Is a road bike a good commuter machine

clonmahon

Every time a newbie asks here about a bike for commuting there tends to be a numerical bias in favour of road bikes. Here is a 6 minute video shot in that great cycling nation of Holland, I can only count one road bike in it. Why is it that so few road bikes appear in this video? Did the video producer edit out all the road bikes bar one or do the Dutch ride those heavy roadsters because they are stubborn fools who refuse to the see the overwhelming value of road bikes for all kinds of road cycling. Or might it be that the sporty road bike is not the best answer to many peoples commuting needs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swqaAIkGtpA&feature=related

tomasrojo

I've never used a road bike, per se, for commuting, because I always wanted a bike with at least a rear rack, which they generally don't have.

If you want to commute in the clothes you're going to wear at your destination, I guess a roadster is a better option. Or at least a bike with mudguards and some luggage capacity. There are plenty of other options, obviously, including a somewhat modified road bike.

Lumen

Most "what bike" threads involve commutes of at least 10km each way.

I wouldn't want to do 20km a day on a 25kg sit-up-and-beg bike.

CramCycle

Whatever you feel comfortable on cycling to work is a good commuting machine. I have a road bike, a semi-touring bike and a fixed gear, all do the job and all are comfortable. Come the fall of snow I hope to have a MTB up and running but the fixed with cable ties sufficed last year and was more comfortable and faster than any other machine I seen on the road.

Basically, they are if thats what you like. In Holland, thoser bikes are more common, ergo newbies are more likely to take to what the masses have, creating a self perpetuating cycle. For my work they are not quick enough but if I had more time I would love to ride one, I particularly wish to buy a cargo bike when funds arrive/appear.

Cookie_Monster

the main reason for the non appearance of road bike in the Dutch video is theft, last time I was in Amsterdam got talking to a local about it, said bike theft was enormous so everyone just has a cheap sit up straight bike. Goes so far that if your crappy bike gets nicked you just take the next one apparently.


I find those bike horrifically uncomfortable and really difficult to control cos of the back facing bars too. I used to commute on a (cheapish) mountain bike without issue too.

reallyunique

The simplest way to think about this is to ask yourself if you'd rather commute in a tarmac race car, a rally car or a Ford Focus. I've actually tried all three and the Focus was the only one you'd want to do journey in every day. The others were fun once but that's about it.

My commute is about 8k each way and I've done it on a road-race bike, several mountain bikes and a sort of cross between a Dutch bike and a hybrid (weird).

Personally I hated the road-race bike as I don't like the riding position when I'm in my ordinary clothes, my pants get caught in the chain, the drops feel a little 'twitchy' for me in traffic, I get sprayed with road muck when it's wet and there's no panniers so I need a backpack. Having clipless pedals was a pain as I needed to carry spare shoes too.

The MTBs feel better (to me) than the road bike, I like the position better and the suspension takes away all the bumps. It's not too squishy though as my best bike is more XC orientated. That said, I still get greasy pants and and require a backpack though the mudguards keep most of the spray off. The MTBs are bigger and heavier than road bikes but it hardly matters unless you're timing yourself. I regularly do 40-50k on the nice bike with no problems at all.

The "hybrid" bike is a little lighter than the usual Dutch fare but has all the proper commuting bits. The chain guard saves my pants, the mudguards keep me drier, the panniers even let me do some shopping too. It has a small basket on the front which is great for gloves and a hat (I'm cold when I start out but hot by the time I'm half way there). The weight is irrelevant as I'm by far the heaviest bit of the bike and with all the locks etc having a 7kg bike would be mad for commuting. This is the slowest of the bikes but is really quite comfortable and the speed makes no significant difference. It's way faster than by car and only slightly slower than the road bike as it's traffic lights all the way. The few minutes I'd save would be eaten up having to shower or change anyway.

So, for a commute I like a commuting bike. For long distances or for punishing my fat frame I'd choose the road racer and for falling down hills the FS MTB is your only man. If I could only afford one bike it'd be the MTB but that's a personal thing. There's no reason not to have the right tool for the job. Race and MTBs may be very expensive but a decent commuter won't cost a fortune.

seamus

All good posts above. However in reality the reason why a road bike is usually recommended is because most people ask for bike that will take them into work....and maybe a little more at the weekends cos I want to get fit.

You can do substantial weekend spins on a hybrid/commuter but if the bug bites it will get painful very soon and you'll find yourself looking to buy a brand new road bike within a couple of months.

If someone only ever plans on going in and out of work for 5km, then a road bike isn't the best option for them.

Surveyor11

Great video. Interesting the absense of helmets, mopeds included. Just an observation and dont want to open up that can of worms, also not a single MAMIL:eek:

Seweryn

clonmahon wrote: »

Every time a newbie asks here about a bike for commuting there tends to be a numerical bias in favour of road bikes. Here is a 6 minute video shot in that great cycling nation of Holland, I can only count one road bike in it. Why is it that so few road bikes appear in this video? Did the video producer edit out all the road bikes bar one or do the Dutch ride those heavy roadsters because they are stubborn fools who refuse to the see the overwhelming value of road bikes for all kinds of road cycling. Or might it be that the sporty road bike is not the best answer to many peoples commuting needs.

Are there any country roads on that video? I can only see urban commuting areas... And for this kind of environment, these heavy Dutch bikes are perfect (if you are commuting, say 10km or less each way).

For someone like me, who cycles 22km each way on main / country roads to work in Ireland, the road bike is the only way to go. I can't imagine myself on one of these bikes, like shown on the video. It would be just as impractical as using a truck for pizza delivery.

desertcircus

Holland is also remarkably flat, as well as being hugely built-up, with a population density of 402 per square kilometre - so people would be expected to have shorter commute distances. Additionally, the Dutch public transport system is excellent, so longer commutes are more easily doable without private transport (be it car or bike) - and the cycle lane system in Dutch cities makes in-city cycling a breeze. Combine hills, distance, and a lacklustre public transport system, along with awful traffic management and a gridlocked city, and you'll end up with cyclists who A) spend a fair bit of time on hills, are doing a pretty decent distance, C) have no other option for their journey, and D) are experienced enough cyclists to cope with the madness that is Dublin traffic. All of which produces a bias in favour of road bikes.

A sit-up-and-beg is great for short commutes around a bike-friendly city when you live two miles from work. It is emphatically not a particularly good option for cycling from Dalkey to Dundrum in rush-hour traffic. Likewise, a road bike is by far the best option for a 15km commute along crowded roads, but crazy overkill for a five-minute spin down to the local coffeeshop.

ednwireland

if i was in holland i'd prob get a flat bar fixie

seeing as my ride home is


then i'll stick with this

rp

ednwireland wrote: »

then i'll stick with this

Is that a Kaffenback?

clonmahon

Seweryn wrote: »

Are there any country roads on that video? I can only see urban commuting areas... And for this kind of environment, these heavy Dutch bikes are perfect (if you are commuting, say 10km or less each way).

For someone like me, who cycles 22km each way on main / country roads to work in Ireland, the road bike is the only way to go. I can't imagine myself on one of these bikes, like shown on the video. It would be just as impractical as using a truck for pizza delivery.

Video of Dutch kids cycling to school on rural cyclepath. According to the description with this video kids cycling up to 15 km to school are not exceptional. In this video not a road bike in sight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrQ-d2PBUto

Also came across this photo from Holland rubbish bins designed especially for cyclists.

monument

Interesting thread, might reply in greater detain when I get the change but for now...

desertcircus wrote: »

Additionally, the Dutch public transport system is excellent, so longer commutes are more easily doable without private transport (be it car or bike) - and the cycle lane system in Dutch cities makes in-city cycling a breeze.

The Dutch public transport system looks good compare to ours, their promotion of the bicycle is arguably far more important -- it's more cost effective and carries more people than their public transport.

But the bicycle complements public transport (and and vise versa) -- the Dutch estimate at least 50% of all train trips include bicycle to / from the train station and they are improving that with better parking and bike rental at stations.

BTW the above graph is for all trips -- while we generally only measure commuting trips. Source: Cycling in the Netherlands.

ednwireland

rp wrote: »

Is that a Kaffenback?

yep - the old one

Harpz

As a German friend retorted when I suggested a road bike would make his commute faster..."and have to hunch over like a gorrilla?"
To be fair this gentleman would commute with a suit and overcoat and wouldn't consider going at a pace that would require sweating.....which when you think about it is a better way of commuting...a leisurely dawdle and no need for showers/changing at work.
That said I enjoy a quick short dart into work on a road bike.

Lumen

Cycling slowly is a wasted opportunity. If I wanted to relax I'd take the train.

Dermot Illogical

Surveyor11 wrote: »

Great video. Interesting the absense of helmets, mopeds included.

I wonder what they attach their cameras to?

Condatis

clonmahon wrote: »

Every time a newbie asks here about a bike for commuting there tends to be a numerical bias in favour of road bikes. Here is a 6 minute video shot in that great cycling nation of Holland, I can only count one road bike in it. Why is it that so few road bikes appear in this video? Did the video producer edit out all the road bikes bar one or do the Dutch ride those heavy roadsters because they are stubborn fools who refuse to the see the overwhelming value of road bikes for all kinds of road cycling. Or might it be that the sporty road bike is not the best answer to many peoples commuting needs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swqaAIkGtpA&feature=related

Only one helmet in that lot – and – remarkably – no phones.

rp

Lumen wrote: »

Cycling slowly is a wasted opportunity. If I wanted to relax I'd take the train.

It means less time in bed, too...

clonmahon

Condatis wrote: »

Only one helmet in that lot – and – remarkably – no phones.

No lycra either or high vis vests. Just lots of ordinary people in ordinary clothes.

clonmahon

Don't think a road bike would suit these people

http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/po1b_amsterdam_bicycle_suit.jpg

http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/pp8b_amsterdam_bicycle_dres.jpg

http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/pr0b_amsterdam_bicycle_dres.jpg

http://www.ski-epic.com/amsterdam_bicycles/pn4b_amsterdam_bicycle_many.jpg

kincsem

I don't want to derail the thread, but I thought this was interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XuBdf9jYj7o

clonmahon

kincsem wrote: »

I don't want to derail the thread, but I thought this was interesting.

Very interesting video, I’m very interested that the Dutch learned the lessons of the 1973 oil crisis and didn’t forget them when it was over. This was part of the push for cycling. I remember the 1973 oil crisis well, a lot of people in my area, including my father, who drove to work suddenly bought bikes, or took out bikes that had been laid up and cycled to work. Unlike the Dutch when the crisis was over we in Ireland forgot all the lessons and went back to cars. This is a lesson we are going to have to learn all over again, quite soon I fear.

Cookie_Monster

clonmahon wrote: »

No lycra either or high vis vests. Just lots of ordinary people in ordinary clothes.

and they're not just appearing out of the gloom and dying instantly. Amazing eh

Keep_Her_Lit

Lumen wrote: »

Most "what bike" threads involve commutes of at least 10km each way.

I wouldn't want to do 20km a day on a 25kg sit-up-and-beg bike.

A 13.6kg bike should be just fine, however.

Surveyor11 wrote: »

Great video. Interesting the absense of helmets, mopeds included. Just an observation and dont want to open up that can of worms, also not a single MAMIL:eek:

Are you having a go at us MAMIL's? Give me MAMIL-dom and a burning mid-life crisis any day. Imagine being 20 and choosing to cycle everywhere like that. Good God man, no wonder Europe is doomed!

clonmahon wrote: »

No lycra either or high vis vests. Just lots of ordinary people in ordinary clothes.

Well hey, some of us prefer to be extraordinary people in extraordinary clothes.

Dord

I commute on a road bike. I did have a flat bar hybrid but it was uncomfortable for long journeys. I prefer the road bike with drops, but I think I might get an auxiliary brake installed for around town.

cdaly_

Like the cross levers on this bike?


Unless you spend a lot of time on the tops in traffic, they probably won't be used much. OTOH, I can confirm that they work very well when you do use them.

Wheely GR8

Cycling looks so safe and peaceful in that video ,no wonder so many people wear war helmets here:D

MungoMan

Harpz wrote: »

As a German friend retorted when I suggested a road bike would make his commute faster..."and have to hunch over like a gorrilla?"

Fair point, roadbikes do make you hunch like a gorrilla with the seat being up to 10cm higher than the handlebars. You even need to raise your neck slightly to see ahead.

The way I see it, when chosing a bike, there is a tradeoff between performance and comfort.
At one end of the scale, you have Velodrome bikes which force you into a very aggressive riding position which is not comfortable, but very optimised for speed. Not many people would want to commute on a bike with a geometry like a velodrome bike.

At the other end of the scale you have something like the Dublin transport bikes which are as comfortable as sitting on a bar stool, but are slow and weight over 20kg.

For me, although I see the merits of Hybrid bikes, I'd prefer to commute (like a gorrilla) on a road bike for speed and performance reasons.

Bluefoam

One of the reasons that racer style bikes are put forward here is that many of the users here are cycling entusiasts, rather than just people who cycle.

In Coppenhagen, you will see less racer style bikes, because they use their bikes for transport, lifestyle and comfort rather than speed, fitteness and sport. There a bike is a tool & they tend to cycle in their normal cloths, so don't want to break a sweat, therefore they cycle more upright bikes, with a more comfortable position, leisurely cycling style, storage & carrying options and protection against the elements.

I do however agree that with Dublins more suburban population that the high nelly may not suit all. I chose to ride a Charge Tap, which had lots of storage options, can take most mud guards, has a slightly forward seating position yet is still comfortable, and skinny tyres that allow for me to pick up a decent pace without too much effort + its easy to maintain due to the 8 speed hub gear & is fairly bulletproof. This style of bike is a great compromise for Irish cities.

coolbeans

I think the likes of an entry level road bike represent an excellent choice as a commuter. A Trek 1.2 comes with rack mounting points, a carbon fork for the rough roads and has the speed and comfortable riding position for suburban commuting. You can also fit muddies and slightly larger tyres for winter and this makes for a far superior machine to any hybrid or Dutch style bike over the longer commutes characteristic of Irish cities owing to their low density.
If Dutch cities were planned like Irish cities the ubiquitous Dutchie we all know would be a very different animal. Good bike design responds to the predominant environment. A Dutchie is perfect in Holland but in Ireland the road bike wins for 10KM+ journeys.

coolbeans

@Bluefoam, as you infer, a bike is a tool and a roadbike with rack and mudguard mounts is the most effective tool for the job in Ireland.

Bluefoam

coolbeans wrote: »

@Bluefoam, as you infer, a bike is a tool and a roadbike with rack and mudguard mounts is the most effective tool for the job in Ireland.

Please don't twist my words.

While a rack and mudguard mounts are important options. I don not believe a 'roadbike' (racer) is the optimum option for commuting in Ireland.

There are plenty of good options available for many different needs, IMO a racer is purley a sports bike & is not the best option for commuting in most cases.

Surveyor11

I use two bikes for commuting - road bike (preferred - also for weekend spins) and mountain bike (reserve - used more for casual riding with my 5 year old). I find the road bike more comfortable - I do not agree that it hunches my back, in fact if anything your back should be straight when on the drops. It's also more nimble in traffic and generally responsive.

The mountain bike I tend to slouch more on when cycling - you can't get as comfortable in my opinion anyway on longer journeys. It's probably more sure footed (wheeled?) in terms of tackling the ups and downs of Irish roads, but the shear weight of the thing makes it a beast to get going at any speed.

For me, the commute is a daily part of my exercise, so I try to do it as intensively as possible. Other's are quiet happy to amble along, but horses for courses I guess.

coolbeans

@Blue - Can't agree there, over any sort of a medium to long distance commute the lower more aero positioning of the road bike plus the option of the drops is a big benefit as it's both more comfortable and efficient in Irish conditions.
The road bike also makes more sense by virtue of the low population and building density leading to increased commuter distances characteristic of Irish town and city layout. Flat bars and upright positioning on the other hand makes the rider susceptible to the wind, less efficient and will generally make for a slower more tiring to ride machine, the last point being especially salient where commute distance increases.

seven stars

seamus wrote: »

All good posts above. However in reality the reason why a road bike is usually recommended is because most people ask for bike that will take them into work....and maybe a little more at the weekends cos I want to get fit.

You can do substantial weekend spins on a hybrid/commuter but if the bug bites it will get painful very soon and you'll find yourself looking to buy a brand new road bike within a couple of months.

If someone only ever plans on going in and out of work for 5km, then a road bike isn't the best option for them.

This hits the nail on the head. I have a 19k commute, and I ignored the advice on here because I wasn't sure whether the bug would bite. And now that it has, I'm wishing I'd gone for an entry level road bike instead of a hybrid.

Lumen

It would be boring if everyone rode the same bike.

If people can't be bothered to do their own research and rely purely on the unqualified recommendations of a bunch of obsessives, they deserve everything they get. :pac:

In any case, we all know that "which bike?" is a stupid question; the proper question is "which bikes?".

Dali Farmer

Lumen wrote: »

It would be boring if everyone rode the same bike.

If people can't be bothered to do their own research and rely purely on the unqualified recommendations of a bunch of obsessives, they deserve everything they get. :pac:

In any case, we all know that "which bike?" is a stupid question; the proper question is "which bikes?".

I agree with the above. I have been using a trek 1200 for the past 7-8 years for my daily 38k commute, and would never consider anything other than a roadbike. However my brother uses a boardman hybrid for his commute and he recently cycled from Mizen to Malin on it, and I don't think he would consider changing it

Dord

cdaly_ wrote: »

Like the cross levers on this bike?


Unless you spend a lot of time on the tops in traffic, they probably won't be used much. OTOH, I can confirm that they work very well when you do use them.

Exactly. I meant for use around town/and in traffic where I could sit up and have better visibility... and brakes while doing that. :P

dave_o_brien

You're all right.

Thank you.

ROK ON

cdaly_ wrote: »

Like the cross levers on this bike?


Unless you spend a lot of time on the tops in traffic, they probably won't be used much. OTOH, I can confirm that they work very well when you do use them.

I had a bike with brakes like that, but in 2 years of commuting on it, I never found the opportunity to use them.
Road bikes can be comfy and most are hard wearing. I had a hybrid for years and used on the occasional fine day cycling into work. As soon as I got a road bike I began cycling into work on it every day. I found it more comfortable. I didnt like the upright position and didnt like the breaking.
But, each to his own. Reality is that up to 1 hour of a commute, I think that pretty much any bike would suffice. Main thing is that it is fit for purpose.

rp

Looking at the rain this afternoon, I've vowed to get the bike below as my commuter:



Might need some lights, tho

Dord

rp wrote: »

Looking at the rain this afternoon, I've vowed to get the bike below as my commuter:



Might need some lights, tho

A rudder at the back would be good. It'd be like a mini cycle-powered submarine, perfect for Dublin! :pac:

clonmahon

rp wrote: »

Looking at the rain this afternoon, I've vowed to get the bike below as my commuter:



Might need some lights, tho

These machines can really move on level ground

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=CpNCK1ctzt4#!