Jobs was right; Adobe abandons Flash.

naasrd

This just in!!

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2011/11/adobe-kills-mobile-flash/

kjl

mobile flash

Tom Dunne

When I had my Nokia N900, Flash performance in the browser was horrendous. Adobe are now confirming what everyone knew.

Blazer

Flash was/is the worst thing you can have on a browser.
I have an iphone but also had a Xoom tablet...remembering going to the install page within market for flash 10.1 and the reviews were slating it saying all it did was put more ads on their browsers....oh how I laughed

whatawaster

Flash performance in any android I've used has been absolutely fine

whatawaster

Sc@recrow wrote: »

Flash was/is the worst thing you can have on a browser.
I have an iphone but also had a Xoom tablet...remembering going to the install page within market for flash 10.1 and the reviews were slating it saying all it did was put more ads on their browsers....oh how I laughed

anyone with any cop-on will install flash and then block it from loading until the come upon an instance when they actually need it.

Meesared

Tom Dunne wrote: »

When I had my Nokia N900, Flash performance in the browser was horrendous. Adobe are now confirming what everyone knew.

Heh Flash runs as smooth as silk on my GS2

cornbb

whatawaster wrote: »

anyone with any cop-on will install flash and then block it from loading until the come upon an instance when they actually need it.

I agree, I run a flash blocker in my desktop browser, but the fact that it needs to be done is kind of acknowledging that Flash is a bloated parasitic piece of crap...

whatawaster

cornbb wrote: »

I agree, I run a flash blocker in my desktop browser, but the fact that it needs to be done is kind of acknowledging that Flash is a bloated parasitic piece of crap...

I don't think many will argue with you there, but I don't think you can argue that it is needed for a full web experience. In today's environment anyway.

conolan

The sad thing is that Flash had the potential to be an easy route for a lot of developers to get into IOS and Android app development. Apple blocked that on IOS, and obviously the performance issues make it difficult. Such a pity.

For those who think of flash as a video/animation player, think again. It was a great tool for small games suitable for the web.

PogMoThoin

Apple didn't block it for performance reasons, they did it because the internet is full of free flash games similar to those Apple make money out of on the Itunes App Store.

cornbb

PogMoThoin wrote: »

Apple didn't block it for performance reasons, they did it because the internet is full of free flash games similar to those Apple make money out of on the Itunes App Store.

Unlikely, the App Store doesn't represent big profits for Apple. It runs barely above "break even".

http://www.slashgear.com/app-store-operates-a-bit-over-break-even-for-apple-suggests-analyst-2391163/

kjl

If I was mod of this forum I would actually delete this thread for fanboyism.

Jobs was not right, he said the mobile processor couldn't handle flash as it was a processor hog, Adobe choosing to no longer develop the platform does not mean jobs was right.

Tom Dunne

kjl wrote: »

If I was mod of this forum I would actually delete this thread for fanboyism.

It's a bit ludicrous when we have a discussion on something related to Apple and are accused of fanboyism. Nobody is forcing you to read the forum.

kjl wrote: »

Jobs was not right, he said the mobile processor couldn't handle flash as it was a processor hog, Adobe choosing to no longer develop the platform does not mean jobs was right.

Whatever way you spin it, up until quite recently, flash performance on mobile devices was not up to par.

wayne040576

Tom Dunne wrote: »

It's a bit ludicrous when we have a discussion on something related to Apple and are accused of fanboyism. Nobody is forcing you to read the forum.



Whatever way you spin it, up until quite recently, flash performance on mobile devices was not up to par.

You're right. I have flash on a HTC desire HD a Xoom and have had it on a Galaxy S. It was rubbish on all of them. It loads really bad and gives constant flickering. I think people who said it was fine were just talking about videos.

Unfortunately there are websites out there that use it for the main interface.

Designing a website using flash for controls was and still is a bad design choice.

Hobbes

PogMoThoin wrote: »

Apple didn't block it for performance reasons, they did it because the internet is full of free flash games similar to those Apple make money out of on the Itunes App Store.

That isn't really true. If you check the press releases just before the first iPhone to be released, you will see they did say that Adobe were working on Flash and it would be released shortly iPhone was released.

But Adobe were never able to deliver. They didn't have a mobile version of flash until 2010.

Also there were other limitations with putting flash on a mobile device that uses multi-touch.

Some references:

http://tech2.in.com/news/social-networking/a-short-timeline-on-adobe-vs-apple-on-flash-technology/256372?utm_source=MC_TECH2_HOME


http://www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughts-on-flash/

Tom Dunne

Aside from the slightly biased impression of Steve Jobs, speaking from my own experience, Flash on a mobile device does not deliver a good user experience.

Any Flash enabled site I have used on Android tablets has been pretty poor in terms of user interface (note: not performance). Software that is developed for desktop browsers quite simply does not translate well to a mobile platform.

cherryghost

Completely agree with Tom. HTML5 has better compatibility across different PC/Phone platforms, and doesn't chug along like Flash can do at points (not everything though). The touch UI on flash based sites is just terrible at the best of times.

kjl

Well proof is still in the pudding, goto ANY video based website and what do they use?

I am not saying it is the best available option, I think HTML5 is great, but the fact is that the majority of web content is done using flash.

As for the fanboy stuff, I like my iPhone and my iPad as much as the next guy if not more, but enough is enough on the Steve Jobs is right bs. Steve Jobs was a self-centred a&*hole and the only reason he didn't want flash on his device is because he had been having a feud with adobe over OSX support for CS products, also did you see what he wrote about Bill Gates in his books, shocking.

brianwalshcork

kjl wrote: »

Well proof is still in the pudding, goto ANY video based website and what do they use?

YouTube has had videos in html5 for almost two years now. I'd give flash 12 more months before it goes into serious decline.

...and not a moment too soon. It's a headache on work networks.

Brian

Dades

You can't just say Jobs was "right".

It was a self fulfilling prophesy. He cornered the mobile market while not supporting flash. The success of their mobile devices has forced Abode to drop Flash in favour of their HTML5 compatible technology that will operate on Jobs' devices.

Adobe looked at the iOS market share and admitted they were fighting a pointless fight.

Sad Professor

Well, it depends what we're suggesting Jobs was right/wrong about. Back when we were all arguing about this, many people were saying that Apple's decision not to support Flash was going to hurt the iPhone because Flash was supposedly essential for viewing the web and that a web device that failed to support it wouldn't succeed.

Jobs, however, felt that Flash was redundant technology and that nobody would care about not having it on the iPhone. And in this regard it seems he was absolutely correct. The lack of Flash did not stop people from buying iOS devices. The people who were most upset about the lack of Flash were Flash developers.

Indeed, one could probably argue that the absence of Flash made iOS better as it forced developers to design apps for iOS. This in addition to the numerous other benefits of not having Flash: better battery life, etc. Combined with the fact that Adobe simply failed to deliver a mobile version of Flash to prove Jobs's criticisms wrong.

psychward

Good . I hate Flash. It sucks up too many computer resources even on a desktop.

Darksaga87

Why do people that hate iphone/apple always show up to talk about how great it is to have an android phone?

I mean, like im not over trolling the muslim forum about how great it is to eat pork.











mmmmmmmm pork.

Yakult

It's been coming a long time!

Oafley Jones

After reading the bio, I'm convinced that the issue, more than anything else, was Jobs' vendetta against Adobe for not developing for NeXT.

Tom Dunne

Interesting article here on CNN: http://edition.cnn.com/2011/11/09/tech/mobile/flash-steve-jobs/index.html

In 1999, he [Jobs] was flatly denied when he asked Adobe to create a version of its popular Adobe Premiere digital-graphics software for the Mac. Adobe also wouldn't rewrite Photoshop for the Mac's operating system, even though Macs were popular with designers.

"My primary insight when we were screwed by Adobe in 1999 was that we shouldn't get into any business where we didn't control both the hardware and the software, otherwise we'd get our head handed to us," Jobs said, according to Isaacson.

Aside from his claims about performance, was there a vindictive element to his feelings towards Adobe and Flash?

... Jobs ... in Isaacson's book comes off sometimes as vindictive and brusque as he was innovative and inspirational

Sad Professor

Jobs definitely had a long memory, but I think that was very low down his list of reasons for not supporting Flash. I reckon he probably gave Adobe a chance to deliver a working mobile version of Flash,but they dragged their heels or weren't too bothered so he said f*ck you we aren't waiting. Jobs was initially opposed to the idea of an app store, so that wouldn't have been a factor at that point.