shape so that if after six months they dont or cant offer me a position then I should have no problem getting a position with their competitors but ultimatley would like to stay there as it would look better on Cv. Time will tell............

frAg

Easy Rod

Job bridge worked for me. I was given loads of experience in various different areas, even had my own office! After 4 months working there i was offered a salaried job by a large consulting firm, the company i was working for were desperate to keep me on but couldn't get the headcount.

It really depends on the company- some take advantage of the system others don't.

AnnyHallsal

There are definitely valuable opportunities available via Job Bridge. And there is definite exploitation going on adversely affecting employment.

An example: someone I know applied for a creative position in a highly profitable company. It went to someone more experienced, though not fully experienced, so fair enough. He was then offered an admin internship by the company. He turned it down. He has admin experience coming out his ears. Why should that highly profitable business not pay someone to do their admin?

As someone who keeps an eye on jobs sites, there are definitely less paid positions available in numerous sectors than there were last year, as a significant percentage of what were previously entry-level positions now appear as internships.

Mrs OBumble

kadman wrote: »

If they are a large multinational, they could have made that salary position happen for you immediately.

Hmm, if that's been your experience with multi-nationals, then I'm very pleased for you. Many people would report just the opposite, though.

kadman

JustMary wrote: »

Hmm, if that's been your experience with multi-nationals, then I'm very pleased for you. Many people would report just the opposite, though.

Maybe I should clarify what I meant exactly.

I meant that they could have decided whether it was going to be a salaried role, or an intern ship, at the interview , or prior to it. there,s no need for extensive consultation for that decision.

Looking into it. Whats to look into. Its a simple decision really. Part of the interview process, if the candidate suits the bill. Its not rocket science.

I did it whenever I was interviewing people for positions.

kadman

Mrs OBumble

kadman wrote: »

Is someone you know benefitting from using an intern for their business. A partner or family member perhaps.

Are you working on an iternship, or is your partner that has a business, using the intern scheme.

No: I'm on contract to a multi-national, who almost certainly have some interns (paid, I think) in their ranks. But I'm not one - nor would I be unless I wanted to get some experience in a field that I had no experience in.

My partner's a sole trader. Never has had staff, and never will.

My extended family - no idea, I don't talk business with them. Don't even know what some of them do.

On principle, I believe that everyone should be paid. In practice, I know that people who don't have experience need to have a way of being more attractive to an employer than others who are experienced - internship is one of the few options available to them. Sad but true, in the current economy.

kadman

JustMary wrote: »

No: I'm on contract to a multi-national, who almost certainly have some interns (paid, I think) in their ranks. But I'm not one - nor would I be unless I wanted to get some experience in a field that I had no experience in.

My partner's a sole trader. Never has had staff, and never will.

My extended family - no idea, I don't talk business with them. Don't even know what some of them do.

On principle, I believe that everyone should be paid. In practice, I know that people who don't have experience need to have a way of being more attractive to an employer than others who are experienced - internship is one of the few options available to them. Sad but true, in the current economy.

Agreed, thanks for the honest answer:)

kadman

jaffaD

frag420 wrote: »

Hi Folks,

Just my input..............I started my internship this week. I approached the company I wanted to work for in Oct. They are a multinational company. I got a reply the following day from them. They basically said that they had a meeting the evening before(when I sent the mail) about advertising for an intern so I just saved them the cost and would I be interested in calling in for a chat.
Anyways I met the head of the dept I was interested in working in. We had a great chat, he told me where that dept was, where it was going and their aims going forward and how they needed to bolster the team by adding an intern. He even said that he would prefer if they got someone in on a salary and would look into it for me. A week later I met the MD of the company. We also had a great chat. I outlined how I would like to progress over the next 6 mths and where I want to be then. From the conversation I could see we were both on the same page and this put my mind at ease.

So here I am a few days into my internship. Ok so I did not get salary but I am happy so far. I am working with a great team, I am not the office coffee monkey and I am actually active in the role.

So my advice would be to approach the companies you want to work for and ask them would they be willing to offer you an internship. Have a couple of meetings with them to gauge if they are serious about getting someone in with the possibility of a full time position at the end of the internship or are they looking for free labour. If you are happy then outline and agree a learning path with monthly meetings to access where you are, anything you need to work harder on and what to expect the following month and work hard!!

Lastly remember that this is about gaining experience so if there is no position at the end of your internship(which may be the reality due to any number of reasons) that your experience will stand to you. Many employers in your industry will see the fact you worked unpaid in order to learn and will look at this favourably and it will open doors!!!

Anyways I am here to learn so must get back to work. I will try and pop back in here to update as the months go by.

frAg

Is there much involved in this? in terms of you approaching the company in order to get the internship.
I now qualify for the jobbridge internship and while there are a few positions on the website that interest me, there are some local companies which I would love to try get in the door with but they dont have internships advertised.
I obviously have to do more research on the scheme but its possible for me to go to the companies and try get them to sign up?

irishgrover

just to add my personal view on this.
I recently hired someone who has just completed the job bridge scheme. He was trying (and I guess has now succeeded) to transition into the IT sector from another sector.
Without the experience he gained through Job bridge there is no way in hell I would have interviewed him, never mind hired him.
Now clearly this was not the only criteria that was important in the hiring process. He had many other positive characteristics that added him in my final decision to employ him. However I can categorically state that without the experience he gained through job bridge, he would not currently be working for me.
So it does work....
He did not do job bridge through me, and he knew up front that the company that provided him with the job bridge opportunity would probably not hire him permanently, and this is what happened. However the experience gained did absolutely stand to him.

I guess ultimately it depends on the approach, attitude and commitment of the company that "sponsors" the individual. If they do what they commit to it can really stand to the participant. If they do not, and they misuse the program to get cheap labor then they cheapen the whole program, and are, IMHO, guilty of "stealing" the time of the participant and the money of the state...

Andrew Purfield

irishgrover wrote: »

just to add my personal view on this.
I recently hired someone who has just completed the job bridge scheme. He was trying (and I guess has now succeeded) to transition into the IT sector from another sector.
Without the experience he gained through Job bridge there is no way in hell I would have interviewed him, never mind hired him.
Now clearly this was not the only criteria that was important in the hiring process. He had many other positive characteristics that added him in my final decision to employ him. However I can categorically state that without the experience he gained through job bridge, he would not currently be working for me.
So it does work....
He did not do job bridge through me, and he knew up front that the company that provided him with the job bridge opportunity would probably not hire him permanently, and this is what happened. However the experience gained did absolutely stand to him.

I guess ultimately it depends on the approach, attitude and commitment of the company that "sponsors" the individual. If they do what they commit to it can really stand to the participant. If they do not, and they misuse the program to get cheap labor then they cheapen the whole program, and are, IMHO, guilty of "stealing" the time of the participant and the money of the state...

In Drogheda the vast majority of internships are ordinary everyday jobs that would otherwise have been advertised as part time or full time or seasonal work. I am a casual worker at present and not signed on yet so wouldn't be eligible anyways.

The reality is young graduates earning nothing like myself, living independently and who only qualify for a 100 euro anyways would happily do menial jobs in return for a full time basic wage, and these natural entry level or menial jobs that young people, immigrants and under qualified people typically do are all being replaced by this slave labour scheme, certainly in provincial towns anyways.

Well done to you for not participating in it and fair play for hiring a real worker. Maybe Jobbridge would be better served as a part time scheme ie something for students with a real basic social welfare allowance (208) guaranteed for 20 hours work, the same way people on the CE scheme work. That would lift students out of poverty and mean the rest of the hoors would be forced to hire those of us desperate for a real job.

sligoface

irishgrover wrote: »

just to add my personal view on this.
I recently hired someone who has just completed the job bridge scheme. He was trying (and I guess has now succeeded) to transition into the IT sector from another sector.
Without the experience he gained through Job bridge there is no way in hell I would have interviewed him, never mind hired him.
Now clearly this was not the only criteria that was important in the hiring process. He had many other positive characteristics that added him in my final decision to employ him. However I can categorically state that without the experience he gained through job bridge, he would not currently be working for me.
So it does work....
He did not do job bridge through me, and he knew up front that the company that provided him with the job bridge opportunity would probably not hire him permanently, and this is what happened. However the experience gained did absolutely stand to him.

I guess ultimately it depends on the approach, attitude and commitment of the company that "sponsors" the individual. If they do what they commit to it can really stand to the participant. If they do not, and they misuse the program to get cheap labor then they cheapen the whole program, and are, IMHO, guilty of "stealing" the time of the participant and the money of the state...

Fair play to him and yourself. For most people, working for free for nine months for a company that you know will not take you on just doesn't make sense. If you read the 'Jobbridge Scandal' thread, the horror stories far outnumber the success stories, so I wouldn't say the scheme works just because it worked out for one person.

If you were one of the nearly half million people out of work in this country, looking at job websites every day for ANY kind of job to get off the dole, and seeing positions like cashier, waiter, petrol station attendant, sandwich artist, janitor, etc. being advertised as unpaid internships instead of paid jobs you wouldn't be singing the schemes praises for very long.

If you were a young person between 18-24 who had their dole cut the past two budgets to 100 euro per week or 144 per week for 25 year olds (as if everyone under 26 can still live at home off their parents) you'd see that this government is basically forcing you into working for free just to being your payment up to the normal rate of social welfare, and that if you don't want to be a slave you're only option is to leave the country. And wouldn't that leave a very bad taste in your mouth? Young people in Ireland have been hit hardest by the recession, and the government are using this scheme simply to massage figures, because both Jobbridge interns and emigrants are removed from the live register.

Keep in mind the IT sector is one area that is still employing people in Ireland. In most other sectors, if the host company has no intention of keeping you, you're back to the dole. And most companies do not intend to keep interns, many do not even offer any valuable training or experience, they just use it for free labor. As you said, they are just stealing time and money. It is replacing entry level, menial jobs that require little training and normally would be a paid job. The scheme is not supposed to do that but it is not policed properly and these BS internhips with no real learning involved are allowed to go on for the sake of fiddling figures. Jobbridge is not in any way a solution to the unemployment crisis and since all contributions still come from the DSP, it does not save the country any money.

I think it's great that the someone got a job from your company due to the skills they learned during their internship, but sadly, these stories are the more the exception than the norm. By and large, the scheme is not being implemented properly and is just exploitation.

Andrew Purfield

Good post Sligo. Dead on the doornail. The figures would be at least 1-2% higher possibly and 4-5% higher for youth unemployment(not to mention those of us underemployed who work for a wage that when the hours are toted is less than many people would get on the dole due to having to do the same part time jobs we did 5 years ago cos the economy is in such bad shape-no offence to the few decent local employers(in my case two employers have kept me going every spring and summer since I started college) who provide that lifeline to people, but it is f'n dreadful how little full time work there is especially as people spend 4-5 years in college for nothing!). When you take into account jobbridge, courses and the CE scheme as well as various invisibles like former self employed folks on the supplementary schemes...the real unemployment rate has to be close to 19-20% and the real youth unemployment rate must be far above the oft quoted 20%. Not to mention if other countries suddenly stopped giving our lads visas...

There is a real underlying volatility there masked by some financial engineering in the social welfare dept. I watched a few youtube clips on Britain's privatised workfare and job centre plus agencies and schemes and I've every reason to believe this is just the start of the Thatcher like dismantling of the welfare state, particularly as all the McCreevy heads are partying like its' 1987 with calls for income tax cuts and meanwhile further calls for 'labour market reforms' which is newspeak for further welfare cuts and punitive measures against the general poor and vulnerable as Charlie type tax cuts for the hardpressed mé féiners of Ireland have to be funded somehow. This country is split between haves and have nots. 900'000 workers would not even see anything from tax cuts as they are either temp workers/seasonal or too poor to even pay PRSI/income tax and a USC cut would be pittance. And from my own experience the only other type of jobs apart from seasonal and part time are temp clerical ones-remember every 3-4 week job is a 'created' job!