Placement of the residents of Proiry Hall

shanered

I hear that the residents of Priory Hall are being relocated in a Hotel In Drumcondra, is this true?
I have also heard that some of them might even get to stay in Uras An Uctarain.
But my main question which only stands if I am right in saying that they are being relocated to a hotel, is I wonder, how was the tendering of this done?
Is there a buddy of the government running the hotel rubbing his hands at the prospect of the government paycheck to cover all the expenses of his new guests?
Who owns this hotel?
Would like to see what people know about this issue....

snappieT

I believe it's the Regency Hotel on the Swords Road they've been relocated to. That's owned by the Regency Hotel group, which has hotels in Dublin, Wicklow, the UK and UAE. The group is owned by the McGettigan family. Whether there's anything dodgy going on is not for me to judge. It seems like a relatively inexpensive hotel that's reasonably close to Priory Hall. That said, there are many others like it.

What I will say is that 50 of the new Regency residents were booted out for a few days because their rooms were otherwise booked by a poker tournament. They've been put in Bewley's, a completely different company. If there was something strange going on, they'd likely have been placed in the North Star hotel, also owned by McGettigans.

chris85

shanered wrote: »

I hear that the residents of Priory Hall are being relocated in a Hotel In Drumcondra, is this true?
I have also heard that some of them might even get to stay in Uras An Uctarain.
But my main question which only stands if I am right in saying that they are being relocated to a hotel, is I wonder, how was the tendering of this done?
Is there a buddy of the government running the hotel rubbing his hands at the prospect of the government paycheck to cover all the expenses of his new guests?
Who owns this hotel?
Would like to see what people know about this issue....

No time for tendering process. This takes weeks/months to do. They must set dates for tenders in, setup a process, review all tenders through a board and make a decision.

Regency is basic hotel and no massive prices. They may have been able to get a little cheaper but at what cost in terms of the time it would take and the lag this would put on certainty of the residents of Priory Hall.

shanered

I just wonder why they didn't move them across the road into some of the current NAMA vacent properties in Clongriffin.
Was just pondering on whether it was a quick buck for some cronie hotel owner.
And yeah, I recollect hearing about that poker tournament actually.
What a disaster...

ANXIOUS

shanered wrote: »

I hear that the residents of Priory Hall are being relocated in a Hotel In Drumcondra, is this true?
I have also heard that some of them might even get to stay in Uras An Uctarain.
But my main question which only stands if I am right in saying that they are being relocated to a hotel, is I wonder, how was the tendering of this done?
Is there a buddy of the government running the hotel rubbing his hands at the prospect of the government paycheck to cover all the expenses of his new guests?
Who owns this hotel?
Would like to see what people know about this issue....

Are you actually for real? If it went to tender you'd be on here complaining that 50 families were living on the streets.

shanered

I was just wondering how many hotels were even asked;
Not alone putting them into NAMA properties directly across from the estate which are currently vacent and ready for use....

Degsy

So i presume the builders who bodged the job in the first place wont have to bear any of the expense?

As usual it'll be John Q Taxpayer left to foot the bill.

Gumbo

shanered wrote: »

I hear that the residents of Priory Hall are being relocated in a Hotel In Drumcondra, is this true?
I have also heard that some of them might even get to stay in Uras An Uctarain.
But my main question which only stands if I am right in saying that they are being relocated to a hotel, is I wonder, how was the tendering of this done?
Is there a buddy of the government running the hotel rubbing his hands at the prospect of the government paycheck to cover all the expenses of his new guests?
Who owns this hotel?
Would like to see what people know about this issue....

shanered wrote: »

I just wonder why they didn't move them across the road into some of the current NAMA vacent properties in Clongriffin.
Was just pondering on whether it was a quick buck for some cronie hotel owner.
And yeah, I recollect hearing about that poker tournament actually.
What a disaster...

shanered wrote: »

I was just wondering how many hotels were even asked;
Not alone putting them into NAMA properties directly across from the estate which are currently vacent and ready for use....

The hotel is relativey close to the residents original homes. Probably the only hotel that had that many rooms available at a short notice.

Also, these Nama homes that are ready for use, i dont believe they are ready for use, with no drainage connections, power connections or internal fit outs.

But i do believe Nama And Dublin City Council are in talks to try find what properties under Nama control are suitable for living in with a view to relocat some residents there.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/1019/prioryhall.html

Degsy wrote: »

So i presume the builders who bodged the job in the first place wont have to bear any of the expense?

As usual it'll be John Q Taxpayer left to foot the bill.

Dublin City Council are footing the bill.

Degsy

kceire wrote: »

Dublin City Council are footing the bill.

Dublin City Council being funded by the taxpayer.


What about the developers whose shoddy workmanship led to this scandal in the first place?

Off the hook i suppose.

LXFlyer

The builder and developer are currently under investigation by the High Court.

shanered

He's bankrupt for £180,000 in UK, no money there.
Might see him prosecuted, he wasn't exactly a Fianna Fail Galway Race tent regular with his IRA past I doubt, though I stand to be corrected.

ectoraige

Part of the council's major emergency response plan includes what to do with evacuees. The Welfare section of Civil Defence is involved too, and AFAIK they maintain a list of suitable premises such as schools and community centres for emergency accommodation. I imagine there is also a list of hotels and other service providers for more permanent accommodation, the question would be then how that list was put together. Dublin City Council may be able to provide an answer.

shanered

Thats pretty much what I was wondering, how the list was put together.

stovelid

Since this recession started, I find myself genuinely amazed at what people will find to complain about.

I guess the families involved should camp on the side of the road while they tender hotels or get vacant properties up to scratch.

The problem with this country sometimes is that too many people think of their taxes as being like a personal munificent donation that they should apportion as they see fit.

Punish the pricks that built these properties by all means but don't take it out on the people that they conned.

Degsy

This is probably just the tip of the iceberg..lots of those apartments were built shoddily..paper-thin walls,pyrites in the foundations,uneven surfaces,prone to flooding etc etc..people wernet just conned they were fcucked royaly.

Gumbo

Degsy wrote: »

What about the developers whose shoddy workmanship led to this scandal in the first place?

Thats a civil matter and nothing got to do with the Local Authorithy, those apartmenst were built privately and signed off by a private sector architect/engineer.

shanered wrote: »

Thats pretty much what I was wondering, how the list was put together.

Thats if there is a list?

Degsy wrote: »

This is probably just the tip of the iceberg..lots of those apartments were built shoddily..paper-thin walls,pyrites in the foundations,uneven surfaces,prone to flooding etc etc..people wernet just conned they were fcucked royaly.

thats what property developers done, they built for the lowest amount and sold for the highest amount possible. they sourced materials at the lowest price possible and still incrteased profits.

maybe we need to go back to the old days where councils inspect the properties and nothing gets signed off unless the council sign it off first?
This is what happened before new legislation was passed to allow self certification.

shanered

Suppose some of these people made some fairly basic mistakes themselves and have themselves to blame, everybody should get a structural engineer to have a look at a house they are going to buy as people should have mechanics to look at a car.
I know people shouldn't be just chucked out of their house and left on the street, no decent person would have that happen and I never suggested that, the main thing I was wondering is how does the tendering process go, and it doesn't have to be over a few weeks while people are left out in the street, their must be a plan in place for a large group of people who need accomodation quickly and I was just probing the boards whether it was friends of government who get these contacts, or do the government really look at the cheapest way to relocate people while furfilling their basic needs.
I do sympatize with anybody in the situation and what they have to go through, but I am just starting a conversation on this angle of the whole episode.
I am not complaining about anything or treating taxes like personal munificent donation that they should apportion as they see fit.
Even though I do believe in public oversight in government spending though you may disagree and believe that us mere citizens should butt out of everything and let the government get on with it.
But that can have serious repercussions.....

Gumbo

shanered wrote: »

Suppose some of these people made some fairly basic mistakes themselves and have themselves to blame, everybody should get a structural engineer to have a look at a house they are going to buy as people should have mechanics to look at a car.

The problem here, is that the buyer should of been protected, when buying a home, you must engage a surveyor to inspect property, he reports on the property to the bank. the solicitor checks all legal ties including land registry, title of deeds and planning permissions and also that each apartment has fire safety cert, homebond structural warranty, and certifcates of compliance with building regulations from the private sector architect.

The buyers were let down by a whole chain of people that simply didnt check the properties out properly, or do what they were getting paid for.

shanered wrote: »

the main thing I was wondering is how does the tendering process go, and it doesn't have to be over a few weeks while people are left out in the street, their must be a plan in place for a large group of people who need accomodation quickly and I was just probing the boards whether it was friends of government who get these contacts, or do the government really look at the cheapest way to relocate people while furfilling their basic needs.

Sounds to me your simply looking for an argument or just trying to have a dig at Public Procurent etc etc, Irish Economy / Politics forum is thata way OP

---

>

Priory hall is located in X place, the goverment would of looked at hotels in Y radius. This hotel was probably the only one that could take the large group, heck there could of been a vote between the residents on which hotel, but we dont know that.

It looks to me that you simply looking into it too much, and trying to get 5 from adding 2 and 2. but hey, thats my opinion.

Degsy

kceire wrote: »

thats what property developers done, they built for the lowest amount and sold for the highest amount possible. they sourced materials at the lowest price possible and still incrteased profits.

maybe we need to go back to the old days where councils inspect the properties and nothing gets signed off unless the council sign it off first?
This is what happened before new legislation was passed to allow self certification.

I remember when Santry Avenue was first being developed..the difference between the "social housing" on one side of the road (to re-house ballymun) and the "private" apartments on the other(aimed at young professionals)was huge..the council dwellings were substantial two-story houses lined with brick whilst the other were wretchedly-built shoeboxes already starting to turn blaclk outside form water damage.

shanered

I was just asking a few questions about it and have a conversation out of it, was wondering if the residents had a vote or how they figured out which hotel was used. I understand that it was more than likely all above board but like so many things they aren't, such as was the way everything was tickedy-boo when everybody signed off by all the engineers, architects, fire saftey officers etc....
It it more for matter of discussion I created this thread, if you think I have any agenda or want an argument you are wrong, just wanted to discuss this aspect, thats all.
Sorry if I have come across anyway other than that.

Gumbo

shanered wrote: »

I was just asking a few questions about it and have a conversation out of it, was wondering if the residents had a vote or how they figured out which hotel was used. I understand that it was more than likely all above board but like so many things they aren't, such as was the way everything was tickedy-boo when everybody signed off by all the engineers, architects, fire saftey officers etc....

The problem here, is that you are lumping in Public Sector emplyees (Fire Safety Officiers) into the mix with privately built apartments, private sector architects and private sector engineers.

When a development gets planning permission, it must thean apply for a fire safety certificate. This involves a report from a fire consultant and also drawings showing extent of fire proofing incluind 30 min doors, 60 min doors, safe compartments etc etc and travel distances to safe compartments.

The fire safety officer (Dublin City Council Employee) will then approve/reject the plans, and if he approves, then a fire safety cert is issued based on the plans submitted by the private sector architec or engineer.

The priory hall development seemly got its fire cert all above board, but the private sector developer / builder then went ahead and changed the layout, with rooms within rooms and also used cheaper/inferior materials or indeed in some areas, not used any at all.

shanered wrote: »

It it more for matter of discussion I created this thread, if you think I have any agenda or want an argument you are wrong, just wanted to discuss this aspect, thats all.
Sorry if I have come across anyway other than that.

Discussion, fair enough, but you keep harping on about greedy friends of friends within government / DCC, when there is no evedance of that, and even pointed out to you in an earlier post about some residents moved to a different hotel, under a totally differnt ownership than the regency.

shanered

Just after coming into Clongriffin there, seen a big queue of people outside the main office with radio stations and news reporters, thinking it may actually be residents of Priory Hall moving to the estate.

chris85

shanered wrote: »

Just after coming into Clongriffin there, seen a big queue of people outside the main office with radio stations and news reporters, thinking it may actually be residents of Priory Hall moving to the estate.

They are collecting keys there for temporary accomodation they have been offered.

Gumbo

shanered wrote: »

Just after coming into Clongriffin there, seen a big queue of people outside the main office with radio stations and news reporters, thinking it may actually be residents of Priory Hall moving to the estate.

chris85 wrote: »

They are collecting keys there for temporary accomodation they have been offered.

yes, just over 40 units have been made available by Dublin City Council and NAMA and are being allocated to owner occupiers down there. Keys been collected from the local counil office.

No idea what type of house/apartments etc are being allocated though.

January

And yet people are still on huge waiting lists for council housing... how can they make these properties available so quickly?

And btw, before anybody mentions, I know these people need somewhere to live and I'm not begrudging them that, they need to be in proper accommodation, not holed up in hotel rooms living out of bags. I'm just questioning why the waiting lists are so long if the council could mobilise 40 homes in the space of two/three weeks to move these families into. There's perfectly good houses in my estate that are lying empty while there could be families living in them. (And I know they're perfectly good and habitable because the council spent weeks refurbing them and finished up four months ago, yet the houses are still boarded up and empty)

chris85

January wrote: »

And yet people are still on huge waiting lists for council housing... how can they make these properties available so quickly?

And btw, before anybody mentions, I know these people need somewhere to live and I'm not begrudging them that, they need to be in proper accommodation, not holed up in hotel rooms living out of bags. I'm just questioning why the waiting lists are so long if the council could mobilise 40 homes in the space of two/three weeks to move these families into. There's perfectly good houses in my estate that are lying empty while there could be families living in them. (And I know they're perfectly good and habitable because the council spent weeks refurbing them and finished up four months ago, yet the houses are still boarded up and empty)

These are short term housing until the works on Priory Hill are fixed as far as I see. They are not owned by the council. They are owned by NAMA who would be trying to sell them to recoup money on loans. They could not just be offered out to people on housing list long term as they are not owned by the council basically.

January

Apparently only 33 of the houses are NAMA owned, which leaves 7 that are council (I think they were given out by a different housing scheme but they are still council properties none the less) owned... still seven more families that could have been housed out of them.

Gumbo

January wrote: »

And yet people are still on huge waiting lists for council housing... how can they make these properties available so quickly?

And btw, before anybody mentions, I know these people need somewhere to live and I'm not begrudging them that, they need to be in proper accommodation, not holed up in hotel rooms living out of bags. I'm just questioning why the waiting lists are so long if the council could mobilise 40 homes in the space of two/three weeks to move these families into. There's perfectly good houses in my estate that are lying empty while there could be families living in them. (And I know they're perfectly good and habitable because the council spent weeks refurbing them and finished up four months ago, yet the houses are still boarded up and empty)

January wrote: »

Apparently only 33 of the houses are NAMA owned, which leaves 7 that are council (I think they were given out by a different housing scheme but they are still council properties none the less) owned... still seven more families that could have been housed out of them.

they are the majority NAMA owned, not DCC.
Although i know 2-3 people on housing lists and its not as black and white as you think, these people are waiting on a house in specific areas, ie. they turn down where they dont want to live.

mikemac

As I understand and I'm happy to be corrected, DCC pay forty five euro per night per room.
A tender process likely would not beat that rate
The Regency sell out during autumn and DCC get a good rate, that was some good negotiation

January wrote: »

And yet people are still on huge waiting lists for council housing... how can they make these properties available so quickly?

People on the housing list regularly turn down accommodation. You should listen to the Pat Kenny podcasts, their roving reporter Paddy O'Gormon interviews people on it.
A single parent in Ballyfermot turned down a place in Flnglas, she felt it was too far away and she knew nobody out there.
Same with a single parent in Dublin Eight who turned down a place in further west, you'd think it was two hundred kilometers away and the end of the world the way she described it. Some serious inertia and people reluctant to move areas going on in Dublin

Degsy

kceire wrote: »

these people are waiting on a house in specific areas, ie. they turn down where they dont want to live.

Well then they should be thrown off the list..bad enough they wont look after their own accomodation needs but now they want to pick and choose where they live(for nothing).

January

Degsy wrote: »

Well then they should be thrown off the list..bad enough they wont look after their own accomodation needs but now they want to pick and choose where they live(for nothing).

Not for nothing, they still have to pay rent... as I know it, you get to choose three "areas" where you would like to live... whether they offer you one in one of your preferences is a different story... I think you get two refusals and then go to the back of the list again.

Gumbo

Degsy wrote: »

Well then they should be thrown off the list..bad enough they wont look after their own accomodation needs but now they want to pick and choose where they live(for nothing).

yep, agree 100%, but thats an argument for a different day!