DIY Wireless GSM Home Alarm

worc

I’m looking to setup (DIY) a wireless home alarm system with:

3 motion sensors
3 magnetic sensors
GSM
Outdoor siren
1 key fob

I’ve been reading/searching boards.ie and numerous other sites and my head is a little fried trying to work out the best option. I’m typically seeing either Visonic PowerMax Pro or a HKC (can’t remember details on HKC) with additional accessories to add extra motion / magnetic sensors and siren.

I’m finding the Irish based sites don’t give prices so it’s hard to work out the guts of how much this would cost – they all list “call for a price” and I don’t have the time at the minute to be calling around. I’ve found an American site that I can get all of the above for just under €570 including shipping – though I’m sure customs might have something to say about it.

I was curious if someone had an idea of the ballpark figure I’d pay for the setup mentioned above from an Irish or UK based seller?

altor

I would strongly advise against importing the powermax from America. It uses a different code for the devices we use here plus the power supply is American. I know you can get a converter for it but its more hassle than it is worth. Same with if you do have any problems with sensors or any of the equipment, easier to source here.

You should contact a few distributors of alarm equipment/components here. They will give you the price they sell the equipment for.

For powermax:

CONDOR SECURITY DISTRIBUTION LTD.
23A Greenhills Industrial Estate,
Greenhills Road, Walkinstown, Dublin 12, Ireland.
01 409 7733/34

For the HKC:

REW (Richmond Electrical Wholesale)
The Westway Centre,
Ballymount Ave,
Dublin 12
Tel:01 405 0200
Fax:01 456 8802

There are others on the list so shop around for the best prices available.

worc

altor wrote: »

It uses a different code for the devices we use

Thanks for the advice - I have zero knowledge of these systems and wasn't aware there were different codes for them (not even sure what you mean by codes but probably something I've completely missed!).

altor

worc wrote: »

Thanks for the advice - I have zero knowledge of these systems and wasn't aware there were different codes for them (not even sure what you mean by codes but probably something I've completely missed!).

Your welcome worc, different enrolling codes.

FMartinp

altor wrote: »

worc wrote: »

Thanks for the advice - I have zero knowledge of these systems and wasn't aware there were different codes for them (not even sure what you mean by codes but probably something I've completely missed!).

Your welcome worc, different enrolling codes.

Looking at the pricelist I got from Trade Electric in Santry these wireless items would cost you about €400+vat excluding the GSM which is about €285+vat.

altor

FMartinp wrote: »

Looking at the pricelist I got from Trade Electric in Santry these wireless items would cost you about €400+vat excluding the GSM which is about €285+vat.

Which system are you referring too ?

worc

FMartinp wrote: »

Looking at the pricelist I got from Trade Electric in Santry these wireless items would cost you about €400+vat excluding the GSM which is about €285+vat.

Thanks for that - as altor mentioned which system is that?

- - - - -

I've been thinking about the setup I want to go with for the house and I'm half thinking of getting 4 motion sensors and not bothering with the magnetic ones at all.

I was going to go with 3 downstairs (hall, kitchen and living room/dining room) and then one on the upstairs landing. I feel like that magnetic sensors wouldn't cover what I want (5 windows upstairs) and instead of putting the 3 on windows upstairs I'd prefer to just buy one extra motion sensor for the upstairs landing instead.

Is there any good advice / reason to go for magnetic sensors as well as the motion sensors?

Seems more cost effective to just get the motion one since they cover larger areas.

KoolKid

worc wrote: »

I've been thinking about the setup I want to go with for the house and I'm half thinking of getting 4 motion sensors and not bothering with the magnetic ones at all.

I am not in favour of this type of system. It will not activate untill someone is in your home. The damage has been done at that stage.
Concentrate on the perimiter first with one or 2 PiRs after that.

FMartinp

worc wrote: »

FMartinp wrote: »

Looking at the pricelist I got from Trade Electric in Santry these wireless items would cost you about €400+vat excluding the GSM which is about €285+vat.

Thanks for that - as altor mentioned which system is that?

- -

I've been thinking about the setup I want to go with for the house and I'm half thinking of getting 4 motion sensors and not bothering with the magnetic ones at all.

I was going to go with 3 downstairs (hall, kitchen and living room/dining room) and then one on the upstairs landing. I feel like that magnetic sensors wouldn't cover what I want (5 windows upstairs) and instead of putting the 3 on windows upstairs I'd prefer to just buy one extra motion sensor for the upstairs landing instead.

Is there any good advice / reason to go for magnetic sensors as well as the motion sensors?

Seems more cost effective to just get the motion one since they cover larger areas.

Sorry guys I've been busy. It's the HKC wireless.

altor

Not a bad price.

Inertia/contacts on all accessible windows would be a better solution.

worc

KoolKid wrote: »

I am not in favour of this type of system. It will not activate untill someone is in your home. The damage has been done at that stage.
Concentrate on the perimiter first with one or 2 PiRs after that.

altor wrote: »

Not a bad price.
Inertia/contacts on all accessible windows would be a better solution.

Reading a bit in the forums here you guys obviously know your stuff so I'll go with what you say, cheers.

My plan is to go with the PowerMax Complete Kit with the addons previously mentioned - also gonna add on the wireless keypad so I can hide the panel and make it silent so it can't be found by sound.

Just before I buy, I was curious about the quality of the Visonic accessories - I've been reading reviews saying they aren't that well made and when the batteries need to be changed problems can start as a result of not being able to put (for example) a PiR back together properly so you end up with lots of false alarms. Is that common?

I forgot to ask how much the batteries are to replace in the accessories - some prices I've found online suggest replacing the batteris in ~3 years on 3 motion sensors, 3 magnetic sensors, outdoor siren, 1 key fob and 1 wireless keypad could be in the region of €100. Would that be about right?

KoolKid

I have been using visonic for years and have not come across any of those issues ..
I find them very reliable. Battery life is underestimated. I have a good few wireless devices at home that are in over 3 years. I have not replaced one battery yet.
Battery prices vary from around €4-€8 .
They are very easy to replace.

altor

worc wrote: »

Just before I buy, I was curious about the quality of the Visonic accessories - I've been reading reviews saying they aren't that well made and when the batteries need to be changed problems can start as a result of not being able to put (for example) a PiR back together properly so you end up with lots of false alarms. Is that common?

I have being using these systems for years and lately I have had a few issues with them so much so that I wont be installing them anymore.
The battery replacements is common knowledge and they said they have addressed this with the newer type sensors they have. Only time will tell if the life span has increased.

worc wrote: »

I forgot to ask how much the batteries are to replace in the accessories - some prices I've found online suggest replacing the batteris in ~3 years on 3 motion sensors, 3 magnetic sensors, outdoor siren, 1 key fob and 1 wireless keypad could be in the region of €100. Would that be about right?

There are a few different type batteries you need for this system, keeping the sensor data sheet that comes with the packs will make sure you get the correct battery types for the different sensors. The outside bell comes with a second holder for another battery, installing this when installing the bell will nearly double the time before the battery needs replacing. The battery should cost from €12-€15

worc

KoolKid wrote: »

I have been using visonic for years and have not come across any of those issues ..
I find them very reliable.

altor wrote: »

I have being using these systems for years and lately I have had a few issues with them so much so that I wont be installing them anymore.

Dangit - was hoping for consensus. I have to admit I feel like still going with the Visonic as I'm finding it a lot easier to find information about their systems online and when calling around there seems to be more known about them. Getting info/prices on visonics was a breeze compared to getting the info on HKCs for example - I know that's no mark of quality but when things go wrong I like to know there's plenty of info out there so I can DIY the fix where possible.

Thanks for the input - very helpful.

KoolKid

If you are thinking of HKC I would recommend looking at Siemens. Their wireless would be cheaper than HKC. You would also have the option to use visonic sensors as well .

altor

worc wrote: »

Dangit - was hoping for consensus. I have to admit I feel like still going with the Visonic as I'm finding it a lot easier to find information about their systems online and when calling around there seems to be more known about them. Getting info/prices on visonics was a breeze compared to getting the info on HKCs for example - I know that's no mark of quality but when things go wrong I like to know there's plenty of info out there so I can DIY the fix where possible.

Thanks for the input - very helpful.

Sorry for that but if your looking for an honest answer that is it.
If you look on there website here they have info on there products, they also have a down load page here which will give you more info.
If you get on to some of the suppliers here they will more than happily give you prices on systems available.

You are on the best site for info on most systems used in todays market, we even through in a bit of DIY help if needed

worc

One last question (instead of starting a new thread).

Does the Visonic Powermax Complete and Visonic accessories meet the IS EN 50131-1 standard?

I can find documentation to say they meet "EN 50131-1" but the "IS - Irish Standard" part is missing and am not sure if that's an important part of the standard. I'll be talking to the insurance company to check if the system is ok in their eyes but thought I'd check with the pros here first!

KoolKid

Visonic Powermax is fine for EN50131 in Ireland.
I have had inspections passed with them.

altor

worc wrote: »

One last question (instead of starting a new thread).

Does the Visonic Powermax Complete and Visonic accessories meet the IS EN 50131-1 standard?

I can find documentation to say they meet "EN 50131-1" but the "IS - Irish Standard" part is missing and am not sure if that's an important part of the standard. I'll be talking to the insurance company to check if the system is ok in their eyes but thought I'd check with the pros here first!

Yes it does meet the EN50131 standard. If this is a self install that will mean nothing as only certified installers can install a system to these standards.

KoolKid

I also should have mentioned re the insurance. Ensure your policy is not stating a system to EN50131.You would have great difficulty getting a claim paid without a cert & regular servicing by a licenced company.

pms7

KoolKid wrote: »

I am not in favour of this type of system. It will not activate untill someone is in your home. The damage has been done at that stage.
Concentrate on the perimiter first with one or 2 PiRs after that.

I agree totally. A standard house alarm is useful in an empty house. If I am at home asleep, I want to know if someone is walking around my house thinking of breaking in. This gives you a head start to call Guards and perhaps seeing life inside might put them off breaking in. Granted this is more suited to rural detached house than city housing. I currently have several PIR's outside linked to all external lights and internal buzzer linked up via a PIC. However PIR's are not totally suited to external use and false triggering was a problem. So reprogrammed PIC to trigger only when 2 PIR's on within 5 mins. Currently setting up a IR beam across entrance which should be more reliable than PIR's. Also have external cameras so can check when buzzer goes off.
Any ideas appreciated.

worc

altor wrote: »

Yes it does meet the EN50131 standard. If this is a self install that will mean nothing as only certified installers can install a system to these standards.

KoolKid wrote: »

I also should have mentioned re the insurance. Ensure your policy is not stating a system to EN50131.You would have great difficulty getting a claim paid without a cert & regular servicing by a licenced company.

Duly noted - was not aware of that requirement to meet the standards, thought it was purely down to the system. Will clarify that with the insurance crowd tomorrow to make sure it's not specified as EN50131.

Thanks again guys!

KoolKid

No bother. Better safe than sorry.Insurance companies have tightened up a lot in recent times. No point in giving them another out.

Marcin_diy

worc wrote: »

I’m looking to setup (DIY) a wireless home alarm system with:

3 motion sensors
3 magnetic sensors
GSM
Outdoor siren
1 key fob

I’ve been reading/searching boards.ie and numerous other sites and my head is a little fried trying to work out the best option. I’m typically seeing either Visonic PowerMax Pro or a HKC (can’t remember details on HKC) with additional accessories to add extra motion / magnetic sensors and siren.

I’m finding the Irish based sites don’t give prices so it’s hard to work out the guts of how much this would cost – they all list “call for a price” and I don’t have the time at the minute to be calling around. I’ve found an American site that I can get all of the above for just under €570 including shipping – though I’m sure customs might have something to say about it.

I was curious if someone had an idea of the ballpark figure I’d pay for the setup mentioned above from an Irish or UK based seller?

Www.satel.pl/en/

This is a polish company, i bought gsm module plus all cabling and wireless and wired
Sensors battery and central unit from them and paid less than 300 euro vat inclusive.
I have setup this here in dublin and it works perfectly fine with vodafone sim card.
You can set central unit language to english, get all the manuals -users and installator in english.
once all cables are connected you setup gsm unit via usb port on pc.

altor

worc wrote: »

Duly noted - was not aware of that requirement to meet the standards, thought it was purely down to the system. Will clarify that with the insurance crowd tomorrow to make sure it's not specified as EN50131.

Thanks again guys!

The system itself must meet these standards but so must the installer of the system for the system to be certified to this standard.

Here is a copy of an old post of mine regarding the same issue:

The panel and components comply with EN50131 standard. All certified installers must be certified to install alarms and only install components that comply with this standard, so if you install an alarm in your house using these components the alarm is not certified. A certified installer will also give you a cert to say it has being installed by a certified installer, one copy for you and one for your insurance. After having your alarm in for a year your cert will also expire unless you have a maintenance contract on your alarm.

tiptops

Can you explain, What did your 300€ Include,

How many PIR / door / window contacts, how many zones ect

I am looking to DIY my own house and 300€ is my budget if it was a really good alarm system

thanks

Marcin_diy wrote: »

Www.satel.pl/en/

This is a polish company, i bought gsm module plus all cabling and wireless and wired
Sensors battery and central unit from them and paid less than 300 euro vat inclusive.
I have setup this here in dublin and it works perfectly fine with vodafone sim card.
You can set central unit language to english, get all the manuals -users and installator in english.
once all cables are connected you setup gsm unit via usb port on pc.

Marcin_diy

tiptops wrote: »

Can you explain, What did your 300€ Include,

How many PIR / door / window contacts, how many zones ect

I am looking to DIY my own house and 300€ is my budget if it was a really good alarm system

thanks

Hi there.
Included in the price was
Gsm module, main console where all the cables and battery are connected , small wall console beside entrance door where you can see in english info abour opened zones and enter your password, usb cable to connect system to,the pc, 3 wireless move sensors, 8 mWwwagnetic sensors for door.and windows and cable - I needed about 20 meters only as there was a system before that I upgraded.

On the satel.website you can download pdf installer manuals - make sure you can do this, my dad is an electrician and he had to help me with few things via skype and video call.

I test my satel.system.once a month and it always works fine - it sends me a.text with pre.written message. To get a phone call you would need a landline connected.
Of course there is a chance you can miss a text thats why I setup my , my wifes, and 2 colleagues numbers on the system. They always ring me when get a message.

Sorry for my english I hope you understood me.

What is pit?
I have 9 active zones setup. If any of them like window except door is open it
Wont let me to arm the system.
I get a text as well if main power is cut off.

worc

Got my PowerMaxcomplete and just prior to installing I thought I'd check on a few final things - interesting to note the warranty is voided once I attempt to install it myself - fingers crossed everything is working

1. For the internal PiRs there is the option to have the alarm go off after one or two events. Is there any advice on which is best? I know there would be less false alarms with choosing 2 events so I was tempted to go with that option. I'm just checking that say a person breaks in at the one area I might not have a door contact, I'm presuming that a person walking into the house at a constant pace and into another room where I might not have a PiR isn't recorded as just one event and the alarm wouldn't go off?

2. I'm tempted to use the flashing LED lights to show the PiRs and outdoor siren is on, but I'm also aware that will reduce battery life. Is it worth putting the lights on to show everything is working? If you have the lights on all the time and the day something stops working it might be noticed as a result, so perhaps best to leave them off from day 1?

3. The outdoor siren (MCS-730) has some "holes" at the backing of it (not broken or anything, they are there by manufacture) that I presume are fine in terms of rain/water not getting into it when put on the front of the house just below the roof gutters? I think I was expecting a fully enclosed item but that's probably impossible since the siren has to go off.

altor

worc wrote: »

Got my PowerMaxcomplete and just prior to installing I thought I'd check on a few final things - interesting to note the warranty is voided once I attempt to install it myself - fingers crossed everything is working

Thats correct but it is the joys of installing your own alarm system

worc wrote: »

1. For the internal PiRs there is the option to have the alarm go off after one or two events. Is there any advice on which is best? I know there would be less false alarms with choosing 2 events so I was tempted to go with that option. I'm just checking that say a person breaks in at the one area I might not have a door contact, I'm presuming that a person walking into the house at a constant pace and into another room where I might not have a PiR isn't recorded as just one event and the alarm wouldn't go off?

Two events is the way I would set them unless they are for curtain motions. One event would be the same as a curtain PIR. It is set this way by factory default to cut down on false alarms. All it means is two seconds of the PIRs view lines have to be broken to activate an alarm trigger.

worc wrote: »

2. I'm tempted to use the flashing LED lights to show the PiRs and outdoor siren is on, but I'm also aware that will reduce battery life. Is it worth putting the lights on to show everything is working? If you have the lights on all the time and the day something stops working it might be noticed as a result, so perhaps best to leave them off from day 1?

Yes do, It does use more battery life but as you say it is an indication that the PIR is picking you up when walking by. If your PIR goes into sleep mode which can be as much as 3-4 minutes you will not see this light so please be aware of this. it will be the same when you full set the system, you can move as much as you like in front of the PIR once it has gone into sleep mode.

worc wrote: »

3. The outdoor siren (MCS-730) has some "holes" at the backing of it (not broken or anything, they are there by manufacture) that I presume are fine in terms of rain/water not getting into it when put on the front of the house just below the roof gutters? I think I was expecting a fully enclosed item but that's probably impossible since the siren has to go off.

Thats correct. There are 5 screw holes, 4 around the sides and the pry off tamper which is in the middle of the bell. The pry off one is the most important one as if the bell is ripped off the wall the alarm notices the tamper.

worc

^^^ Thanks again for all the help!

Jnealon

Marcin_diy wrote: »

Www.satel.pl/en/

This is a polish company, i bought gsm module plus all cabling and wireless and wired
Sensors battery and central unit from them and paid less than 300 euro vat inclusive.
I have setup this here in dublin and it works perfectly fine with vodafone sim card.
You can set central unit language to english, get all the manuals -users and installator in english.
once all cables are connected you setup gsm unit via usb port on pc.

The satel kit is quite good but is not widely available over here.
I know a couple of guys who were involved in designing it

worc

One last question (hopefully!) - I've got it up and running, all is working like a charm but I'm noticing the power supply unit inside the panel is somewhat hotter than I'd have expected.

It's not piping hot or anything but I was surprised how hot it is even when I only had it on for 30 minutes from being dead cold. It's about as hot as a laptop ac adaptor gets if you've had it on for about 10 hours.

I had a sparks friend check I had it wired up correctly and I have a 3 amp fuse in the plug; is the heat normal enough for this system?

altor

Yes, that would be normal for the transformer to get hot, not hot enough to melt the control panel.

worc

altor wrote: »

Yes, that would be normal for the transformer to get hot, not hot enough to melt the control panel.

Ah that's good to know - cheers yet again!

altor

worc wrote: »

Ah that's good to know - cheers yet again!

Your welcome, hopefully you will have no issues but if you do let us know