Awesome sounds that simply wont fit

seannash

Okay so I generally start to make my songs by making the drums(even basic ones) first,then maybe chords or bass after that.
Problem I'm having is that when it comes to making Leads or other synth sounds the best and most interesting sounds seem to be coming from when I have a few oscilators which are all detuned.

Now this means that with my limited music theory that I simply cant fit these sounds into my tracks because I have absolutely no idea what notes to play now that the oscilators are detuned.
The only way I've figured out is to create everything with the same amount of oscilators and detune them all the same so that I know notes will work


Is there a better way,besides the obvious of learning music theory

krd

seannash wrote: »

Problem I'm having is that when it comes to making Leads or other synth sounds the best and most interesting sounds seem to be coming from when I have a few oscilators which are all detuned.

Detuning "all" the oscillators will likely put your music in the key of Q or W (in other words put it out concert pitch - they may sound out of tune with whatever you play them against).

Tuning is relative - if one oscillator is still concert pitch/standard, then everything else may fit.

Music theory won't teach you much about pitch, it assumes you use standard tuning.

The only way I've figured out is to create everything with the same amount of oscilators and detune them all the same so that I know notes will work

Use your ears. If I use a sample, I just adjust the pitch one way or another. If it sounds right, it's right. Sometimes, I don't even look at the notes. Or my bassline is a tuned up or down drum sound - I often have no idea what the original note is.

In music theory, there are no absolutes. Notes do not have to be strictly in their scales (major/minor) to work. If it works, it works. If there is only a minor pitch is clashing, adjust it til it fits.

If you've pencilled in a bass line you like, shifting it a few semitones one way or another, will make it fit - that's music theory. Any short note sequence, will work in several different keys - some keys there will be more agreement, some lesson. And an agreement is simply when it sounds right.

In the early development of formal music theory, several hundred years ago, they were hamstrung by their own rules - believing the rules were absolute. As the story goes, Mozart would break so much with formalism, women used to faint in shock at his recitals. "Did he really just throw in Db in that piece in C....I've never in all my life.......pass the salts, I feel weak"

madtheory

Are you detuning the oscillators to create chords, or just a bit of chorussing? To be more specific- are you detuning them in semitones, or in cents?

seannash

madtheory wrote: »

Are you detuning the oscillators to create chords, or just a bit of chorussing? To be more specific- are you detuning them in semitones, or in cents?

Bit of both really,Im using Gforce Minimonsta which lets you detune in semitones and cents with the turn of one knob.I know i could generally detune by 7 or 5 semitones but I honestly just detune til it sounds good

I also know thatI could just find notes that work and not worry about what but this is very labourious and to be honest doesn't always work,Handy if i just want 1 note repeating but not so much if i want a melody

madtheory

So... you need to learn what chords you are creating by tuning, and play them as notes on the keyboard instead. So ya, learn music theory! Which is best taught by singing, and some basic keyboard technique. Trust me, it's much easier to write music that way, than how you're doing it now.

Just had a quick listen to your Soundcloud. You have an ear for jazzy chords. This says to me that you'd have a good musical ear in general. You're able to mangle a synth to get the chords you normally hear in house music. So it's a small step for you to physically play those on a keyboard instead.

krd

seannash wrote: »

I also know thatI could just find notes that work and not worry about what but this is very labourious and to be honest doesn't always work,Handy if i just want 1 note repeating but not so much if i want a melody

If you're using different notes - if oscillators are detuned, essentially you have different notes. The combination you get is a chord. There's the chords everyone is familiar with - major/minor G,C,D etc. But any two notes is a chord - add more notes, you can get weirder more complex chords.

And why it's sounding good for you on single note, but not on a melody comes down to music theory. (this is not an absolute rule) you do not play melodies with chords - or you're much more limited if you're going to use chords - the way you're setting up your oscillators, the note distance is the same ratio for all note/chords you're going to try and play for your melody. Simply, certain notes/chords you hit are going to be off key - one of the notes needs to change for the melody to fit. Or, you have avoid that note choice.

You don't need to know music theory to fix it - even if you did, you'd still use your ear - off key note combinations sometimes work.

If you like a melody played on one oscillator, but you want the detuned sound. Have your detuned oscillator on another track - when it hits a note that doesn't work in the melody, just shift it, until it fits. So you'll still get your detuned sound, but it will work across the whole melody.


By the way - that thing, of having notes clashing with detuned oscillator chords is a real noob floob. It must drive people nuts trying to figure out what's gone wrong.

romarr

I'll probably get lambasted for this ... but untill youre comfortable with the theory ... record a bit of the created synth patch and run the recording through melodyne and or rapid evolution ... you'll have a good idea then of the actual notes and what key youre in

cheaty mac cheaterson

seannash

madtheory wrote: »

So... you need to learn what chords you are creating by tuning, and play them as notes on the keyboard instead. So ya, learn music theory! Which is best taught by singing, and some basic keyboard technique. Trust me, it's much easier to write music that way, than how you're doing it now.

Just had a quick listen to your Soundcloud. You have an ear for jazzy chords. This says to me that you'd have a good musical ear in general. You're able to mangle a synth to get the chords you normally hear in house music. So it's a small step for you to physically play those on a keyboard instead.

Yeah I think I really gotta bite the bullet and just learn an instrument.
Its definetly beyond frustrating sitting down and trying to work out chords with my limited musical ability.

Guess I'll just have to be more aware of how I'm detuning in future.