What ARE you willing to have cut?

harrythehat

I'm getting somewhat bored of people's outrage over cuts that effect their particular position in society.

Let's start a new discussion. What WOULD you cut? Now before 100 posts go up about TD's salaries and pensions etc bear in mind that fun as it would be to make them work for minimum wage, it would have a negligible effect on our national debt.

So where would you start if it was really up to you? Education, health, social welfare, arts??

Ghandee

My banjo string.

I think circumcision would quite suit me. :pac:

Mike 1972

harrythehat wrote: »

Now before 100 posts go up about TD's salaries and pensions etc bear in mind that fun as it would be to make them work for minimum wage, it would have a negligible effect on our national debt.

Doesnt mean we shouldnt cut their pay anyway ?

While I wouldnt expect a TD to work for minimum wage a third of what theyre currently on would still be generous.

There are a lot of positions (mostly managerial and administrative) within public bodies (particularly the health services) which could do with pay cuts (or being elliminated entirely) with negligible effect on frontline service.

policarp

Devalue the Euro. . .

Random

why not make a list of what we cant cut with a valid reason why, and trim the fat off the end of the list then?

WindSock

Health and education. No point in educating people who are going overseas anyway and no point in giving medical treatment to people who are going to die anyway. Then pensions, old people don't know what to do with their money and only spend it on Worthers originals and such like.
Increase social welfare, more money spent on goods and services by us lardy layabouts means more capital flowing. Or make an Irish based butterscotch sweet and ban Worthers Originals, create jobs keep money in the country etc.

Fran1985

The Automatic right to a council house for unmarried mothers. And Job Seekers Allowance for anyone unemployed for more than 10 years, from 2013 (give them a chance to get some work) Also, if you're unemployed for more than 5 years (enough time to get a degree and some new work) then your dole is halved. I'm in support of a 50/75cent toll charge per junction on motorways too. Gotta make sacrifices unfortunately whether we want to or not, but some of things we hand out money for in this country is insane

Well get rid of this sort of thing completely:
http://www.rte.ie/news/av/2011/0921/media-3059049.html
(and no I don't mean RTÉ)

Not only does it cost money but it's enabling people to get payments they may not need.

Mike 1972

Thought Id stick this in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgpa7wEAz7I

Suspect it might go well with the likely overall theme of the thread.

mattjack

WindSock wrote: »

Health and education. No point in educating people who are going overseas anyway and no point in giving medical treatment to people who are going to die anyway. Then pensions, old people don't know what to do with their money and only spend it on Worthers originals and such like.
Increase social welfare, more money spent on goods and services by us lardy layabouts means more capital flowing. Or make an Irish based butterscotch sweet and ban Worthers Originals, create jobs keep money in the country etc.

We should not cut education.Children need to learn how to spell.Its spelt Werther's Originals by the way

pragmatic1

Charge a bit more for prescriptions, every state benefit should be means tested, defense budget should be slashed, PS salaries and pensions have to be looked at again.

Mr. Presentable

Rent allowance

Oranage2

Everything that doesnt affrect me.

Firstly

- Smokes, raise it to €100 a packet
- Put a toll bridge on every road
- Make the un-employed personal slaves to working folk
- All national tv or radio presenters wages cut

Faing

tighten right up on the awarding of legal aid especially in the case of people that come here from abroad and demand legal aid to fund their right to be here having contributed absolutely nothing to our economy.

bijapos

harrythehat wrote: »

I'm getting somewhat bored of people's outrage over cuts that effect their particular position in society.

Let's start a new discussion. What WOULD you cut? Now before 100 posts go up about TD's salaries and pensions etc bear in mind that fun as it would be to make them work for minimum wage, it would have a negligible effect on our national debt.

So where would you start if it was really up to you? Education, health, social welfare, arts??

I actually think that a TDs salary is OK, its the expenses gravy trail that does it for me, the insane mileage where its possible to rack up €40-50,000 in travel expenses, the fact that they get €140 per night for overnighting if they live more than 15km from the Dail. James Reilly lives in Rush Co Dublin and he falls into this category FFS.

All independent TD's in the Dail get a "party leaders allowance" of €41,000 per annum, I havent heard Shane Ross whinge on about this yet. Its madness, plus the fact that they get pensions when they resign/ are unelected whereas everyone else gets it in their late 60's. Its starts at home and their expenses which would never exist in the prtivate sector should be first for the chop.

df1985

"Rich" taxes.

People who are sitting on massive savings earning interest-increase DIRT tax.
People receiving big inheritances and other assets. A certain amount already comes tax free so its people only receiving huge amounts that would be hit.

Means tests across the board for all social welfare. pensioners sitting on huge savings should be hit. same for rich families receiving child benefit.

eth0

Oranage2 wrote: »

Everything that doesnt affrect me.

Firstly

- Smokes, raise it to €100 a packet
- Put a toll bridge on every road
- Make the un-employed personal slaves to working folk
- All national tv or radio presenters wages cut

it would be an awful waste building all those bridges on roads that don't cross any river

Mike 1972

bijapos wrote: »

I actually think that a TDs salary is OK,.

Its not just the expenses its the extra allowances (and holidays)

On top of their salary they get extra allowances for actually showing up for work.

They get further allowances for sitting on commitees

They get better holidays than the gawdamn schoolteachers.

And to cap it all they get free car parking in Leinster house FOR LIFE (work out the BIK rates for city centre car parking in Dublin)

pensioners sitting on huge savings should be hit

To an extent thery already are.

Although while Id be all for means testing for sources of income I dont think creating disincentives for personal saving is a particularly good idea particularly given that it was largely a credit bubble which got us into this mess in the first place.

wonderfulname

Rent allowance, severely, it's artificially holding up the rental market so keeping it at it's current level actually causes more people to struggle, it makes no sense to have the same system we had at a time defined by inflated property prices.

Free fees, get rid of them, replace it with a government backed loan system, capitation is currently at two grand, who can afford two grand? Bung it all into a deferred loan and you immediately have a much more equal system with less cost to the taxpayer (in 17 years, but not thinking long term is what got us into the mess in the first place).

We need to stop being so political about our health service, who here knows the deal with loughlinstown hospital? Ever had to go to the place? It's a liability and a drain on resources, it should be shut down and services moved to vincents, same with every similar situation, this country is too sparsely populated to ensure everyone is within 20min of a hospital, it's cheaper and better to insure everyone has access to a good quality health service, abet with a bit of a drive, the politics keeping these places open is the same parish pump politics people like to give out about, just on a larger scale.

I'm sure I have more, I'll think about it for ya...

bonzodog2

Ministerial pensions for those still sitting as TDs

david75

Defence. It never ever gets touched.
A review if Garda bonuses and benefits would save a fortune too. The allowances they get are ludicrous.

8 million a year on TDs pensions?
They should be first to get cut.

CorkBabe33

Children's allowance - I'm serious. Why on earth are people being paid for having children?? People don't get an allowance for their pets.
And as for children's allowance being paid for children not even living here - should be stopped with immediate effect.

Yakult

Bodily hair, grass, hedges, nails and really anything else that will vastly help our financial burden.

Mike 1972

Look at why it costs so much to keep a prisoner locked up and why it is necessary to have such a high ratio of prison staff to prisoners ?

Mr. Presentable wrote: »

Rent allowance

Perhaps scrap it entirely for long term receipiants and rehouse them in NAMA owned ghost estates ?

Address two problems at once.

And why do we still house people in B&B's for crysakes ?

CorkBabe33 wrote: »

Children's allowance.

Dont scrap but:
1) Means test
2) Operate sliding scale- i.e. less money for second child than first child (unless twins etc) opposite to the way it works at present.

Free TV licences, telephone rental, fuel etc for pensioners. -Even if the decision were taken to increace their pensions by the equivalent cash amount it would still save on the cost of administation for these populist gimmicks and its about time we treated pensioners like adults and let them decide how they should spend their money.

Repeal the official languages act and end all subsidies to the Irish language industry (Fund TG4 from the licence fee)

papajimsmooth

50 euro of everyones dole would be a good start

mal1

CorkBabe33 wrote: »

Children's allowance - I'm serious. Why on earth are people being paid for having children?? People don't get an allowance for their pets.
And as for children's allowance being paid for children not even living here - should be stopped with immediate effect.

Will your Jack Russell look after you when you get old?

ejmaztec

mattjack wrote: »

We should not cut education.Children need to learn how to spell.Its spelt Werther's Originals by the way

I hate sweet-nazis.:mad:

rossie1977

childrens allowance, rent allowance, half the dole for anyone under 30, slash the top salaries across the board in the public bodies with particular focus on the education and health sector

Spudmonkey

Mike 1972 wrote: »

Doesnt mean we shouldnt cut their pay anyway ?

While I wouldnt expect a TD to work for minimum wage a third of what theyre currently on would still be generous.

There are a lot of positions (mostly managerial and administrative) within public bodies (particularly the health services) which could do with pay cuts (or being elliminated entirely) with negligible effect on frontline service.

Bringing it down to a third of the current rate would make it comparable with the average industrial wage. A better solution would be removing their ability to claim unvouched expenses and put a cap on what they can claim.

ejmaztec

CorkBabe33 wrote: »

Children's allowance - I'm serious. Why on earth are people being paid for having children?? People don't get an allowance for their pets.
And as for children's allowance being paid for children not even living here - should be stopped with immediate effect.

New low for AH, children=pets.

Perhaps there should an annual kid-licence.

Cill Dara Abu

rossie1977 wrote: »

childrens allowance, rent allowance, half the dole for anyone under 30, slash the top salaries across the board in the public bodies with particular focus on the education and health sector

Why anyone under 30?

homerjay2005

is there anywhere that gives a detailed breakdown on public spending?

for example, we spent 21billion on social protection across 60 + schemes last year. the dole is only one of them. take in 447,000 people on the dole and lets say an average of 250 a week (its probably less), thats still only 5.8billion.

the dole is only one part of the problem, its the other fees that make up 75% of the expenditure. and then you can add another 10 billion in free healthcare.

rent allowance,single mothers payment and child benifits are 3 that should be reviewed,stopped and means tested. theres probably another 3 billion there. i assume then the pension makes up another billion or 2 and wages/administration costs a fair whack.

but would be interesting to see where this 30odd billion is going. the amount of money it costs to run a country with a workforce of 86% in a population of 4.5 million, is astounding.

Mike 1972

mal1 wrote: »

Will your Jack Russell look after you when you get old?

Why assume your kids will ?

Spudmonkey wrote: »

Bringing it down to a third of the current rate would make it comparable with the average industrial wage. A better solution would be removing their ability to claim unvouched expenses and put a cap on what they can claim.

The two options are not mutually exclusive.

Coriolanus

Get rid of the navy and air force. The Army is grand, they actually do stuff and are pretty cool. All the navy does is cause drug droughts.
Legalize weed, import it cheap, tax it to high heaven and it'd still be cheaper than off the dealers.

Mike 1972

Nevore wrote: »

Legalize weed, import it cheap, tax it to high heaven and it'd still be cheaper than off the dealers.

Is Irish weed not good enough for you ?

Spudmonkey

Mike 1972 wrote: »

Why assume your kids will ?



The two options are not mutually exclusive.

You are willing to have someone acting on a national scale drawing the same amount as a industrial worker?

Oranage2

Cill Dara Abu wrote: »

Why anyone under 30?

I think the rossie1977 is the clue

FloatingVoter

We should immediately declare war on the US and the UK, possibly China too. When we lose, they'll rebuild us and we get to rule Europe (this has happened before). Just means we cut a few politicians due to the inevitable hangings. Shortly before we declare war, our senior civil servants become commissioned frontline troops with Field Marshal Kevin Cardiff in charge.
Our gangland inmates can supply the cannon fodder.

Crann na Beatha

This post has been deleted.

WindSock

mattjack wrote: »

We should not cut education.Children need to learn how to spell.Its spelt Werther's Originals by the way

I see punctuation is over-rated too :P

Richard Hillman

Any RTE funding
Scrap rent allowance
End social housing
scrap any extra money for lone parents over 1 child
end childrens allowance
Cut the dole for single people living in their parents house by 80%

Then i would privatize Dublin Bus and RTE. Sell the prime real estate that is Leinster house and move the Dail to a NAMA site. I would also sell the naming rights of Bank Holidays and rail stations.

mal1

Mike 1972 wrote: »

Why assume your kids will ?

Did I assume? I just know that your dog won't.

papajimsmooth

Well, we have to end apartheid for one. And slow down the nuclear arms race, stop terrorism and world hunger. We have to provide food and shelter for the homeless, and oppose racial discrimination and promote civil rights, while also promoting equal rights for women. We have to encourage a return to traditional moral values. Most importantly, we have to promote general social concern and less materialism in young people

Mike 1972

Spudmonkey wrote: »

You are willing to have someone acting on a national scale drawing the same amount as a industrial worker?

Several TD's claim they only draw the industrial average.

TBH when all their pay and allowances are included about double the average industrial wage should be a pretty fair salary for a backbench TD with full Dail attendance (seeing as how theyre not in it for the money and only doing it out of a sense of public service -right ?)

Expenses should be capped at a reasonable level and fully vouched/audited.

A small (means tested) pension should be available for any TD who has served for more than two years and is no longer active in public life and has no other source of income.

That is all.

mal1 wrote: »

Did I assume? I just know that your dog won't.

If things get hard sure you might get a couple of days eating out of it.

Coriolanus

Mike 1972 wrote: »

Is Irish weed not good enough for you ?

It's not really economical to grow it in hothouses here. There's a reason Penneys get stuff made abroad. Given a regularized workforce and shipping schedule in a convenient subtropical country it really would be cheaper than anything we could grow ourselves and most certainly cheaper than that smuggled traditionally.

Mr Trade In

Civil Servants, Banks, cut the local councillors, close the Seanad,cut the number of TDs, Dublin has way too many for starters, yes to cutting their pay and pensions, cut the tax exemptions for all who receive them, close the loop holes many use to hide their assets in banks abroad. Stop the needless secretive tribunals and hold these in open court, any found guilty should be charged with treason and have their assets seized. Have a massive fire sale of the ghost estates,cash only.

saa

If you're living with your parents you should not get the dole, if you can't live with your parents you must submit a report as to why, I think people should have to prove their needs.

No one should have a medical card as such so the doctors don't get paid for having them on their listings, the drs don't need the extra cash, if you need to see a doctor or go to the hospital you should claim it not have unlimited doctor visits and so on (from a medical card holder!)

Anyone over a certain wage should not get child allowance.

I don't mind people giving out as long as their is action and a willingness to give up certain things

Mike 1972

Abolish the presidency.

Nevore wrote: »

It's not really economical to grow it in hothouses here. .

Pleanty of empty NAMA houses and unemployed people knocking about. I reckon we could have the basis for dynamic new export idustry here. Might even give those Dutch a run for their money.

david75

Pepare to get sick.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2060899/As-Ireland-braces-budget-cuts-politicians-cut-secret-deal-3million-euro-year-pay-rise.html

gifted

Pay public pensions for the same amount of time that they done their job, eg, minister for 5 years should get ministers pension for 5 years. If you join the army at 17 and leave after 21 years you get a pension for life from the age of 38 onwards, crazy that is. Pay them for the amount of years they do

pragmatic1

david75 wrote: »

Pepare to get sick.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2060899/As-Ireland-braces-budget-cuts-politicians-cut-secret-deal-3million-euro-year-pay-rise.html

That might just be the breaking point.