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The Sudden Stratospheric Warming 2011/2012

135

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭oterra


    oterra wrote: »
    Interesting read here from the USA in '85 when the Polar Vortex shifted.
    Excuse if it has already been posted.
    http://www.answers.com/topic/january-1985-arctic-outbreak

    Just wondering if anyone could shed a little insight into what happened to cause this event back in '85. What would the conditions have been before the shift. How did it effect us in Ireland/Uk?
    Fascinating stuff!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,693 ✭✭✭Redsunset


    oterra wrote: »
    Just wondering if anyone could shed a little insight into what happened to cause this event back in '85. What would the conditions have been before the shift. How did it effect us in Ireland/Uk?
    Fascinating stuff!

    Read the thread, have posted bout 85 in some detail.Especially page 2


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    GFS update trends are good as well this morning.

    The only drawback is that it is not until T+240 that the vortex show signs of leaving Greenland.

    However, we see a forecast of significant warming at the 30 hPa level for the first time.


    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126401


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    A look at the mean zonal winds at different layers of the stratosphere highlights both the strong polar vortex conditions that we have seen and the changes already encountered in upper to mid levels of the stratosphere.

    First we see that the 10 Hpa temperature is now running above average.

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126417


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    Excellent stratosphere forecasts this morning from the ECM.
    If these forecasts verify then I would say a SSW would be
    imminent. Looking through the height charts IE 10mb,
    30mb,50mb etc good downwelling seems to be occurring
    and the profile of where the heights and vortex is likely to
    be look very good for the UK and Europe from a cold
    perspective.

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126481


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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    ECM update:

    Starting from the top af the stratosphere, we see a warming forecast for a considerable time that leaves us with the following picture at T+240.

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126482

    This chart show a considerable warm upper stratosphere with a reducing vortex that looks to be soon overwhelmed by the warming. The forecast mean zonal mean winds are very negative ( -30m/s). During the record breaking SSW of 2009 the mean zonal winds, at this level, bottomed out at around -40m/s, so that gives one an indication of how strong this event could be. The vortex is not completely forecast to disintergrate yet though.


    Moving lower now, into the middle stratosphere we see that there is a displacement of the polar vortex forecast at the 10 hPa level that is being recharged by considerable warming.

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126484

    We have yet to see reversal of the mean zonal winds at this level, but with this type of warming (and if the forecast verifies) then that would be the natural progression.

    We see further propagation at the 30 hPa level which continues the theme.

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126485

    The trend at the lower stratosphere on the ECM is for a complete displacement of the vortex to the Eurasion half of the hemisphere leaving a small area of weaker vorticity that has dropped into East America.

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126486

    This suggests Atlantic blocking but is the most unreliable part of the forecast. Small shifts in the vorticity centres can lead to very different tropospheric pattern for our small island. We best wait until we have some cross model agreement before establishing where exactly any High latitude blocking will establish. ( An Aleution high looks a safe bet though).

    The next chart sees the negative mean zonal winds becoming established in the upper polar atmosphere. Hopefully in the coming days we will see these blues lower further towards the troposphere.

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126487

    GFS update to follow later.


  • Registered Users Posts: 386 ✭✭mcriot29


    I have a feeling the true cold air will miss ireland , and most of the uk when it does come south , some seem to think more of a east euro freeze with west missing out ,time frame seems to be frist week of feb .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,693 ✭✭✭Redsunset


    SUDDEN STRATOSPHERIC WARMING (SSW) + COLD HEALTH WARNING
    I see that it's now very likely that we will be seeing a SSW.
    1hpa Upper strat winds are forecast to greatly reverse.Even if it backs off somewhat like the previous warming that never actually made the reversal as forecast, I still think that the warming is too great and the polar vortex is past the point of rescue and so the effects will propagate down to 10hpa and completely reverse the upper westerly flow to easterly.
    It only becomes a SSW when winds reverse at 10hpa level so will be watching this part on graph with great interest.
    fluxes.gif

    The Temps are shown to rise well above average at the 30 hpa level which is very encouraging.

    temps.gif

    Now this all disrupts/splits the PV ,so greatly enhances any chances of super cold periods down the road.However there is no guarantee any future blocking will set up in the perfect place to drag Arctic conditions to our back yard. Canada,USA could favour from this and we could be on the wrong side so hang fire on the excitement until the models get their head around what's happening because they don't handle situations like this well.
    That is all for now. Tis very encouraging to say the least


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,134 ✭✭✭✭maquiladora


    If the PV splits and if it heads the right way, then were going to have great fun watching the models and seeing what does or doesn't appear in FI.

    If it splits the wrong way, I think I might start following cold/snow developments on the US weather forums. I usually only read those forums during hurricane season. Could be interesting. :)


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    Just a little look at what the ECM predicted at 30hpa 9 days ago.

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126527

    This is what happened.

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126528

    Very good verification.. the only marginal difference is the high, with the +216 predicting lower heights and slightly cooler temps. The flow was almost perfect. I'd say it gives a lot of confidence for those forecasting using the tool.


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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    Personally and this could be just wishful thinking but I can see
    no negatives in this major warming thats being forecast. I would
    expect to see a very negative - AO and then -NAO develop
    from this. Also looking at the height profiles from 10 hpa down
    through 100 hpa I'm inclined to believe a cold pattern will develop
    within the 10 to 15 day range.
    The effects of the SSW ( if there is one) should be seen throughout
    the stratosphere and troposphere for several weeks to come,
    whether this means prolonged cold for the UK and Europe or polar
    (Arctic) incursions from time to time depending on other teleconnections
    is far to early to say but I really like what I am seeing at the moment.
    My money is on a stonking easterly setting up within the next 3 to 5
    weeks with a portion of the vortex trapped over central Europe.
    Not a lot to ask for is it.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    Wave 1 is expected to increase height amplitude and temperature amplitude congruent with the expected warming. Very nice heat flux from wave 1 between 5 and 10 hPa and even wave 2 by 240 indicating it wants to get going a bit. Pretty solid momentum flux as well by day 10 from wave 1 but this occurs at the top of the stratosphere. Very strong momentum flux from wave 2 by 240 in the Euro but again it as at the top of the stratosphere.

    Looking at some forecasts, I expect to see IO convection increase at a pretty good amount around the 25th of January, perhaps setting off another Asian MT event to cap the month off and give the PV one more blow heading into February. This is the hope that I have for February in giving us the high latitude blocking that we all seek. As of now the warming will help but I'm sure most can't shake the feeling that we'll need 1 more warm push to set us free.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,508 ✭✭✭✭dsmythy


    Randomly came across this so might as well stick it here.



    From about 1:00 in the video.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,944 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    umm the ECM charts this morning wouldn't inspire confidence fell more back inline with GFS


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,667 ✭✭✭WolfeIRE


    Unrelated to the the thread in most respects but I thought those reading this thread might appreciate it.

    Interesting one from NASA

    See How a Stronger Arctic Oscillation Has Shifted the Flow of Russian Runoff

    An interesting new study published in Nature points out that an increase in the strength of the Arctic Oscillation between 2005 and 2008 caused winds in the region to grow more cyclonic and shift ocean currents in ways that drew more upper-surface freshwater from Russian rivers toward the Canada Basin and the Beaufort Sea. To see the shift in the animation above, look for the tightening of the wind patterns (shown in blue) over the Canada Basin that begins about 13 seconds into the video.

    Notice how the stream of less salty water from river runoff in Russia (shown in red) begins to loop westward toward Canada in sync with the circulation of the wind rather than continuing toward Greenland as it typically would. The purple arrows show the transpolar drift, a current that generally pushes water toward Greenland. NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory has a press release with more details, and a number of news outlets have written stories about the study. In the image below, the altered path of the freshwater current is shown in red.

    1029456main_earthB20120104-full.jpg


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    Villain wrote: »
    umm the ECM charts this morning wouldn't inspire confidence fell more back inline with GFS

    Yes, no major changes in the ECM forecasts today,

    Without doubt the best type of wave break that we will see is a local (central) wave break from the troposphere into the stratosphere centered around the Greenland area - as seen in 2009/2010 winter. This doesnt normally lead to a SSW but can lead to a spell of disturbed vortex and blocking.

    The type of wave breaking event we are seeing now is from remote waves circling the edge of the polar vortex before rebounding back down towards the troposphere. This type of wave breaking is less favourable and less guaranteed to produce tropospheric effects than local wave breaking.

    Thie remote type of wave break can cause a SSW or just disturb the vortex. So far we are seeing a mayor disturbance of the vortex but no complete collapse of the vortex in the middle stratosphere. The disturbance seen so far, is in the form of a displacement of the vortex towards Eurasia - however, the closer we get to the troposphere, the less pronounced this displacement becomes, and the tropospheric teleconnective influences and residual vortex strength of the tropospheric vortex override this signal somewhat. That is why we are yet to see any major blocking signals in the tropospheric output as of yet.

    So far the forecasts suggest a displacement of the vortex (which may lead to pronounced negative mean zonal winds) but no complete disintergration of the vortex. Whereas the warming is good and will eventually filter through to the surface and perhaps allow local wave breaking, it is a far cry from having the complete disintergration of the vortex. I suspect that it is the complete disintergration of the vortex that we will need this winter to override the tropospheric polar vortex and La nina signal.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    Just a quick one, I have had a look at the excellent (of late) EC 32 day this morning and in close detail and the final week of January and into the opening week of February heralds a change. The model scenario is towards a pattern which deepens a marked trough of low pressure across Scandinavia as the zonal Atlantic dies away, particularly compared with of late. There is a +ve pressure anom across the W Atlantic and up into E or NE Canada, though not over Greenland.

    The end result is a mean flow from the N or NW during the final week of January and into early February which signals a temperature anom of around 0C if not trending slightly below average and precipitation totals drop to near or slightly below average.

    All this does is reiterate the signal that a pattern change, of sorts, is likely the further we progress through winter and the EC 32 of late has been excellent, all winter up to present to be honest, so I am certainly hoping that this trend and evolution is being modelled correctly.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    Looking over on the Netweather forum there is really a good few lads clued into the SSW,

    One of the lads chionomaniac seems to be really up on SSW's and most of the stuff I have posted is from his postings on netweather, Its extremely insightful and great to follow.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,010 ✭✭✭Tom Cruises Left Nut


    Been watching that myself, interesting stuff !


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    t|nt|n wrote: »
    Been watching that myself, interesting stuff !

    There is quite a few of them although I did only mention one of the posters, a couple of others I always look out for our , Matt Hugo,Glacier Point,Lorenzo,Coling CLimate and Phil N Parks.

    Some seem to be experts and some learning as they go on.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,010 ✭✭✭Tom Cruises Left Nut


    There is quite a few of them although I did only mention one of the posters, a couple of others I always look out for our , Matt Hugo,Glacier Point,Lorenzo,Coling CLimate and Phil N Parks.

    Some seem to be experts and some learning as they go on.

    The mood is a bit like a rollercoaster mind :pac:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,220 ✭✭✭Davaeo09


    t|nt|n wrote: »
    The mood is a bit like a rollercoaster mind :pac:

    That's what it's like here for us snow bunnies :D


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    I was just about to post the latest GFS update still keeps us on track. Whereas we have no SSW forecast yet , it still is a strong possibility. Of course I feel we don't just want a technical SSW where the vortex recovers quickly, but a total disintegration of the vortex.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    One thing I find is that weather forums have a great difficulty in 'getting' the extremely lagged timescales involved with the stratosphere.

    Agressive, sharp warmings can have a shorther propagation time but generally 20+ days is considered the most likely duration for an event at the top end of the stratosphere to work its way down.

    With that in mind, the warming event over Christmas was centered in the Pacific sector.
    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126579


    Wind forward to GFS ensemble mean H5 anomaly projection for the 18th January:
    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126576


    There may be some tropospheric factors at play which inclined the blocking signal to this region, however this does provide some additional weight to the evidence around tropospheric influence from the stratosphere.

    Two further warming episodes are forecast in the next 15 days from around day 8 through day 14. I wouldn't be suprised to see these two merge as they are relatively close together:

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126578

    index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=126577

    The first of these is also being modelled by the ECM. The second of these being a rapid injection of warm air into the core vortex.

    I'm still not totally convinced that the 1st warming has come onto the radar yet, particularly if it's a nodal propagator which by nature would appear to come and go as it descended. Factor in the possible height rises early February in those areas where warming is forecast, and the whole polar field becomes infinately (more) problematic to model.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 25,234 ✭✭✭✭Sponge Bob


    Forgive me Pete, I cannot make out where these are oriented on the Instant weather maps generated pics of yours above....can you add continental outlines or thicken them or display Longitudes ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,963 ✭✭✭TheMilkyPirate


    Sponge Bob wrote: »
    Forgive me Pete, I cannot make out where these are oriented on the Instant weather maps generated pics of yours above....can you add continental outlines or thicken them or display Longitudes ?

    USA and canada directly underneath centre, Ireland and europe to the right pacific to the left.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 7,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭pistolpetes11


    Sponge Bob wrote: »
    Forgive me Pete, I cannot make out where these are oriented on the Instant weather maps generated pics of yours above....can you add continental outlines or thicken them or display Longitudes ?

    Im afraid bob as I have said in the title of the post these were taken from netweather ,

    But looking at the site you might find the info you are looking for here ,


    http://www.instantweathermaps.com/GFS-php/showmap-strat.php?run=2012010612&var=TMP&lev=10mb&hour=039


    Not sure if this will help u but I have marked Ireland and UK which might give some orientation

    187422.png


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 25,234 ✭✭✭✭Sponge Bob


    Ireland always at 3 o clock is it?


  • Registered Users Posts: 200 ✭✭jimmy.d


    Davaeo09 wrote: »
    That's what it's like here for us snow bunnies :D
    this is what we will be like in a couple weeks covered187433.gif


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,220 ✭✭✭Davaeo09


    jimmy.d wrote: »
    this is what we will be like in a couple weeks covered187433.gif


    Can I hold you too that statement mate? :D


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